PODCAST TRANSCRIPTS

As an empowered educator, how do you shape the minds and hearts of your students?
In this world that can seem chaotic, we all want them to grow successfully, but also to be kind and compassionate towards others.
Encouraging them to reframe and adjust their perspective a tiny bit will help them become the best versions of themselves.
Welcome to episode 30 of Take Notes with Jen Rafferty podcast! Today, I’m joined by Amy Dickinson. She is an advice columnist, bestselling author and radio personality.
Amy talks about the power of reframing our thoughts and the way we see things.
When bad things happen, we often look at it negatively. But embracing a kinder and more compassionate mindset will help you live more freely and happily!
Tune in to this very insightful episode and let compassion grow in your heart.
Stay empowered,
Jen

Let’s keep the conversation going! Find me at:
 Jen Rafferty | Instagram, YouTube, Facebook | Linktree
Instagram: @jenrafferty_
Facebook: Empowered Educator Faculty
Room

About Amy:
Amy Dickinson writes the syndicated advice column, “Ask Amy,” which is carried in over 150 newspapers and read by an estimated 22 million readers daily. She is also author of the New York Times bestselling memoir, “The Mighty Queens of Freeville: A Story of Surprising Second Chances,” and Strangers Tend to Tell Me Things.
She is known not only for her wisdom but her wit. Since 2006, she has been a featured panelist on National Public Radio’s comedy quiz show, “Wait Wait, Don’t Tell Me.” She is also a sought-after speaker, delivering her inspiring and comic stories of her adventures and misadventures to groups around the country. After living in New York, London, Washington DC and Chicago, she moved back to her hometown in Central NY, married a local contractor she had known since childhood, and is now mother to five daughters.

TRANSCRIPT:  Sometimes we are just so close to our problems that we can't see the forest through the trees. Everything seems so big and wrapped up in our face. However, if we shift our perspective, even just a little bit or go high, as I like to say, you start to see things differently. And now there's space for real creative problem solving. Today, I'm speaking with Amy Dickinson, who through her correspondence with her readers, encourages them to reframe their problems and adjust their perspective a tiny bit to help them become the best versions of themselves. This conversation was truly lovely, and I am so happy to share it with you. And as a side note, we talked about Abbott Elementary and at the time of the interview, I had not seen it. And I know I know, I was definitely behind the pop culture eight ball with this one. But since then, I have watched them all. And yes, it is a great show. And if you haven't seen it, make sure you watch Abbott Elementary. When you're done listening to this episode 24 ways to find calm in your busy world is now available to podcast listeners for free and empowered educator.com/ebook. Here you will find 24 ways to feel more ease and joy by noticing all of the things that are all around you that are usually out of sight. I did all the work for you and it's yours for free. So download your copy today and empowered educator.com/ebook. Remember all the passion and vision you had when you first went into teaching. Feeling like building young minds and creating community through your work would make a lasting impact on this world. Well, those days may feel like they're behind you now because you're exhausted, stressed and overwhelmed and frustrated. But I'm here to tell you it doesn't have to be like this. In fact, the love of teaching never really went away. But it absolutely needs transformation. Welcome to The Take notes Podcast. I'm Jen Rafferty, former music teacher, mom of two and certified emotional intelligence practitioner, and I'm here to light the way for you. In order to create a generational change for our kids. We need to shift the paradigm away from the perpetual stress and overwhelm and into a life of joy and fulfillment. This is education 2.0 where you become the priority. Shift how you live your life, and how you show up both at work and at home. So take a sip of steamy morning coffee and grab your notebook. It's time to take notes. Hello and welcome to another fabulous episode of take notes. I am here with an incredible guest. This is Amy Dickinson who of course writes the syndicated advice column as Amy which is carried in over 150 newspapers and read by an estimated 22 million readers daily. She's also the author of The New York Times Best Selling memoir The mighty queens of freewill a story of surprising second chances, and strangers tend to tell me things she is known not only for her wisdom, but her wit and since 2006 She has been a featured panelist on National Public Radio's comedy quiz show. Wait, wait, don't tell me. And she is also a sought after speaker delivering her inspiring and comic stories of her adventures and misadventures to groups around the country. And after living in New York, London, Washington, DC and Chicago. She moved back to her hometown in central New York, married a local contractor she had known since childhood and is now mother to five daughters. Hi, Amy. Hey, Jen.


Boy, that's crazy. You know, what do you hear your bio read LS like, Whoa, did I do all that? Yeah. Amazing. Yeah,


it is amazing. Thank you so much for being here. Although I have to say like I were just saying before you recorded you did leave something out. That was very important. Very talented. Alto.


Thank you. And thank you for recognizing when I sing for your choir, thank you for recognizing I love this one session where you pointed out how different like the stereotypical soprano is a certain way and this year and I really love that I it's sort of like when you first discover that you really do match your sign of the zodiac. I was like Eliane such an alto. Oh my god.


Yeah, and for those listening who are not musicians, go ask your musician friends and ask them what we're talking about with Yeah, sopranos have like certain personality that is fully me. And like your delta solid alto Ami.


Well, I'm daring to harmony. Yes. And


so for some context, I had directed an intergenerational choir in Frey Ville and it's a beautiful organization. Honestly, I think when we talk about lifelong learning, for me as a music teacher for so long, that choir was the missing piece for me because we spend the 10 months of the year teaching the K 12 kids and then it stops and for me that intergenerational choir having kids as young as one eight right eight are not Yeah, let me in with three generations sometimes a families or people in their 90s Coming to sing


Jen in acquire. I sat next to a 94 year old woman who had been my teacher in high school. But incredible. And you know, for me as glorious as it always is to work with children and sing with children and watch children and enjoy children. For me, the elders, it was all about them. I just, I don't know, it was such a special experience, somebody should make a film about it. And can I just say, just this week, I got a question for my advice column. I couldn't believe it. It was from this madder grouch. Who said, What do you think about this? Amy, I was at a community band concert. And a baby was crying, disrupting what what? And I was like, I literally Jen, I pushed up my sleeves. And I was like, Okay, I'm going in. I'm going in. And because of course, the whole idea around groups like this is the idea of community. And I loved the way I ended this. The person gave me a rant, I sort of gave them a rant in return. And the way I ended, it was basically reflecting that a lot of us have been shut in for a long time. And we're out and about, and the world is noisy. And that, in my opinion, it would be great if this person could see babies is making beautiful music.


Yes. Isn't that interesting? Good timing. Yeah.


And I know you do this in your work, how often it helps to just reframe, reframe, just adjust your perspective, a tiny, tiny bit. And that's not to scold this person who wrote to me, but just to try to inspire that person and other people to think for a second like, Well, wait a minute, that noise is all about humanity is about it being a human being in a community. I mean, the irony that this person kept going on about this community community, I said, Yes, this baby is part of your community, you know?


Yes, sure. Well, and I think this is a nice segue into some of the things I wanted to ask you today, about a lot of what you do in your advice column is about reframe. Oh, yeah, definitely. Can you talk a little bit more about what that means for you, and how people can actually get into this elevated perspective of what their situation is. So they can be in a place to even think about a reframe.


Some of it has to do with compassion. As I get older, I actually, I was in a rough patch in my own lives, where one of our daughters got pregnant in high school, and I was in a brand new marriage, and I freaked out, I just lost my perspective completely. And we so overwhelmed. And I just, I really did some deep thinking about really reflecting online reaction to this, because I wanted to, despite my reaction, I wanted to behave well. You know, I wanted to model good behavior. And so I did a lot of really deep thinking and just try to center more on my compassion. I think it it doesn't always come naturally. And I just tried to imagine this girl in this household, and what she might be going through. And I really started to alter my perspective. And what I've learned is that if you just shifted a tiny bit, I mean, some of the old cliches like walk around in somebody else's shoes, those things actually can help to just change your perspective, even slightly. I have a friend who visualizes it by she puts her hands up in front of her face like a little signposts, and then shifts it just five degrees, it can make such a huge difference. And now as I get older, I've been doing the column now for 20 years, and I feel like my own perspective has shifted and I am much more compassionate in my column despite the scoldings. I occasionally feel compelled to offer and I urge people to reframe, and I do something that I know you and your sister were modeling in one of your podcast episodes, which is I provide for readers a script. A lot of times people, they don't know what to say, now. I think, actually, they don't know how to feel. And sometimes if I give them a little script, it can coach it can urge a person into feeling a certain way. You and your sister talked a lot about something like how to apologize. I love this too. I do this a lot, how to have a difficult conversation. And the suggestion to buy suggested this In my column many times I've done this in I mean, I suggested it my column, then I thought, Oh, now I have to do it. already hate that. Advice, right? Yeah, starting a conversation by saying, this is hard for me. I'm not sure. If the words are gonna come out, right, just hang in there with me. And I just hope that we can talk and do an understanding. But just starting by acknowledging that something is difficult or challenging. I think that can really help.


Sure. And that requires vulnerability, which I think people are not comfortable with, because it doesn't feel safe for people to feel comfortable. And there are tons of ways you can go with some of the things that you're saying. But I want to stay here for a little bit and talk about this script. Because it is really important. Because even in psychology, we talked about like heuristics of you get into a certain situation, and your mind kind of plays something out for you of the way you think it's supposed to go based on what you've seen before. But if you're in a situation where you want to make a new choice, you don't have a script anymore. It's off the books. And so having something as simple as a reframe for the situation. And kind of a guidebook is a beautiful way to start having that conversation. And transparency for me is always the best way through because then you're talking person to person always and not problem to problem. Would you agree?


Yeah, that's a great way to put it. I have sound that it's interesting. You came at this or you do come at this from an academic level. It's funny when I started sort of doing little scripts for people suggesting, here's what you can say in your condolence note, here's how to apologize. I'm shocked that none of the advice columnists I grew up meeting ever did that. And I think it's because I got the job after a very long career as a writer, and writers write their way out of things. So for me, scripting came very, very naturally. So it was less an academic or cerebral approach and more of a, I'm gonna write your way out of this pickle.


Yeah. And it ends up getting to the same results, which is super cool, because at the end of the day, I think people, we need to rulebook we need to be some guideposts because when we're walking into uncharted territory, which is I imagine where most people are, when they write to you and reach out to you. I don't know what to do here, I am feeling lost, I need some guidance. Having that script in that guidebook, at least is essential for them to at least feel a little bit of safety as they walk in to the unknown.


Also, people really, really crave validation. And they write to me and they want when I choose to publish their question, they most often want to know if their issue is legitimate. The deal with a crying baby, not legitimate. But yeah, so they want to know if the dilemma or the conflict they're facing is legitimate. And I think they want to do something about it. Some of the questions I get involve long standing estrangement, for instance, in a family. And I feel like by the time somebody writes to me, they're inspired to some sort of action, they actually want to do something.


Yeah. And then they reach out, and then we get the yes, you're on the right path, or maybe think about it this way. Right. I mean, I think each of us wants to be seen to feel seen. And I really believe that that's an important aspect of the work that I do in my advice column is to see somebody and validate sometimes legitimize their issue sometimes disagree with it, I almost only rarely suggest that anyone walk away. Because, like I said, I feel like often these people are at a Nexus line where they are inspired to try to do something. And so when you're in a position to give somebody advice, whether it's in a column, or whether you're a principal, or an administrator, or guidance counselor, or someone who's just in a position where people go to, you had said earlier that the best place to come from is compassion based. And you also said you want to be able to honor your feelings. He didn't use these words, and also knowing that you do want to have good behavior in this right. So there's some sort of like moral compass, also that that you're using here. I think that, especially now, a lot of people are confused as to like, where north is on that moral compass. Would you agree? Yes. And so I'd love for you to talk about that. Because that I think, is a lot of the root of where some of this conflict lies when we're just looking through this lens of our own moral compass.


Yeah, when I was much younger as a child and as a young adult, and in my early career My early days in a career in broadcasting, I've always been very outgoing, very mouthy. Quite the wit, sarcastic all of it. I've just always been out there with my comebacks. And I have learned as I've gotten older, the power of love, first of all, behavior is vital. And I don't know, if children are really learning like, Well, no, they are learning how important behavior is. I think sometimes as we adults, we forget how important our behavior is, in my experience, there's a lot that you can't take back. So I do believe that there's a right way to behave. And I also feel really strongly that sometimes in this is hard for someone like me, doing more listening is vital. And two, as my mother used to say, your big mouth is gonna get you into trouble some day, I don't want to ever make things worse for someone else. I definitely don't want to make things worse for me. And so I've really learned, I've had to concentrate on being quieter, a better listener. And that's been incredibly valuable in terms of my own behavior. And yes, I do believe that there's a right and a wrong. I mean, I am somebody who I receive huge volumes of mail, email, Twitter, like social media, huge, huge volumes. And I used to be very thin skinned, and I get a lot of I wouldn't call it hate. Now, as much as I mean, people can disagree with me, that I've always felt like that is what makes the caller robust is like, Oh, you're mixing it up a little bit. But I receive a lot of really hateful messages. And I just take it and they're always from a lot of time from elderly people. Really, I mean, some awful stuff has come my way from elderly people. And I don't know what that if there's a filter this disappearing or why. But I do think that we've lost our compass a little bit. And it has to do with, I grew up in a dairy farm and a really small town. And if I was out and about as a child, and I put a foot wrong, I remember once I was riding my bike down the wrong side of the street, I was riding facing traffic. And the next Sunday at church, a woman at church who lived nearby, mentioned that to me. I was like, nine years old. And I'm like, dang, I can't even like excuse me, I can't even I'm being spied on and corrected. But I really had the benefit of growing up in a community where adults would give you a quiet correction, a gentle correction. And I think that is incredibly valuable. And I don't know, one of our daughters just moved into this massive subdivision in Orlando. And I think it's gonna work out great. But the first thing we just went to visit and the first thing I was looking for was, Are there bikes in the garage? Like, are there people out walking on the sidewalk, like I want this family to be in a community where people know who they are, where if the kids, I have two grandchildren, like if they go astray, they're on the wrong side of the road, whatever is somebody can gently offer them some direction. I think that's incredibly valuable.


Yeah, well, and I think it also comes back to what you were saying at the beginning to have just compassion that I think really that kind of guides our moral compass is this idea of human connection, through compassion, where when you see someone a child not doing something that is safe or inappropriate, that just out of humanity, you can quietly correct, because that's a way that we can elevate together. And I think people have shied away from that, because it all of a sudden seems very scary. And make comments on someone else's behavior.


Jan. Absolutely. And this is the thing about living in a small place because these people love your parents. And but no, I think that a lot of people wouldn't dare offer a correction to it. And in fact, I get a lot of letters about this about other people's children. Can you correct them when they're at your house? I mean, and the answer is yes. Yes. I say yes to that. Yeah. Yeah. And frankly, someone like experiences as a child. Some of my best experiences happened and other people's homes because I was in the situation and my household was pretty it was on the Your farm was failing, my father left with like, pretty sad and lonely sometimes. But I had these girlfriends in a winter their houses, especially my one friend, her parents were just such great models for they were so nice to each other. They were really, really into children. And I still know these people, and I'm close to them. And I've told them many times how influential their household was, for me. It gave me a way to look at things that felt positive, reassuring. But no, people don't want to do that. You know what I liked about teaching that I'm aware of the children. Now, teachers talk a lot about kindness. Jen, when I was in elementary school, you didn't talk about kindness. You weren't praised for being unkind. You really weren't. And I think that's an incredibly positive, very positive and fairly recent style. I don't know it children are, I think, encouraged to understand their feelings more than we were. When I was young. It was like, stuff that down, it'll go away. You know, what, the legs? Yeah, well, and it's so important. And because when children grow up, recognizing that they have VLANs, they then learn to manage them to modulate them. And I think that's where compassion grows.


Yes. And as you're saying this, I just want to underscore what you're saying, because it is really important. And being in the classroom, as some of these like kindness initiatives are coming up, it's like very easy as an adult in the space to feel cynical and jaded about it, right? Because you're doing all of these things. And all of a sudden, oh, now there's gonna be this kindness campaign. There's like other thing I need to do. Right? Right. And it's a go back to this shifting of your paradigm a little bit. And this reframe is this is actually something that is an opportunity that you get to practice yourself as an adult, because let's be honest, the kids are not learning to be kind by getting blue ribbons of how kind they were at the end of the week. They're really watching the adults in these spaces and seeing how is this playing out? Because even as you were describing your story about your friend's house, you were describing what you observed, not the number of compliments you got for how kind you were at their house. It's, you know, what am I experiencing? What is the culture like? So these kindness campaigns or whatever social emotional program you might have in your school is not just about the kids, this is about having an opportunity for you as the adult in these spaces to embody the practices, which is then how we teach the kids?


Absolutely, yeah. And I assume that these campaigns are met with a lot of citizens have in the break room?


Sure, no. Oh, they are? Oh, yeah.


But I will say, as an observer, and as a grandparent, and I spend a lot of time around children. It's working. I think it really, really matters. I spent some time at my little village school where I went to school, and I've done some literacy programs there. And I'm really impressed us very impressed by how kind the children are to each other. To me, honestly, when you time traveled back, right, if you're an adult, I mean, have you ever taught in your elementary school? I have not. Okay, Jen. It's crazy. It's crazy. Yeah. Can you imagine because you had the smells, you're like, Oh, the principal's coming around the corner. Like you have all of the feelings that you had as child and all of these feelings and impulses as a child. And I assure you, so being in the exact same space and teaching, I assure you, we were never as a well behaved, considerate and kind of as these children were, we were like less. That was like crazy. So I like it.


Yes. And I think that's the thing, right? Like, we have to start with the adults in the spaces. Because like you said, it is working in the places that really embrace this idea. Even before the kids get out of the car when I dropped them off in the morning. It's like Bye, love you have a good day be kind. And at night to at our dinner table. We do some gratitude, sharing whatever, but like, how are you kind today, and keeping that at front of mind is really, really important. And I really do think that's how then we kind of move that needle back to true north of this moral compass,


right? Being kind is different for being nice. When I was a kid, we're trying to be nice, yet you were taught to be nice and oftentimes being nice. I mean, it's just on a whole different level being nice. It means you're being accepted by the group. It's I don't know it has a different quality kindnesses. It has a very deep quality. And for instance, I mean, when I was due her children's age no one ever mentioned kindness to me. And I go, but uh, you know, despite what I said about my own household, it was a really cool fun. I had an amazing mother who was like, very, very, very dialed in. But the conversations were not about that. It was more about winning. Yeah,


yes. Tell me more about that. Because that resonates with me.


Yeah, just the importance of winning. And that's another thing that seems very different to me from now, is the model we had was sports, sports, music, I participated in everything. And that was your venue to express yourself. And winning at that, at whatever I was doing. It was certainly important to me to feel like it was winning. And by winning, I mean, excelling. I can't remember ever been praised for a good effort. But lots of accolades for excelling.


That resonates a lot. And I'm thinking to now with this shift in this direction of kindness and what even you were saying before is people want to feel validated. Right? A lot of times that validation comes with what we call like achievements, like what are we achieving? How many like good job gents, how many A's do they get? How many gold stars you know, for me as a performer to its to the audience applauded? Do they been loud enough? Did they give me standing ovation? You know, what are the critics say, they know the next day and the paper, those sort of external validations of things were metrics of like you said, it was like winning and achievements. And that is what I thought was really important. And truly, until COVID, kind of like squashed everything about everyone's reality, but particularly mind because we're talking about me right now. I had to reframe what being successful actually looked like and felt like and what I found was the metrics that I really wanted to start using was my connections with people and how I felt because like, achieving didn't always feel good.


Well, when you look back, as I seem to be doing a lot in this conversation, nobody I said this to one of my nephews recently, who had just graduated from college, and someone was ragging on him about his grades. And I was like, Dude, I am here to tell you, no one will ever ask you what grade you got in that class is never going to happen. But what I did say, pivoting back to you is that, for me, certainly the college experience, in fact, because they live in my hometown, the whole educational experience was about connecting and feeling safe as a child to connect with other children, other families. Yeah, that's what it's all about. And it's, you look as a musician. I mean, if you're rehearsing hours a day, and then I'm on this live radio show, that's we perform before a large audience, sometimes huge audience sometimes is huge. Okay, here's the story about winning. The second time I was on the show, as a new panelist, I spoke with a producer and I said, I just don't feel like I can. No, I don't feel like I'm doing very well. She said, why is that? And I said, Well, unlike not winning the quiz, and she was like, Are you kidding me with this? She said, Amy, this is not about winning the game. The idea? She said, I'll never forget she said wasn't what Paula Poundstone does. She has literally never won. She lies herself on fire before she goes down and is you are brave enough to go down in flames. You are going to love doing this. And they're gonna love you. What a lesson.


Yes. And so how did you then go into your next show? What changed for you?


What change was I decided to have a lot more fun, less focused. And because it's a trivia show, I had gone in sort of wanting to ace the quiz. And what I realized was the most enjoyable parts for the audience's it's like on SNL when people break and the most fun for the audience is when your ad libbing when you're laughing when you're an another thing. I think this I am unique as a panelist on the show for what I do. I am very, very generous to the other performers. I laugh because it's all stirred up to mediums and me. I like I have a day job, if any, I want to you and ask but I'm not a professional comedian. But stand up comics. You get them together in a group and they're not they're not going to laugh at your bit. I feel like I have a pass because I'm not a stand up kind of like and I really I think I'm generous as a performer. I really enjoy what other people are doing and let them Have the spotlight and let them win. Yeah, it's fine. It's all about like having fun. It's an audience experience. I love it when the audience I mean, it's so much fun. It's a radio show jam that people come to watch. And we're like, you know, you could just listen for free this weekend, but they pay money, and they come to watch. And it's really glorious experience performing like that. It's wonderful.


Yeah, what, uh, you know, I think that is a really beautiful lesson, right? I mean, when you stop thinking about the outcome, and the end results, and you're just in the moment, having fun being authentic, that's when the magic happens. Whether you're on age, or in the classroom, or at home with your partner. That's it,


Jen, dare to Vale, we need t shirts.


Let's do it. Because at the end of the day, there's really no such thing,


right. And it's like, I think your your sister quoted this in a previous episode, that it's like, the person who's thinking the most about you is you, other people, like you're in your head, night and day, this stakes, that's not a thing that really helped me honestly, in my career in my personal life, understanding what the stakes are having a clearer view of what the stakes are, sometimes the stakes are very, very big, lots of times, they're not. And so when the stakes are low, I permit myself to fail with grace, light myself on fire trip over this sidewalk. I just allow myself to be human in that way. And I really started enjoying my sales


a lot more, you just reminded me of something too, because whether we're on stage or whether we're in for me, I experienced this even more. Even with my experience as a performer. I felt this more as a teacher as a role as being a teacher of this performativity of what I had to show up as because I thought, I created this persona for myself based on what I thought other people expected of me, right. And so what happened was, I would pretzel myself into something that was so uncomfortable. But on the outside, I looked put together, I looked like I knew all of the things I needed to know like, you know, you want someone solid go to Jen. But what happened was, and yeah, of course, it was dependable and reliable. But all of that stuffing inside of me was so uncomfortable was is the only word I can think of to really describe that. And until I had that moment where my world imploded during COVID. And I realized that actually coming to the same conclusion, which was what you just described as my faults, my missteps, my humanity, my mistakes are actually part of the process and in sharing it, and being transparent, is actually how I'm able to make more connections to people because it's real,


right? It's real. I mean, when I get praise from my books, or my column or whatever, it's often in those terms that end when people meet me in person at a book event, they'll oftentimes only that they like my work because I'm so real. I've written two memoirs, nothing tragic. I just put it out there about for innocence crying on the bus for a year after my I still cry about my divorce, by the way, and it was like 30 years ago, but I've come to realize that a lot of people are very uncomfortable with their own humanity, their own reality. I'm like, Oh, I'm not writing about anything that I can't own. There's a lot of stuff I don't want to own I probably won't write about but being out in the world and being a bumbling stumbling human is honestly, I didn't realize people thought that was brave. But it's the kind of bravery that I like. Yeah. And it's way more fun. Yeah, way more fun. It's,


yeah, get into community with people who also recognize their own humanity, we get to actually have fun with that together. And in my world. That's what my hope is for everybody to just wake up to their own humanity. So we can do this without all the pretense and get back to really that compassionate connection to each other. So we can all be human and stumbled through. Jen,


can I ask you as an educator? This is silly. Maybe but what do you think about the show? Avid Elementary?


Oh, I haven't seen it. Okay, I want to know, what do you think about Abbott Elementary?


I think it's really amazing because a lot of the qualities you and I have been talking about today are on full display with the teachers at that school. The main character is this sort of Liz Lemon, like love with women. It's so endearing because you really see how brave it is to be out there. And I think how good it is for children to see adults being real, being making mistakes and then cleaning up their mistakes. And I just think it's all of the teachers. It's an incredibly positive show about early education. It's wonderful. Well,


I will be starting that tonight. Thank you because I needed something to watch tonight. I ended my, my other TV shows. So new series starts tonight. We've been doing that one. Yeah, I need to ask you. Of course, the question that I asked everybody at the end of the podcast is, what is your dream for the future of education?


As a parent of five and a grandparent? I guess I would like to see education opened up, if that makes any sense. For instance, I'm very happy to see that standardized testing is less well, at the college level, the SATs are a lot of colleges are looking at that. And to really educate the whole child, look at the whole child, teach pro social behavior, get children into community. Yeah, this is what I want to see. That's what I want to say, you know, Jen, when I went to my little elementary school, talk about this time travel experience, I said to them, they had been primed. They were like, a really famous writer is going to come la blah, blah. So I went in, and I said, Okay, I have something incredible to tell you. And they're like, why? And I said, I went to this goal. And they were like, I then understood, you know, children's book, authors love doing school events. I see why these kids were so so thrilled. But anyway, my choice to sort of reveal that in a way like I really made them pay attention, there was this build up and that they told them and they were floored. So yeah, that's connection. That's connection that really


is, you know, that's beautiful. And I to see schools as an incubator for the community. And making that connection explicitly is part of the job.


Yeah, Jen, and I think we're wrapping up. But I want you to know that a couple of months ago, I bought a building on Main Street, you're afraid now. And I am going to open a library. I really wanted to have a place where kids could go after school, do their homework, do puzzles and games hang out. And that's really, my mission.


And heart got very tingly when you were describing that. I need to learn more. And after we stopped recording, I want to learn more about how I can help in that endeavor as well. Because that feels all the good feels.


Yeah, I just really, I feel very strongly about providing a safe space where kids can just be themselves, hang out, do what they want. And adults will be around like, I'll be there. Other adults will be there. And I'm very, very excited. I'm very excited.


Yes. And that what a beautiful full circle. Yeah, totally. I love it. Amy, thank you so much for your time and your talents and for just sharing your expertise with me. And with the take notes audience. I really appreciate it.


Thank you, Jen.


So if you enjoy today's episode, make sure you subscribe and tell friends. And I will also make sure that I link all of the things that Amy has, for example, her books. And wait, wait, don't tell me as well as the podcast episode that we kept referring to because that's important for you to listen to also. And we'll see you next time on take notes. Incredible, right? Together, we can revolutionize the face of education. It's all possible. And it's all here for you right now. Let's keep the conversation going on empowered educator faculty room on Facebook.

Let’s be honest, empowered educators, aim for a bright future for each of our students. We want them to succeed, not just inside the classroom, but also in the real world.
And when you think about it, we guide them to bridge the gap between how our students see themselves and how they act and behave.
As their teachers and role models, we must understand the power we hold when we show up for our students. We are their mentors and setting a good example is important for them to hone their future.
Welcome to episode 29 of Take Notes with Jen Rafferty podcast! Today, I’m speaking with AJ Crabill. He is an advocate and public speaker on education reform.
AJ believes that student outcomes don’t change until adult behaviors change. And he shares the importance of transformation of adult mindset to encourage our students.
You get to be the change you want to see in your students.
Stay empowered,
Jen

Let’s keep the conversation going! Find me at:
 Jen Rafferty | Instagram, YouTube, Facebook | Linktree
Instagram: @jenrafferty_
Facebook: Empowered Educator Faculty
Room

About AJ:
AJ Crabill serves as Conservator at DeSoto ISD -- where during his guidance, DeSoto improved from F ratings in academics, finance, and governance to B ratings -- and as Governance Director at CGCS. He served as Deputy Commissioner at Texas’ Education Agency and Board Chair of Kansas City Public Schools.

Connect with AJ:
Website: www.ajcrabill.com
https://www.greatontheirbehalf.com/
IG: @ajcrabill7

TRANSCRIPT:  As educators, we hold a very important role for our students future. But when there is a problem with behavior in the classroom, we often point fingers at the students and build in consequences without ever taking a second to meaningfully look at your role as the adult in that situation. My guest today believes that student outcomes don't change until adult behaviors change. And he shares the importance of transformation of adult mindset to encourage our students, we are the variable in every situation. So you get to be the change you want to see in your students. The way forward most often happens when we look at ourselves in the mirror. And look, that's not always easy, but it's truly the most important work that we do in school or anywhere. Here is where you get back to your agency and feel empowered. I'm really excited to share this conversation with you. And this work only works within community. So if you are listening, it is time that you join the Facebook group empowered educator faculty room, because if you enjoyed this podcast, you will love the Facebook group where you'll get live workshops with me giveaways, insights and where we can celebrate you throughout your Empower journey. You belong here in the Empowered educator, faculty room on Facebook. Remember all the passion and vision you had when you first went into teaching. Feeling like building young minds and creating community through your work would make a lasting impact on this world. Well, those days may feel like they're behind you now because you're exhausted, stressed and overwhelmed and frustrated. But I'm here to tell you it doesn't have to be like this. In fact, the love of teaching never really went away. But it absolutely needs transformation. Welcome to The Take notes Podcast. I'm Jen Rafferty, former music teacher, mom of two, and certified emotional intelligence practitioner, and I'm here to light the way for you. In order to create a generational change for our kids. We need to shift the paradigm away from the perpetual stress and overwhelm and into a life of joy, and fulfillment. This is education 2.0, where you become the priority, shift how you live your life, and how you show up both at work, and at home. So take a sip of steamy morning coffee, and grab your notebook. It's time to take notes. Hello, everyone. And welcome back to a another wonderful episode of take notes. I am here today with an incredible guest AJ kraebel, who serves as the conservator at DeSoto Independent School District in Texas, where during his guidance to so to improve from F ratings and academics, Finance and Governance to be ratings, and he also serves as governance director at Council of the Great City Schools. He has also served as deputy commissioner at Texas Education Agency and Board Chair of Kansas City Public Schools. He believes that student outcomes don't change until adult behavior has changed. And changing adult behaviors requires new mindsets, new knowledge and or new skills. And his intention is to transform student outcomes through the transformation of adult mindsets, knowledge and skills starting with his own. So clearly, you can see why I wanted him as a guest on the show. Thank you, AJ so much for being here today with us. Thank you for having me, Jim. I'm excited to just get this conversation going. So can we just dive in a little bit about why have you come to this realization and discovery that children's outcomes don't change until adult outcomes change.


This is actually kind of intuitive for a lot of us. So many of us have had that situation where we had a student whose behavior in this group of class was one way and then their behavior in this group of classes with a very different way. You know what I'm talking about? Have you ever been, I know


exactly what you're talking about? What do y'all get into meetings, and we're like, Wait, he doesn't act like that way for you, you know, what's happening here.


I certainly reflect on my own journey. And I can think of years where I performed at a level that even I didn't know I could perform at in these teachers classes, and was just a an unholy terror in these classes. And at the time, I certainly didn't have the capacity to be reflective on what's going on here. But with the benefit of hindsight, like it's clear to me that the adult behaviors that I experienced in these two sets of classrooms, which is fundamentally different than that in one classroom, there's this mindset, you know, little AJ doesn't want to learn and so we're just gonna just gonna figure out how to get through to how to survive this drama and, and maybe even we'll just get rid of him and his other classroom. The mindset is, you know, he he wants something for himself and we want something for him and, and he's got the goods to make good on that. What am I going to do as a teacher to help be the bridge between where little he is and where he wants? To be in that mindset, I was blessed, and I've thrived. I think my story is probably everybody's story. We've had this experience of these two ways that people showed up in our lives. And that is young people. Often we were responsive to that. I take that as incredibly encouraging news. Because if there's any validity to this idea that student outcomes don't change until adopt behaviors change. The blessing in that is that we don't have to wait for the right children to come along. We don't have to wait for the right teachers, we got to wait for the right. Parents. We don't have to wait for the right school budgets, you know, for the right legislative environment, that what's possible with this, for the children in our orbit can emerge immediately from my willingness to change my adult behavior. Oh, 100%.


And that's, I think the best part of recognizing that you're the problem, because you're also the solution that right? Yeah, totally the solution. Absolutely. Yeah, that is good news. That's the best news because we don't have to wait, we can actually start like right now. I have a sense of agency. Oh, 100%. Yes. Because if we're always gonna be waiting for like, like you said, the right group of kids or the right legislator, the right administrators, or the right school board, we are just gonna be waiting and counting down the years, you gotta be waiting for a minute, Jen, we will be waiting. Yeah, it would have been done years to retirement, because you can't wait to get out of there. Because it just never happened for you. And that's the reality for a lot of people.


That is not the day to day grind that I want for any of our teachers, what folks show up at work, just kind of treading water getting through waiting for the world to change. I want people to be able to live their passion, why they came to the classroom to begin with, like, what, what are we doing here, that here to be angry and frustrated and broken, we're here to live in to our own greatness, and through us to cause your greatness in the lives of the children that we interact with. That's why we all showed up. That's what we're doing here. That's what we want. And I see this, at least for me, as an inspiration that challenges me to stand in the place not necessarily instead of truth. Like I'm not putting this out there. This is the truth for the ages. Because on a whole nother angle, someone might argue, are you saying that young people can't be the architect of their own learning? Absolutely. I'm not saying that. And so the point of this isn't to D agency, are students and saying, Well, they can't create their own educational improvement, but as to rather create a sense of agency for me, it will like in whatever role that I'm in, what is it that I can be doing? How can I modify how I'm showing up and who I'm being in the moment in a way that can really be transformative for our students.


But I think that that is truth there, AJ, I think that is capital T truth. Because when you understand your own power and your agency and feel empowered in those moments, from moment to moment, there is an actual ripple effect that happens because when you show up differently, everyone around you shows up differently to give permission to everybody. Right? So while No, you are not 100% responsible for the children in your class, and the choices that they're making, in being responsible for your own choices, that 100% And that is truth affects the outlying environments, wherever you go,


the way I talked to, we're going to visit with teachers, education leaders, the term I use is parallel process, this phenomenon that whatever the leaders are doing, that in that moment, we are silently and subconsciously often giving permission to those who subscribe to our leadership to do the same. And so if we have a PLC, if I'm leading the PLC, and I show up exactly on time to the PLC every week, then I am silently permission others to do the same. If I roll into the PLC five minutes late every week and have the word leave the PLC I am silently giving permission to everyone else to do the same. This idea of parallelism is this parallel process, though, that the leader is doing and permissioning others to do I absolutely believe that that's powerful. Just as much so in the boardroom as it is, in the principal's office, it is it in the classroom, that how I show up is more likely to be echoed than just the demands I make them. Well, you all should treat each other respectfully, dammit. Well, how I'm showing up is more likely to permission the behavior than the things that I'm giving as an instruction.


Yeah, you know, and I'm laughing because what you're joking about, it's true. It's just there are people and it doesn't matter in which role you are in in the school, right there is this drip effect that happens. And so when you are wondering, why aren't people showing up on time, and you're the one who's also doing the thing,


rolling up minutes late, right,


you know, and but that goes for everything that goes for kindness that goes for respect, that goes for communication that goes was for expectations and agreements that we have with each other to create culture in a school district, that as a leader, you have a responsibility to do this internal work and really figure out what is my role here because you are the home of the energetics, you know, and how everything kind of aligns and is attuned to creating some sort of progress, whether it's the progress that you want, or not, that a lot of it depends on how you show up and do this internal work


absolutely reminds me, I was doing a classroom walkthrough once I was visiting the building and wanted to do some walkthroughs, because the building was really struggling. And as I went to one particular classroom, and I saw some of the most appalling instruction I hadn't seen in a while, it's like, there's no sense of connection or engagement between the educator and the learners. I'm not clear on what the lesson is. I'm not clicking anybody else in the room. Is any two people in the room? unclear what the lesson is just so many things. Yes, no questions rather than open ended questions. I'm not hearing academic language. Students are being engaged. Just I saw some of what I found just just horrible instruction, but these children are not receiving the blessing of their hate receive. And so I left that classroom finished doing the walkthroughs. Fast forward, a year later, I'm in a different school. And I noticed that the same teacher that whose horrible instruction I saw the year before, is now at this school was like, whoa, what, why is this person still here? And I immediately go into this kind of confused, like, I believe this was horrible structure. But why not? We need to go in here. Have you been in here that you're you're the principal, why haven't we go into there? It's like, well, Lil, let's watch and see. So the principal guides me into the classroom. She's standing right next to it, we watch. And I sit in the back of the classroom for 15 minutes and watch some of the most amazing instruction I have ever seen. All the students were engaged. Everybody knew exactly what was going on. Folks, were excited about the learning fired up about the lesson. The teacher was busy, you know, providing guidance, you know, not the sage on the stage situation here. But you have students working there different groups, and folks, you know, we're demonstrating autonomy, like it was just this really beautiful classrooms edit. And we step out in the hallway with the principal's like, what, this is not what I saw for this person last year. And the principal she hit me with. Yeah, that's because principal last year didn't believe her. But I do. And something about just how that principals showed up differently for that teacher, made all the difference in how that teacher showed up for those students. And so this idea of parallelism, that as a leader, whether a pure leader or formal leader, or you know, that informal leader in the building, who everybody looks up to, but even though they don't have the official title, that I have real power and how I show up for people in the work that I've done, in my own mind, that who I'm being in the moment really creates a safe space for them to be the best version of themselves as well.


I'm so glad you shared that story, too. Because I also imagine in that year where that teacher was struggling, there were moments where they must have questioned what they were doing, should I even teach because that they felt it. And I think that's where a lot of teachers are right now, because everyone's so activate. I mean, we're still just coming off the pandemic. We're not out of the woods yet. And I think that there's this big questioning process of what am I even doing here? And I think everyone's activated,


then to make matters worse, you have some knucklehead, you know, muckety, mucks come to a walkthrough and see you I'd probably your legitimate, where's the day of the good, and I certainly was not breathing possibility into that teacher in the moment. And so yeah, I absolutely get in that moment, in part due to my behavior and how I showed up in the walkthrough a year one versus year two, like in that moment, we run the risk of losing an absolutely amazing educator, because the leadership behavior is and see how it can modify itself to be of service to that particular educator and to through her than open up what's possible for a classroom of students children suffered in that day. And the difference maker was adults, in this case, district leaders and building leaders changing our behavior to really open up possibility for the teachers we serve.


Absolutely. And I think that is what's happening now is that we're losing a lot of our best and brightest because of just that. And you know, we talk often about you know, we have this beautiful analogies of the flowers in growing we don't blame the flower we change the environments, right? We have all of these like stories around this but the thing is, we are the environments that the people who are in these places or these other people, we are the environments we are bringing no


sunshine whatsoever that the people out here We'll


wait. And we wonder why, like what's happening, right? Why isn't my garden growing? Well, because you're not nourishing it. In fact, you're giving it more of what it really doesn't need. And so looking at ourselves in this way, as as being part of this environment, I think is a really important perspective to take.


Yeah, I'm out here sprinkling pesticide on the garden front to figure out why in a row. And the problem is,


yes, and the thing is, to a day, I'm sure you've discovered this, in your own journey is that looking at a mirror doesn't always feel good, it's painful, sometimes always best to blame the others first, it seems like But how's that working for us. But it is painful to look in the mirror, because you have to really dig deep. And I think circling back to what you were saying before about what your own beliefs are about what's possible, about how you think about your self efficacy, and your ability to show up the way you want to all of that impacts how you're going to be interacting with the kids in your classroom and your colleagues. And really taking a look at that mirror is asking yourself some really hard questions, which is painful. But when we all do it together, there's this beautiful community and then sticking with this garden metaphor, our garden grows. So I have a question now I want to shift a little bit is, you know, you have an incredible amount of experience with school boards. And I really do want to talk about this and highlight this a little bit. Because I think sometimes when you think about the school boards, it is a little bit like this group of people on this mountain who make the decisions. And we need to ask permission to talk to the people


bring the tablets back down, chiseled.


Yes, we only go there when there's a big emergency and everything's on fire. So can you talk to us a little bit about really what the role of a school board is, and how we can work with a school board to reach this common vision that we all have?


Yeah, so the work of the school board is quite unique and separate from everybody else in the school system. So the board's job is to represent the vision and values of the community that to really listen to what happens you have a community, but there's just too many of us in the community to all sit around a table and make decisions about things that the school should be doing. And so at some point, somebody said, instead of having the 100,000 of us sit around a table and make decisions, why don't we get people who represent our vision for what should happen, which shouldn't, you know, be able to our values are non negotiables. Let's hire some folks who are going to represent us and Aboriginal values and have them do this on our behalf. We refer to that group that the community hires to represent its vision and its values on its behalf, we refer to that group as the school board. So that is the job school board is to represent the vision and values of the community, the vision that describes what we want our students to be able to do. And the values described, what are the non negotiables that have to be honored on the journey, then the job of the superintendent and everyone else in the organization is to implement the vision and values of the community. It's actually not teachers, job principals, job and superintendents job to decide what the community wants for its children. It's not those folks job, the job is to hear what their vision is as distilled from communicated by the board, and then to figure out how are we going to make that happen? In reality, this is a hard distinction to maintain, because you simultaneously have teachers, principals, superintendents, who probably live in the community as well do have their own ideas about what the vision of value should be. And you simultaneously have school board members whose sole job is to represent the vision values, but not to implement it constantly trying to figure out how can we get more and more involved in the day to day implementation. And so this can be a tough separation to maintain the value of maintaining atones because then you segregate expertise, the expertise of individual school board members, is listening to the community, understanding the community's vision or values and writing it down. And by the way, the written form committees vision and values. That's what we mean by policy policy is nothing more than the codification of the community's vision and values. That is the sole expertise. So even if you have a board member who has been a teacher, they're not on the board, to bring the expertise of a teacher, certainly the perspective of a teacher, but they're on the board to represent the vision of values of the community. And when we hire staff, we're not hiring staff who need to have expertise and going out and listening to the community vision and writing about the policy. We're hiring staff who have expertise in taking a set of vision about what we want our students and are able to do, and operationalize that on a daily basis. That is the work of our staff. And so we need both, but they certainly do different jobs. Like you hear the old adage it takes a village to raise a child. This is certainly the case. What is often missed is not all the villagers have the same job. Add, some villagers have the job of actually working with the students. Some villagers have the job of just listening for and synthesizing the entire villages vision and values, and then passing that on to the teacher to say, here's what has to get done, you go figure out how it gets done.


So can we pause here for a second? Because I want to just say what's on my mind. All of that sounds so beautiful, and practical and valuable. And for me as a community member in the school district that I worked into, I think what I have observed in that experience and other areas that I've been at, is there is a breakdown in the communication of what those values are, and how they're being implemented. Is that like, the biggest breakdown that you've experienced?


That is essentially the crux of the book I just wrote.


Great. So yes, because we need things like that. Because, you know, I'm thinking like, Okay, I'm hired as a new baby teacher, and I've got bright eyed and bushy tailed, and I'm, like, ready to go to teach my content and change the world with my students. And here I go, and I have no idea what the role of the school board is, until all of a sudden, I mean, I was a music teacher, there's a problem, they want to cut my program, I might not have a job next year. And that is my first relationship with the school board. That's crazy to me.


What's odd about that is, generally speaking, when the school board is really doing its job, well, you're probably never going to hear about them at all, even when your program has shifted. Like, ideally, those type of decisions aren't decisions that the board's making are involved in at all. That's the implementation layer. And so where I often see things go really sideways. Some of the failure modes, the school boards, entertain, winds up being when boards are actually showing up at schools and trying to engage themselves in decision making, well, we should keep this program we should cut that one. I don't think she's a very good teacher. I've heard people don't like her. And so we should do something about that. Well, you know, he's a really good guy, he goes about church, so we should keep him when boards get involved at that level, then you do hear about them, for good reason, because they're creating real harm within the organization. But generally speaking, if board members are really, really doing their job, well, most of the time, they should be really impossible to run into, because they're very much behind the scenes.


So tell me more about the crux of your book about this communication breakdown. And then how do we navigate it and in a way, so we can make it work, because we are talking about the adults here again, because in order to serve kids, we need to talk about the adults in


the book, essentially, if we want to see improvements in student outcomes in the classroom, that's going to happen largely by the teacher just getting stronger and stronger, and aircraft day in day out, just continuous improvement. And it's a really simple formula, you know, be clear about what exactly it is we're trying to accomplish in the classroom today, actually deployed, do some measurement to figure out what works reteach where necessary. Wash, rinse, repeat, it's this is really tight, continuous improvement cycle. And as long as we've got the appropriate short cycle assessment, and we've got some coaching, preferably, but not evaluative sort, that we can just make it a really tight, we're just week in week out, I'm just getting stronger and stronger and stronger. And the next year, when I come to this exact same content, I'm gonna be on fire because we really hold and hug and hold that continuous improvement cycle is the almost the exact same thing that boards need in the boardroom. And the step one is we got to get clear about why we're here, I refer to that as a focus mindset. And this is where the train often leaves the tracks very early on in the process is that it can be very easy for board members to get off into believing that their job is to be the ombudsman and appease the needs of those who are privileged enough to be connected to the board members. That's actually not the job of the board. But it can feel that way. But it's not. And so the first step is a focus mindset. Why does the school system exist? And what I offer is the school system exists for one reason, one reason only, it's to improve student outcomes. It's to cause improvements in what students know and are able to do to cause improvement and what students know and improvement to what they are able to do. Because when children walk out of the school house for the last time, the only thing they're taking with them is what they do and the ability to do without giving them they don't get to take a teacher with them when they leave, we're probably not giving them a stack of textbooks when they leave, we're probably not giving them a laptop when they leave. When they leave. They leave with what they know and they're able to do the job of schools is to cause an increase in what students go and are able to do. That's step one, in the continuous improvement process for school boards. Is it going to focus mindset to be very clear that that is The work in that our access in the boardroom to causing that is through changing our adult behavior. Focus mindset is step one. Step two is getting clear about the priorities. And this tool is where many boards completely fail. And they can't tell you Oh, what the priorities I frequently walk into a board meeting where I've been invited in to provide some coaching for the boys say, okay, what are your priorities? Are you all clear about your priorities? Yes, absolutely. All right, well, pop quiz everybody. There's a pad of paper in front of us pit, everybody write down the priorities for this board? And we're gonna call it Yeah, no problem. We'll write that down. You can guess where this thing is going. Alright, folks read above. I have $100. Bill for any two people who work the exact same.


Have you ever given away that $100? Bill, I need to know


all my buddies about pocket. But the challenge is the board's not clear about the priorities. But just in and among itself, there's definitely no way there's going to be clarity between the board and the rest of the school system. Part of the reason this is particularly dangerous is because then if the board says, Oh, well, we need a shifting of this direction. And then they look at where the school says, Well, how come what you're doing is in alignment with what we're doing? Well, you need to hurry up and get alignment, because we're going this way now. And in that context, you see, school systems do really wild things, to try to be responsive to this kind of Herky jerky, non clarity of priorities. And often this is where programs, programs change. And this is where the flavor of the month concept comes from, oh, well, this week, we'll go in this direction this week, we'll go in that direction. All of this emanates from failure to get clear about what the priorities are. That's step two, after that, it's just the same implementation stuff the teachers got to do. After we get clear about the priorities, then it's monitor progress, align resources, and communicate the results and then wash, rinse and repeat over and over again. And so like I say, the the fundamental continuous improvement cycle is pretty similar between the boardroom in the classroom, they look a little bit different. But the key thing is that the board's not doing it. It has powerful ripple effects throughout the entire organization.


Sure. And the way you just kind of laid this out in this framework, it seems so simple. It's not easy. Not easy, but very simple. It's very simple. And one of the things I think that complicates it a little bit is this perceived power dynamic between superintendents, and the school board. And I'm sure this comes up a bit for you. Can you talk a little bit about those power dynamics, and how that can potentially complicate that process that you just laid out for us?


Well, a common misconception, you actually asked the question correctly. A common misconception, however, among board members, is a misinterpretation of the question you just asked. And so my way of getting at this, I'll ask a board that I'm newly working with, went to seven number school board, a lot of school boards across the country of five, seven or nine members were mostly usually around seven. I'll ask them how many bosses in the school board have? And people think how do seven, and that's completely wrong, that is 100%, wrong about the superintendent is not have seven bosses, this is a complete misunderstanding of the role. The superintendent only has one supervisor, and that supervisor is the school board, collectively as an entity, none of the seven members of that board have any authority whatsoever over the superintendent or any person on staff. And in fact, in most states, the law is very explicit that individual board members have no authority. They can't tell the superintendent to tie their shoelaces. They have no authority whatsoever is an individual board member. Now when acting in collective in collection with their colleagues on the board, then absolutely the board collectively, does have final authority over most things in the school system. But a common mistake is made his folks think that Oh, well. I'm on the school board now. So you vote for me, I'll show you how to fire this coach. And you know what, this music teacher, she's not very good vote for me, I'll show you you're gonna cut her, but I'll get rid of her. And people speak like this as if they individually represent the vision of values of the community. This is arrogance of the highest order that the board collectively represents the vision values in the community. No individual board member can lay claim to that.


I'm so glad you said it that way. And it is confusing when it's not that way. For the people in the ecosystem of the school districts and the community.


It's incredibly confusing. And I would be lying if I said that I wasn't guilty of this myself when I first joined my school board, like even if you were trying to honor that. It takes a whole different way of thinking about things and a whole different way of showing up to honor it. So when I first got on my school board, well the first thing is I went off to one of our Montessori schools and I was really curious about I want to learn more about and so I went and did a walkthrough I thought was a really interesting visit. hopped in my car drove away If I'm not 10 minutes down the road, and the superintendent called me, why the hell did you go in here and start telling people everything was wrong with their school? I'm like, Whoa, what are you talking about? I didn't do any such thing. What happened was, while I was in the building, must have made some offhand comment about one of the display boards that wasn't complete or something yet, whatever I did was triggering for folks, because a board member who served before I joined the board had a habit of going into buildings, and yelling, literally yelling at staff and telling them what was wrong with their display boards. And like, what you need to get this right, and this is, of all things, like, if we get the display boards, right fit, everybody's gonna be literate. I mean, so of all things to focus on, but this is apparently what she would do. And so I made some offhanded comment, it was super triggering for this, like, Oh, my God, now we've got a new board member. And now we got to fix all of our display boards. And so apparently, the principle that Snapseed like, I've had enough and called superintendents like, I want to grieve, or I'm angry about this person coming down and yelling at us, and the superintendent that probably picked up the phone, gave me an earful. There was a moment I realized a couple of critical things about school board. One is it is really, really hard to be clear about what my intention is, in the context of there are other board members currently serving and board members who have served before me that it's not enough for me to be mindful of what I'm communicating, I also have to be mindful of what I'm communicating in the context of the folks who come for me, if folks have experienced trauma before I got here, I have to be mindful that whatever I'm doing is going to be experienced through the lens of that prior trauma, not through the lens of my intention.


And can we just pause here for a second too, because that's true also for everything and every one and every other interaction that everyone's doing all the time. So that's like, big picture capital T truth. That's another one. But yes, in this context, right now, in school boards, that is also particularly true, yes, yeah.


And I didn't know that. And I wasn't respectful of that. I wasn't mindful of it. And even though my intention was to be uplifting, and loving and supportive, what was happening in the school, my impact was anything but and I had to do the work to clean that up, I had to do the work to earn the trust and confidence of our educators, I was not outed, I had to earn it. And basically what they were the job, I was going to the exact opposite direction. That was the first takeaway from that. But the second takeaway is I had an opportunity to spend more time and reflect whatever I'm focused on, is what other people got to disproportionately be focused on as a board member and as a board. And so if we spent all of our board meetings, talking about display boards, if we spent all of our board meetings talking about the color of the astroturf on the football field, or what color should this hallway be, or all of these things about facilities and buses, like to the extent that that's what we spend all our energy on, we are obligating our staff to spend energy on that I spent energy talking about display boards, they didn't hear anything else I said, that whole school visit, all they heard was great. Now we got to fix artists, play boards, among all the other things I've got to do for children today, whatever I'm focused on, I draw the focus of the entire school system in that direction. And so this is a critical area of failure for school boards, is that you could be forgiven for having watched a school board for a full year, and never had an idea that they were governing a school system, because they never talked about student outcomes and never talked about what is it that we want students to know and be able to do? And what is current performance relative to that community expectation. And so there's this sense that I have to be incredibly focused and dialed into, what is the thing that I want most, and also means have the discipline, to not focus on things that might actually be really worth focusing on like that objectively, hit it up themselves are really important things and vital things. If somebody calls and says, Hey, my kid didn't get picked up at school, they stood on a bus stop for three hours today, what are you going to do about that? That's a really important thing. But to the extent that I make that the focus of the next school board meeting, which probably not the focus is when that kid to get to school to actually learn something. And so that's the really hard part about any leadership role is that I've got to be disciplined enough to while they're all these important, all these urgent things that are popping up around me, I've got to constantly weigh the cost benefit of focusing on them, rather than focusing on the things that have already articulated to the priority.


And that's just it getting really clear, like you said, on what your purpose is, and what the priorities are, because that then becomes your Northstar and everything else while might seem important in the moment, can that be delegated to someone else? And does it align yes or no? And if it's no then we don't talk about that at this meeting. And that's just how it is. And it is discipline because it takes intention in your not just your behaviors, but your thoughts about audit of which thoughts you're actually going to be attaching to, to align it then with the language you're using when you speak not just to other board members, but to other members of the school community and the greater community, you have to be hyper vigilant about making sure that when you are speaking, you are speaking as that role, and it needs to be aligned.


And that's tough transition, especially as I go from educator to a board member go for being a parent to a board member, it takes a lot of intentionality to remove, the educator had to remove the parent hat and take on fully, here's the hat that I need the my students need me to be wearing right now.


That's the question, isn't it? That's a great question. What's the hat that I need to be wearing for my students right now, because then it takes you out of the equation. A lot of this, you know, we're talking about you were talking a lot about your personality. And underlying, we haven't really talked about explicitly, but like ego, right, and like, what's important and your own personal priorities. At the end of the day, this isn't about you. This isn't about any of us. This is about the mission, and the purpose of why we're here. And once you take yourself out of the equation, and things actually start to get a whole lot easier.


This is the discipline that comes with time and practice and trial and error, but it's a critical journey. But ultimately, it's what gives rise to my ongoing assertion. Do not commit don't change at all adopt behaviors change, starting with me.


Yes. And me, and you for whoever's listening. So I have to ask, before we wrap up, what is your dream for the future of education?


The thing that I dream most about is actually about the future of our society. When I say our society, I mean, the species level society at the moment, but perhaps a multispecies society very soon with the advent of AI is seemingly at our doorstep.


Oh, that is another podcast episode, we put a pin in that one.


Back, I definitely have thoughts on that one. But I dream about what's possible for our society. And my sense is that anything that is possible for us as a society, writ large, is lives or dies, inside of our ability to create really great educational opportunities for our children, that if we are not creating a space of aspiration and possibility and hopefulness and joy and learning and hard work and trial and error, if we're not creating that in a really powerful way, in our schools, I question whether our society one will be long lived at all, is that collective technology surpasses our collective wisdom. But even if somehow survival? What does that survival even look like in the absence of folks being able to live choice filled lives where they can really pursue meaning for their selves, on their own terms in a way that makes sense for them and their families like that. That's what I think about when I think about what's at stake. And that's what animates the work I do to be constantly looking at, what's the thing that we can do to improve outcomes for


all of our children? Yes, it is too important to mess it up. And that fire that I'm feeling in my belly, as you're saying these words is the thing that gets me out of bed every morning, because this is too important to be complacent. It's too important. And it's going to feel messy and difficult, clearly, right? Because change is messy and difficult. And it needs to happen in order for us to become something bigger and better than what we already are. Otherwise, what are we doing?


There's more than it's possible for us as a society. I wouldn't say a step into that possibility. And the thing that I can do to most support that is to help accelerate the transition from adult input focus to student outcomes focus.


Yes. And that is one of the reasons why I love having this platform and connecting with people like you who do the work in this world that you do, because we're stronger together. And I really believe this is how we change the world change ourselves, you change the world. Amen. Yes. Well, so before we go, I need to ask you, how can people get in touch with you and learn more about your work,


feel free to reach out AJ crable.com Just AJC are a b i l l.com. And feel free to just drop me an email AJ, AJ credible.com. Especially if you're working on something, and you're really seeing amazing results. You just want to visit with folks who can help identify how can we can we share that story? How can we spread it to more places? You know, one of the benefits of the work I do is I can just put a lot of time week in and week out with leaders who collectively are educating about 8 million of our students across the country. I have a real platform to bring to their attention things that are working. Now. These needs to be evidence I want to hear what You enjoy or what you feel passionate about. I need those things as well. But I need data that says and here's the evidence that we know this is making a difference for children like it is people have that. Like there's amazing things that are happening all around us. I'm loopy honored to be a conduit that helps spread that. And so to the extent that that's true, folks, please don't hesitate to drop me a line.


Fantastic. And I will put those links to your website and your email address in the show notes. He thank you so much for spending your time with me today. It's been really great talking with you. Thanks for having me. And if you've enjoyed today's episode, make sure you subscribe so you don't miss a single episode and share it with your friends. And I'll see you next time on take notes. Incredible, right? Together, we can revolutionize the face of education. It's all possible and it's all here for you right now. Let's keep the conversation going at empowered educator faculty room on Facebook.

Do you feel burnt out, tired, and sluggish at times?
Sometimes this can actually be because our hormones are a little out of balance.
Working in a fast-paced environment, you sometimes don’t realize that your daily habits can be extremely exhausting.
It’s easy to chuck it all up to your stressful work. But the truth is, knowing how your hormones work can help you understand how your system changes throughout the month.
Welcome to episode 28 of Take Notes with Jen Rafferty! In this episode, I’m speaking with Dr. Beth Westie. She’s an amazing author, speaker, chiropractor and the host of Female Health Solution Podcast.
During our talk, we cover the importance of knowing about how your hormones work in maintaining good health and lifestyle. Dr. Beth aims to provide the best tips and tricks that you can start implementing to help you be more productive and energetic in your work.
As an empowered educator, it’s really essential to get your body to a state of optimal functioning to serve your students better.
Today is all about the power of knowledge towards a healthier lifestyle!
The power is in your hands, are you ready to claim it?

Stay empowered,
Jen

Let’s keep the conversation going! Find me at:
 Jen Rafferty | Instagram, YouTube, Facebook | Linktree
Instagram: @jenrafferty_
Facebook: Empowered Educator Faculty
Room
About Dr. Beth:
Dr. Beth is the author of the Best Selling book, The Female Fat Solution, the creator of the 12 Week Female Hormone Solution, the Eat for Your Cycle™ Method, and the host of The Female Health Solution Podcast. She has made it her mission to change the way women view their health. Working to educate and empower women to take their health into their own hands, she uses nutrition to help women work with the natural cycle of their bodies to achieve lasting weight loss results.

Connect with Dr. Beth:
Website: www.drbethwestie.com
IG: @drbethwestie

TRANSCRIPT:  Your physical well being is essential in the work that you do, because you can't show up and be your best self for your students if you're feeling burnt out or tired or sluggish. So my guest today, Dr. Beth Westie walks us through how our hormones actually affect our body and can cause some of the feelings that we feel, and then what we can do about it when we aren't feeling good. This is about leaning into the natural cycle of our bodies instead of fighting against it. Our hormones are a part of our chemistry and when we learn about how they work, we can feel empowered, and how we navigate all of the ups and downs. Get out a pen and a notebook because you are definitely going to want to take notes for this episode. And my book 24 ways to find calm in your busy world is now available to podcast listeners for free at empowered educator.com/ebook. Here you will find 24 ways to feel more ease and joy by noticing the things that are all around you that are usually out of sight. I did all the work for you, and it's yours for free. So download your copy today at empowered educator.com/ebook. Remember all the passion and vision you had when you first went into teaching. Feeling like building young minds and creating community through your work would make a lasting impact on this world. Well, those days may feel like they're behind you now because you're exhausted, stressed and overwhelmed and frustrated. But I'm here to tell you it doesn't have to be like this. In fact, the love of teaching never really went away. But it absolutely needs transformation. Welcome to The Take notes Podcast. I'm Jen Rafferty, former music teacher, mom of two and certified emotional intelligence practitioner, and I'm here to light the way for you. In order to create a generational change for our kids. We need to shift the paradigm away from the perpetual stress and overwhelm and into a life of joy and fulfillment. This is education 2.0, where you become the priority. Shift how you live your life, and how you show up both at work, and at home. So take a sip of steamy morning coffee and grab your notebook. It's time to take notes. Hello everyone and welcome to this fabulous episode of take notes. I am here with the incredible Dr. Beth Westie, who is a chiropractor, author, speaker women's health and nutrition expert and founder of eat for your cycle and nutrition for your hormones. Dr. Beth is the author of the best selling book the female fat solution, the creator of the 12 week female hormone solution, and the eat four year cycle method and is the host of the female health solution podcast. She has made it her mission to change the way women view their health. And she works to educate and empower women to take their health into their own hands by using nutrition to help women work with the natural cycle of their bodies. Hi, thank you so much for being here.


Thank you for having me. I'm so excited.


I am excited. I came upon your work through Tracy lit and her work. I was at one of her events and you spoke there and kind of took back the curtain on what I thought was like typical normal health issues and rocks my world in a way that was like very uncomfortable. But it was beautiful because it made me really ask some very important questions. So before we kind of dive into the crux of what we'll talk about today, I really want to know what got you really interested in doing this work, particularly with a man of the first place.


Yeah, that is a great question around this. A lot of people who do this type of work I know have their own struggle that they went through. And I'm the same by quick background on me if you can hear it from how I talk. I'm from Minnesota. So I grew up on a goat farm in Minnesota, and I was an athlete in high school, went to play volleyball in college in Michigan. And then I went to graduate school, went to chiropractic school, I had my first two kids in primary school and then graduated, bought a clinic started in practice couple months later found out I was pregnant again, right like and then my youngest was born. Actually, seven months later, she was a preemie. So at that point, I had had a lot of stress. I was less than a year into business brand new, really struggling in business really struggling overall, had a two year old a four year old and a preemie. And that stress just was the max one of the most stressful times in my life. And my body's response to that was to start creating ovarian cysts. I had never had cysts before. And for women who have had cysts, they understand like holy bananas like it can be really, really painful. Really, really awful. Like it would put me on the floor. like it'd be one of those things like eye pressure and I'd be like, Yeah, this is uncomfortable. I'm sore, I have kind of a cramp. And then all of a sudden it would be like a searing knife pain that I would just drop. And we'd be on the floor for several moments like not being able to move until the pain subsided. And there wasn't a whole lot that I was given in terms of recommendations, going in making appointments, all these things where they're like, yep, Mensa says like, Yup, your sis burst. I'm like, Oh, okay. But like, I didn't understand, like, I didn't have these before. Why do I have them now. And my solutions were, oh, here's some birth control. Here's something I couldn't, like I was supposed to be just doped up on pain meds my whole life, and just take birth control my whole life. And I was like, I'm not a candidate for certain types of birth controls, I get really bad side effects from the pill, all that stuff. So I was like, this is not the best option for me, I want to take care of this. I want it like I didn't have them before. I'm having them. Now. How can I reverse this process, and I wasn't really given a lot of assistance there. And I'm also licensed in acupuncture and Chinese medicine. So what I did is started diving into doing more work with the Chinese medicine background, started getting more trainings and everything else and dove into hormones, fertility, a lot of stuff for women, and then started working. And doing the same thing for myself, like I started really working on regulating my hormones, encouraging to have a normal hormonal output each week of the month, your hormones are different every week of the month, all these other things. It took a while, right? It didn't happen overnight. But after a couple of months, I stopped having cysts like they stopped birth. And it's been just over a decade now. And I haven't had a cyst. And so when people say, Oh, you had PCOS, or if I phrase it like that I had PCOS. Technically the way that they go through this, it's something that I am at risk for. Still, if I let my hormones get out of control, or if you know, if I'm under a lot of stress, and I don't manage my health, I have the potential to having more cysts moving forward. But with managing my hormones was making sure my stress levels are under control. I haven't had assessed in that long of a time. And that's what I teach other women how to do is how to work with their hormones, how to take these issues that they're struggling with and really work with your body, your health, your hormones, and a big piece of that is really just learning more about how our body functions, and then working with that instead of fighting against it.


Yeah, I think that was one of the most eye opening things that you had talked about was that our hormones was something that that we really need to know about. I mean, saying this out loud now seems so silly, because I've been working with you and knowing your work for so long. But we talk about hormones when you talk about puberty. And if you're somebody who wants to get pregnant or has been pregnant, that's another time where you talk about them. But other than that, it's like oh, well, just PMS. And hormones actually isn't part of our natural way that we talk about our bodies ever. So the fact that we don't know really anything about them was mind boggling to me. And so high level, what's important to really know we're moving forward that people can say, Oh, wow, okay, that's something that's interesting that I just didn't know before. And well, in the I think,


to your point here, like you're absolutely right. I honestly think it's a huge disservice that we're is done for us that we don't understand more about our physiology and unlike the benefit of having our hormones shift and change. So when we talk about this, I'll split it into like two main categories, because it's easier to understand essentially, like your when you have a cycle, right day one is the first day of your period, then up until day about 14 that's when you would ovulate. That phase there are your hormone levels actually start off are actually really really low while you're having your period. Your estrogen and progesterone levels are the lowest during days like one through three. And then after that estrogens tune really starts to rise and peaks right before ovulation. Then after ovulation that flips ovulation triggers if you're having a good healthy ovulation, it triggers progesterone. And then progesterone rises, and it's elevated and more dominant than in days 15 through 28 of the cycle. Now, these hormones do completely different things in your body, estrogen is going to help give you more energy, you're going to have more mental clarity, you're going to have a better memory even it improves your digestion improves your body's ability to process carbohydrates, it improves your muscle recovery, all that other stuff and improves your metabolism like your metabolic rate is higher at this point too. So that that's estrogen oftentimes a lot of people feel fantastic during the first you know, couple of weeks of their cycle, and then they ovulate and then they're like, you know, things are starting to go downhill. I feel different. I don't feel as wonderful. And that is very common, especially for people who have access estrogen or estrogen dominance. And then after ovulation, progesterone should elevate and be more dominant. And you're going to notice Yeah, my digestion is slowed down. I feel a little more sluggish. I go to the gym and workout and I just don't feel as energized as I did two weeks earlier. My memory isn't quite as sharp as it was before. Just little different things that you can notice. And that increases up through You know, week four, though, you know, having the most PMS symptoms that women experience are usually days like 24, or 25, all the way until their period starts. So that is where oftentimes we are just not eating enough fueling enough, your system is going to need more nutrient, more protein at that point, to really lean into what your body's doing at that time with progesterone, and the fact that it's going to shift how your body chemistry works is that I feel like I just word vomited a lot. You


know, I love this word vomit is the best kind of word vomit, because as I'm listening to you, there are two things that I wanted to touch on. The first is understanding that you have you said the benefits of hormone shifting and changing. And I think hormones, colloquially get a really bad rap. Because it's like, oh, we don't want to be too hormonal. But in fact, this is just part of our chemistry that we really need to embrace and lean into. Right?


Yeah, absolutely. Like our system changes throughout the month. And that's it's not a bad thing. It just is the way it is. But that also just knowing that information. And the example I use a lot of the time is like going to the gym, because so many women can relate to this where they're like, Yeah, I go to workout sometimes. And I show up and I feel like I kicked but I just like, oh, I nailed that workout. I lifted heavier, I feel fantastic. And then you're thinking, wow, I'm getting so fit, I feel great. I recovered really well. Whoo, like Go me. And then just a couple of weeks later, you'll go to the gym, you could do the exact same workout, you could have slept the same number of hours, ate in the same thing for breakfast had the same thing for hydration, like literally everything else in your life is the same. But you go to the gym, you do this workout and you feel like holy crap, these weights are heavy. Why, oh, I feel so tired at the end of this workout. And then you feel like you don't recover as well. And you're like, oh, what's wrong with me? Nothing. You took a different body hormonally to the gym that day. So it's going to respond different. And just to understand that and lean into like, Oh, I'll give myself a little more rest time in between sets, or make sure I'm getting extra nutrients for recovery. I don't need to push my heart rate as high during this phase, because it's going to be harder for me to recover, if I'm getting my heart rate super, super high during my progesterone phase,


right? So how else can we lean into this cycle.


So besides the exercise piece of it, there's also the nutrition piece of it, I talked about eating for your hormones in your cycle, and it does match with your basal body temperature, too. So this is the Eastern medicine part of it. So it sounds a little a little out there.


No, bring it bring it.


But this is where you would be eating, cooling and warming food. And this is just a different way to look at the classification of the food that you're eating. And it's easy. And I do talk more about this stuff sometimes where it's like, oh, like, Is this good or bad to eat? Like, oh, is it banana bad to eat? Because it's fruit and it's sugar? And it's like, no, it's not bad. It's just a banana, you know, but it's what else is that doing in your system, right. And when we look at specific foods, a lot of times when you're looking at Eastern medicine, they have a certain tone to them. And they can be classified as either warming, neutral or cooling and the cooling foods, we would want to eat more of those during the estrogen phase during days one through 14, that's going to help work with that lower basal body temperature and help the production and maintenance of estrogen in your system because you're working with that phase, then after you ovulate, then you switch over to the progesterone phase and you're actually going to be incorporating warming foods. So cooling foods are going to be things like chicken, turkey, fish, any raw fruits and vegetables, seasonings that can be cooling would be rosemary, mint, thyme, cilantro, dill, just, you know, stuff that is probably in your kitchen right now. But it would be beneficial to utilize more of that during the days one through 14, and then days 15 through 28 just switched over eating more beef and bacon that's very warming after when you're in the progesterone phase there spicy foods, adding peppers using hot sauce, great. ginger, cinnamon, you know, cooking fruits and vegetables, especially because at that point to your digestion is just slower naturally, which is fine, right? So you can do things to help it along. But this is where sometimes women realize, Oh my gosh, I eat a salad for lunch every day because it's healthy. Great, right? But sometimes I have a hard time digesting it or I feel like it upsets my stomach. It's usually during the progesterone phase because your stomach digestion is just slower. So you'd have to do things either to help your digestion more and or not eat them any raw veggies, then, you know, if you're going to eat leafy greens, like saute them cook them, you know, I would not be quite as fibrous, right, help your stomach out. Yes, but it's just a very different way of looking at how you eat and again if the basis of what you're looking at is talking about basal body temperature lower during the estrogen phase higher during progesterone phase, and leaning into that, which again is like huh, I didn't think of that. I don't know Okay, and then sometimes the thought process of, well, if my basal body temperature is lower at some point and higher and other points, would I want to have it be the same all month, sometimes people may think this, they're like, well, if my basal body temperature is lower and estrogen, one, I want to eat warming foods to lift it up. And that's actually the opposite of what we want to do. Because our body is cyclic, because our system goes through these different phases. It's beneficial to lean into that natural shift, go with that lower temperature, help cool things down, you'll see and feel the difference. Oftentimes, people do that. They start noticing, oh, my gosh, yeah, my body is just a cooler temperature or when they're like, oh, yeah, ovulated. And I just feel hotter overall, like, This is crazy. My internal temperatures higher. Yep.


It really, right. And you know, it's just understanding this knowledge of our biology and our chemistry is so important. My kids now are eight and 11. And they come home from school, they talk to me about the digestive system, and my son just brought home a thing about the brain. And you know, I also love learning about brains. And that's great. And we can also like, understand where the parts are, and say the names of all the things. But if we don't really understand the actual application of the functions of these systems, we're really not learning the thing that's going to make a difference.


Exactly. And so many of us feel out of sorts with our body, just like you wake up, you don't feel as energized, you move through your day, and you're like, oh, what's wrong with me? Or oh, why can't I this, that or the other like, oh, and you just feel like you're fighting yourself. And that's where it's so nice to just realize and understand, Oh, of course, you know, I'm with Dave my cycle, of course, I'm gonna be like this, when I really started leaning into this work. And again, starting with myself and I started working with the patients in my clinic at the time doing this, one of the things I started to recognize was, I have certain days of my cycle that I just, I'm a pretty easygoing person overall, but there's a day or two, where I'm just like, a little more like, I just need a little more space. I just need a little more when my husband has a very touchy feely person just wants to snuggle, like, if we're sitting on the couch watching a movie, he's like, right next to me, like right there. And I'm like, can I just have an inch of space? Please, sir, come on. Anyway. Most of the time, I don't mind it's fine, whatever. But there's like one day visually, every month I started tracking them. There's sometimes I'd be like, Why are you still close to me some like you're right here. Just take a step back, please. And then like two days later, I wouldn't care wouldn't mind or whatever. And it would be funny, because I could feel the reaction in myself. And so I started marking down on the calendar. Okay, what day is this? And for me, it's day, 21. Day 21. Right around that day. So it's just one of those things. Sometimes if you track some of these things, you'll realize it with yourself where you're like, oh, you know what, yeah, during a certain day, I just tend not. So if I feel like I'm getting irritated, I'll be like, okay, just give me 24 hours. And I'll probably find tomorrow, but for right now, today, back it up, sir.


Yeah, I love it. And then, you know, also giving yourself grace that, you know, doesn't have anything to do with your being good or bad, or in something or out of something. This is you being just beautifully human, and understanding and embracing that.


Yes, yes. Oh, my gosh, yes. And that's the thing, too, I feel like there is this whole mental spiral that we go down oftentimes. And again, it can be stemmed, you know, I mean, you've done lots of mindset work. So this stemming from, you know, shame, guilt, whatever that's from or feeling like you're wrong, or you have to be a people pleaser all the time, or whatever, that anytime your physical body reacts differently than you feel like it should. It's an internal fight or struggle. And then that was one of the greatest gifts, that tracking my own symptoms, hormones, all that other stuff gave me was little things like that. And it continues to where I'm giving myself grace, saying, Oh, my gosh, yeah, I am a little more tired today. I didn't sleep well, last night, I am going to do some movement today. But I'm not going to do this heavy workout because it's not going to be good for me, I am going to make sure I have all the personal space I need today, day 21 or whatever. And just to honor that and work with my system. I am way more productive way happier, healthier, balanced overall. And it's never a fight. And it allows me to communicate what's going on internally, with myself and with others just that much better.


Yeah. And it's getting quiet enough to listen and know enough to understand what to listen for. Yeah, so a lot of this also, then we're gonna go down the spiral for a little bit here. That brings up a lot of stress, which then also has an effect on your body and your hormones. So teachers and educators who whatever role you play in right now, if you're listening, you are under an incredible amount of stress pretty much all the time So let's talk about that. Dr. Bat, can we get you talking about stress and what that's actually doing to our bodies? And why it's kind of counterproductive to some of the efforts that we think that we're making to live a healthier lifestyle? Yes,


yes, we can. Stress is a huge piece of this. And there's a few things that I want to say about the profession, because one of the toughest jobs to have overall. And that being said, like, I have never been a teacher, but I will say this, like, I have had a lot of friends that are teachers, I work with a lot of women that are teachers, and my mom was a teacher for 43 years, a high school chemistry teacher. So the schedule that you have to keep you know what I mean? There's so many times where I've heard people say that, Oh, you're a teacher, or you get the summers off, blah, blah. And it's like, Are you kidding? Do you have any idea how many hours teachers spend in the classroom in the summer, setting up things My childhood was spent in the high school chemistry lab, cleaning beakers, cleaning test tubes, setting up the lab, setting up the storage room, all that stuff? That I mean, it's not just like, oh, you know, fall school starts, there you go, No, it is a year round nonstop, early in the morning being available before school for kids doing things that you don't you know, during the day where you don't even get a lunch break. I remember my mom talking about so many years that she would have to cover lunch duties and all these things. And her way to eat lunch was that she would have to eat during a study hall when she did like, watch the study hall. That's not the


right word. Yeah, sure. You have, like, you have like your duty, right is the study hall.


That's it. Yeah, like teacher duty was the study hall, that's when she actually got to eat her lunch. And then doing things after school being available after school for kids that needed to make up a test or wanted extra study time or wanted extra assistance or things like that. People who work a nine to five often have a much easier schedule than teachers do. That's not even including, again, the other work that you do outside of that to prep for your teaching hours. So it is a very stressful job that shifts and changes year round. And it can change again, as well stress wise, with a batch of kids that you have that you have in your classroom, it can change with administrative sayings, or if something changes in the school district or funding changes, or all this or that, right, like the stress can come from so many places. And when we talk about the impact of this, and nobody goes into the teaching profession to become a millionaire, you know what I mean? They go through, they become teachers, because they love it. And they love teaching, and they love kids and the education process and want to share that with others. So the hard thing I see with a lot of this is that people who love aspects of their job and love the work, but the stress of the environment, and the schedule, and everything can really wear you down. And it can be really damaging to your health, to your hormones to your adrenals everything. It's all it reminds me to have that the frog in the pot of water. Do you know I'm talking about share it ill? Yeah, yeah. Where it's almost like the water is boiling before you realize there's a problem.


Right? Yeah, it's that slow boil? Yes, yeah.


So the stress that I see from people is usually something that's been going on for a long period of time, it's been chronic stress, which is some of the worst stuff to put up with. It's easier for the body to recover from stressful events, if there was a big stressful event and say the stress level gets to be like a nine out of 10. But it's for a short period of time. So then your body can recover and move on from it. If you have stress levels that are like a six to seven out of 10. But on a daily basis, every day, your stress levels are six or seven out of 10. You might be thinking, well, it's not that bad. It's not as bad as that one day. But if that's still a really high stress level, and then if your stress levels are like that every day, for years, it wears on your system so much. It will impact how well your digestion works. Your digestive system is not going to work and function as well. It's not going to absorb nutrients, you're more likely to be nutrient deficient, you're more likely to have a fatigue issues, you know, adrenal insufficiency, or adrenal fatigue is what people call it. It can be hard to get up in the morning, where you're going to be relying on caffeine to just make it through the day. There's a gal I worked with. This is one of my favorite things. Oh my one of my favorite stories is somebody I work with that was a teacher. She was a teacher. It was 19 or 20 years that she had been a teacher and she taught in an elementary school, like fourth or fifth grade or something like that older elementary school kids. And we had started working together over the summer, because she was really like she had taken the spring and then the early part of the summer and was like, Okay, I'm going to get healthy. I'm going to feel good. I want my next year to be like the best year of me all this stuff for the school year. And when in her school years started, she was like, Yeah, Joan, okay. I know there's a lot different, though I'm not sure. You know, it's just really doubtful. And then several weeks later, we touched base again. And she said, Okay, I have to recap what I said on our last call, because like, I didn't even realize she goes, but my husband said something about how I must be feeling better. And she goes, I didn't, I didn't even notice she is. But he said that with his work schedule, like he would normally come home from work. Later in the evening, she would leave for work early and would come home at like 330 or four or something like that. And then he would come home a couple hours later, so she would be home before him. And normally at the beginning of the school year, every year again for like 19 or 20 years, every time in September, when school would start. He would come home and she would be asleep on the couch. It's tough to go from summer to all of a sudden, the early mornings and all this stuff, right? She was exhausted, she was exhausted, he would come home, she'd be asleep on the couch, and he'd have to wake her up. And then they'd make dinner and all the things whatever. Well, she had started school. And he said, Yeah, you must be feeling better. And she's like, what, what do you mean? And he goes, every day for the last three weeks that I've come home since you started school. He goes, you've been awake. You haven't even been sitting on the couch, like, I come in, and you're doing stuff. You're in the kitchen, you already prepped dinner, or I came home. Remember that other day I came home, you were out for a walk, like, you gotta be feeling better, right? And she was like, Oh, my gosh, I didn't even realize but yeah, I come home, and I'm not exhausted and then fall asleep on the couch anymore.

So what kinds of things was she doing to get her to that place?


Yeah, so one of the first things when she's eating a protein, you know, he doesn't nutrient and getting enough protein because again, being a busy teacher, she didn't have time to eat during the day. And so she just kind of had given up on it. She'd eat something in the morning, and then would literally go her entire school day without eating your blood sugar crashes. Cheryl, it's so hard. So one of the biggest things we did as I was like, You need to keep snacks in your pocket. I was like, even if you're walking from one end of the building to the other during this timeframe, I was like, get a snack and get some bytes of a protein bar something. So she had a couple of different points during the day where she could shove some good interface. Again, she wasn't sitting down when she was doing it. But she goes, Oh my gosh, I definitely feel better on days where I'm eating. And I'm like, yeah, yeah.


Wait, can you? Can you just say that again? For the people in the back?


Should I feel better on days that I eat? And I'm like, Yeah, I mean, is it optimal to like, sit down and have a full meal for lunch and all those things, for sure. But a good teachers don't have time to do that. You know, so I was like, even if you have a bar, a snack, I mean, it was literally, it was protein bars, she had these little individualized packs of nuts. And you know, it was like trail mix type of thing from Costco that she'd keep in our pockets. And then oh, and then she'd make these little like oatmeal protein balls that she really loved. That's what she would throw in her face. And it was just a matter of like keeping her body going. And she's like, I can't believe that I went this many years, you know, and thinking it was fine. Just because I could make it to the end of the day on nothing. She's like, Yeah, I drink coffee and water throughout the day, just to keep going.


Well, that's a lot of it. Like you said, that is the boiling water. Right? We make it through the day. So we're like, check. We did it that was successful, I guess because I didn't die. Right. But like for me, and the people that I work with, I say this a lot if you'd like not dead is too low of a bar. Right? We need to do better than that.


Not dad. Will love have a bar? Oh, no.


Yes. I'm laughing because it sounds so silly. But honestly, I was there to like I was that also. And I think just I'm going to digress for just a second. Because this weekend, I was actually talking with a lot of pre service teachers who are in collegiate programs. And I think it even starts then because you're overloaded with the schedule and you go, go go, you're often taking a full course load of 18 credits, perhaps even taking some credits for free. Your student teaching experience is actually an unpaid experience for the most part of I'm starting to change right now. And so we kind of live in this world right from the get go of this is just the way it is here. And you're not only going to dedicate your passion and your purpose, but you are also going to sacrifice in the name of selflessness and martyrdom, your physical being for the sake of the kids and your passion and your purpose. And that's just bullshit like I get so angry about it because you can't actually serve the kids that you want to serve. If you are not taking care of your physical body. We as a prioritizes differently.

Yes, the oxygen mask has to go on you first before somebody else.


Yes. So that's I mean, what you're describing right now hits in a place that is very near and dear to My heart because that's just in the air that we breathe that water coffee narrative Israel.


Yeah, again, I watched my own mom do it for years, for years. I mean, I will share this as well on here because we talk about hormones and things like that I remember very, very vividly, when I was younger, I was maybe eight or so. And I remember my mom wanting to have another baby. And she had a few miscarriages like it was just not. But I remember at that time, too, she was as a teacher, she would drink a pot of coffee every day. That was how she functioned. That was how things went like, was adipose thing. You know what I mean? Like, what the heck, she drank a pot of coffee every day for decades, decades. And it impacts your health, it impacts your body, it impacts all this stuff. But again, you just keep going just to make it to the end of the day, and everything else. And so that's the other thing is when people realize, like, oh my gosh, I'm busting it through the day. But then who are you outside of that? Like when you go home? What do you have leftover for your kids, your significant others, or even for yourself? Like, do you have hobbies or things that you love to do that you just have zero gas in your tank to dive into? I mean, that was the thing, this gal that had been a teacher for 19 or 20 years, and then for her to come home and not need to sleep for two hours on her couch. And not only that, not just not to not sleep, but to be up and about doing things not just like doing chores at her house, but to be out for a walk like she's enjoying her life. Yes. But one of the biggest changes was just eating throughout the day. And even if she didn't have the time, but just to have that strategy of getting some protein pasting in getting that fuel, and then that way outside of her work hours, she could be herself. Right be her best self.


Yeah, you know, in my worlds, you know, with my rose colored glasses on that I refuse to take off, by the way. What I really want to see are organizational structures in the school systems that promote teacher health and well being that prioritize lunchtime for teachers, just like we will many schools prioritize recess for their kids, you know, we are all humans living in this space together. And we're also modeling for these kids what it's like to be a functioning adult or dysfunctional adult in this world. And we can do better. And that's really what this is about, too. So can you share some other besides eating and throwing some protein in your face every once in a while? What other things can we do to actually make sure that we get through the day and not just like slowly make it through the day on caffeine and water?


Yeah, so besides eating and protein, specifically, because it does provide so much fuel and nutrient for your body, really hydrating. So and using electrolytes and minerals, things like that are going to be really important. And then the other thing is adaptogens, using herbs, things like that to manage and mitigate your stress response. That's one of the biggest things overall is that, you know, stressful things will happen. If you do not have your nervous system regulated or you do not have a good stress response going on. It makes it that much harder. You know, it makes it that way. And again, it with schools and the like with kids and other people involved. I mean, you never know what's going to happen for the day. You know what I mean? Oh, yeah. So what's that phrase? The best offense is a defense. No, I'm not saying it right. The best.


Yeah, the best offense is a good defense. Yeah, yeah. Or the best debase? Good. I don't know. I don't do the sports thing. Yeah, that's like outside of my realm of expertise.


We're gonna call it into this right now. And they're screaming it in their car. They're like.


Yep. Apologies. Yeah.


But then it's like, every day you walk into a building where there's an unknown number of things that can happen and to be there to serve small humans. And to be there, it's like, you have to have this amazing capacity to be a sponge for whatever. And the more you can do to help your own nervous system and stress response, the better. And so their meditations and deep breathing and only the first year for sure. Adaptogens are just another tool like that, that can really help your system, manage and mitigate that stress response.

Tell me more about that. What exactly are adaptogens? Tell me what


adaptogens it's a group of herbs that are Chinese herbs or Vedic herbs. So there are the Eastern medicine classification of herbs that actually help keep your stress response within a certain window of tolerance. Stress sometimes gets a bad rap because we think stress is bad or cortisol is bad. It's not bad. Like you should have a cortisol response of some kind. It just it's not great if it gets to be too high or too low. So we want to keep it you know, it's like the the three bears. We don't want to be the papa bear or the mama bear. We want to be the baby bear right in the middle. Right in them. It'll write in that window of tolerance. So you have normal reactions to things when our stress levels get to be too high. That creates a lot of anxiety feeling in our bodies, racing thoughts, some people get heart palpitations, some people have excess sweating, that also is a trigger for throwing off your hormones, things like that, that disrupts your sleep disrupts your digestion, a lot of things like that. So adaptogens are great because they actually help bring that down, and help calm your system. Adaptogens are really unique. And again, they're in Eastern medicine are most of the things from our western medicine mind, we think about if I have this thing, I have a happened to me, I need something that deals with a if I have B happens, I need something different to deal with B. So if you know if a is too high, B, it's too low, I need two different things. The cool thing about adaptogens is that they actually work with both, they keep you they bring down high cortisol and help your body manage that. But they also bring up low ones. So if you are too low, if you have a hard time getting out of bed getting going if you feel like you're just sluggish, sluggish and slow responses to things. Sometimes people feel like just very mad, very low mood overall, like not feeling like yourself, you can be completely burned out and have really low cortisol adaptogens will help bring that up.


So when you say that, that makes me think of you know, having someone have this chronic stress all the time is that sixth and the seventh and then build up, build up build up, then it kind of flipped over to the other side. And that's really where the burnout happens. And it's overload and then all of a sudden, it's depleted. Is that kind of an accurate way


to describe that? 100%? Yes, okay. Yeah, there's I feel like that, like math is kind of where, where most of the people that I'm talking to, you are feeling right now. They're like, I'm not like, I don't feel like myself. And some of them use words like burnout, and depletion, but you know, explaining it that this is kind of a low cortisol timeframe is an important context. And then my other question, then to kind of circle back to what we were talking about before? How does cortisol interplay with your cycle? Yeah, so several different ways when your body has an improper cortisol response. And again, this can be too high or too low or so it's not at the level it should be. It can cause your body to utilize more nutrients, when your nutrient deficient things like that, it's going to mess up your cycle. That's an easy way to phrase it. Cortisol can also impact your body's ability to ovulate regularly. So your body just won't ovulate won't ovulate on time. There'll be early, it'll be late. So that can cause a lot of irregular cycle things that feeds into that whole estrogen dominance piece. So then, a lot of times the tricky thing about this is that it doesn't necessarily happen overnight. Right? It's just like it you'll think back to Yeah, over the last six months or last year. Yeah, my stress has really, I've been fried, and then my cycles have gotten heavier and heavier. I've had more clots, I've had more pain, I've had more issues with this. I've you know, and you'll realize like, holy cow, yeah, my hormones have become more of a problem. But it's from that cortisol response and how it impacts the ability, it's like your body cannot ovulate on time. So you're not going to create that progesterone level. Sometimes people describe it as it like steals progesterone doesn't allow that creation to happen. That's an easy way to kind of think of it. So that feeds into that estrogen dominance more and more every single month, little bit worse, little bit worse, a little bit worse. The other thing I see a lot with women when we talk about stress, and chronic stress, is the ability to create maintain enough testosterone. And testosterone is you know, mainly a male hormone. But it is really important to have an appropriate amount in the female body. Because it does impact your body's ability to have energy to have stamina, to have a metabolism, to have muscle repair, to have a libido the number of gals that I look at that I've said yeah, that their adrenals are terrible, their cortisol levels are bad, and then their testosterone is low. And then they'll be like, Yeah, I just don't feel right or whatever. And so many times they're like, Oh, I didn't even realize my testosterone was bad. And like, yeah, yeah, like things have been going on so long for you. It's not just your cortisol, it's like the cortisol has now impacted the estrogen and progesterone and that balance, and that is totally off. And it's now impacted your testosterone levels. And that is really depleted. And so there's a lot that we have to build back from. It's like you're in a deeper hole now, because it takes a little longer to climb out of it with that, but those are some very specific direct things and how it can mess up your other hormones.


Sure. So I'm always looking for like, what are the tangible markers of awareness? And if it seems like even though we might be sitting in that boiling water, we might not be aware, noticing what your cycle is doing is actually a really good indicator of your stress level. Is that a fair thing to say? Okay,


And yeah, yeah. And so if you're thinking, gosh, like, is this what I have going on? You know, oh, I have a cycle every month like, Okay, would you say it's a great cycle? Do you feel like you have? Like, do you have a lot of pain? A lot of problems, a lot of symptoms there or not? Do you have a heavy cycle? Does it disrupt your gut? Or any other things that you know, along that line? Okay, important to recognize what are your energy levels around this? What's your stamina? Or like, what's your libido? Like? Those are all things that are actually related to how your body responds to stress, or just how long it's been under stress. Right? And I can't tell you how many people that I talked to that they're like, you know, I don't I don't feel that stressed. I don't know. Like, it's fine. I'm like, okay, but like, if you were to rate it a zero to 1010 being the worst, and they're like, Well, maybe it's a six or seven. Okay, how long has it been like that? Well, maybe five years, maybe eight years. Okay, that's too long.


Yeah, it's like that meme with the dog in the room that's on fire, right? And it's like, this is fine. This is totally fine. You know. And as much as we want to, like wish it to be. So I think it's extra important for your longevity, for your legacy, for your impact for yourself, and overall well being to really take a look in the mirror and get really honest about where you are. And wherever it is. It's beautifully. Okay. And there are steps to make it better for you, if that's the choice that you want to make. Yes, absolutely. So with all of this being said, because we've covered so much in a short amount of time. And you know, it's funny, because like, I've been working with you now and I was at when he came on, I was like, Oh my gosh, where do I want to take this because we could just have like, several parts to all of this. But I want to encourage people to listen to your podcast, because that's really where all of the juicy information is. And I will make sure that that link is in the bottom of the show notes too. But regarding, you know, teachers, and overall well being and from where you're coming from and your perspective in this world and your work, what is your dream for the future of education?


Yeah, there is. I want to say like just so much that I would change about this. And this is i People ask me this all the time, like, you know, oh, like Are your kids in public school? Yeah, my kids are in a public school. They do really well. I do think that there's so many great things about having a school organization, things like that. That being said, I do think there is a lot of room for improvement. And I think the main area to improve is the support of the teachers and letting the teachers do their jobs. However, that happens, from what I have seen, from what I have observed from what I have heard from people is that there are so many other things that get in the way of teachers doing their best work. And a lot of it does have to do with the schedule, that they're forced to run the schedule that they're forced to run the timing. And I know like it's so easy to say, Oh, well, this is financially and this and this and this and blah, blah, blah. And it's like, okay, then like figure out the fight, like have somebody else figured out that it works. But if teachers are like, imagine a school where teachers got to come in, they had support, they were allowed to have an actual lunch break. They were allowed to go to the bathroom when they needed to go to the bathroom. Right?


Yeah. Oh, yes. Oh, yes, you're nodding.


Nods over here. Yes, a number of teachers I work with that have said that they've had bladder infections, because they literally could not have the time to relieve themselves is to me just terrible. And that teachers, like I said, they get into this profession, because they love the art of teaching, and reaching out to young minds and all these other things, no one's doing it, too, just to make it rich, or whatever. I mean, out of all the things that you could do in the world, that is not where you go to make the big bucks, you know what I mean? It's you do it because you love it. And if you can take people like that and support them in their health and in their own missions, it would literally change the scope of education, I would say that it would change it in a very short span of time. Like imagine five years that a program was introduced, that teachers got their health was important what they said they think they needed food, to bring the day hydration, bathroom breaks, all that stuff. Even decompression time, between classes, even if it's five minutes, where you're not forced to rush and have that stress response just be kicked off again and again. It would change so much, I think,


Oh 100% Well, and that's my mission and the work that I do. And you being here today is a big part of realizing that mission for me and giving that to the educators that I work with. Because if we are not taking care of ourselves, we're not able to have the impact that we want to make in this world. And the most generous thing we can do for our students is take care of ourselves.


Yes. 100% 100%. Yeah, so


let's let's change the world. Yeah. I'm in love. Yeah, let's do it. So how can people learn more about you and get in touch with you?


Yeah. So I am on In the interwebs, Dr. Beth Westie on Facebook, Instagram, Tik Tok, my website, YouTube, all the things is Dr. Beth Westie. And then my podcast is just called the female health solution. So and I do cover a lot of topics I talk about hormone testing, I talk about nutrition, eating for your cycle, all the things I talk about, you know, menopause, and all that stuff. So kind of wherever you're at in your phase of life, we talk about


things. Yeah. And on a personal note, I have been working with you now for a while, and it has been a joyful confronting experience. Perfect, it was important for me to get a kick in the pants about really where I wasn't my health as someone who I thought was very healthy to begin with. And the ride that I've been going along in learning more about me has been incredible. And even just as a mom being able to pass that along to my kids, and them just witnessing me making these changes has been instrumental as well. So it's been really wonderful to learn with you. So thank you. And it's been a pleasure to have you here and talk with you today. So thanks for being here.


Yeah, thank you so much. That's so nice of you to say and yeah, yeah, I love this. I love this was like the fastest.


All right, and by here, I know. And so if you're listening and enjoyed the show, please be sure to subscribe and share it with your friends and we will see you next time on take notes are incredible, right? Together, we can revolutionize the face of education. It's all possible. And it's all here for you right now. Let's keep the conversation going at empowered educator faculty room on Facebook.

It’s unwanted, hurtful, and aggressive.
One out of every five students reports being bullied in schools around the United States. While it’s a rocky territory to navigate, it’s important to empower students and strive for a better future for them.
So, how do we stop it? How do we turn anger to compassion?
Welcome to episode 27 of Next level Greatness! In today’s episode, we are joined by Dali Rivera who is a parenting coach specializing in bullying. She’s an advocate for the kids and aims to help families thrive and promote equality in their communities.
Dali gives us a glimpse of how she started her mission to educate people about bullying prevention and awareness.
Ready to stand firm and strong against the bullies? Listen to this insightful episode and learn how you can help yourself, your friends, and families to fight against bullying!

Stay empowered,
Jen

Let’s keep the conversation going! Find me at:
 Jen Rafferty | Instagram, YouTube, Facebook | Linktree
Instagram: @jenrafferty_
Facebook: Empowered Educator Faculty
Room


About Dali:
Dāli Rivera is a parenting coach specializing in bullying awareness & prevention education for parents of middle school-age kids. She helps parents learn how to advocate for their kids, and get them through the experience in a healthy way.
She is also the creator of the Diversity & Anti-Bullying Academy (#DABA) and owner of DaliTalks, L.L.C.
Dāli is a U.S. Army veteran, speaker, parent to two teen girls, and wife of a U.S. Army veteran. Dali earned a master’s degree in Women & Gender Studies from Towson University.
Dali’s passion to stop bullying comes from her own personal experiences as a bullied child and from having become an advocate for children, including her own. She has dedicated herself to sharing her knowledge to help families thrive, and promote equality in their own communities.

Connect with Dali:
Website: https://www.dalitalks.com/
IG: @dalitalks
YT: @DaliTalksShow
Podcast: The DaliTalks Podcast

TRANSCRIPT:  I remember all the passion and vision you had when you first went into teaching. Feeling like building young minds and creating community through your work would make a lasting impact on this world. Well, those days may feel like they're behind you now because you're exhausted, stressed and overwhelmed and frustrated. But I'm here to tell you, it doesn't have to be like this. In fact, the love of teaching never really went away. But it absolutely needs transformation. Welcome to The Take notes Podcast. I'm Jen Rafferty, former music teacher, mom of two, and certified emotional intelligence practitioner, and I'm here to light the way for you. In order to create a generational change for our kids. We need to shift the paradigm away from the perpetual stress and overwhelm and into a life of joy, and fulfillment. This is education 2.0, where you become the priority, shift how you live your life, and how you show up both at work, and at home. So take a sip of steamy morning coffee, and grab your notebook. It's time to take notes.


Hello and welcome back to another episode of take notes. Today I have a really perfect guest to talk about something that is near and dear to my heart. And dolly Rivera is a parenting coach specializing in bullying awareness and prevention education for parents of middle school aged kids. She helps parents learn how to advocate for their kids and get them through the experience in a healthy way. And she's also the creator of the diversity and anti bullying Academy and owner of Dolly talks LLC. Dolly is a US Army veteran speaker parent of two teen girls and wife of a US Army veteran. And dolly earned a master's degree in women and gender studies from Towson University.


And her passion to stop bullying comes from her own personal experiences as a bullied child. And from having become an advocate for children including her own. She has dedicated herself to sharing her knowledge to help families thrive and promote equality in their own communities. And I am so glad you're here today dolly to talk with me and the rest of the take notes audience. So thank you for being here.


Thank you, Dan, you made that bio sounds so amazing.


Isn't it interesting when you hear someone else read your bio, and you're like, oh, that's me. Right? Yeah, I do those things. Yeah. Well, I'm honored that you wanted to spend your time here with me today. Because bullying is something that everyone experiences it in some way or another or in our lives. We are human, we grow up and everyone, especially in the middle school ages. It's like everyone says this is such a hard time of our lives. But bullying happens at every age, from young childhood all the way through adulthood. And many adults are still dealing with bullying and bullies and how to navigate this kind of rocky territory. So I'm really looking forward to diving into this with you. So can we start first with your story as to how you even got here? Why are you having this mission of bullying prevention for kids?


That's such a great question. I actually started the whole thing years after this particular event. So my child, she's always been very confident and just enthusiastic about education and everything. She was five she started elementary school was riding the bus. And she came home one day and told my husband I that she was being bullied. She said a certain child who had asked her out to be her boyfriend started pulling her hair kicking her calling her really vulgar bad words. How old was she? She was fine.


Yeah. So then I asked her to be his girlfriend's boyfriend. Yeah. She rejected him. I'm assuming to


she's sure did yeah. She was like, No, I'm five. So you don't need a boyfriend. And you know, the kid was really nice. They actually even played together the summer before school started. And so that happened. She said, No, started going to the bus stop. And we started noticing this is after she told us what was going on. My husband, I started noticing that the boy had two older brothers that were about seven and nine. And they would get very aggressive with him. And they would tell him things to like, just try to reel him up. And they'd say things like you got a man up. You got to show them you got to show her that you're the man that you're the boss. So I think what happened was that because they knew that, that their little brother had been rejected by my daughter. They had this idea of masculinity in that they have to prove that Yeah, well, she turned him down and she should regret it because this isn't the man but that five year old. So obviously these ideas don't come from this anywhere. This means they were either watching something or maybe somebody was role modeling these behaviors and these ideas at home. Maybe it was somebody like a neighbor that they look up to who knows.


So it will get very aggressive. And one day in particular, because this happened over time, and my husband and I reported the bully to the bus driver, because it was happening at the bus stop, right, the bus driver said, I can't do anything because all the kids are scared, they don't want to speak up. And that year, we had a whole bunch of five year olds starting school. So a lot of these five year olds just didn't want to say anything. And one day, these three boys, they're doing their usual thing. And they start messing with that five year old, the little boy. And the older two brothers, one of them grabs the little one, his arms and holds them behind them, while the other brother punches him in the stomach repeatedly telling him to man up. And it was like one of those moments where the little boy and I locked eyes for this a split second, but it felt like it was like Time stops. And I truly saw his pain. And I understood then that all those horrible behaviors that he was practicing and using to hurt my daughter was really like pain of his own that was being caused by his two brothers.


And I remember seeing like his eyes really watering, he was holding back from crying. And I remember I can still hear him saying like, stop it. But he didn't want to sound weak when he said stop it. And he was so angry. And I felt really, really bad. And you know, that experience allowed me to have compassion for bullies, because now I understand that a lot of times these children are just trying to survive. And that right there is what motivated me to start doing research on bowling, not just on, like how to help my daughter, because, you know, when I went to the bus driver, and they said, I'm sorry, we can't help, then I went to the school principal, because you know that naturally, that's what you do as a parent. And the school principal said, I'm sorry, but it didn't happen on a school campus. So I can do anything about it. And I was furious because I like what the heck, what do you mean, you hired or your school hired the bus company, therefore, in my opinion, you're responsible just as much as they are, you need to do something about this. And of course, bullying moved on into the school.


So what's happened to our school, most have been on a bus and it was on and off, on and off for the entire school year. Every time I go and talk a school principal, they give saying we have to follow protocols, we have to follow policy, we have to try this, we have to try that before expelling suspending kicking them off the bus. And I was like, This is ridiculous. Let me see this policy. And I was at the time in my master's program. Ironically, my concentration is Social Policy and Leadership. So I was in that nerdy mode of research. And and


I fully feel that yes, and you're like me, you are talking to the wrong person.


Let me go see what policy you're talking about. Exactly. And, you know, I started researching that. And then I learned how to use their own policy against them to get what I wanted. And it worked. But it took a lot of research and a lot of just like learning not just what the policy said, but also how was implemented the school culture, the mentality research from like institutions that actually do bullying research, not just in the United States, but in other countries. So it's been very interesting. I started with back then she was five, she's now 16. And I haven't stopped researching since so fast forward a few years later, in 2019, is when I created Donny talks, LLC, I had all these workshops that I continuously provided for free to PTA friends, and my husband one day, he was like, hey, you need to sell this to the schools. And it was like, No, you know who we are. We're like pilots, you know, that's what I do. And he convinced me I went to a school districts Family Engagement Center. And I asked them if they'd let me pilot the program. They said, Yes, we did it over the summer. And I was like, no parents gonna come in the summer at 9am to learn about bullying. But let's see what happens. And much more surprise, I had, like a packed room. And they brought their kids which was something I was not expecting, because in my mind, I just wanted to work with the parents because I felt like I was a new parent. Bullying is not one of the things that you think is going to happen to your child, especially at the age of five. When you think of bullying, you think high school, you think Mean Girls, right? Like Junior High High School. And it was just very surprising. They brought their kids every morning, we had a series of workshops, and they loved them. And that's how I pretty much got started in created that diversity and anti bullying Academy which consists of like now over 20 workshops and courses on different and yet from cyber bullying. And I include diversity because one of the things that you know, when I had that moment with that little boy were we like locked eyes, my nerdy self, because my master's is women and gender studies. So I remember telling my husband is like, Oh my God, I need to teach kids or the parents how to not teach toxic masculinity. He was like, Girl, nobody's gonna listen to you. Like people hear those buzzwords. And number one, they're politicized. People hate that. Number two, it's very, like, rejected because it feels like an attack on patriarchy, you know around manhood. So it's like, you gotta go ahead and add it another angle. And it was like, okay, so yeah, there was a lot of learning through this experience on just knowing how to deliver the message, and also tying in the importance of eradicating stereotypes and misconceptions and unconscious biases, and how that aids or like, reinforces bullying. Sure. Yeah. Well, and


the messaging, I think, is important, especially with the gender studies to, you know, yeah, we need to smash the patriarchy. And my nothing to do with your masculinity is about how do we reframe what is in front of us, so everyone can get an equal chance and opportunity. And I'm sure from what you've described as the success of your business, and the amount of impact you've had on so many people, it has been very well received.


Yes, I am so grateful for that. Because you know, originally thought it might be just a few schools here and there. But no, I've actually been hired by universities to give PD for teachers, and after school program coordinators and stuff. I've been hired by schools, rec centers, libraries, private organizations, and I also do you know, like coaching, consulting, one on one with parents. So I have those where I work with this organizations, and then I work with the parents one on one, it's been so rewarding, and of course, tough to because there are a lot of people out there that have these misconceptions of bullying, they think these kids are just sauced, these kids just don't have as good social skills, or this is just conflict resolution tools, they'll be fine.


But then you do the studies on the effects of bullying of any type. And then you find out that there's a correlation between crimes, violence and bullying, there's a correlation with negative mental health impacts. There's a correlation with dropout rates, even attendance before the pandemic of proximate studies show. And you can look this up on Stop bullying.gov 160,000 kids were missing school, you know, just not going to school every day, just to avoid a bully. And when you think about economics, right, like how that impacts not just you as an individual, as a taxpayer, but your school, if schools get paid.


And this is something parents also don't know, schools get paid, sometimes approximately $120 per child per day that they attend. So if I had that in 60,000, kids are missing school from just every day, that's 160 times $100 list is rounded down to 100. That's millions of dollars outside that are being taken out of the education system, which happens to be your tax dollars, that are not being put to work. So when people say it's not a really big deal, it's not a big issue. Yes, it is a huge social issue. And it actually is a financial economic issue. And people just are not educated. I'm not


sure I see. We are not educated about that, which I think is why the work that you do is so important that the implications are just what you're seeing in front of you. They're they're far greater than that. So I've so many questions about what you introduce to everyone at the beginning here. And I actually want to talk first about when you mentioned, bullying, and having compassion for the bully, so that to me, I would love for you to dive into that because as a victim of bullying, to then have compassion for the bully. There's a lot of stuff that needs to happen there. And I don't know if that's the only equation. Right. So can you talk more about that?


Yeah, definitely. That's such a good question. It's something that I get a lot of resistance from when I talk to parents about it. Because the mentality is the heck with that bully, they need to be punished. But we have to look at the root causes. These are children, these are somebody's babies. And something's going on like that little boy, that five year old. He was such a sweet kid, until that stuff started happening at the bus stop.


And what I've found with research is that there are several reasons why kids bully, sometimes the victim bullies, so they're trying to survive because they have tried to use the system that is set in place that is supposedly going to keep them safe. So say reporting at school, and the children go into their their report, according to them, and nothing's done. And they see the bully getting away with stuff over and over and over and over to the point to where they're like the heck with this. Nobody's helping me. So I'm going to become the bully because nobody messes with the bully. And then there's the children who have and they live in an environment where bullying behaviors are practice every single day. Is this a toxic home, and then they come to school and they're repeating those behaviors because that's what they have for a role model.


And they don't realize it until somebody teaches them the hard way, right? Sometimes it's throat fight. Sometimes it's going to the principal's office, so many reasons. The other thing is, too, that I feel like the media sometimes glamorize this bullying, when you have movies, where the bullies is bad, like, absolutely. And he's mean that the man and you know, people are like, yeah, look at that, I want to be like that. Nobody's having these conversations with children, when they're watching those types of scenes. Somebody's not saying, Hey, okay, let's talk about that. That was funny, it was cool. But in reality, that's not good. It's not accepted behavior, then there's children who just go through stuff that have not been taught how to manage their emotions. That's why so many schools, the last what decade or so have been focusing so much on social emotional learning skills, which means pretty much teaching children how to recognize their emotions and have self control. And that ties in a lot to bullying and many other type of things that happen, right, not just at school, but overall in our lives.


So if we're not teaching kids that it's okay to have anger, but it's not okay to use that anger to hurt themselves or others, then we're not going to stop bullying or any type of violence. So these are all the different type of I mean, there's more reasons why kids practice those behaviors. But you know, the other thing tool that I notice, not just by having focus groups, with teachers and parents, but also being at school campuses observing, I see that the language at schools needs to change. For example, when a child does something that's not acceptable, they are sent to detention, they are labeled as the troubled kid, or the bully, in so the schools are reinforcing that stigma. And when kids feel stigmatized, like they're tied to that label, and they can get out of that, then they lean into it and go like, Oh, yeah, I'm the bad kid, I'll show you, okay, because they start to accept that I'm like, This is what they expect from me, therefore, that's what I will be.


And I remember many years ago, when I was starting, I went to a principal. And I knew that at this school, they had a bullying problem. I had a conversation with him. And I suggested, would you consider instead of having a punishment, like having them go to detention, maybe having a meditation session? And he laughed about that? And he was like, why would I reward a kid who bullied somebody? What are the parents gonna think? And I thought, you're not thinking it through because what this child needs is reflection. And meditation helps with that, right? So then, a couple of years ago, actually, my kids middle school principal, I was having a conversation with him. And he was telling me that he had this room called OCI.


 I can't remember what it stands for. But when kids do something not acceptable. Instead of detention, they go to this room, where they have reflection, writing, they have a conversation with a school psychologist or with a social worker that works at the school, they have journaling, they even watch sometimes like some type of like moral the story short movie, just to help them understand why they did what they did, how to avoid it next time and how to make it right. How do you get to that point to where you are sincerely apologetic, in you convey that to the person you hurt? And then how do I help you as the offender to not repeat that offense. And also, they had, like tools that they give the parents on for the victim on how to help the victim. So I still see that there's a big lack in providing the tools to the kid who exhibits the bullying behaviors, and there's a need to change our language like, don't call somebody the bully, say this child is exhibiting bullying behaviors. And I still have that problem.


Because the difference right between behavior and then the label, I think so what you're saying and correct me if I'm wrong, it's less about in the moment victim having compassion for the bully, this is really about the other adults in these spaces, understanding that the behavior is a symptom of a greater situation that's going on to get curious about that, and, and separately, handling the victim of the bullying, and then eventually, perhaps getting to a point where there's some sort of reconciliation.


Yeah, definitely. And you know, this is something totally achievable. We just have to change that mindset as adults, because we do we come from like a history of spanking your kids, putting them on timeout, because they you know, making them do like something harsh, like even the military today. To this day, if you do something that you're not supposed to what do you do you go out and like, do some type of hard labor as punishment, and instead, we need to just give teaching tools so that people recognize where they went wrong, how to make it better, how to sell I'm pregnant pretty much. And also, too, when it comes to kids to let them know that your mistakes, do not define who you are. Because that's how self loathing starts,


which then it's the bullying, move on,


and more and more some people, man, when you look at the statistics of like the juvenile detention system, and there's been studies where they did just research of like, how many of the kids who were incarcerated or imprisoned, were bullied before the age of 14? And then how many after the age of 14, and how many were bullied both before and after? And the studies show a significant increase, comparing them to kids who were not bullied before the age of 14. I mean, it's crazy, because so many people are like, Oh, no, this is just a behavior issue. This is just a discipline problem. This is just the parents didn't teach them, right. And it could be that, but studies are showing that it's also being victimized. And studies also show that everybody involved in bullying behaviors, and incidents tend to also have negative impacts and mental health. So we've got to look at it from that standpoint, instead of just like, let's punish these kids.


And I'm thinking of this too, as the role of, of the adults in schools, we also have been victims of bullying have been bullies ourselves, you know, and looking back at my life, especially when I was a teenager, there are moments that I cringe about where I did not treat somebody the way that I'm proud of. And I've also been a victim of bullying when I was a kid. And I think that we carry those stories with us and those memories and those feelings with us. And now we're in a position where we are helping kids navigate their own lives.


But those stories are still there, those traumas are still there for us, which then affect the way that we handle these situations. So I think, how do you talk with the adults about handling their own bullying situation, even when there's bullying that's happening within the schools? I hear this a lot, you know, because now I work pretty explicitly with the adults in schools. And, you know, there are situations where it doesn't feel safe to be authentic, it doesn't feel safe to use your voice. And unfortunately, what happens is a lot of complacency of that we just don't do anything. And we just kind of ignore it and sweeping under the rug, and we don't talk about it. So can you speak a little bit about how to maybe course correct a little bit?


Yeah. So I mean, if you're talking from like what the teacher can do in the classroom, or go from that ankle, the teachers have so much power because you create the environment that you want, right? So having many like, say, every morning, you give one simple little tip, I mean, basic foundation tips about kindness, about not hurting others, or yourself about inclusive language, just like observe your class. And then take note on what you need to educate your classroom your students about. So if you're hearing a lot of like stereotypes being shouted out at somebody, then you find either like during reading time, a book that teaches something that dispels that stereotype.


 But also, just doing this every single day with microbes habits, pretty much like I've seen some teachers that are super creative with starting with, say, like affirmations wet before you enter the classroom, or where you always have to say simple things like thank you, or excuse me, they're so basic and people's, like, that's just homeschooling, that's this home training, you will learn that at home. But not everybody does. Because some kids are not being role model those behaviors. And then literature is so huge, because the kids are already in school, right? So be more than intentional on the type of books that you choose for reading time, especially when it's leisure time. And I have a huge list because I'm always going out and check it out books, especially in new releases, that can teach about kindness, empathy, but also teachers need to also request support.


And I know that this is a big issue. And I know that there's lack of funding. But imagine if all the teachers in the school or the majority of them are asking for this one type of training consistently, then eventually they're going to be hurt, right. But the other thing too, is teachers, I think could take the opportunity with a short little email or maybe a one on one conversation during school pickups or drop offs with parents to let them understand too that they parents have an even more powerful voice than the teachers when it comes to requesting resources.


And this is one of the things that I always teach in my workshops to the parents is like hey, you actually can help the teachers more than the teachers can help themselves because the administration is going to listen to you before They listen to the teachers, because you're the ones who hold their feet to the fire. So if you feel like your teachers are not being provided with the right training on how to manage bullying at schools, and the studies show that most of bullying happens in the classroom, when people are present, then obviously, there's a need for that. We just need to educate our parents and our teachers, right. Yeah, and as far as parents go, micro habits, oh my gosh, they're so important. And when I mean micro habits, I mean, to build confidence, because confident children, number one are not going to become targets.


Because bullies want the weak link, the one that they know is not gonna say anything. And number two consonant kids will also not feel the need to bully others. So these micro habits can be practice from oh my gosh, so, so young, with simple things, like using the power of your voice, like when, you know, if you have a very shy child, and they're afraid to ask for a drink of water, when they're like, Can I have a drink of water, encourage them to say, Take me have a drink of water, they've very caught, and you've had to role model it. And when I was looking for studies that can indicate anything about a successful bullying program, or anti bullying program, I looked not just in the United States, but worldwide.


And UCLA found a study, they did a study, and they found out that the programs that are using Finland, are super effective, and the most effective, for one reason. And that is because they have role model, the behaviors, the positive behaviors, which is funny, because I've been teaching that since I started this. And when I tell parents, you got a role modeling, you got to play it out, like a scenario or something, you got to have your child stand in a power pose, you know, like that Superman, or Superwoman, or Wonder Woman pose, with their chin out, their chest puffed out, you know, their shoulders squared, and how you have them use that power of voice, you know, with not shouting, but just inflict it, you know, very steady and strong.


And they're like, I'm gonna kind of do that I'm like, well, they're little, and little kids will most likely go along with it, if you make it fun. And it doesn't have to be like a one hour class. It can be simply like, as you're coming out, as you know, out of your home to walk to the bus stop. Just have them say their goodbyes in a very assertive way. These micro habits like what my child one of my kids, she has been very shy most of our life. But I have used micro habits to help her, you know, shed that shyness. One of the things that I've done is because she's scared her speak to people is every time we'd go to the store, I just have her go do a price check.


I didn't need the price checked. I just wanted her to go and practice her power of voice here. Go to the cashier and ask her to give you a price tag and then come back and let me know. And at first she was very adamant. She's like, No, I'm too scared. Will you come with me? Okay, will you stand behind me? Will you stand beside me? Will you whispered in my ear? Sure. But you're gonna do it to the point to where we did it over time, so many times, you know, and she does just she just does it on her own. Now,


I learned all of those micropower habits, I still use the power pose. That's something I do. If I walk into a situation, and I just noticed my body is just like not my mind's there. But my body isn't coming along with me. I will stand in that power pose like this. This is when I play this for as long as I need to in order to feel it.


Yeah. And I want to remind people that power poses and not just when you're standing there, even when you're sitting, and if anybody wants to get a better idea of the concept of Power Poses look up. Amy Cuddy's TED talk on Power Poses. She was a Harvard professor who did research on the Power Poses. Here's a controversial study. Now some people are like, No, it's not effective. But you'd be the deciding person if it works for your child or not. But even when they're sitting, you know, like taking up space, the whole study of like how girls are taught to close themselves in Sure. And that gets you very introverted and not self assured. versus boys are encouraged to like, hey, take up space, sit back, lean back, but you're not slouching.


You're leaning back assertively, I guess you can call it you know, take up space. Don't be afraid. Because you're owning your own power. You're owning yourself when you do that. In those are the micro habits. So we need to teach our children to just speak with confidence, ask questions with confidence, sit with confidence, stand walk all of that such tiny little habit. So if you know your child has a certain challenge, like for example, they're afraid to be the first one up front in line at school to go to lunch or whatever, if you're volunteering at the school was challenged your child to go up to the front.


And if you had to tell the teacher Hey, on this one, I'm trying to do get your teacher involved, because that's a tiny, tiny little thing that doesn't really take much time or effort, right? And so like just have your child be the line leader because once they feel the power of being the line leader, guess what? They're gonna feel like oh, wow, that wasn't so scary. Number one, and, hey, I'm good enough to do that.


Yeah. Right, yes, yes. And that goes back, of course, to just you know worthiness. And I love this idea of really combating bullying with offense, instead of defense, you know, we're building tools for kids to not even have to go there, instead of just playing catch up and clean up once it's happening. And I feel like we're always behind the ball in that regard. And while a lot of the social emotional learning programs, I think that is one of the results of it, that this you know, what people really want, as a result, I think the things that you are talking about the target bullying behaviors are a little bit more pointed, and serve a very clear outcome where it's not just, we're all going to feel good, which is amazing.


We want to feel good. We also want to feel safe, internally within our school environments. but confidence is something that I think is totally a bullies kryptonite, both as the bully and as a victim of bullying is that confidence to speak up, use your voice, say, No, tell someone when it's happening. And again, not just for kids, you referred to many times that the role of the adults, and the role modeling of the adults is crucial to get these messages across. So ultimately, while these programs generally focus on kids, again, we keep going back to this introspective work that has to be done first, because at the end of the day, if we're teaching these things, but then the way that the kid notice that the colleagues are talking to each other, or the culture of the faculty is not aligns with what they're saying, those are actually the stronger messages that they're receiving.


Definitely. And you know, kids are watching you.


Oh, sure. Sure.


I remember volunteering and overhearing conversations, or sometimes when I would do my own little reading group with the kids, you know, they're innocent, and they say things that they should meet they overshare and they're like, oh, yeah, Mrs. So and So Mrs. So and so don't like each other. You know, it's like, she's very mean that she's called her this and like, oh, wow, this is not good for them to know that there's conflict going on there. But of course, they know it, right. And the other thing, too, is how a child is, I guess you can say dealt with when they do something incorrectly, is oh, man, it's kids are like watching like a hawk. Because they're like, Oh, is that going to happen to me, and what's going to happen to that person, and they actually care, they actually care, because that's their peer, right? And they want to feel like they're a unit.


And I mean, if you notice, there's so much like classroom pride. And that's why it's very effective when you have like competitions with one class than the other. So you can use that to your advantage. And if you have anything, like any question in regards to how to teach kids to not bully, is always make it pro kindness pro cousin. And I use the word anti bullying, because people understand what that means normally, but I think my method is more pro pro kindness, pro teaching kids to be a good citizen.

And that's why the whole changing the language like okay, we're going to correct this action, not we're going to punish you, or like, we're going to make this right not, we need to discipline you, we're going to work on what happened and how we can correct this or how you can get to the point to apologize instead of like, you have to you know that you have to demand because when kids feel like they're being obligated when they're especially when they're not ready, it's not going to happen, and they're going to feel resentful, they're gonna feel like it's a punishment, they're not gonna learn their lesson, it's not going to be sincere, then the victims not gonna believe them. So, think about those things. You have to be patient. And you have to always think like, how is this positive? Let's take the the negative feeling and the negative language out of it.


Yeah. 100%. So with all of this being said, What is your dream then for the future? This is such


a personal thing for me, not just because I had to go and defend my kid. And let me tell you, it wasn't just when she was five. It's happened after that. But I experienced it as a kid and I was pretty bad. I came to the US from Nicaragua at the age of seven. And for some reason, all these years, you know, like you get older, you're thinking well, I was a target because I was the immigrant. I was different. I didn't know English. I had to speak it. And it was all choppy and stuff. People used to make fun of me. Even Latinos didn't really know what I was or where I was from. The studying was education. Like I would tell people or from mica, where they were like, Oh, well Carter Mikiko is that for him? I'm like, What? No, oh my gosh, that's so sad. You don't know geography, both in Central America. So all these misconceptions, the fact that kids are not taught diversity opens the door to bullying and many types of discrimination. So if you can create an environment at schools With the parents, that allows you to learn from one another, I think that can create an NFC in one school in particular do this.


So so well, well, it was incredible where all the parents used to go to most of the activities, events, function celebrations, assemblies. I mean, it was amazing, but it was the administration that just put a lot of effort into making them feel inclusive. So if the population at the school was majority like Latino, then guess what the menu was for their activities, something that those Latinos would most likely instead of forcing them to do something that is not, you know, in their culture, the music, they had a mixture of not just like, quote, unquote, American music, but also like Spanish or dawn, you know, like all the other stuff. So my dream is to be able to create Thai communities, because that's really where it starts. And the reason I work with parents is because, well, there are some schools that have bullying prevention programs, they're teaching the kids, right. But how, if you're not teaching the parent, how is the parents supposed to reinforce that? A lot of parents have never been to a workshop that teaches you them what bullying is, when I ask at every single workshop that I've ever had? I started off by asking them, can you clearly define what bullying is? And it is so rare for a parent to get it right. Because most of the times, they're describing teasing, and some of them just flat out say Nah, not really.


And when I started talking about the different types of bullying, the different types of cyber bullying, there just in charter, like I didn't even know that there were more than 10 different types of cyber bullying. I didn't know that there were four types of bullying that they teach at school there, there are more, I didn't know that every school district has a different or might have a different definition of bullying, than a different policy on how to report and how to investigate new incidents. Think I went off on a tangent here, but my dream is to have a very cohesive community and need school where bullying is not really the main reason why kids end up having that scar as a child in school, you know, because you talk to a lot of kids or adults today.


 And then they're like, so did you get bullied at school? You're like, Oh, yes. And then they have like this, you can feel their pain. Even as an adult. I remember, I spoke to the 64 year old man. And he came to the workshop because he brought his grandchild. And we just had this conversation. And he said, You know, I was bullied and he started occurring. And he's like, you know, that still haunts me. And I still knew all my life, I did this or didn't do that, because of what happened to me. And when you start having these conversations with adults, then first off, say, not really, I didn't have any experiences like that. And then they start thinking more about it, or like, oh, my gosh, either witnessed something or something happened to them. And you know, that's completely preventable. Is is that society thinks it's such a huge task. And like, No, you just start at home. You just start at home, or start with your classroom. That's all and start with the basics. But the basics are so underestimated. It's crazy.


Yeah, for sure. Because we don't know. And that's why the work that you do is so important. So I how do people get in touch with you and learn more about you and your worlds?


Oh, thank you for that question. So I'm very active on Instagram, but I'm on on social media at Valley talks is my handle. But at Danny tux.com? It's my website. And yeah, I have a blog. There's a free information. I have a podcast that only talks podcast, which you've been on?


Yes. Yeah. Well, yes. Works to talk with you.


So yeah, I'm here for people if they have a question and have courses, consulting workshops, and I can also go to your schools or your business, because everybody, yeah, I feel like this is something so basic, that is not just about kids, because the other two questions I get almost every single actually every single workshop that I've done, whether in person or online is how do I manage bullying at work? And the other one is, how do I handle a teacher bullying my child? So there's definitely work to be done?


Absolutely. Well, we are in the works. And it's really exciting. And I really looking forward to continuing this relationship with you and empowered educator because we certainly go hand in hand and it's just very exciting. So thank you for the work that you do in this world. It's been great to have you on the podcast today.


Thank you so much, Dan. I appreciate you.


I appreciate you. And if you enjoyed today's podcast, make sure you subscribe and please leave a five star review. And we'll see you next time on take notes. Incredible, right? Together, we can revolutionize the face of education. It's all possible. And it's all here for you right now. Let's keep the conversation going at empowered educator faculty room on Facebook.

If I know one thing about you, it is that you are a dedicated teacher.
Despite all the hardships you endure, being an effective teacher is, undoubtedly, a priority for you.
Now, when it comes to challenges and triumphs, do you ever wonder why some things work out and why some don’t?
One of the most important tools for being an empowered educator is the reflective process.
By reflecting on your experiences, you can align your purpose, understand what makes you happy, and develop an awareness of why things work out or don't.
This reflective process also helps you tune into your body and create a culture of celebrating even the hard stuff. Which is why I’m excited for episode 26 of Take Notes with Jen Rafferty!
Today, I’m joined by a special guest Selena Woodward.
Selena is a teacher, mentor, mother and the voice of The Reflective Teacher Podcast. She will be sharing her insights on the importance of reflection, especially for school teachers who want to build a fulfilling life and career.
Here’s a reminder to pause, notice, and reflect on the things around you, even if it means leaning into the difficult emotions. By doing so, you can enhance your effectiveness as a teacher and ultimately achieve a more rewarding career.
Stay empowered,
Jen

Let’s keep the conversation going! Find me at:
 Jen Rafferty | Instagram, YouTube, Facebook | Linktree
Instagram: @jenrafferty_
Facebook: Empowered Educator Faculty Room


About Selena:
Selena is the voice of the Reflective Teacher Podcast, a university Lecturer and an English and Drama teacher who coaches Educators around Australia through the Accreditation process. With years of experience working with the AITSL standards, she is well known for her clear, helpful and easy to implement tips and tricks for making the process of evidence gathering and reflective practice easier. Her mission to give teachers the perspectives and tools that they need to get the most out of the reflective process. She strongly believes that reflective practice is all about helping you to connect with what you already do everyday, to see your impact, to celebrate that impact and to share that with your students.

Connect with Selena here:
Edufolios.org
IG: @edufolios

TRANSCRIPT: I remember all the passion and vision you had when you first went into teaching. Feeling like building young minds and creating community through your work would make a lasting impact on this world. Well, those days may feel like they're behind you now because you're exhausted, stressed and overwhelmed and frustrated. But I'm here to tell you, it doesn't have to be like this. In fact, the love of teaching never really went away. But it absolutely needs transformation. Welcome to The Take notes Podcast. I'm Jen Rafferty, former music teacher, mom of two, and certified emotional intelligence practitioner, and I'm here to light the way for you. In order to create a generational change for our kids. We need to shift the paradigm away from the perpetual stress and overwhelm and into a life of joy, and fulfillment. This is education 2.0, where you become the priority, shift how you live your life, and how you show up both at work and at home. So take a sip of steamy morning coffee, and grab your notebook, it's time to Take Notes!

Hello, and welcome back to another fabulous episode of Takes Notes. I'm here with Selena Woodard, who is the voice of the Reflective Teacher Podcast, a university lecturer and an English and Drama teacher who teaches and coaches educators around Australia through the activation process. She is well known for her clear, helpful and easy to implement tips and tricks are making the process of evidence-gathering and reflective practice so much easier. And her mission is to give teachers the perspectives and tools that they need to get the most out of the reflective process. And she strongly believes that reflective practice is all about helping you to connect with what you already do every day. So you can see your impact and celebrate that impact and to share that with your students, Selena, Hello

Hello, How are you? thanks for having me.

Good!

Yes, I'm so glad we get to reconnect Selena and I met close to a year ago actually when I was a podcast. Everyone, need to listen to that one too. It's it was so much fun. We lost it out.

So I'm so glad you're back. And I would love for you to share a little bit before we dive into the nitty gritty of reflection. You know, why was reflection something that you wanted to even pursue the way that you're pursuing it right now why? Why was that important for you?

I think for me, it's the way my brain is wired, I have a magic power of being able to connect dots really, really quickly. I suspect that I am a bit neurodivergent and possibly a bit gifted. And my brain works really quickly. And so I also have a naturally curious brain that likes to understand everything. So reflective practice has been a huge part of just who I am in my head. And I'm sure there's others who can relate to that. Some might call it the strict critic at times, it can be a little bit mean that boys but I've always been really curious. And teaching for me was always about curiosity. I remember when I was studying to be a teacher at uni, I told myself, I wouldn't bother teaching for longer than 10 years, because it will get really boring because as an English teacher, that meant 10 years of teaching the same texts over and over again. And that was kind of what I understood it to be. And then when I became a teacher, and I realized that teaching had very little to do with the content and more to do with relational leadership, more to do with the how we deliver, it became such a glorious puzzle for my brain. I was like, right, I've got 32 different kids, five sets of 32 different kids every day to work out. And so reflective practice just became my way of understanding my impact. Because for me, what really matters is the difference that I'm making and how enthusiastic the kids are not just about English, but about themselves. I used to work in a lot of low socio economic schools, originally in the UK. And I used to work with a lot of kids who were very down on themselves didn't really see the world in a very exciting way. So I became like this. I'm a type two Enneagram. So I'm a helper and I have to solve the world's problems. And the only way to do that is to see and understand what's going on. And so reflective practice just became a part of what I do. And I used to do that by writing on a blog. And that's kind of how my whole business came about, because I ended up learning how to reflect and then here in Australia, we have teaching standards that we've been able then to use to dive deeper into the what and the why of what I'm doing. And it's just become a huge part of who I am as a professional who I am personally, I just think it's incredibly powerful. Absolutely.

Yes, it is powerful because we can't change but we don't notice. So reflection really is the noticing in all of that right?

Absolutely and that's it and often, particularly in teaching It's an incredibly busy job, right? We hardly have time for a wee in a day I used to say, you know, like, so I actually had to practice like meditation like anything else, I have to practice pausing and noticing, pausing and reflecting. Because otherwise we make assumptions about our practice, we assume that what we're doing is right, because it worked last time. And often we're wrong. And working with educators here in Australia, I often find the teachers are quite surprised when I take them through my processes. They go, Oh, my goodness, I was planning to like, for example, this year, I was working with a brilliant teacher in New South Wales. And he was working on preparing kids for an exam we have here called NAPLAN. And he had planned this whole unit. And then he was working with me. And I asked him to plan for measuring impact to reflect during his lesson and to do that with the kids. And within half an hour of his lesson, he realized that these kids were moving way faster than he thought they were. So if he hadn't have paused, hadn't planned to include that measurement of impact in his lesson, he would have carried on with this unit, and he would have slowed them down. And he would have wasted that time. And he was like, blown away by that, you know. So it's so important that we don't tell stories in our head about what we assume is happening. And so you're that puzzle, the part of that, but as you say, noticing it slowing down planning to see the impact, not only to understand the reasons why things are going well, and why they're not going well is just a part of the fun of teaching really, isn't it? A part of being?

Yeah, being an effective teacher. And I think that there are so many of these external evaluations or external variables that are placed on us to determine whether or not we're being effective. Whereas I think that the most powerful tool for being effective is the reflective process.

I don't know. And that's kind of why I've ended up with doing what I'm doing. Because we do have these teaching standards, right. And here in Australia, you have to prove that you've met certain levels of these teaching standards. There's the ones you do it uni as people see them, you kind of should be learning new things all the time. Hey, so but you know, there's the graduate ones, then there's the proficient ones that prove that you've ticked the boxes. And that's unfortunately, how it's been presented. It's a piece of paperwork, it's a hoop-jumping exercise is kind of that kind of culture behind it. And my mission is to just turn that around and go, actually, we got to do this stuff. Because it's a hoop-jumping exercise, it's part of our career progression. But we can make it really meaningful. And I haven't yet met a teacher who genuinely cares about the teaching standards, or the accreditation paperwork, what they actually care about is the kids, they're working with the colleagues, they're coaching, the community they're impacting on right. So if we can change our mindset, look at it through a slightly different lens, those tools that we've we feel like I've been thrust upon us can actually become really cool ways to help guide us through that reflection. So that's, that's kind of a huge part of what I do is a mindset shift, where we basically change it up and turn it around and say, what what do you care about? What is your purpose here? We know it's not tick the boxes do the paperwork, right? So how can we change the lens so that you can get that paperwork done, because it has to be done, but in alignment with who you are and what you believe, as a practitioner, and in a way that will spark you and actually inspire you.

So I actually get teachers telling me they're quite addicted to the process, because it becomes a bit game of bide, right. Okay. We've got 37 focus areas across this career stage. Oh, let's see what I can do. You know, and it helps you with that structure in it, it helps you become really aware. I don't know, Jen, I talk about the shadow side and the light side of a teacher. So bear with me. Okay, so this is No, I haven't told Jen about that. So when I work with educators, and we use the standards, and we use it in our way to help inform our practice, we usually discover that there is a light that we like to stand in. And it's really comfortable, and it feels really good. And there are certain areas of our practice that we run away from, there are shadows, that are things that we haven't done the professional development in, there are things that feel really hard, and we're a bit frightened to going towards. And so it's really good to know that. So for example, I know in my practice, I'm obsessed with education, technology, technology integration. That's what I lecture in at Flinders any year in South Australia. I've written books on that. And so as a teacher, I'll be like, can I go to this big conference in Sydney called edgy tech and someone will pay for me to go to that. But as you do I need to go and do more PD on the thing I've written books about sure I want to I want to go network and see my friends and I want to have the lunch and I want to find out what's new, or do I need to look at myself as a holistic practitioner.

Are there areas and I know there are that I am scared off. So as I said, I'm British, right. And I moved here 12 years ago to Australia. And one of our standards is Aboriginal Torres Strait Islander histories and cultures, I had no idea about that stuff, and so that I will happily avoid. So using reflective practice in line with a framework that allows me that enables me to go okay, so yes, you're allowed one fun conference in technology, and you can read all the books, but I also need you to go and address this thing, because it's actually really, really, really important. So I think, for me, those who've jumped in paperwork, things, it's about mindset. And it's about aligning that back to your purpose, so that you are meeting the requirements of whatever government body, you know, is currently in power, but you're doing it with style. And you're doing it by setting those hoops on fire, because like, you ain't doing nothing, you ain't got time for anything, that's not going to make a difference to you personally, or your kids. And I think a slightly practice is a huge part of that for me. Yeah.

Style and fire. I like where you’re going for.

Okay, good. You know where to go?

Yeah. So I would love for you to walk us through a little bit of the process, because I think that reflection can become this very big, heavy meta idea. Whereas reflection can happen in those small moments in those interactions that you have with students, or colleagues, right? Or even at home with your family, right? Because you're the same person, whether you're at work, or it's yes, or at home. So can you talk us through some of those places and the processes of what reflection even looks like?

Yeah, so I guess for work purposes, I have lots of different strategies, we can do different lenses. So let's think about this. So if I'm a teacher, and I'm looking to just reflect on my practice, in a really informal way, I'm not currently trying to tick a box. I'm just here to show up for myself, show up for my students and lean into that curiosity. I actually talk a lot about professional spidey senses in my work. So really channeling spider man here. All right, you know, we all have, you know, we've seen spidey senses tingle. And I don't know, I'm sure everyone can relate that, as a teacher, we have the same ability. And it comes over time, you know that you plan this amazing lesson, and you've spent hours on it on Sunday, you might have laminated some things off, you've gone crazy. And then you rock up on Monday morning, and it's a full moon last night, it's high winds, it's raining, and probably some insect slash pigeons flown into your classroom, you know, like, sudden, why don't all of those days, you know, doesn't matter how much time and effort you've put into that lesson, it ain't going to happen the way you thought it was, the kids are up on the ceiling, game over because there's a wasp, or pigeon, you know, like all these things happen.

It could be as dramatic as that, or as simple as you've got 30 Kids in front of you. And there's just a group of kids in one corner, or one or two who are just not aligned to what you're doing and are vibing they're not getting it, maybe their behavior is not quite right. Something there'll be a sense that this isn't working, you'll get a gut feeling, I really feel that it's a real that's why it's relational in our classroom, right that you'll get a feeling like Oh, and you can either just keep going stick to the plan. Or, as we get more practice, we start to I guess, pivot, you could use the business center, pivot and go, right, okay, this is not working, what will work and you pull out another resource, or you try something different. And in those moments, you're already in the process of reflection. And what's happening is you're actually, if you can be aware of what your body's telling you and tuning in, you'll begin to be aware of how you do it automatically. You'll be like, Okay, why did I just have it that? Why did I change my plan. And so what I get my teachers to do, is in their planner, I get them to write emojis in the corner. So if we felt great again, to draw a smiley face, and just one word next to it about something just to remind them of what it was. And if it felt like oh god, this is all going to crap. They can draw a pigeon if necessary, right? I like a sad base that that or sad base and a question like a word in a question.

And then once the lesson is over, I asked the people I work with to schedule just 15 minutes a week, it's all into their day. So we have met times and noncontact time on our timetables, and we make sure there's 15 minutes to pick a smiley face incident or spidey sense incident and just dive into it. And I think the really important thing about that, well, it's twofold. One, if it's happy, we need to pause and connect with that and celebrate that because my God, we are so tired. Right now the world has been bonkers. And when we focus on the difference we are making, that's our purpose. That's our y that recharges us that makes us feel good. That makes our brain go, Hey, I like this. We should do more. It helps us keep going You're right, and helps us focus on the path we want to go on. That's really important. And the other thing that's really important is to lean into the sad face. Because the sad face represents what I like to call our metaphorical rock. I don't know, Jen, have you ever taught a lesson where it's gone really crap, and you didn't address it? And you know, you've got that class again next week. And you maybe you have a cup of coffee before it's coffee break or whatever. And you're just reading them arriving? Because you're still in the energy you were a week ago. Has that ever happened to you?

Oh, yeah, for sure. Absolutely.

Yeah. And that is the rock. Right? That? Yeah. Yeah. And that's the sad face. That's the rock. All right. So sometimes, and this really freaks out the teachers I work with, because they think when they're reflecting, they've got to only talk about the good stuff, because they need to show up and show the world that they're amazing. And I'm like, but the way you show you're an amazing educator, is to show you're an amazing learner. And I Oh, yeah, that's a good point. Okay, so if that went wrong, what can you learn about that, that means you could put that rock down and not carry it to the next lesson that you have with those kids? Is there something you can take away from that. And then when you've learned that lesson, your brain will let it go. If you spend all term just adding rocks to your rucksack, by the end of the term, you're just so busy carrying all that you haven't, you know, one of the resources that you know, let's say the power of that, just that simple practice of 15 minutes and just tuning into your body and going okay, do I need to drop a rock? But that's terrible. Robert, Robert, doing Oh, do I need a break? You know, how does that sound?

That's a really informal, one that I do with my teachers all the time. And that's gonna be a conversation with leadership, too. If you're listening to this as a leader in a school, creating a culture of celebrating the hard stuff, and making space for teachers to admit it was hard, and it's safe, and they can be vulnerable. And they can listen to each other and say, Yeah, I had that as well. You know, like, it's amazing what we can learn from each other. So I'll give you an example from my practice, if you like, I once had a ye eight class, I was always given the tricky classes. I love puzzles, right? So tricky. Classes are my favorite thing. So I had this great class and I couldn't crack them in terms of they were just all over the place shiny. Now. I'm also very shiny. And I had to be aware of that. So I was trying to dull my shiny down and or shiny up over here, like get there. I tried everything you know, like, right, I'll increase the pace of my lesson.

So they keep moving in the car. It's so time to move I'll I'll or I'll try classical music. And we'll come in and we'll come tried everything and nothing was working. And I was reflecting on is trying different things, tweaking and pivoting all over the place. Still, still not quite got it. And one of my colleagues, Alistair, his name is Alistair had them once a week. So we kind of had a slip class. Now Alice does a very different teacher. I'm very loud and big, and I have lots of energy. Alistair is that teacher who walks down the corridor with the clipboard and everyone runs, you know, I know. But that's his performance, right? And I was like, okay, and he's like, I don't have any issues. I know what you're talking about. I'm like, Well, of course you don't. But um, alright. So eventually, I decided to go and observe my class with him. And you know, I tried everything. And I'm telling myself stories at this point, because I'm running out of ideas. And you know, what he did differently? One thing he did differently was he closed the blinds in his classroom. And that meant that the interactive whiteboard screen at the front was the shiniest thing in the room. And it changed the energy. And I was like, Are you kidding me? And I have spent all term like, pedagogy, their strategy. And sometimes being in a culture where it's okay to say to a colleague, dude, help me, he can come and observe me and he can just draw my blind spots. You know, like, just being able to do that and reflect together is probably one of the most powerful things you can do for your kids in your community. So yeah, so having that informal way of doing that is really great in a sort of, on the fly kind of way. But I also have a bit of a ritual that I like to do at the end of term as well. Do you like to hear about that one?

Yeah, sure. These are great.

This is this. Yeah. Cool. So I have a little ritual that I like to do every quarter or every term however, it kind of rolls with you guys semester, whatever word you like to use when you're feeling like okay, sometimes those rocks sneak in, and you're like, feeling like crap about this bit crap about that. Can't reflect on everything in 15 minutes a week. Okay, so you set aside an hour, and I make two lists. I make a list of everything that felt awesome and let me up and everything that felt heavy and I just regret and I wish it would go away. And there's like, for me, that's usually shame and embarrassment, and oh my god, I'm not good enough fives in that column, right? That's usually that column. And I just list them all. Put some music on, have a coffee and just get it all out. I like to call it vomiting on the page, but Do it with words. Okay, do it with with just let it all that happy face column sad face column. And then you get a different colored pen. And you write why.

So not just the what but why I always start in the sad column because that's just how I like to torture myself. But this is clearing. All right, so Okay, so that lesson that was a complete disaster. Why? What happened? Was it that I didn't have the resources? Was it that I had tried to too much, there was just too much. And it was, you know, what was it and I'll just make notes in a different color. So what I'm trying to do here is connect with the why I'm trying to let my brain move away from the emotion that the emotion is my signpost I need it. It shows me that the thing is a rock. It was an uncomfortable heavy emotion, write down what triggered it. And then I write next to it, why I think that happened. And then I look in the happy column. And this is a really real doozy for me, or I go okay, here are all the things in the happy column. Is there anything in here and this is that word? Should?

Is there anything in here that I feel I should feel more excited about than I am? And it's really interesting this column, because this is where it reveals my values as an educator, usually, okay. So for example, I might have written, there was an X percentage increase in attainment in this class, right? I could have written it like that. And I'm like, I should feel like, wow, the school thinks that's a huge thing. And they wanted that grade or, but for me, it wasn't really about that with that class. Alright, and then I'm like, Okay, so let's lean into why I'm not as excited as I should be. What's going on there? Is that a block for me? Am I not able to say you did something amazing there? Is this something coming up in me that I need to look at around a block? Or is it that that doesn't really belong in this smiley column, that's somebody else's, that I'm now accepting your projection of, doesn't need to be there. And that helps me stay at alignment with what I actually care about next term. And it helps me learn the lessons that I need to learn and let go of the things that I don't want to do. And I actually learned that from a guy called James Wedmore, in a business podcast about looking at what you've been doing in your business every quarter. And I tweaked it. And it's so powerful, because it's exactly the same practice. It's not deep reflection, that one, it's not like, let's dive into the detail of what teaching strategies I choose. It's just connecting with where your body is showing your emotions, learning what you need to learn. So that next time you're not carrying all of that, and I'll be honest, like some types of rock sneaks through now even. And they recruit showing up because you got to practice. That's right, you got to practice it is reflective practice, it takes practice. But if you don't show up for it, and you know, practice, that you get more rocks, that's my experience, like it is true, two different ways.

No, that's kinda, and I think, you hit on two things that are really aligned with the work that I do and share this idea of constantly looking for that alignment, we are so good at projecting, like you said, and what we think we should be doing or what we're supposed to be doing, what we should feel excited about what we should feel, maybe embarrass or shame about or guilt about. But at the end of the day, once you are able to get it out of your head and onto paper, it becomes more objective. And you can start to think about it consciously and separate from the stories and the narratives that have become a part of who you are. And decide, is this serving me or not? Because if it is, if you like your Banda rocks, cool, like live in love, if you

need them, okay, sometimes they aren't serving you. And that's usually a sign that you probably do have some work to do. But you know, like, you could carry that the water?

 Absolutely. I don't actually want to carry these rocks anymore, then that's a moment of beautiful growth. And is it going to be uncomfortable putting them down after you've been so used to carrying them all the time? Absolutely. That's why I think doing this with somebody who can walk you through the practice or in community, like what we've been talking about, even before the podcast started recording, we were talking about community building, you know, yeah, to do this individually within community. Absolutely.

And it is really important because the schools that I work with, where I've got one teacher, and they're on their own, they say come to me because they're feeling isolated, and they need that community connection. And I run eight week programs and we connect in zoom and we're from all over Australia usually, you know, and I want to add as well go back to what you were saying around the whole stories and taking it personally thing and I want to bring it back to the paperwork because I know we all hate the paperwork right and the teaching standards in every country. We all resent them when we feel that we told her to do our job and and that is often honestly for me came from a place of fear because they represent a judgment. That's how it feels. They are there to judge me. And I'm scared of that because I don't want to fail. It's important to me that I'm really good at My job, but if I get practice that reflection, it's important to me that I learn I get the data, the information about where things aren't right, and I am leaning into it, right. And then that means that instead of seeing it as judgment, I'm seeing it as an opportunity for growth. Now, a lot of people will be listening to that, oh, yeah, whatever. But lean in with me here, okay, because it's proven, it works time and time. Again, if you flip it right, and you start with your story that's really important. Do not start with the standards, whatever they're called when in whatever area, do not start with the paperwork. Start with the curiosity, start with the emotion and write it out. So if you're doing a smiley faces in your planner, and then using that 15 minutes format on the page again about that thing, don't worry about how formal it is, or what someone else is going to think when they read it. None of that is relevant. Just get in here, get it out. And then use the paperwork, right? Use the frameworks to ask questions. Because what that does, if you're on your own, and you don't have a community around you to do that for you, is it gives you a kind of scaffold a way of diving deeper into your practice. So you know, if you've written about an assessment, look at what the standard say about assessment and ask yourself. So here in Australia, we've got one that's ridiculously long. That's something that uses a range of formal informal summative, they're like, oh, there's really ridiculously long standard about assessment. All right. And so maybe I look at that, and I go, Okay, this assessment was crap, it didn't work I got, I didn't get the data I needed, let's have a look at the standard. Or maybe what I actually needed was a formative assessment, not a summative one. So the standards become a friend, they become a completely impartial guide on the side. It's really powerful. And it's a real mindset shift. And I know it does mean that you do become quite happy with those pieces of paperwork. But you know why? It's because you're owning them. And you're using them in a way that fuels you and is again aligned with what you're doing. And you're not letting them lead anything. You're asking them to be the guide on the side to you as the hero learning how to do your job. Amazingly, they are your Yoda.

All right, that's who they are. I've seen them that way. And take them with a pinch of salt. And then if you don't, eventually you will end up being able to guide other people in that way. And what tends to happen is because they're not no longer about judging you negatively, they're about leaning in a beach curious and identifying, oh, my God, I've done all of that. I'm amazing. Or, oh, that's curious. I've been avoiding that. A lot of people who come to me here in South Australia or in Australia, they want to do the we have four career stages. And two of them are like the highly accomplished and lead teacher status. And a lot of teachers come to me wanting to do ha ha highly accomplished because they feel like they want another certificate, it's time for them to prove themselves. And then by the time they're finished with me, they don't want the certificate. Because what they've actually realized is there's plenty of fun to be had. And I do say fun playing with those standards and exploring themselves as educators. And eventually once they've done that they will have their evidence. And if they fancy submitting it to get the certificate cool. They've got it right. There just got to obviously they got to package it for the assessor but it'll be easier. They know what the joy, and they're having so much fun using the framework as their Yoda. It's helping them dive in a creating it in a way that means it's not personal. And if you're mentoring a trainee teacher from uni, it's the same thing. Did you have a crap practice? You have an awful prac when you were a practicum, when you were training to be a teacher, everyone I know had that one mentor that made their life miserable. Did you have that? That? Feels so I had a really hard Lucky. Lucky. Okay, good. Well, I'm very proud of that's very good. People I know of her Yes.


That's good.

That's wonderful. Well, you know, like, if you are mentoring a pre service teacher, it can be really hard to guide them and say, Look, actually, this isn't working. And so if you can go back, you go back with this, this what you did,

let's have a look at the standards, how to use it, you can use that you can use your sub Yoda, you can be chief Yoda. And the standards can be many. I don't know, Greg, who is that work that will work. They can send us can we grow goo in that instance. All right, and you can use them to help guide the conversation and keep it really professional and not let it go. She doesn't like me or anything like that. You know, like, it's amazing. So even if you're working in a mini community where you're mentoring somebody, using the standards like that just keeps the conversation really healthy. It's really cool. See, I get very passionate about it. No, I passionate about rubrics.

i Well, I think that's why I always so you know, drawn to your energy and other things that you share and do and even when we first met because it's that passion and that it's very clear and evident in what you share and how you share it that it's not about the word. It's very clearly about the why for you and yes, that's Yes, really. I think why we Both aligned in love having these conversations, I was one something that you said that I think is really important too about ego, you know, our ego wants to make everything personal. And when that happens, it sabotages the reflective practice, because you're no longer looking at objective data, all of a sudden, you are trying to protect your ego from being hurt, and from being wrong. And so it gets in the way of real learning and expansion. And when you start to practice dropping your ego, you start promoting the pieces of yourself that are curious. So you can actually have the space to expand and be open to new information so you can grow. But that, I think, in my experience, and what I've observed and correct me if I'm wrong, that's usually the biggest saboteur

it is. And that's where self awareness becomes really important. And for me, I'm going to be a bit nervous might come across as nuts that I don't care, I guess I had, like, lots of voices. In my head, I had lots of different kinds of egos. My ego was very split into different personalities, they were all protectors from different phases of my life, you're off of them, I had no idea where they were coming from some of them, you know, as anyone else, you might hear mom's voice in your head, or you might hear and you realize, oh, that's my mom, that's weird. Or teacher, as a teacher, you know, you hear your teachers voices in your head, you compare yourself to your favorite teacher, or you desperately don't want to be that teacher, you hate it, you know, like, there's all these thoughts, and they're all running in your unconscious, you're just not consciously aware of them. And so I think self awareness is a really big part of it. I think reflective practice is a great way to start becoming self aware. And the more you practice it, you start to see patterns emerging. And then you're like, that's the interesting pattern. Do I want that pattern? Where's that pattern coming from? And I know, for me, I tie my professional life and my personal life very closely. We were talking before recording about that in terms of business. But that's very true in teaching, too, because it's a very relational space. I've said that lots of times you are there as a human with other humans, every human in that room sees the world completely differently. So there can't be perfection, because every single person has a completely different view of what perfection is. So that's a completely stupid game. Don't play that one. And so yeah,

yeah, no more perfection.

Don't buy that game. Yeah, it's pointless. Yeah. If you interviewed everyone in that room and ask them, even if they're for what's the perfect lesson, they'll all have a different idea about what that looks like. That's part of the puzzle, right? And you're trying to create some learning activities and some learning experiences that tap into as many things. It's exhausting. It's so fun. I love it. Like my brain loves it. You can hear that's what my brain does. It's these patterns. And yeah, you know, it's amazing that as you do that, I remember in my early career in England, we used to get observed every year and graded with a number. And I would be devastated. If I was satisfactory. That was failure. As far as I was concerned. I'm a Hermione Granger, by the way, Harry Potter. So I needed outstanding. But then I would work so hard to get the outstanding I would sabotage myself because I was so busy trying this is how I've learned my lessons and got to where I am now. Right? I was so busy trying to tick all the boxes, I actually forgot that I was actually there to teach children really, to be honest. I remember I had a role as a technology lead. that'll surprise everyone. No. So I've always coordinated technology across several faculties. And I was being observed by my line manager. So I prepared this amazing lesson. I was in Birmingham in the UK, it was travel writing, I had teachers from New York, ready to answer my kids questions in a chat room that was all fully vetted. I had Time Square, beaming live on my interactive whiteboard. I was going for it at the end of the lesson. And the teacher went, This was great. It was so exciting.

Lots of great, cool stuff. But I'm gonna I can only give you satisfactory and I probably should fail you. And I'm like, What will your learning objectives were about sentence structure and creating in creative writing. But they just seem to spend a lot of time talking to teachers in New York. And I was like, shit. Oh, no. Yeah, like, I got so upset. We're trying to prove to this guy that I was a tech genius. And I had all this network Look at me, because that's what I thought he wanted to see. I completely lost sight of the fact that I was actually there to teach them travel right. I know the kids had a great time I even saved them New York bagels at the door. I did the whole sensory experience, noodle bagels at the door sound and I was going for the full sensory experience. It was a brilliant lesson, but I didn't teach him any English, unfortunately. So you know, like it was a great that was a God moment for me, in reflection of how far I was willing to go to try and please somebody else, not my Kids. And as I say, if you're into Enneagram, I'm a type two Enneagram. So it's really important to me when I'm in an unhealthy place that everyone loves me and appreciates me. So I will work really, really, really hard until you tell me that I'm fabulous. I think a lot of teachers might be a type two, we love that.

I think you're right. Yeah. And you know, it's funny, I've interviewed so many people who have shared those oshit moments with me, you know, you are sworn to poker? Oh, that's totally fine. And because it's, it's real, it's important. You know, this is something that every teacher goes through at some point, if you're paying attention, right, so you're doing your thing, and then all of a sudden, you're in this world, and your eyes all of a sudden, are open, and you are swept into being in like the middle of a mud puddle that is also in a desert, and you're in outer space, and you have no idea of where you are because you lost sight of maybe the thing that matters, right? Or yeah, you've become so disconnected from perhaps the objective or the purpose in an effort to follow tradition, to people, please to be a perfectionist, or the list goes on and on and on and on. And all of

that is my ego, right? It's my ego, because my ego is trying to protect me, it's like this guy wants you to show him this. And that's not what that guy, I've made that story up. Well, my ego has made that story up. Because he thinks it's helpful, and it's trying to protect me, thank you, we go, thank you very much, right? It's an old panic come, it comes from my childhood, I'm trying to please the older figure, I'm trying to doesn't matter whether they know, I probably knew way more, it didn't matter. That doesn't matter. Because he's been around longer. He's in a position of seniority. Therefore, these are the rules. And these are the things I have to do. And that's not who I am. That's not self that's protector, or firefighter. If you're into internal family systems. It's like, yeah, it says me risk.

We can talk about that. And we're gonna put a pin in that.

Watch out watch as we do, no doubt. So yeah, like, so like, it's parts of me that are doing a beautiful job. They're parts of all programs, though. And you know, that protector might have appeared when I was four. And at that point, I was 30, something like, I don't need the same little person to pop up. So for me, with all the reflective practice, it does come down to self awareness. And then I'll start to see these patterns in my ego. And then I can then move to a place where I can get someone to help me unpack that and pull those away. So that and this is not just about me, as a teacher, this is personally too because you start to see the same middle over there on my hand, that's what I do. My therapist, there is no, they wouldn't be like a pop up, I have a chat with them. And I integrate them back. Because it's usually a conflict when that happens. Yeah, like at the end of that lesson, I'm like, Oh, right. So I listened to you. And this is what's happened. And this part of me wants to be really successful. And that means making sure the kids are learning for this job, have and growing and developing their skills personally and in English and Drama. And this person really, really wants to impress the boss, and thinks that then they're probably doing both the same thing. But they've just got different ways of doing it. And it's about letting four year olds with whoever this one is integrate with the one who actually knows the real world and the present, and that in them come together so that I can actually do what I need to do without being sabotaged by a part of me that is no longer that helpful isn't serving me anymore. Yeah.

And that's when you start to really do the introspective work. It's just data. It is all daily, and there's nothing wrong with you. And there's nothing broken. We're all beautiful, human, and we get to be on this journey of exploration and self discovery. And I think that is the most exciting journey to be on.

It is an if you are a practitioner of reflectiveness or reflective practitioner.

So you get to lead into that with curiosity, right? So you learn, you kind of learn to be okay in those uncomfortable spaces, because your brain learns and understands that you stay there for a little time. And then it drops and it's okay again, because you put the rock down, right. If you don't practice that, then the uncomfortableness feels really limited scary. And don't get me wrong. Sometimes there are some scary rocks and I don't want to go near them, like you saying they're serving me in some way right now. And I don't even want to go there because they're too scary. And that's totally okay. There has to be a level of resilience in you as well. I think that's really important. Don't go and cover in rocks when you're not in a good place to uncover a rock. You know, like you got to have the support which you know, is coming back to that community professionally, and it could be professional help. Personally, I think I personally have been journeying this year with neuro linguistic programming that has been amazing for doing that my my practitioner that I work with does parts work as part of the end They'll pay as well. That's the little people and the integration. And that has been really great. And that takes my self awareness to another level now, because I've been doing that for about a year. And so now I'll rock up to session, I'll be like, Hey, I noticed this thing. It was really interesting because things are popping up in my life. And I be like, this happens. And then I feel like this, and I just shut down. And she's like, there was a sore. What did you think before you shut down on it? Oh, nothing, I didn't think anything, I just shut down. She's like, that's not how it works. You got to slow this down. And that's what I mean about the unconscious subconscious things that you're doing so fast, you actually genuinely have no conscious awareness of them. And the first part of the conversation is always is that awareness, right? And so when something like that happens, and I don't understand why I've shut down so like I maybe I'm in a meeting, someone said something and the shame monster has consumed me, I tend to go into my shame cave, I'll shrink inside and go very, very quiet. I don't want to do that. I'm a powerful, informed educator. Like, I don't need to go into the shame case. That's not who I am. Right. So I'm like, an amped up like, Well, what did you think? And I'm like, nothing. So I had to become really conscious of what was happening before I went into the shame cave, like what was the thought? And then once we had the thought we could work with that and explore what that thought was, what emotions were attached to it, and then just pull it away. It's really interesting. And it's not like a lobotomy, but it feels besides strings. Yeah, basically. Well, my brain, overfond, 42. Now, so I've got 42 years of very wacky wiring going on in here. And there's 42,000 protectors and the voices, I used to call them the voices, and they all had different opinions. Sometimes they argue with each other to say, I hope everyone's relating to this, and they'll go, Who is this completely insane

woman hanging out with me and empowered, educated, and we're all this is familiar target. Okay, good. We're going to Okay, cool.

So there's all these choices, you know, like, but I want to be listed y'all, but you must please this person. And then there's another one over here. And so I can take that once I work out what my body is doing, how my unconscious mind is kicking in those pathways, I can see them, I can unpack them, and I can choose to remove them. It's as simple as that with the help of a practitioner. And that is amazing. And really, I'm going to use a really weird word. It's really discombobulating. Oh, because I remember saying to her, it's like, I've been driving the car with the mirrors adjusted like this. And now you've pulled that away, I need to adjust my mirrors and everything looks different. Like the way I show up is different. The way I see that person's behavior is different, because it's no longer about me, it's about them. And that gives me the power to hold up a mirror. Sometimes it was with love and compassion, and let them learn that thing that they need to take forward. Because if I keep taking it all, they're never going to go on their journey, right?

They're never going to learn what they need to learn. So I it's been amazing. And I think yeah, reflective practice is definitely the beginning of that. And the more you practice it, as I say, that leads to patterns. And that leads to real freedom. And that's what it's about. For me, I want to be me, I kind of see from an internal family systems perspective, their self and myself, Selena, she's very chilled, she likes to sit down under the cross legged and just chill, she laughs a lot about all the crazy things going on around us. She finds it very amusing. And then there's all these other versions, there's all these other protectors who think she's Why is she relaxed like that, like they're anxious, they're anxious, they're busy, they're very high energy. And, and she just has to have a conversation with them fairly regularly. And I now know by feeling into my body when I am self, and when my ego or these parts are showing up to sabotage me. And that's so powerful. Now that's taken years of practice. But that's incredibly powerful to know what it feels like call it when you're in alignment. And when you're not, you know, what happens? What do I do, I will giggle a lot I'll say something really serious and then giggle because I'm scared. You know, like I'll be I'll have giggled over something that's really not funny. That means you're uncomfortable. Okay, just take a breath, you know, like little tics, little things that show up in my body. It's really interesting. And it all begins with learning to slow enough to reflect professionally. And of course, personally, chi, they all very tied together.

 Yeah. Well, wherever you go, there you are. So yes, yeah, exactly. No, is going to be the stage of entourage. Areas versions of you, however, yeah,

it's still last question. I know, because we can go on forever. And I would love to actually continue this conversation in some other capacity. But for the purpose of today's podcast, what is your dream for the future of education?

I think for me, education is always about learning. And everyone will be like, Well, duh. But weirdly, I think education is not always about learning when it comes to the way the system is currently set up. It's about political agendas. I said it you know, like, I've got to be able to track these numbers. So I look good. And I can say and let me again, there's always some kind of strange thing for me edgy Patients should be a relational for me education is about removing all of this hierarchy and understanding that no matter how old we are, or what journey we're on, it's about community and about sharing knowledge and wisdom. So as an English teacher, I can nerd out about William Shakespeare and go into loads of detail. And I want to share that with kids so that they feel excited about the history and the culture of the arts, you know, I don't and if they get an A in their exam, awesome, but you know, like, I want them to be to learn what they want to learn, I want to light them up. So for me, education is about lighting buyers, it's Prometheus, I guess it's lighting fires, and allowing kids and teachers the freedom to experience their fire and nurture that. And that does mean sometimes exploring the things that are putting out the fire. And that can be systems that can be processes, and it can be ourselves. So for me, education is about alignment, I want my dream would be that people are free to be vulnerable in their jobs in their spaces, and educator vulnerable with the kids and vulnerable with each other, so that we can all grow together on that journey. Because I can tell you now, I learned so much from my students and from my colleagues and from teachers that I work with. It is all a reciprocal energetic exchange, you know, like, it's all about learning and swapping knowledge and wisdom. And I think if we could make education focus on what lights us up, I think the world would be a much happier place. Rather than all this pressure on things that don't really matter to most, you know, yeah. That went deep. Sorry, that was

No, I love it. I'll tell you being surrounded by people who are gonna fan your flame. Absolutely.

Protect and fan it. Absolutely. Yeah. I mean, yeah, part of my job is that we've I've been up we haven't. Exactly, this is what it should be. This is education, right? We're learning from each other. We're swapping stories. We're sharing wisdom. And we're lighting each other up. And we're very excited. Yeah, that's it. That's it.

So how can people learn more about you and get in touch with you?

Yeah, sure. So my business is called edgy folios. So I actually have a business where you can reflect on your practice very geared towards the Aussie market, but you're welcome to come and join us. And that's edgy. folios. That's Ed U F O l i o s.org. And I have a podcast to gents on it. And I talk about reflective practice all the time. So if you want to learn more tune in to more of the stories and the interviews that I have to then head to add your folios.org and just shove podcast on the end. And you can connect with me there. And feel free to have a wander through all the resources. I also have some online courses, you can come join me on, it's all at edgy folios.org.

And her podcast is pretty fantastic. So check that out because you'll learn some really great stuff. So Selena, thank you so much for your time and your talents and sharing them with the world of take notes. I still appreciate you.

I appreciate you. But back at you my friend. Thank you for having me.

So if you enjoyed today's podcast, don't forget to write a five star review and subscribe and we'll see you next time on take notes.

Incredible, right? Together, we can revolutionize the face of education. It's all possible. And it's all here for you right now. Let's keep the conversation going at Empowered Educator Faculty room on Facebook.

Do you find yourself constantly giving your all without expecting anything in return?
While it's admirable to prioritize others and hold space for them, this trait can also lead to teacher burnout.
Also, it's crucial to remember that prioritizing your own needs is just as important as thinking of others.
As a valued and empowered educator, creating a healthy work environment is essential in providing the best possible learning experience for your students. That's why I'm excited to introduce you to episode 25 of Take Notes with Jen Rafferty, featuring special guest Amelia Nagoski.
Amelia, an Associate Professor and Coordinator of Music at Western New England, is an expert on the human body and a celebrated author and conductor. She's here to share insights on a range of topics, from human giver syndrome to the effects of oppressive social systems on individuals.
It's time to remind yourself that you deserve happiness and fulfillment in your life. By taking care of yourself, you can continue to be the best educator you can be. So join us for an inspiring conversation with Amelia Nagoski and start prioritizing your well-being today!

Stay empowered,
Jen

Let’s keep the conversation going! Find me at:
 Jen Rafferty | Instagram, YouTube, Facebook | Linktree
Instagram: @jenrafferty_
Facebook: Empowered Educator Faculty Room
 About Amelia:
Amelia Nagoski is the co-author, with her sister Emily, of the New York Times bestselling book, Burnout: The Secret to Unlocking the Stress Cycle and the Burnout workbook. She has a Doctorate of Musical Arts and her job is to run around waving her arms and making funny noises and generally doing whatever it takes to help singers get in touch with their internal experience. She lives in New England with her husband, one cat, and two rescue dogs.
https://www.burnoutbook.net/

TRANSCRIPT:  Sometimes teacher burnout comes from holding space for others all the time and prioritizing others regardless of how much you need to take care of yourself. However, empowered educators know that they need to make themselves a priority in order to build a healthy work environment that is nurturing for both you and your students.

Today, I am talking with Amelia Nagoski, author of Burnout, The Secret to Unlocking the Stress Cycle which by the way, the link to the book and the workbook is in the show notes. And we are discussing understanding human giver syndrome and the impacts of oppressive social structures within our school systems.

I hope this episode serves as a reminder that you have permission to be happy and find joy in your life. So you can move the needle forward and leave this world in a better place for the next generation. And here's the thing, we can't do this alone. This work only works within the community. So if you are listening, it is time to join the Facebook group Empowered Educator Faculty Room. And if you enjoyed the podcast, you'll love this Facebook group because you'll get to have live workshops with me giveaways, insights, and a place to celebrate you throughout your empowered journey. You belong here in the Empowered educator, faculty room on Facebook.

Remember all the passion and vision you had when you first went into teaching. Feeling like building young minds and creating community through your work would make a lasting impact on this world. Well, those days may feel like they're behind you now because you're exhausted, stressed and overwhelmed and frustrated. But I'm here to tell you it doesn't have to be like this. In fact, the love of teaching never really went away. But it absolutely needs transformation. Welcome to The Take notes Podcast. I'm Jen Rafferty, former music teacher, mom of two, and certified emotional intelligence practitioner, and I'm here to light the way for you. In order to create a generational change for our kids. We need to shift the paradigm away from the perpetual stress and overwhelm and into a life of joy, and fulfillment. This is education 2.0, where you become the priority, shift how you live your life, and how you show up both at work and at home. So take a sip of steamy morning coffee, and grab your notebook. It's time to Take Notes.

Hi, everyone. Welcome back to another fabulous episode of take notes. I am here with the incredible Amelia Nagoski, who is the co-author with her sister Emily of The New York Times best-selling book Burnout, the Secret to Unlocking the Stress Cycle and the Burnout Workbook. She has a doctorate of Musical Arts and her job is to run around waving her arms and making funny noises and generally doing whatever it takes to help singers get in touch with their internal experience which I can completely relate to what my mother thought I did for very many years. She lives in New England with her husband, one cat and two rescue dogs.

Thank you so much for being here, Amelia.

It's my pleasure.

Let's just dive in. Can we just get in it because we have such a short amount of time and so much I want to talk about can we talk first about giver syndrome? And how teachers, especially teachers, who are women and teachers who are women and also parents that's like the trifecta, right? Experience this idea of givers syndrome, what is it and what does that mean?

It comes from a book called Down Girl the Logic of Misogyny by a moral philosopher named Caveman. And Dr. Mann is a moral philosopher posits a world in her book where there are two kinds of people, human beings who have a moral obligation, because she's a moral philosopher, they have a moral obligation to be their humanity, to live it, to express it, to acquire whatever resources are necessary in order to accomplish that goal. And the other kind of people are the human givers who have a moral obligation to give. Their humanity their time, their lives, their bodies, to others, but in particular, the human beings who are entitled to everything that human givers have to offer and even more than they have to offer. And it's from a book called Down girl, the Logic of Misogyny. So can you guess which group the women are?

Of course, human givers and this is like a feeling that rings really true. And a lot of people respond to this by going I mean, I like giving, I feel like it's my purpose in life to share and to support the people around me. And yes, indeed, that is, as a default state for humanity. Ideal. What is not ideal is existing as a giver in a world with beings who feel entitled to your time and life and energy and body. So they make it clear that you have a moral obligation to squeeze yourself empty like a tube of toothpaste to be discarded once you have nothing more left. So that dynamic resulting what Emily and I call Human Giver Syndrome. It becomes toxic when you start to internalize the belief that you have a moral obligation to be at all times pretty happy, calm, generous, and attentive to the needs of others. And that if at any time you fail, in your own moral obligation to be at all times, pretty happy, calm, generous, and attend the needs of others, then you are a failure. And that since you are a failure, you deserve to be punished. And like, if nobody's around to punish you, we just go ahead and punish ourselves.

And finally, the last sign of human giver syndrome is, if you think that this has just played a role is it's just normal and true. Of course, I feel a moral obligation to give until I have nothing left. I don't deserve resources for myself, that's selfish for me to have a full night's sleep, eat a nutritious meal, sitting down at a table among friends, I only deserve whatever I can stuff in my mouth while I'm driving my kid to soccer. That's all I deserve, because I should be giving all the time. So that's this system is an ideal way to burn out half the population. And of course, I mean, being from a book called Down Girl, the Logic of Misogyny, this is a lot about gender dynamics, but of course, the power dynamic that exists across all the intersections of power and oppression. So even as a woman who feels this from men who are in a position of power above them, even if they're not, like hierarchically systematically, men are told by the universe that they have the privilege to lord over and to absorb the resources, even if they don't believe it consciously, deep in their brains, they've learned based on just what culture has shown them must be true. And the other side of that, like for the people who are told that they must be in power, they must be in charge, they must be at all times, brave and ambitious, that's also toxic and dangerous for them. But the truth is that for teachers in particular, even men who are teachers are working in a field that is historically dominated by women is considered women's work. It is not often that a man teaches in a school and does not experience the same kind of like misogyny based demands, where parents think you're a teacher, you owe me everything that you are, you need to put your maternity leave on hold, so that my child doesn't experience the dystopia that would be a substitute teacher, right? So human giver syndrome is the belief that you have a moral obligation to give until you have nothing left. And it does not exist because generosity is dangerous. It exists because there is a dynamic in the world where some people genuinely feel entitled, and will teach you that you only deserve to give resources and you don't deserve to take any for yourself.

Yeah, and this is so loaded. And there are so many places we can go with this. But first, I just want to say this is in the air that we breathe.

Yes. Right. I mean,


It is in the messaging that we get in the interactions at the grocery store, from our parents, on TV. And so this is a generational idea that has been perpetuated for, since the beginning of time. Right? And so waking up to this one day and realizing oh my gosh, and having confusing and conflicting feelings about that. That's a totally normal thing.

Oh, yeah, you're gonna have feelings about having been kind of indoctrinated into human giver syndrome, and part of who's going to be like, but I love giving, it feels so good to give. And then you're also going to have feelings about like, no one has protected me from this. And there's gonna be some rage and some resentment. And you're gonna need help. You're need other people who care about your well being as much as you care about theirs, to share this experience with and to remind you that you deserve sleep, and food and have space to cry, and also permission to laugh your ass off.

Yeah. And we don't prioritize that because we think we're not worthy of it.

Not consciously, people are going well, I know, I'm worthy. But like, all the books you've read, every TV show you've seen, like, the nature of the the the office of the presidency of the United States, teaches us that women don't deserve power, that they're not capable of holding power. Yeah, it's so deep down and we have to spend some time unearthing it.

We do in community for sure. As you mentioned before, this is not a solo job.

Not a solo job. Yeah, we actually say over and over again in the book that the cure for burnout is not self care, the kind of like stress that like eats away at your physical health. That feels like burnout is the cure is all of us caring for each other. None of this can be done alone. It's not possible. It needs to be done in company and with care.

Right. And that is something I also very much believe and foster in the communities that I work with to where we all need to do this introspective work to wake up and realize, okay, what's possible for me, but it can't happen alone because of all of these feelings that we need to process through. We're human, and we definitely need each other and it's messy. It doesn't always feel good.

Yeah, I'm so glad you said that. There's way too much messaging that as you heal, as you become less of a human giver, as you take up your own potential and believe in your own power, that you're gonna just start to feel so much better. Like right away. No, man, healing hurts, right? Once you break your leg, your leg does not feel good again, until it's whole. And you need help every day between the day you break your leg and the day your leg is fully healed.

Yes. And I'll digress for a minute talking about my own healing journey here. This is like an ongoing process. It is not like one day you wake up and say, Oh, got it. I'm good. Now. Every time there's a new thing. There's a new growth point, there's a new expansion. There's a new wakening or realization. You kind of go through this again. And so now I for me, I'm at a point like okay, Jen, we're gonna cry for a while we're gonna go to the rage room for a little while, and it's gonna feel like shit. But afterward, I know that there's light at the end of that tunnel. Exactly. Right. Yeah, that's, that's also totally normal. So can we talk for a minute about moving from kind of giver syndrome to this idea of self care of like, what it is, and what it isn't? Because self care has been like this very triggering word that has been bastardized, especially now after COVID. I could see it's like physically doing things to you right now to like self care. So let's talk about it. What is it? What is it not?

Self-care, the phrase self-care comes from a community of psychologists who are dealing with people who cannot keep themselves clean and fed, because of mental illness because of cognitive challenges. But self-care is keeping yourself clean and fed, taking your medication, paying your rent and all your other bills, that is self care is maintaining yourself. It is not like oh, my pedicures, snow, when it is it has been commodified in this way to sell soothing products to white women basically, on Instagram, like comfortable pants and scented candles and bath bombs and stuff like that's not what that is. Keeping yourself actually physically supported is self-care, getting enough sleep, eating enough nutritious food, and moving your body to the extent that is comfortable and helpful. This is self-care. It has nothing to do with pampering or indulgence, or luxury.

And I think, I'm glad to use that word. Because when we conflate taking care of yourself with indulgence, that's confusing and mixed messaging, because then we start to feel like oh, allowing myself to take time to move my body in a way that's healing is now indulgence. Girl. No, your body just needs to be a body body's built to move. So it's a primary human need, oh, people, I've lost track of the number of women who have told me they feel guilty for sleeping. And sleeping is not an adult, it's it's not a luxury, it's a basic human need. We have to do it. And that's not self-care, like in the self-care sense of, you need to have like the past sheets, in order to get a good night's sleep. What you need is to live in a system that doesn't treat you as a commodity to be sold. That doesn't treat your energy as something that you owe to other people. We need to have a system that includes people who will stand in front of our bedroom door and guard it so that no one disrupts our sleep because they prioritize our well-being the same way that we would prioritize theirs. They tell us, thank you for all the days that you've given up sleep to care for us, we will now do whatever it takes so that you get the sleep that you deserve.

That's powerful, and needs to be said out loud. These are the conversations that we need to be having. Because I think sometimes there's like inklings of thoughts right? Where we're like, Wouldn't it be nice if we're like, I wish or that family over there. And we get into like this comparison mode too, right? So people are kind of like wondering about this, but having this conversation can feel dangerous sometimes because you're opening up a big door to a mirror. And looking in a mirror isn't always pretty, but it's necessary to make change because you can't change things you don't notice

Exactly. And because we are living in a system, and it's a system that's reinforced aesthetically by social media, that tells us not only do we have a moral obligation to give until we have nothing left, but that includes conforming to aesthetic beauty standards, that includes never offending anyone else. Because I'm not gonna get into the whole cancel culture like fears. But the point is, that human beings require belonging, and social media is a place where we can feel like we belong. But more often it is used as a weapon to make us feel like we need to change we need to conform before we are worthy of belonging. And that's just not true. Like you're worthy of belonging and love and care, just as you are right now, it doesn't matter what color your kitchen is, doesn't matter what color your skin is, it doesn't matter what kind of hair you have, or what color it is, doesn't matter if you finish school, or if you come out or if you don't, if you get married, if you have kids, you don't change anything, who you are, right now. is worthy of love, and care and resources and sleep, and food and safety. And the world is going to tell you that that's not true. And by the world, I mean, Instagram and the parents of your students are, they're not going to believe it, which is why the cure herself, the cure for burnout, is all of us caring for each other, because it requires you to have a bubble around you made of the people who care about your well being as much as you care about there's so they can remind you that you deserve those resources, and that those other voices who tell you that you must change that they are wrong, and that they're predators who are trying to reduce you, and to disempower you and to keep you in your place. And then if you want to create change long term in the world, you need to stay well. And that does not involve sacrifice until you have nothing left,

So let's stay there for a minute. Because that's kind of where I was going to about generational change, because that's what I'm interested in, things are fine, right? Now we can make changes for us now. But the real change happens when the kids that are around us watch us make change. And so what kinds of things can we explore here, when you're talking about generational change, you know, the way I look at it is, it's cliche, because it's true, you need to be the change. And when you change everything around you creates this ripple effect of change. So you have an increased capacity to actually serve the people in your life when you are taking care of yourself. And you're enjoying that more because giving, giving, giving giving giving when it doesn't feel good, is not helpful for you or the receiver. So can you talk a little bit about that piece to really big changing the world by changing yourself stuff.

I disagree with one little part of your premise,

Tell me

Which is that we can make a change in the world right here right now. I'm deeply pessimistic person. And I mean, like, at a fundamental personality level, like optimism and pessimism are personal traits that tend to be constant for your whole life, according to like research psychology, and going through the process of writing the book, like I mean, I took all the tests, right, and I am the most pessimistic person any of us has ever met. So it seems to me that the world is a dark and dangerous place where bad things happen by default. And the only reason good things happen is because we make good things happen, which I think is healthy and a good way to exist. Because it empowers you, you can take steps to make things better. But the world will always be fighting against that. But turns out that you are more that are poised for good well being than I am, because people who are optimists who believe that the world is essentially a good place. And all we have to do is kind of like unlock its potential, you are more likely to enjoy personal wellbeing over someone who is pessimistic. But my pessimism does mean that I don't think that we can make the world good for us right here right now. I don't believe that I am going to experience a world that is more just equitable and safe for more people. I believe that it is my job to throw myself under a bus, to lock myself to the tree or whatever the sacrifice metaphor is, it is my job to stand in front of the onslaught of bigotry and misogyny that everyone will have to experience. But if I serve as a shield between my students, the generation who's coming after me, then I can help make space for them to stay strong enough and healthy enough, and maybe break down the enemy a little bit so that I will make the world a better place for the people behind me. But I don't think that I am going to experience improvement or change. Okay with that. I mean, it's a hard truth. To face but I don't think that I'm going to be the recipient of my own actions care. However, I am the recipient of the care of the generations before me. They stood in the crossfire so that I could take a few more steps than they did you know, the feminist, the Betty Ferdinand, Gloria Steinem, Shirley Chisholm, Audrey Lords of the world, sacrificed and stood as active proponents, against the forces of oppression and toward the good of everyone for social justice, calm safety. And they did not benefit when they did it. But I am beneficiary now. And that gives me an obligation to stand where they were a few steps further than they got so that the people behind me can stand a few steps further than I get.

Does that make sense?

Sure does. So I have a question now for you. What does that shield look like?

Bravery, willingness to be harmed, which I think God have the capacity to do because I have learned, I mean, like I was hospitalized 15 years ago for stress-induced illness. And in that past 15 years, I have focused on learning what the impact of oppressive social systems is on the well being of individuals. And I have learned how to keep myself well in the face of the white supremacists heteronormative exploitative Lee capitalist patriarchy. And because that gives me so much resilience, I have the capacity to be that person to answer the question, or did I lose track?

You answered the question as to how you can be that person. Okay. But I want to know, like, what is the shield look like? Because when you use the analogy of like tying yourself to a dream and standing in front of the bus,

I'm starting to talk about like social justice actions that people have taken.

Yeah, but you know, it's all connected, it's all the same, you know, we are waking up and moving forward in a way that is standing against the oppression, whatever that looks like, even human giver syndrome, right? So I'm with you. And I want to know, if you're standing in front of that bus, it's not just you, Amelia, here, it's you and your abilities, your skills, your knowledge, your information, and what you do with it. So my question is, what does that look like? What is your shield? Here you are, as Amelia Nagoski, who have like, had all of this lived experience, who has done all of this work? Who has gained all of this knowledge, who is now sharing this out to the world? Is that your shields?

There is definitely a place where it's just me doing the work I do. I talk to a lot of corporate audiences about burnout, and suppose it's self care. And I do preach freedom to the oppressed. I mean, I talk about the necessity and the power of unionization, the role of government plays in actively suppressing individual protections, the social safety net like I definitely talk out loud and do not mince words, when I talk to the employees of a large corporation that is openly taking anti union steps, and saying out loud that the cure for burnout is not self care. It's all of us caring for each other. And as Cornel West says, justice is what love looks like in public. So like honest to God, unionization is part of the revolution that will create safety and reduce the health impacts of stress in the population.

That makes sense. You know, the reason why I ask is that if you have a shield, and you are clearly so passionate about it, and in knowing what your shield looks like, how do people then create their own shields? That's really the question is here, you are so passionate about like, Okay, this is my role here I am literally standing in front of a bus. And with that comes with, it's got to be very intentional things. And maybe that's not intentional, maybe it's just you being you. And this is the role that you are in and have embodied. But if there are people who are listening, who are like, Yeah, I feel like I want to shield to because not only do I want to wake up to my own power and feel empowered in my life, but I also want to be able to stand against and protect those that are coming after me. What does my shield look like? That's why I ask the question,

That is a fantastic question that's gonna vary so widely among people. Because the most important thing is that whatever you do for the world, it has to be something that fills you with joy, right? That feels meaningful to you and connect you to something larger than yourself. So there's a quote from Howard Thurman, which is Don't ask what the world needs. Ask what makes you come alive and go do it. Because what the world needs is people who have come alive. That's it. I think that's your shield.

That's your shield, too.

Yeah. Oh, for sure. And maybe I just forgot how I hot here because I think you're right that a lot of it is, I have fewer inhibitions than a lot of people I my personality has some intensity that kind of cuts through and resists being blunted by social expectations, which is, I know is unusual, I'm actually autistic. So like, it's definitely related to that. And so for other people who feel more of like a connection to the wider community, in the sense of belonging, and the need to, like, fit perfectly into the system that they're part of, they enjoy that. Whereas I've never felt that and I've always only pursued the things that made me feel like I've come alive.

But I think that's the secret sauce, right? Really, like, when you find the thing that brings you joy, and makes you come alive. That's everything. And here's, I think, this interesting part that feels dangerous sometimes, because we keep coming back to this word belonging where yes, we are inherently belonging to each other as a human race as just person to person, we are connected. But sometimes finding your joy and coming alive and waking up causes fear because the folks around you have not yet. So can we talk about that a little bit, too?

Yeah, that is exactly right. Because especially for women and other people who do not conform to the socially constructed ideal, which is a very narrow ideal that almost no one belongs do, we are told that as human givers, the thing that makes us come alive, is only worthy, if it is of service to other people, if it is supporting other people. If all it does is make us feel good, then that's selfish. But that social pressure is enough to keep people from recognizing or engaging with the thing that they find feels meaningful and important and fills them with joy. Because then they feel ashamed of the joy because it's selfish, and how dare you How dare you spend money going to a Star Trek convention, that's not good for anyone. Do you know the carbon footprint of the flight you will take to get to that Star Trek convention, all that polyester you'll be wearing? How dare you, except that when you're there, you feel connected to this community, who believe in this hopeful story where it's problematic, but the hope that's behind it, is of a universe of equity, and justice, and limitless boundaries, like that is good for you and for the other people that you connect with.

And as you're saying, when you feel joyful, and nurtured, that means that you're going to take home with you that feeling and you're going to be able to spread it to the people around you, who will then be able to spread it to the people around them. And that's how the world changes if we give people permission to indulge in joy. And again, it's not really an indulgence, I'm framing this as we might think of it with the current dominant worldview. But I mean, if we allow people access to joy, there's a poet Toi Derricotte, and one of her poems has the line. Joy is an act of resistance. Yes, exactly. Yeah, I think like for musicians and teachers, a lot of times the kind of like sharing of art and teaching students is very joyful, until the system interferes with our ability to actually do that by imposing these kind of political structures on top of what the actual act of teaching is, which is so beautiful, and so powerful. And then we have to like, conform to a very specific and arbitrary curriculum that was decided by a politician who has never been in a classroom since he was 18, who has never thought about who a teacher is, except from the perspective of being a student, or being the parent of a student. And therefore, they see teachers not really as people or as educated, or they see them as like oppressive authority figures who don't deserve to have that authority. Like, again, I think I've lost track of the question, but the point is, yes, Joy. And we need to allow people

Yeah, no, I'm tracking with you. It's a lot and what I'm getting at, and I love how articulate you are. And I love how you're bringing in a lot of these other philosophers and writers who have studied this and in all these other areas outside of teaching, because it's so relevant, that it's not one thing. This is not one thing. This is such a complicated amalgamation of generations of crap, and intergenerational oppression, and not just misogyny and politics, but family dynamics and value systems that have been set just because of where your parents, grandparents and their parents were in time. And so now we're kind of this product of all of this drip edge, millennia, which millennia drippage, sounds gross but true. I have like a nice visual happening right here. Right. But this isn't just one thing. And I think that goes back to what we were talking about earlier of. This is the reason why you can't just wake up one day and be like, Oh, I figured it out. I got it now. Yeah, exactly. It is in our DNA. And there are things that going to happen in your life and your interactions, both at the classroom and at home, that are going to be confronting to the joy to the wanting of the joy. And that's, I think, a part of an acceptance of this process. That's an important piece of moving through it.

And you may very well wake up one day and be like, Oh, I got it. And then you encounter the world. And the world says, No, you don't? And you're like, Yes, I do. And so it's, it's this constant, you will never be left alone, by the wider world telling you. No, you don't. And you don't deserve this. And so you always have to keep fighting. I mean, so we say in the book that wellness is not a state of being it's not a state of mind, wellness, is the freedom to oscillate through all the cycles of being human. And that means from Independence, to connectedness, from effort to rest, and from like fighting to kind of like going with the flow from resisting to taking a break and letting others take up the mantle for a moment while you just chill out quietly in your room. But yeah, you may wake up in the morning and be like, Yeah, I got this, I understand. But you're always gonna have to keep facing the system that says, No, I am now picturing Wonder Woman in that scene, from the first wonder Moon movie where she like, leaps out of the trench and like, takes all the bullets on her cuffs, I imagine that scene a lot.

And she's guarded and protected by her superpowers. But like that fight never ends, the movie goes like two steps further beyond that, to like, where she finally reaches an opponent, she can just barely beat and the only reason she beats him is because of love and the protection of the people around her and the care of the people around her. Which is not because she's weak. It's because that's what humanity is good for. So yes, you may well wake up one morning, but because we live in a system that's coming and going. And the other thing about the system that's constantly ongoing, is that your own mind will hide pain from you until you're ready to face it. So you may wake up when you're in your mid-40s. Having had a nightmare about your eighth-grade bully, because only now that you're in your mid-40s Does your mind feel like okay, you're ready to deal with this pain that happened to you 30 years ago. So you're like, I already talked about that in therapy. I thought I was done with this. Stuff comes back stuff resurfaces. And now it sounds like I'm saying that like life is never-ending suffering. And I'm not. No, it's not. It's just it's lifee.

It's lifee. It's completely lifee. Yeah.

And you know, if you can lean into some of these things as part of like, that's the contrast, right? It's pain, and it's joy. And it's love, and it's hurt. And it's exciting. And it's scary. And because we have all of that, that's what makes it so beautiful.

And you might be like super mad at your brain that night. You're like, why did you give me that stupid dream. But like, how amazing is it that your body or memory held on to that for you until you were safe, and is in touch with your power as you need it to be in order to confront that pain, and heal a little more like, that's an amazing miracle. I practice Tai Chi, which is exactly what you were saying about life and death, pain, suffering, yes, but also joy and feeling alive, like these things are all part of a single entity, which is the universe existence itself is made of these opposites that interact. And we live in the moment of interaction, this is getting super woowoo I know

I am with you. And people who hang out with me know that my woowoo scowl is a little higher than some of the other educational spaces. So we're good. I'm with you. Let's go there.

Even if all you recognize is that we live at the point of intersection between the past and the future. They're happening right here right now. This is the intersection of the past in the future. And then if you can kind of extrapolate from there and recognize that this is the intersection of pain and pleasure, this is the intersection of bliss and loss, right? That it's not damaging or permanently horrible that something's hard. It's just part of the cycle of the freedom to oscillate, which is also known as wellness, according to me.

Yes. Well, and I love that definition of wellness because it's active. We often think of wellness as what we were saying to at the beginning of going for the massage and just laying there or sleeping which is just like a fundamental human need like wellness is actually an active piece of your life and needs to be prioritized in order for you to actually do it.

I want to tell you something I've learned about massages, being autistic, I did not like being touched by strangers for a long, long, long, long time, until a member of my choir was a massage therapist. And I had this like shoulder pain that was impacting my ability to conduct the choir. And she was like, come here. And what I learned is that a massage is not passive. Like when you get a really good massage, it is a partnership, you and the massage therapist, moving your body and finding like where the points of tension are, and working together to move and breathe and release whatever the tension is. So even like our understandings of what sleep is sleep is not static either. Sleep is it comes in cycles, it comes in deep sleep, light sleep, REM sleep, and during REM sleep, your mind is so active, you might as well be awake. But what it's doing is processing what you've learned that day trauma from the past, like it is giving you a new opportunity to learn something from what it is pulling out of the deep, dark dungeons of your psyche.

Yeah, no, I'm so glad you said that, actually. Because now that I think of it, even in looking at those activities that I mentioned as being passive, it's actually again, buying into this thing, if I'm going to sleep or if I'm taking a massage, I am being passive. And that just kind of falls right into those old stories of being lazy about doing that. And not being worthy of doing that, that really all of the things are always active all the time because we're alive.

Yeah, except the times when we're completely passive, which I am going to say that during this just sometimes, like if they're working on a part of me, that's not like an active issue. I often my brain wanders, and when you're kind of in a deep, forgetting kind of place where you're not thinking about now, you're really letting your mind wander. Turns out, there's very new research, that's there's a group of areas of your brain that come online, when your mind is just wandering, it's called the default mode network. It's an area of brain regions that only work together in a very specific situation, which is, you're not choosing what to think about. Your mind is just wandering, like, sometimes you have really great ideas in the shower, right? Because you're not thinking about what you're doing, your mind is just wandering. And for me, it happens during massages to when I'm not actively trying to like heal a specific wound. That default mode network state of mind is really, it's also active, but it's not consciously active. But it is also an important kind of rest for you to go into that mental state and allow your mind to just wander as a break. But also, those are the times when you have those brilliant insights that you would never have thought of. If you hadn't just let your default mode network make connections that your conscious mind might have taken much longer to get to that make
sense.

Sure does. Oh, yeah, I could talk about brains. That's like another podcast episode. We can talk about brains for another whole hour.

Emily's better with the brain stuff than I am.

But no, yes, I am with you. But like even as you said that is also it's different active. But wellness isn't passive. Yeah, even rest isn't passive.

Right. I do appreciate that reframe. Because I think even the way I was thinking of it wasn't as inclusive as I think it actually is.

Okay, first, I want to like backtrack on your own, like feeling of relief. Because, wait, hold on, you're saying that it's not just passive. But I feel like now I have tried to make things like rest and static and as feel like, you know, you're saying that it's just like, No, I am not saying that. Like it's lazy to be passive or that it's bad to be passive. being passive is part of the cycle. Like you're built to oscillate and like, I don't want to make it seem like I'm saying, No, nothing's passive and it's in passiveness is inherently less valuable passiveness is also valuable, and valid and good for you.

I think that's important to talk about, because there are all of these other ideas of what even that word passive means, right? Because laziness all of a sudden gets associated with passive.

Right or disempowerment. You're passive, so you're not empowered. And that's not true.

It's all just part of the tai chi.

Yes. Yeah, and then oscillation, which is just a natural cycle. So you know, sometimes we get stuck in the semantics because it is associated with other words that bring up some other connotations.

Yeah.

Which is why talking about things is so hard. Stupid words, and they're stupid meanings. So many words, I know. Just everything needs a rebrand that's what we'll do.
Every word will only mean one thing and will not be associated with any other things. And therefore no one will ever misunderstand or misinterpret what we say ever. That sounds like a great idea. And no one will feel insulted because we didn't say what we wanted to clearly enough because there's and then there'd be no art.

I know. I know.

Then then music and like all the nice things and good conversations but stupid humanity so inconvenient and inconsistent.

But this is what makes I think having these conversations on this kind of a platform so important to to at the very least, make it safe to have them.

Yes, yes, yes, yes, yes. We have to say the words we just do. That's how we create bigger shields.
Some people don't like talking. Some people find their joy in the talking. You know, it's important that the people who feel alive when they do the talking, it's important that they do that, so that the rest of us can be like, yes, thank you for saying that thing that I already knew. Or thank you for introducing me to a topic I've never considered before. It's important.

Thank you for doing this work, by the way.

Oh, thank you for saying that I received that. It is something that brings me immense joy. Perfect. So now, I need to ask you the big question. What is your dream for the future of education?

Justice, and equity, specifically for teachers, so that they are paid what they're worth, they are paid like CEOs. I mean, like, remember, when the pandemic first started, and the parents like Shonda Rhimes was like, every teacher should be making a million dollars a year. After that, what happened to us appreciating what teachers did. And basically, for teaching to lose its stigma as being women's work or the work of people who don't know how to do anything else. Or rather, that is a highly skilled job. That also requires an intense amount of labor of the heart, as well as the mind. And the body. Jesus, teaching is exhausting. Here's a political issue. I think that education should be the basis for all government decisions. I think that with good education, all the other problems solve themselves, because you've got an educated, thoughtful population, people who are media literate, people who are critical and analytical and use their higher order thinking and are less likely to like, misunderstand and miss, communicate, or be closed minded about ideas that are new to them.

So I think education should be the guiding principle of all government, I think teachers should be paid more than well, more than they are now about four times what they are now at least, and that they're protected and valued and honored and treasured by parents, the way that parents felt on day 74 of quarantine. The suffering that parents were feeling that day. And the gratitude, they remembered about teachers, I want them to hold that every day. Thank you, teachers, I can't believe you do this work. I can't even imagine doing it myself. It's amazing. And I want to take down all the boundaries that make that difficult for you feel like that was a very wandering answer. And yet, maybe I got the point across.

It was beautiful. Yes to all of that. That's the thing. Because my feeling is and the reason why I asked this question is when we are able to articulate our dreams, and I am an optimist, all the way on the other side of that continuum, by the way.

I can tell yes.

My rose colored glasses are on unapologetically all of the time. When we do say our dreams out loud. That's a big step and actually actualizing them.

Yeah,

that is such an optimist thing to say, I know. And you are undoubtedly right. Feels weird, to me. Doesn't feel like a thing. That would be true for me. But based on the research I've read, that seems very true for the population at large.

Yeah, I think so. So we're gonna continue to do that. And I think that's a great plan. Yeah. And if we move the needle even just a little bit, I've done my job. So that's my shield.

That's perfect. Amelia, thank you so much.

Thank you. Yeah, it is perfect. Yes, this was really wonderful. I really enjoyed having this conversation with you and sharing it with the Take Notes audience. So thank you for your time.

Thank you.

If you enjoyed today's episode, please share it with a friend because there was really juicy stuff in here, and subscribe so you won't ever miss an episode. And we'll see you next time on Taka Notes Incredible, right? Together, we can revolutionize the face of education. It's all possible. And it's all here for you right now. Let's keep the conversation going at Empowered Educator Faculty Room on Facebook.

Are you ready to take that next step as an empowered educator and become a school administrator?
Does your vision include improving school quality and cultivating communities?
Jumping from being a school teacher to an administrator is a big step. It's easy to get overwhelmed by fear and pressure and forget how important it is to get feedback and clarity in your school administrator duties and responsibilities.
But with the right support and guidance, you can navigate this transition and succeed in your new role!
Welcome to episode 24 of Take Notes with Jen Rafferty! In this episode, I’m joined by Darrin Peppard who is a professional speaker, leadership coach and consultant who helps leaders on their journey to gain clarity, walk in purpose and find joy in their professional lives.
Darrin is here to give us an insight on the realities of being an administrator and leader of the school. He tackles topics such as imposter syndrome, hierarchy in school and the fear of taking that next level of responsibilities.
This week is all about the power of feedback and getting rid of judgment! We can embrace both things and use it to grow more.
Stay empowered,

Jen

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About Darrin:
Dr. Darrin Peppard is a leadership coach, consultant, and speaker focused on organizational culture and climate, and coaching emerging leaders. Darrin is the best-selling author of the book Road to Awesome, and is the host of the Leaning into Leadership podcast. As a ‘recovering high school principal’, Darrin shares strategies and lessons learned from 26 years in public education to help leaders gain clarity, find joy in their work, and walk in their purpose.

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https://walkinyourpurpose.roadtoawesome.net/ebook

TRANSCRIPT:  Hello, and welcome back to another episode of take notes. I'm here today with an incredible guest. This is Dr. Darren Peppard, and he is a leadership coach, consultant and speaker focus on organizational culture and climate and coaching emerging leaders. Darren is the best selling author of the book rode to awesome, and is the host of the leaning into leadership podcast. As he calls it, a recovering high school principal, Darren shares strategies and lessons learned from his 26 years in public education to help leaders gain clarity, find their joy in their work, and walk in their purpose. Darren, thank you so much for being here and chatting with me on take notes today. Yeah, absolutely. Jim, thanks for having me. And I gotta say, when you when you read it that way, 26 years, man, it seems like, wow, that was a long time. And I guess maybe it doesn't seem like it. It actually was a long time. Yeah, it is. Right. It's a lifetime and how wonderful now you get to share your beautiful wealth of knowledge and experience with other people and school leaders who are going through some things that you can help guide them, right. Yeah, absolutely. That's a big part of why, you know, jumped into this work. I mean, I am neither old enough nor wealthy enough to just retire. But I did feel like, you know, what I want to be able to do is to really help those early career leaders. And and let's be honest, right now, across the country, even our schools that have the best culture and climate can use additional support on school culture and climate. So yeah, I love that I'm able to share, you know, experiences and things that did wrong and a few things I did, right. And that kind of thing with schools around the country. Yeah, well, I think that's the thing people often consider needing help as a sign of, like, lack, or that they are not doing enough or they're not reaching a certain level. But the truth is support, especially in any place, like culture needs to happen all the time, as just part of what we do here there is there doesn't necessarily have to be a need for remediation. This is just about being able to survive in a changing world that sometimes changing faster than we can even turn our heads. And so I think what you do and what other people like you are doing in this world, is really important to just maintain a steady level of growth for our school districts across the United States. Yeah, absolutely. And you know, what it really does to on top of everything you just said, which was spot on, is, what I do is I provide that third point, perspective, you know, I'm not right in the middle of it. And so often, you know, in leading our own schools are leading our own districts or leading our own classrooms, we, you know, we get so deep into the work, and just so, you know, like, engrossed in it that we end up with blinders on, and it's not intentional, it's not even a bad thing. It's just sometimes really beneficial to have that outsider perspective, who can mention, you know, hey, I noticed this or, you know, ask questions, like, you know, what, you know, what is your strategy here? Or, you know, what is, you know, what are you seeing as progress in this particular area, or, or whatever the case may be that, that third point perspective, you know, that coaching perspective, I think, is just so valuable. 100%. And, you know, it's funny, I think, when we get to a certain level in our career, there sometimes is this belief that, like, I'm good, I don't, I don't know that I need any reflection back at me, or if there is an opportunity for observation and conversation. Often what I've observed, and I've heard from other people's experiences is this can be a very high stakes, uncomfortable conversation. And it really doesn't have to be. I mean, having these growth conversations can be a beautiful opportunity for both parties to learn, and communicate and grow and essentially, do what we want to do better, which is having have an impact on the kids and the communities that we serve. Yeah, you just hit two things that were just boo, I'm gonna try and unpack both of them. Let's do it. Oh, there we go. Um, I'm not the host of the show. You are but you know, we yeah, this on your? I know, we do. Great. Yeah. So So two things that I want to hit there. You know, first and foremost, is it's just that coaching piece, you know, everybody, everybody can benefit from a coach. And you're right. It's not, you know, this, you know, you're in a lacking situation. I mean, in some cases, you know, among my clients around the country. I have a superintendent who has been in the role since October, kind of thrust into the role and is also running an elementary school and just trying to keep her head above water. So that, you know, the feedback and the perspectives that I'm going to share with her are a little bit different than say, a high school principal that I'm working with. It has a really good team and a really well oiled machine, but he's new In the role, bit the feet, the feedback and the input for everybody is a little bit different. Both times. Well, in all cases, I can't remember what the second point was that I was going to unpack. So it must not have been too huge. But I guess there you go, right. Yeah, yeah, I guess that's where I'm at with that one. The other one, and then we'll come back to it. Sure. Well, I think something that I want to talk about a little bit before we kind of move into the nitty gritty of what it means to be a coach and why it's important as an administrator, or really, at any level in your career, in education, or even if you're in another industry, as someone who's been on both sides of coaching now, I see the incredible value in having somebody talk with you through things, right. But I do want to talk about this idea of moving up and doing like air quotes here moving up into administration, right? Those people who really excel in the classroom, we're often told you be great, as an administrator, when are you going to move up to being a principal? When are you going to get your administrators certification? I was one of those people. And I always was confused as to why that was the next perceived step in a career path. And sometimes people move into these places, because they think that's what like their next level is supposed to be. But from your perspective, now, both sides in and out of the classroom and in and out of the school system, as an administrator, what do you have to speak to about that kind of thing? What do you really need to know about yourself to make the decision about whether or not you want to go into administration, besides what other people are telling you you are supposedly supposed to do? Right? You know, it's, it's interesting, it's such a great question. And it, it puts a bunch of thoughts in my head, and I'll try hard to hang on to him this time. But I think first and foremost, you know, as an individual, when you're considering taking that leap out of the classroom into, you know, whatever administrative role, you know, maybe its principal role, assistant principal role, something like that. Or, you know, taking the next leap, like I did, from high school principal, to Superintendent or something like that. Number one, you've got to, you've got to be real clear with yourself what you value, and what's important to you. I had, I didn't do it the right way, I did exactly what you just described, which is, you know, people said, oh, you should do this, you should do this, you should do this. And therefore, that's what I did, because I just believed that's what the career path is supposed to be. And the next job will make me even happier than I am in this role. And the reality is, you know, and you've said in my introduction, I identify as a recovering principal, because to me, that's the best job I ever had. I absolutely love being a high school principal, not that he didn't love being a superintendent. Man, there's something special about being a high school principal, and we can chase that later. But I did, I had this belief that I got to chase the next job. And instead of looking, you know, within myself, and identifying what I really, really cared about what I really valued, and that was being able to make a difference with my students right there on the ground. Now, I did have this belief that moving into a superintendent role, I would have the opportunity to coach and grow more leaders, as a high school principal. You know, I had three assistant principals, you know, big the leadership team instructional coaches have in the whole bit, that I a big part of my job was to groom them. I love that, you know, and a handful of them have gone on to the building principals. One is a superintendent. I mean, it's it's exciting to see where they've gone. But when I moved into the superintendent role, I discovered No, you don't have time to do that you really don't. I think the second thing, you know, beyond first identifying what, what do you really care about is is number two, you've got to think about your skill set. And what it is that you're going to be comfortable doing what you're going to be comfortable stretching yourself to do, because as you mentioned, Jim, you know, people are successful in the classroom, and therefore, people say you should be an administrator. The skill sets are completely different. There's a belief that it's just the same thing. And this is where the coaching piece comes in. You know, you know, school districts throw the keys to the principal's Hey, good luck. This skill said so different. And that's why they struggle because as a classroom teacher, so much is about pedagogy. So much is about building relationships with your students so much is about being able to grow those little individuals in your classroom, whether they're kinders or seniors, they're still little people. As a school leader, now your role is to lead people and you You know, to be able to be clear on a vision to be very clear on the action steps and the the work you're going to do to bring everybody to that vision. It's a whole different skill set. And I don't say that to scare anybody away, but I think people should go in, eyes open, because I didn't. And looking back, that's where my coach made such a difference for me, you know, we will tell I know, we're gonna talk about coaching constantly. But when I was provided an executive leadership coach after my second year as a principal, and I struggled mightily in my first year, I realized the difference between the job I had over here as an assistant principal, which was, which was very task oriented, discipline, or, you know, leading PLCs, or, you know, curriculum or whatever the case may be, to as the building principal, you're a leader of people. And that as a high school principal, especially Jen, you're like the leader of the community. I remember when I got the job, my wife was like, I can't dress down when I go to Walmart anymore. She's like, it's like, you're the mayor now. And Jokes aside, that's very true, especially in a single high school town. And you it's like a political role. So I think that's something that people need to be really aware of, when they're looking at, you know, do I take the leap to the next level? Do I go ahead and pursue that administrative position? They're wonderful jobs, please don't think I'm trying to talk anybody out of it. Just be conscious and cognizant of the difference between being a classroom teacher and being an administrator? Sure. Well, I think it always comes down to alignment, right? It's, again, something that you mentioned a little bit is what feels good to you. And it's really easy. And I, I observe this to throughout my career is when people tell you these kinds of things, you feel important, right? And you're like, oh, wow, I, I'm expected here, this is, Oh, you want me to have more responsibility, that stuff feels good. But what I have now come to realize is that that feeling is different than alignment, that sometimes that feeling is actually connected to an emotional addiction to pressure and stress and busyness and overwhelm, which may feel exciting, but it's actually not aligned with who you are, and who you want to be at that time of your life. And you really need to take some time, look inward, so you can go in with eyes open as to exactly what you're doing when you decide to make that next step, if you decide to make that next step. I didn't I didn't want to do that. I thought it was capable. But it just didn't feel aligned to me. So I didn't want to to make that particular step. I do want to ask you a question too, because this kind of ties into something else that you mentioned, is imposter syndrome. And I'm sure that you deal with that a lot, especially as people who are, you know, with with people who are coming into these new roles, from being in the classroom to now all of a sudden being a leader of people, as you described? How do you coach people through those sorts of feelings? You know, that's Oh, man, that's such a great question. It makes me think actually, of a principal that I'm working with right now, who had been an athletic director prior to becoming a high school principal. His classroom experience was as an inclusive, special education teacher, and his imposter syndrome, his imposter that comes out is how can I go into a calculus class? How can I go into an AP chemistry class? How can I go fill in the blank? How do I go in there and provide any quality feedback about instruction when I taught special education, and a lot of how we defeat that imposter is through repetition. It's through being you know, honest with ourselves confronting the the pieces that caused that impostor to come forward and starting to stop rationalizing, you know, this, this deficit mindset, in this particular person's case has spent a lot of time in his school. And luckily for him, he I mean, I'm really proud of him for this, but his focus is on growing as an instructional leader in his school. And so we're spending lots of time in classrooms, which, that's how you overcome that. Get in the classroom. If you're going to stay in your office, your staff won't see you as that instructional leader. Get out there. Have those conversations and just be genuine with people? You know, I mean, tell me, tell me this, Jen. I mean, what is the perfect classroom experience in order to give somebody feedback? Is there one I mean, real? No, there's no such thing. Yeah, but but I think a lot of times administrators fall into that, you know, I have If I have one that I'm working with that taught at the elementary level taught at the high school level, as a middle school principal, staff will say, well that you teach middle school, that doesn't matter. Good instruction is good instruction, you can give quality feedback on instruction, regardless the level you've been at. You know, that's that with him in particular, that's how we've really addressed that imposter. Now, the reps that I talked about that repetition that's getting in the room, that's having conversations with staff that's asking good questions. I think a lot of times administrators, especially early career administrators, they fall into this belief, and I'm chasing the instructional piece, because this is typically where people have the impostor come up the most. They fall into this belief that they have to have all the answers when they go in the classroom. Like, I have to tell this PreCalculus teacher who was the State Teacher of the Year how she could do something better. No, you don't. You take the third point perspective. And you come in and you just ask a good question. You know, in the the administrator that I'm talking about, in his case, we talked a couple of weeks ago about just asking good questions, like, he has a staff member that he'd like to push them a little bit, but he's been teaching for 30 years. And so the strategy that we're using is, hey, you know, can you give me some advice on this particular strategy? I have a first and second year teacher who are using something similar. I'd like to see them grow it a little bit more. What advice can you give me, when we're asking our veteran teachers for advice, they are going to lean into us because just like you said, a few minutes ago, they believe in you, they trust you, they want you to have this additional responsibility. And if you ask for advice, they're going to give it they're happy to give that. So I think there's a lot of ways to address the impostor. But number one, address it head on, come right at it, don't hide from it. Because if you do, it's just going to continue to linger. I mean, it's gonna be a shadow over your head all the time, it gets bigger. And you know, I think the the last piece of it, I think is really important is that when you come from a place of curiosity, always, it is going to be more effective than anything else you can possibly do in a situation that makes you feel uncomfortable. Because when you are getting rid of the judgment, which sometimes when you when you come into these conversations, or these interactions that we're talking about with these observations, or conversations with teachers, there's this idea, like you said, our belief that I need to know all of the things. And that's really about self judgment of yourself, you shouldn't have to pay anything, right. And so when we replaced that judgment with curiosity, and just think to yourself, Well, what questions do I need to ask this person sitting across the table? What questions do I need to ask myself, all of a sudden, now, the conversation shifts, and everything moves towards a place that moves in the direction of progress, instead of I think, feeding the imposter? Yeah, absolutely. You know, that that that gives me one more thing. Just really quick, I want to add on to that. What you were just saying there, kind of, you know, repeating back, and I appreciate you did that, you know that you don't have to have all the answers. I fell into that trap my first year. And you know, what I discovered? And this is, I guess another way to address the imposter is, remember who sat in the hot seat when you interviewed for the job? You did? It was you? Not only that, remember who answered the phone when they called to offer the job? That was you remember who said yes, that still was you? I fell into this trap of I call it Superman syndrome where like, I thought I had to be everything to everybody. Like I had to be the smartest guy in the room. Always. I had to have everybody you know, answer everybody's questions solve everybody's problems. And oh, my god, Superman did not sit in that chair. When I interviewed. I did. They called me and offered me the job. I said, Yes, not superman. You got to be yourself. And yes, you do have to be willing to look yourself in the mirror and be comfortable with your shortcomings. And be willing to say, hey, I want to grow and get better here. Tell your staff, man, get vulnerable and be honest with your staff. Hey, I'm not very good at this. I'm really good at this, this and this. Your staff already knows that by the way. When you tell them hey, I know I have to grow and get better here. That's when they really start to lean into you and start lifting you up and saying hey, you know, have you thought about this or hey, come to my classroom today. I've got something going on. I want to I want to I want to share with you and you know before you know it what you said which was absolute dynamite absolute gold was it starts to become conversations. It's no longer about judgment. It's no longer about eval. uation it's about conversation and how do we be the best we can be for those little, little people that come into our building every day? Yes. And that's how we elevate that this is how we do it. This is not a secret. You know, it seems so simple because it is, we get so caught up in judgment and ego and suppose tos and tradition, and that we lose sight of what's really important. And what's really important is making an impact on the communities that we are serving. And we can only do that when we rise together. And the only way we do that is by talking to each other as human beings. And this is something I have to pick up, but you just put down for me, because I know you planted it there for me to pick up was the Superman syndrome. So I'm grabbing the bait for me, Darren, you know, that narrative, which we've talked about before. And you know, what I've shared in my TED talk is that, you know, we are not superheroes. And it's that narrative, that does get very dangerous, because while it plays out for different people in different ways, what you just described is another one of them is feeling as if you need to know all of the things and be everything to everyone. And that is a recipe for failure. And what happens is when you as an administrator take on this persona of a superhero, your staff looks to you that way. And what happens then, is that when things aren't going well, you get all the finger points, and all the blame for everything that's going wrong in the schools. And that's just simply not true. And this humanizing of educators at all levels, is really important. And again, we'll start to open up doors for conversations between humans, instead of this hierarchy that seems to be perceived in how we operate schools right now. Can you talk a little bit about that as well? Oh, yeah, absolutely. Uh, you know, I'll start with the hierarchy. You know, I think this gets back to you said the word tradition. And traditionally, that's, you know, you go into administration, and therefore, this is what you do. People get, you know, really wrapped up in the job description to of, oh, this is what I'm supposed to do in this role. And, you know, a part of it is I'm going to evaluate my teachers. And you know, I'm in charge of the budget, and I'm this, and I'm this. But the role of the administrator has changed, I think, certainly in the last 10 years. But definitely in the last three or four years, in so many ways, the leader of the school needs to be the champion of the school, not just, you know, the manager of the school. And when that transition took place, and we moved away from the principal just being the disciplinarian, by the way, as a principal, I did basically zero discipline. You know, I had an assistant principal for that. Principals, I mean, that they're the champion of their schools, that's what they need to be, they need to be the chief storyteller. The person that crafts, the narrative of who our school really is, they need to be the person that is able to stand up, and kind of maybe pull back the shirt a little bit and let the Superman symbol come through. When that hard criticism comes from the outside, they have to be that person who's willing to deflect that from their staff, to protect them and keep them feeling like they are doing the right work. You can't do it forever. But sometimes as a principle, you have to be that person. Sometimes you have to be the mentor, you know, that person who's growing people. There's so many different responsibilities for principals. That traditionally, that's not what they did. You know, to me, that's one of the biggest struggles I see, you know, people, people are running into administrative roles, especially right now. There's like this vacuum, and in leadership roles, that not that there aren't people to fill them. But this vacuum was created at the end, the end of the line, if you will, where superintendents, you know, like myself, who stepped out or retired and principals who have stepped out and retired a little early. Now there's all these positions, and all these people have come charging into the roles. They're not ready yet. They need the support, they need the guidance, they need the coaching and that kind of stuff, because I think they know and they see what the role of the principal can and should be. But so many other schools and their communities are stuck in that tradition of No, the principal is, you know, basically the manager of the school. I think I scrolled a little bit away from what your question was, but no, I think he did hit on something that's so important because, you know, for those who've been listening for a while, know that I generally like to think of tradition as peer pressure from dead people. I mean, we are living in a world that's different from where these traditions started. And you know, traditions can be great if they are serving us. But when we do something, because of tradition, for traditions sake, we are actually doing a huge disservice to our communities. And like I said, you know, just a minute ago, we live in a different world, and we need to work and live and love and care for each other and learn and grow in this world. And that means that we need to shift our paradigms a little bit. And if people aren't getting on board, well, then we need to start having those conversations by asking really good questions. Yeah, so and so I'm gonna go somewhere that you are either gonna love or hate. I don't know, we're gonna find out, given you've said tradition, you said tradition enough. And I absolutely am over here laughing with, you know, the dead people reference because where it takes me as back to my master's program, and I don't think I learned a lot in my master's program. But I do recall. Dr. Mike Ford was was the instructor for this particular course, I don't even remember what the course was. But we got into this conversation about tradition. And he turned and looked at somebody in the room and said, Tevita, you just need to let it go. And almost no one in the room got the reference. Oh, he made us watch. Yeah, he made us watch Fiddler on the Roof. Yes. And that's I mean, every time I end up in a conversation like this, where we're talking about these traditions, we won't let go of I think of Tevita. Because that's, that is the that's like the plot of that movie. It's tradition for the sake of tradition, my God, let it go. So yes, we have to let go of some of the traditions that we've hung on to it. I think it's part of why we face so much outside criticism right now in education, because we think we've evolved. But we really haven't. Not enough. And yeah, let it go to havea let it go. Yes. Well, you know, you're speaking to a former music teacher and a Broadway aficionado. You'd love it. Yeah, and if you haven't, you know, seen Fiddler on the Roof. Please make sure that that you go do that. Right after this episode. Yeah, so that is the only time I will probably ever talk about Debbie on a podcast. So save this one, folks. This is gold. Yes. Well, not the last time for me, though. I'm sure. You'll think of me every time you mentioned to have Yeah. 100%. But you know, it's true. And I think you're absolutely right is, you know, many people. Let me rephrase this, I think that there are pockets of beautiful evolution happening. And COVID provided us a brilliant opportunity to start fresh, I'll be totally honest with you, Darren, when we have that time period between March 2020. And the start of school in fall of 2020, my rose colored glasses were on. So super tight, I was like, Ah, this is, this is going to be great, because we're all going to realize all of the things that are going wrong. And we're going to be able to fix them. Finally, because we can start fresh. And we can have these beautiful conversations with each other. And I was having conversations with educators all across the United States. And we were talking about pivoting and how we were going to be creative and did it. And then what happens, fall of 2020 came around, and there was zero changes regarding the progress of where education could go. And instead, we were trying to fit the square peg in the round hole now, with all of the limitations that needed to happen for safety procedures, right. And now we're back to where we were, and not very much has changed. And I think part of why I'm on this very serious mission is so people can stand in their power in a way to take what they've learned from that time, and actually generate some action that will move education forward to align with this time that we're living in right now. Well, it absolutely should be like a golden age for education. And you know, another one of those things that that has, I guess anchored progress from from getting out of the dark, if you will, is this awful, awful phrase. One I just can't stand this learning loss. You know, because Because kids weren't in in school, and didn't learn whatever I mean, participles or the quadratic equation, or who cares? They learned it the next year. It's not a learning loss. It's think about everything they did learn, or the opportunities they had to learn. And some schools, some schools, Jen did a brilliant job with this. They embraced it. They said, here's a golden opportunity. And they took it. Unfortunately, so many school boards and legislative bodies and that kind of thing as we started to move, you know, back into getting school going, got just focused on things like masks and social distancing. And yeah, those things were important. But, you know, I remember telling my, you know, my leadership team, guys, we need to focus on teaching and learning. I mean, that's what we're here for. And I'm not saying let's focus on the things they miss, let's focus on what they did learn. Let's focus on where we can go from here, because hey, this is a great opportunity to innovate. We can do so many cool things. But then yeah, there are schools that just didn't take advantage of it. I mean, even simple things I had a conversation yesterday with, with a girl I went to high school with who was a conversation on Facebook, she's a teacher in my hometown, fairly large district, and they've done everything they need to have remote learning in place. So you should never have a snow day. Right? You know, I mean, that's an easy thing. They're making kids come to school, when it's 25 degrees below zero, and the winds blow and 40 miles an hour, I grew up in Central Wyoming, by the way, and which it does that all the time. But here, they have this opportunity to say, Hey, this is too cold, it's not safe. Let's just do a remote learning day and they won't do it, they won't pull the trigger on it. Because they face some political backlash from people in the community. If it's what's right for kids, why wouldn't we do it? Eventually, people will see, oh, yeah, this is what's right for kids. But they're stuck in tradition. And I don't want to pull us back into the tradition conversation. But that's what it is. Oh, that's what it is. I said, that's an important theme here, because that's the thing that's holding us back. But I want to actually go back to something else that you said earlier, because now as a, as a role of a leader, as you said, You are the chief storyteller. So how do you use that platform, as a leader, to move your school forward in a direction that is keeping us where our feet are, right now in the present, moving towards a future that we cannot predict, while maintaining your integrity as as a district regarding your vision? And what you stand for? How would you? How do you coach people to do that? That's a big role. It is, it's very, very big. And I would tell you that first and foremost, the most important thing is you've got to have a clear vision, you know, you've got to have that vision. And you have to start to build that groundswell of support from within your staff around that vision. This is what I'm talking about, when we go back to the role of the principal isn't to be the manager, you know, a big part of what you do. And even when we talked about the skill sets, this is a skill set that is way different than than what you need in a classroom. Not that some classroom teachers don't have that skill set, they do. I'm not downplaying them. But this is that part of the skill set, where you have to be this great storyteller of this vision, and you have to tell it to everyone, and you don't tell them once you tell them over, and you tell them over and you tell them over and you tell them over? Because the longer you speak life into it, the more likely it is to become a reality. It's just like, you know, chasing a goal, or, or anything else for that matter. You know, if I said, you know, hey, I want to run a marathon. I don't just say it once and hope it happens. You know, there's work that goes into that. There's training, there's dedication, there's planning, and there's accountability. So when you're crafting that, that compelling narrative of your school, yes, you're starting with that groundswell of the people right around you. But you don't leave out the other stakeholders. It's getting your your community on board. I'll tell you as a high school principal, I talked about it all the time about the benches that were in, in our high school and how I spent most of my time on a bench. I was either talking with students or I was talking with some of my staff, or if I had parents in the building, I would sit and talk with parents. I mean, you never pass up an opportunity to talk about the great things at your school. But it isn't just about being out having coffee with people and go into, you know, the Kiwanis Club and go into this luncheon and that I mean, those things are important, but it's also what you said. You said it's so well and I don't know if I can recapture it. but being aware of where your feet are, and your feet need to be in the classrooms, too, because that's part of the narrative that you want to be sharing, you know, the more great things I'm talking about in the community, about my teachers, the more great things I'm sharing, whether it's social media, or even, you know, print media, I mean, whatever, about the great things my kids and my staff are doing, you know, that that speaks life into it. Jen, I have a good friend who he's an assistant, or assistant superintendent now, but he was a high school principal in Virginia, brilliant, high school principal. And part of his compelling narrative was that they were the greatest High School in America, and are the world's greatest High School. Sorry, it's the world's greatest High School is what he would say, North Stafford High School, Stafford, Virginia. That's how Tom Nichols would refer to a school. Hey, we're at the world's greatest High School. It reached a point during Tom's tenure, where people, you know, people would say, you know, yeah, Tom's over there at the world's greatest, they stopped calling it North Stafford it was just the world's greatest. That's what they called it. It's an incredible high school. But they did a lot to breathe life into that, you know, people started taking pride in that. And people would ask him, you know, Hey, Tom, how can you prove to me it is, and his response was always, how can you prove to me it isn't? How can you prove to me this, it, you know, everything we're doing here is to be the world's greatest High School. And now, what's wrong with that? You know, so, again, have that compelling vision, and speak life into it constantly. You don't have to be, you know, a big frontman, like, you know, like I can be I mean, I love that role, by the way, doesn't kind of shouldn't come as a surprise. But you don't have to be, you know, like, super, you know, flamboyant, or you don't have to be, you know, always the person on the mic. But you do have to live your values out loud. And when you do that, other people come along, and they start to live it to and fro, you know, it isn't just your voice. Everybody's telling your story. I'm so glad you shared that example. Because that really underscores the power of the vision, and then the collective vision, because while you might be the chief storyteller, what you're doing is you are empowering others to tell their own stories within this greater vision. And that's really the magic of vision. Absolutely. It's a vision that belongs to one person isn't a vision, right? It's a hope. It's a dream, you know, and that's how it starts, right? It starts as a whole, it starts as a dream, you know, my high school, and we were on the road to awesome, I mean, that was our thing. And obviously rhodopsin was just become who I am. But that's how it started. You know, hey, we're all on the road. Awesome. We're all going somewhere, why wouldn't we go somewhere? Awesome. That's what we kept saying, as we kept saying, and before you knew it, we were pretty doggone awesome. Because, you know, it went from, you know, my vision to and my dream to everybody taking so much ownership of that. And, yeah, that's what it's for. I just get chills telling a story. Yeah, wow, that's cool. I got chills through the the zoom camera, for sure. It's, it's powerful. And I hope those of you who are listening can really appreciate the the value in what Darren is sharing right now. And, you know, this vision idea has so many layers to it. And I truly believe, you know, this is how we change the world as we visualize something that doesn't exist yet. And we, like you said, live it out loud. I think that's beautiful. And get the people around us to rally. And so it's not just you anymore, it's you and your community, whatever that community looks like. So thank you for sharing that and highlighting that beautiful. Let me let me put a bow on that, too. Here's what happens when you do it. Here's what happens when you do it. You know, over time, over time, over time, it just becomes its own thing. And now, that's how we've always done it here. becomes that and not that old tradition. Yes. Yes, that's it. I like how you tie that back around. I love that. So before we go, I do want to ask you the question that I asked everybody, which is what is your dream for the future of education? Oh, I love this question. And you know, I think I think first and foremost, the dream. The future education for me, is every student has an opportunity to chase their dreams. I know it seems kind of watery to say that but what I don't think we should be doing is continuing to keep kids in a box and there was a point in time when the this was when I was a high school principal when our state had adopt Didn't was happening across the country, this whole career ready thing? You know, and it was the way they phrased it was career or college ready. So in other words, you had two boxes, you know, we're either preparing you to go to college, or we're preparing you to go into a career. Newsflash, Jen, everything you do in school is about preparing kids to go into a career, they might go to college, but you're preparing them for a career, their career might be stay at home mom, their career might be, you know, somebody who works from home, but you're still preparing them for a career. If we, if we can get to a point where students have the opportunity to have their own dream, their own vision, like we just talked about with a school, if each individual kid can have that dream, and had be able to put a path together to take them there. It's a wandering path, you and I both know that, I mean, the dream that you might have as a six year old is going to change when you're 10. And when you're 13. And when you're 17. But as long as you understand and know, as a child, that you have control of that path, that you are your navigator, and that you have all the support around you to get there. To me, that would be the dream of what education should be going forward. Let's let's stop putting them in boxes. Let's stop even even the meme that says things like, you know, you know, let's normalize, you know, going into career technical skills. I think we did that. Let's stop sharing that meme. All that mean does is is reinforced the two stupid boxes. You know, let's normalize kids being able to create a path that takes them to the dream that they have for their future. That's what we should be doing. I would love to be the chief storyteller for that one. You want to be? Yeah, well, coach? No, I'm with you. 100%. Yes. Yes. So, so good. And I would love for you to share with my listeners today. How can people learn more about you and your work? And your book? Tell us? Yeah, yeah, absolutely. So it starts with road to awesome dotnet. That's the website that'll tell you everything about me. Everything about the work that we do here at road to awesome. Everything from the coaching and consulting that you and I have talked about during this, the speaking that I do at conferences and in schools and all that kind of stuff. And even the work we do on the publishing side here at road, awesome. All of that at row dawson.net. Actually, there's an awesome dotnet backslash books. And that's where not only my book, but all the books that we have published here at road to awesome can be found. My book, as of when we're recording, this is going to be dropping here any day. It's a second edition of my book rode to awesome. This one. This one's kind of fun. It's it's the journey of a leader made some made some pretty significant updates and changes to the original book. And I'm really super excited about that. So yeah, everything at the website on social media on Darren M peppered everywhere. And you can always email me it's Darren at road to awesome dotnet Thank you. And all of those links are going to be in the show notes as well. So it'll be super easy for people to get in touch with you. Darren, thank you so much for your time and sharing your talents with me and the take notes audience today. Really appreciate it. Well, thank you so much, Jen. I appreciate you giving me the platform and just sitting down and having this awesome, awesome conversation today. Yes, and for those of you who are listening if you liked today's episode, please share it with a friends. Give it a five star review and don't forget to subscribe and we will see you next time on take notes.

Do you frequently feel burned out at work as a school teacher? Are you eager to set clear boundaries and prioritize your well-being so you can finally achieve work-life balance and set a good boundary between school and home?
Putting yourself first should be a priority. But sometimes making a change can be challenging because of the time, commitment and repetitions you have to make to build a routine.
Welcome to episode 23 of Take Notes with Jen Rafferty podcast! In this episode, I’m speaking with business and life strategy coach, author and speaker for women, Julie Delucca Collins. She talks about the influence of tiny habits in our daily lives.
Julie believes that it’s important to create growth for yourself. She understands that many empowered educators are feeling overwhelmed, exhausted and burned out. Through the power of a positive feedback loop, you’ll be able to build the confidence you need to make a change in yourself and regulate your emotions.
Today, it’s all about showing up and being consistent in your tiny habits. So, join us in this conversation so you can get the momentum going!
Stay empowered,

Jen

Let’s keep the conversation going! Find me at:

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About Julie:
Julie is a Business and Life Coach, Speaker, and Author. She helps entrepreneurs increase confidence, transform lives, and gain clients. She’s passionate about helping women and organizations find success. As a seasoned mentor and coach in the professional field, she supports women in creating a vision and setting goals. Her framework uses the Tiny Habits method to ensure that you create lasting behaviors to help you succeed in your business.

Contact Julie here:
Website: GoConfidentlyCoaching.com
Instagram: @julie_deluccacollins

TRANSCRIPT:  I remember all the passion and vision you had when you first went into teaching. Feeling like building young minds and creating community through your work would make a lasting impact on this world. Well, those days may feel like they're behind you now because you're exhausted, stressed and overwhelmed and frustrated. But I'm here to tell you, it doesn't have to be like this. In fact, the love of teaching never really went away. But it absolutely needs transformation. Welcome to The Take notes Podcast. I'm Jen Rafferty, former music teacher, mom of two, and certified emotional intelligence practitioner, and I'm here to light the way for you. In order to create a generational change for our kids. We need to shift the paradigm away from the perpetual stress and overwhelm and into a life of joy, and fulfillment. This is education 2.0, where you become the priority, shift how you live your life, and how you show up both at work, and at home. So take a sip of steamy morning coffee, and grab your notebook. It's time to take notes.

Hello everyone and welcome back to another episode of take notes. I'm here with the fabulous Julie DeLuca Collins who is the founder and CEO of Go confidently services. The host of the popular Casa DeConfidence podcast and her weekly radio show Confident You featured on a global talk radio network. As a business and life strategist coach, Julie helps women business owners launch or grow their businesses get clients be productive and achieve their dreams. Julie helps her clients create simple habits to achieve goals and change their lives. And she is also the number one best selling author of the book confident you.

And Julie is a sought after public speaker, a trainer and course creator and is a certified coach in cognitive behavioral techniques, holistic coach and tiny habits which are going to be talking a lot about today. And she's also a certified social emotional learning facilitator and has completed her 200 hour yoga teacher certification. Julie, I am so glad that you are here today to talk with us on Take Notes.

I am excited to be here. Jen, I loved having you on my show. I loved having you as part of my universe.
And I can't wait to talk and dive deep into everything.

All the things, all the things. Yeah, let's start. I would love to know more about how you got here. I mean, I'm familiar a little bit with your journey. I know we overlap in our fields of education. But I would love for you to tell our listeners you How did you get from where you were to where you are now?

Yeah, so for the listeners, I started as a humble Pre-K teacher in a preschool in, I always knew I was going to be a teacher, honestly, I was doing our future educators of America in high school. And I came from a family of educators and I loved it. I loved working in schools with kids. And I started to really burn out really quickly.

I'm not going to lie, I hated the hours. I hated the pressure, the lesson planning. And I just felt like there had to be something more but I wasn't sure what that meant. And I was offered a job at my church to oversee the religious education for middle school students. And I had volunteer and I thought, Well, I'm not certified as a teacher for middle school. And as a young 20 Let me think how old I was. I was 23 years old 24 I took over the religious education program for a church that had over 600 middle school and high school students.

And I had to do all of the talking about not lesson planning. But I had to do all the programming for the year for the years curriculum, and align everything to the confirmation, to the confirmation curriculum. And I loved it. I loved working with students in certainly I didn't know that I was not going to be doing that forever. I just knew again, I burned myself out really quickly four years in and I was burnt out. And at that point, I wasn't sure what I was going to do. So I went to work for retail, because I thought I need to make money. Right.

And eventually, in New York, I was recruited to do some grant writing. I had done that in college, my dad worked for an agency in DC that did a lot of grunt work for the government. And I had that experience. And then I was recruited by an educational company, an educational company in New Jersey that is a nationwide company. Many people know them. I was recruited because my teaching experience my ability to supervise, my ability to be able to create programming meet with parents, but also my retail experience.

I thought well this is interesting. And sure enough, I loved what I was doing because now I saw that I was really making an impact on the lives of students who were struggling in school, the families that we were working with. But more importantly, I could also create great support for teachers, in which many of them again, the teachers that came in to work and to tutor students were the ones who needed that part time job, and needed to be able to support themselves. But I thought, can we make this easy and fun.

And of course, I started working with this company, I was the center director for one of their centers. In after the first year, we went to a convention for all the center directors. And I was like, wow, there's a lot of centers that are very successful, that are making a lot of money. Then I went to the head of the company, and one of the founders, and I said, How do I get on that stage? Because to me, yes, it was about the center being successful because of the revenue. But what I was seeing is the number of lives that were being touched, and said, How can I get on that stage next year. And she said, I'm going to tell you the secret, you need to go in, connect with your local school, do school visits, get to know them, get to know what their struggles are, and find out from them, how you can serve them. And that's exactly what I did. It got to the point in which teachers or guidance counselors or principals would have parents in their office and say, Oh, let me call Julie.

And I'm going to send you to Julie, and she's going to help you. And that's really how it started to happen. And to the point that the following year, I was one of the top producing centers, and revenue, but also in the keep rate of students that were stayed for the programming, and I loved it. And then I got promoted. And that sort of got me into the start of a corporate career in the education industry. Over the course of the year, I was lucky enough to be in the right place at the right time for the organization, I would represented the company in Capitol Hill at the beginning of No Child Left Behind, and went through all of that I learned a lot in the company as far as what does it take to be able to work with school districts how to partner with them how to be able to, most of all, provide services.

But for me, I always came at it, not only from the business perspective, which I learned, and the company was very good at mentoring all of the executives on, but I really came to it from the teacher perspective, once a teacher, always a teacher, and I always understood the struggles that teachers have when you're in that seat. So that was one of the things that continued to help me grow and become successful. By the time I left that company, I was at the VP level. And I went to work for another company, again at the VP level helping them expand out of New York City into several different markets.

And I was there until the beginning of the pandemic. And at the beginning of the pandemic, I got a call in and it's funny because I sort of should have known but I didn't know we were hit very hard. The company with all the schools shutting down, we couldn't really continue to do services at the school district level. And I got the call saying we need to separate you're an executive, we cannot afford to keep half of our executives. And I thought nope, absolutely. It makes 100% sense.

And I had already been doing some work on my own. I went through a coaching certification for holistic coaching, mainly because for myself, I also had been working at several colleges and universities here as a volunteer in a leadership mentoring program that we had and is still going strong. So certainly I knew that I wanted to be more in the space of mentoring and coaching individuals being able to provide them with a support system that they needed. And that's how I got here. So three years in almost three years, and I have great business. But most importantly, I am helping women really grow and launch their dream their business, whatever it is that it might be. Because when I was in corporate, everybody would say oh my god, you're gonna get another promotion. You're so good. You're so confident.

And I would say, No, not really, I don't always have it together. And I wanted people to know and normalize for others, that it's not about being perfect. It's not about having it together. It's not about everything that you're doing. But it's about the showing up even when you don't feel like it. It's about surrounding yourself with the right resources, the right support, and also being willing to be in that level of discomfort chest for a little bit. Because then that's when really you start to grow. And you really start to, again, assess yourself and say, Oh, how can I do that better? Or just like we do with our kids, right? That feedback model is so important and giving that feedback model for ourselves is key.

So that's why I'm doing what I'm doing and I love it. I love the opportunity to be able to serve others who have a dream in their heart for whatever it might be, but don't have have the know how when it comes to business, the nitty gritty of business, don't have the confidence and I can share my confidence with them until they start to see their own gifts and start to see how they can start to grow only if they take that chance in themselves. So small answer, long answer, but that's it. Right?

Yeah. Thank you so much for sharing your story. And, you know, I think the thing that struck me is, at the end, you said, how do we show up and do the things that make us uncomfortable, because that's truly where your dreams are, it's going to be uncomfortable, because they're not here yet.

We go for something that we don't have evidence of being safe, it is going to feel uncomfortable. And I think there is this idea, especially now with social media, right? We all tend to posture as having it together. And we posture as having a certain kind of a lifestyle. And some of that, I think is this idea that everyone has it all together all the time. And everyone is feeling that confidence all the time. And it's that confidence that what drives you. But I think that does a disservice because it creates this idea of imposter syndrome, which is like kind of a false thing in my book, I talk about that another time.
But you know, this whole idea of well, I could do that only if I had the confidence. But the truth is, keeping it together is a lie, that is not actually a thing. And so I'm curious to know, and I'm wondering if your training in tiny habits has kind of led you in the direction of also realizing that we don't have to be born having it all together. And to figure it all out that this is Oh, constant process.

Absolutely, it is a constant process. And I will tell you that you talked about and you share the different certifications that I have. And this is the one thing that I want to leave the audience with. If there's one thing that you can really take away from that. There might be a lot of certifications under my belt, but I got them mainly for me, mainly to create the growth for myself.

Because I am my best client, I am the person who needed to learn the tiny habits, how to use that cognitive behavioral techniques, I needed to be able to know how to process in question my mindset, we are all programmed with thought errors in our world typically is teaching us to beat ourselves up for the judgment that we do have ourselves. We are always so prone to think that we're broken but the reality is that we're not we're not in all it takes is doing the work when I started tiny habits specifically. That's one of the things that it's the secret, right, to me becoming more confidence, because yes, I don't always have it together, I don't always feel confident. But I am an extrovert. I am your typical first born leader in my family. So I do have a level of confidence.

And when I create evidence that, hey, I did that, then it gives me the ability to keep programming myself to continue to do it and become an automation, as opposed to not seeing the evidence that I did it and then beating myself up for not doing it. I'll give you an example. Pre pandemic, I was doing right when it came to my physical health, and I was going to the gym. And of course, like many of us, that train sailed for me, I stopped going to the gym, I have an autoimmune, I couldn't do it. And of course, I'm not in the best shape or in the shape that I would like to be in as I started to reevaluate my health, what are my priorities? What are my values, when it comes to my health, I realized that I do want to be fit not so much for a number in the scale, but just I want to be strong and fit as I grow older.

But the thought of getting on the treadmill like I would do before and maybe run for 20 minutes, or even do weights or as a certified yoga teacher do a whole hour of yoga, the motivation is not there. And this is what tiny habits it's about, right? When we think we need to go big or go home, we're going to fail. Because when your motivation, when things get hard, when it becomes very difficult and challenging, then you're gonna like I don't feel like doing that so much, right? Where as if you give yourself the ability to one, create the tiny habit, and you pair it up with something that you're already doing, right.

So for instance, for me, my new tiny habit so that I can work myself up is I am coming into my office, I can do every day. I'm already doing that. And then I'm going to check my email. I'm already doing that. But I take my laptop from my desk and I go up there to the treadmill. And all I'm going to do is check my email for two minutes and walk on the treadmill for two minutes. Right. So that's a lot of tiny habit and you're like oh my God, two minutes on the treadmill. Yeah, because guess what? I'm gonna celebrate that I did the two Minutes, that's all I was setting up to do, if I'm going to do more than two minutes, uh, yay for me.

But I'm always going to yay me for doing the two minutes. So then my brain is like, Oh, this is just automatic what we do. And then you continue to create that evidence that you do the work that you're successful that you can do it. And for many of us, that's where we're struggle. We haven't seen ourselves do the thing. We haven't to continually celebrated that even if we did it, right, we're in that gap thinking that we did it. But we're like, Oh, but I didn't do it enough. Stop doing that we need to really focus on I did it and look how well I did it for the two minutes. And you'll never setting up yourself for failure if you're taking small manageable chunks that way.

That's such a beautiful way of looking at it. Because I think, again, people look at other people. And we fall into this comparison trap, which nobody wins in that comparison trap, you know, that is just the thief of joy, right? That's how that thing goes to her isn't is the thief of joy, because you're looking at someone else's stuff, and only seeing what they're presenting and only really one angle of it. And I think people even look at my journey. And they're like, Oh, you went from being unemployed, staying at home, homeschooling your kids not knowing what you're going to do to giving a TED talk. Okay, well, it's really easy for you to see those two things.

But truthfully, if you were to use a microscope, there were 1000s of microscopic choices that I had to make along the way. And if I wasn't able to make those choices and celebrate those wins, there's no way that I would be able to get to where I am today. So it's this idea, like you said, Go big or go home isn't really serving us, it's actually setting ourselves up for failure.

And by the way, the thing that we don't realize is that expert level requires 10,000 hours or more of practice. And this is the thing that we think that in between you being a stay at home mom homeschooling and where you are now you have been putting in your hours you've been struggling with through the things that you didn't know, but you figure them out.

Why because you kept showing up. And my favorite saying that I tell people all the time, and it really needs to go on a Tshirt is consistent action gets you traction. So I like that this tendency of showing up, even when we don't feel like it. But if you make a tiny, it's easy to show up. Because you're not like my water, I drink water because my action is not that I'm going to drink a gallon of water daily, my action is I'm going to let my dogs out existing action. And I'm gonna pair it up with my new habit or my habit of how to fill my water bottle. And then I'm going to cheer myself on for getting my water bottle filled.

 And then when I start to drink it, every time I go to the bathroom, I celebrate like, yey, went to the bathroom, and I refill my water, right? And I keep drinking and it creates this momentum. And the days that I drink all my water, great on the days that I don't I never failed, right? But I can go back and say, Oh, how come? I didn't drink my water today? Let's be curious about that. Because that curiosity is the curiosity that allows you to course correct, yes.

And it's creating that positive feedback loop for ourselves. We're wired for negative feedback loops. That's just how our brain is working. So we have to work extra hard to create a positive feedback loop. And before I go into asking you about like, how can we practically apply this to everyday lives as teachers, I want to ask you about showing up, you say, Well, you got to show up. And I think part of the issue for some people is how do you know what to show up for? And I think especially in a service profession, where you know, I've said this a million times we are indoctrinated to think about our profession as it only being about the kids.

And when we do that we ignore ourselves. And we don't give ourselves enough worth to even create any sort of idea that that we need to do anything for ourselves. It doesn't, we're not worthy of it, because it's really all about the kids. So when we say we have to keep showing up, I want to just highlight this for a minute, because this is really about showing up for yourself. And in turn, you show up for the people that you serve, particularly the students and then the communities that we're all a part of. But what is that process like for you? How did you know what to show up for? What did it mean to show up for you?

You know, one of the things that and it doesn't matter whether you're a teacher, whether you're a mom, whether you're a business owner, a wife, a friend, a daughter, we are programmed to define ourselves by the role that the world gives us. And it's difficult to show up for ourselves. When we don't even know that we have to show up for ourselves. Many of my friends are still teachers and I have a friend in particular who has been struggling with a lot of anxiety this year, debilitating anxiety. But she's putting the needs of her students, the needs of the school the demands of the school, the needs of her husband, her kids, always her friends me as a friend always first. And that's why you're not showing up for yourself because she's never learn to create like, I am not, Jane.

I mean, I am not Jane, the teacher, I am Jane. Jane, who has anxiety, what is Jane need? What is going on and in? When we start to really analyze in this happened to me, I think that when I started to say, well, what is Julie need? Forget Julie being defined as. My last role was in the sea level of the company. And there was a level and the in which I still define myself by the role. But we have to separate ourselves from the roles so that we can clearly see, hey, the teacher needs to give, the mom needs to mother, the wife needs to wife. But if I am a woman who is feeling tired and anxious, and what do I need to give to that person? What does that person need, because we can identify everybody else's needs so quickly.

And we do it under the hat of the role that we are wearing. But if we take that hat off and really focus on well, you know what I need rest. It happened to me yesterday, and I had a big event Saturday, as you know. And Friday I High Achiever wanted to have everything perfect and didn't sleep very well. Then, of course, I we went to dinner later on Sunday, I said I'm not doing anything except sleeping, reading, sleeping, and having a glass of wine. And I'm gonna just recharge. But sometimes we forget to do that.

Yeah, you know, as you're, as you're saying all of these things, it reminds me of this just very interesting time in my life after the divorce. And before I where I am now, I was dating for a little while. And what was so interesting about that, for me, was I was just Jen, that the people that I would go out with didn't know me from anybody. I wasn't Jen the teacher, I wasn't Jen the mom, I wasn't Jen, who had this background, who was from this place who you know, and I could just be who I was.

I think my favorite part about that experience, because you know, sometimes dating can be a little bit wonky and weird. But for me, I loved it because I felt as if I was being reflected by somebody else in a way that I wasn't used to because I was so connected to my identities. And I'm so glad you said this in a different way becauseI haven't been able to really articulate it the way that you just did so well besides sharing my dating stories, which we won't get into in this podcast.

But that is something that is so important. And if you are able to find a way to really go inside and remove all of the hats that we've not only chosen, but then have also been given to us and really sit and ask yourself with a mirror for yourself. Who am I? What do I need? That really will allow you to go in the direction of Well, where do I now need to show up?

Yeah, the other thing too, you know, as you're speaking and this is something that when I would go into schools, and I would train administrators or or teachers on social emotional learning skills, many of them had the thought that I was there to teach them curriculum that they can then go and turn teach their students. But what I was really there to teach is a practice, because the most effective teachers are the ones who embody the work.

It's not the ones who are reading from the prompt or the curriculum. And if you are not embodying the work, then you're not modeling the behavior. Yeah. And it at the end of the day, it's what happens in our life, we have to embody. And really, this is the other thing that I love about tiny habits, tiny habits allows you to do what you already want to do. The desire that you have, is there.

You just don't know the way to get there. But it allows you to create the identity. So for instance, for me, getting on the treadmill for two minutes is not that I am going to work out it's becoming that person that 2.0 version of me. And this is where if we start to practice then we are becoming that person.

Yes. So can you walk us through an example that might be relevant to someone who's teaching right now you know, I really want to be able to have more me time that's something that I hear a lot is you know, I'm so stressed I'm giving all of my time and energy and attention to everybody else. And they're just like craving me time. And a big part of that is I'm afraid to let anything go. Because if I don't pick this up who's going to do this? So this is a very common scenario, can you speak towards this about how can you practice tiny habits to maybe move the needle forward?

Yeah, so I'm going to teach you the framework. So Dr. Fogg, who is the founder of the Behavior Lab at Stanford, who wrote the book, Tiny Habits, and that's who I got certified through. One of the things that he has found in all his years of research is that in order for you to create a behavior, there's three things that need to be present, the motivation, the ability in a prompt, so for the person that says, hey, I'm really stressed, I want to get more me time, right? That's the behavior that you want. Obviously, you need to have the motivation, which we talked about, it's not always present, right? If something is very hard, specifically, you're not going to be motivated to do it. And if you haven't been doing it, your brain is gonna say, Oh, my God is so hard, and you're never gonna get time, you're gonna have to figure it out. Right? So you can't rely on motivation. So then that means that you have to find the ability to do it, and a prompt to do it.

The first thing that I will say is, look at your behavior already. Look at the things that you're already doing. So take, for instance, my habit of wanting to drink water, right, or wanting to be the person that's hydrated, right? If I said, I'm going to drink that gallon of water, of course, motivation goes away, because like, Oh, my God, so hard, I'm what am I going to drink that water, but I had to find the ability. So when am I going to be able to write break it down into the smallest piece, if I need to have the water bottle fill? What am I going to do it right? And I needed to be able to find the opportunity to fill my water bottle. So yes, I need to come to the kitchen, there's so many times, especially in my house, you have to go through the kitchen to come in, go out, come into the office, etc.

But I needed to have existing behavior that was already automated, something that I was already doing daily that I did, one of the behaviors is I let my dogs out every morning, because if I don't, I'm in trouble, right. So that's something that's always going to happen. So if I put the water bottle next to in my I'm lucky enough, again, my back doors in the kitchen, and it's right next to the sink. So at night, I leave my water bottle there. So when I let the dogs out, immediately I let them out, I turn around, I fill the water bottle, so you have to have the ability to do it.

So let's say someone that get wants to have time for themselves. So maybe you're coming off from a teaching and you're coming into your house, in the first thing that you typically do is you go into the kitchen and open the pantry to grab a snack. So maybe what you're gonna do, you're already have that automation, then maybe you do grab a snack, maybe you grab a healthy snack, whatever automation you have, as I come in the door and put my keys my purse down, then I will go put my purse down in the chair and sit for two minutes and listen to a meditation or just read a page in a book, or just write something that I was grateful for for the day at school.

One thing that stood out that I'm really grateful for just little things like that. And then it's not hard, it's not going to take you that long. It's already something that you do.. So maybe you're sitting in your kitchen and you're having the your after school snack, then write down a sentence or something that and really think about what's going on, do it for three minutes less than two maybe, and get started with that. And here's the key to the tiny habits framwrok in the process. After I write you have your prompt when I do this, I will do this. And the last part is I will celebrate. So as soon as you write your sentence as soon as you do the thing, like celebrate Oh god, me, good job, Julie. Or I give myself a thumb up. Sometimes I do my little dance that I filled my water bottle or it was on a treadmill or whatever it is I'm trying to do.

Those things are the things that keep you going. I'm starting a new tiny habit is every time I cook, I am adding vegetables, more than just a side dish, but into the main dish. So every time I add the vegetables to whatever I'm cooking, I give myself a thumbs up. And guess what, and we're eating a lot more vegetables now than we were a couple of months ago. So that's the key to really being able to automate behavior is finding the moment to be able to do it. Finding the automated behavior, the prompt and then adding the behavior to it and celebrating it.

And I want to talk about that celebrating thing for a moment because this is something I talk a lot about to with my work and it is massively uncomfortable for so many people to celebrate because this is something else that has just been in the air that we breathe that we don't want to boast. We don't want to be too big we don't be too loud. We don't want to toot our own horns because humility is more important. And I think that that's crap. I think that that is another incredible disservice.

Because even just at the biological level, we need to create evidence that what you're doing and changing is not just now comfortable when it used to be uncomfortable, but it's something that you enjoy. And you need to be able to release all of those beautiful neuro chemicals in your body, that's going to make you feel good that it's again, going to create some sort of craving that you're going to do it again. So it's not about necessarily only being boastful and showing off which, by the way, I don't think there's anything wrong with either of those things.

Another conversation, I think, but like, even just on a very basic, you know, neuroscience level, we need to create opportunities that feel good when we're moving through something that makes us uncomfortable. So yay you all the time. Yeah, one of the things that I love to say, and I talked about it on Saturday at the CEO retreat is if you don't toot your own horn, nobody typically will. So take action toot your own horn say Go me. And by the way, celebrations, we make such a big deal about celebrations. Oh my God, I don't want to do that. I coach the Tiny Habits Program almost on a weekly basis, anywhere between 10 to 15 people that I coach through, and that is probably one of the things that no matter what career, what walk of life you have people struggle with.

So we've actually put together a list of 101 ways to celebrate yourself. And they're so easy to do that. Honestly, you could just think of yourself, you know, when you get that email that tells you like, Oh, you're in or this happened and you're like, Oh, hey, replicate that as you're doing your action? Oh, look at me, I did that good job. Or ooh, I made the shot when I throw that paper in the wastebasket. Right? Yes, feeling. That's what you want to replicate. Because that's going to make you feel good. And your brain is going I want more of that. So therefore, you're gonna keep doing the thing.

Yes, it's the dopamine ding, and different kinds of dopamine ding that you get from scrolling on Facebook or scrolling on Instagram. That's cheap dopamine. This is right, which ends up being a lot more expensive in the long run. But in the long run, absolutely

Yeah, it's happened to all of us. Right? Yes. And so this is the really good kind of dopamine that you get to create for yourself. Because you're right, Julie, no one's gonna give you a yay me for sitting your butt on the chair after work for a minute, the only one that's going to do that is you. And here's another beautiful opportunity for you to take complete personal responsibility for the way you are navigating through your life. Because even just doing something like this, it's so easy to again, say like you said, there's not enough time, I can never do it. Everyone else is putting all these pressures on me. Well, here's a beautiful spot for you to say, Nope, I'm going to be sitting down for one minute. And I'm gonna celebrate myself. Thank you very much.

I know. And honestly, the people that are going to benefit are the people that you are trying to give to from an empty cup. Yes, that's the bottom line. Yeah, we hear it all the time, put your mask on first, you can't pour from an empty cup.

But we really don't hear it. And we really don't practice it. And that's what creates that momentum in the direction we don't want to go, right? I think about, there's two things that can happen, right, you can have a snowball effect in which there's a snowball that's coming down the hill, and it keeps getting bigger and bigger and bigger and becomes an avalanche and it creates destruction or you can come down the hill with the momentum of what you're building. And really beautifully skating. If you ski right you can ski or snowboard down the hill and have just this exhilarating experience and fun that you're like, Oh, look at me, and you really enjoy the outdoors and the time that you're outside. So there's two different experiences but choose it every day that we don't choose to be proactive or intentional than we're choosing the avalanche.

Yes, it is always a choice, we forget that we don't realize that that it is always a choice. Because even when you show up the way you've always been showing up. That is also something that you are actively choosing.

 For sure. And that's the one thing that I hope your listeners walk away. And by the way, if you're walking away feeling guilty, that you're not doing it, you're not hearing us. When you're in that state of feeling bad about what you did. The ability to actually change is harder, and it goes away. That's right. And feeling shame and guilt is actually also a choice. Yeah, for sure. Absolutely. Yes. And if you find yourself getting stuck in that reach out to me or Julie

We will get you right back into shape.

We just need two minutes for that. Give us two minutes. Well, you'll be absolutely. And we sabotage ourselves so much, Jen, did you do the Positive Intelligence course?

And so what is that?

Oh my gosh, you really should. I think they're starting a new cohort. Shirzad Chamine, he used to be CEO for the ICF, International Federation of coaches, or anyway, so he wrote a book called Positive Intelligence. And he created a course for coaches. And he's actually given a $1 million grant for coaches to go through a six week certification program on mental fitness. I think he's starting a new cohort, and it's free, it's $1,000 Worth of course, I'll find the information and send that to you, Oh, that'd be great. It's phenomenal. It really is phenomenal.

And in, one of the things that we learn through that is that you have an inner judge, and our judge, everybody has a judge, but our judge obviously varies from person to person based on your experiences, how you grew up, and that internal voice differs. However, we have these cast of characters that are supporting actors to the judge, and they're the saboteurs. And depending on who you are, you may have different saboteurs. My saboteurs tend to be the controlling saboteur. The high achieving saboteur, the one that says, oh, it's not perfect, you can't do it. It's right. The other saboteur that really trips me up is my restless saboteur, the one that says, Oh, my God, it's gonna take too long go to the next thing Go to the next shiny object.

But some people in this is the other thing that people struggle with some of the other saboteurs and really trip them up are the people pleaser saboteur, the one or the one that is hyper controlling, or hyper feeling loss.

Anyway, that's actually not the name of the saboteur, I'm really getting lost myself. So there’s 10 different ones in that makes a big difference.

And it really knowing this about yourself, the more that we can do the introspective work and hold up a mirror to ourselves, again, the better we are going to show up for all of the people around us that we really want to show up for especially our students, and make the impact that we said that we wanted to make in the first place. So Julie, this has been wonderful. And now I need to ask the question, I asked everybody, as you know, what is your dream for the future of education?

 I love this question so much. You know, one of the things that I believe in education is that education is not just about what happens in the classroom. Education is about the experiences and the relationships that we can forge outside of the classroom and create communities where it's not about, you're going to school to get a skill that will get you money, it's about the evolution of knowing that the classroom can be everywhere in anywhere. And that way, it's really time for us to also start seeing education and practicing education in new innovative ways.

 As opposed to an I know it's controversial to say this, but an antiquated system that doesn't fit our in modern society, and the way that students learn. So my vision is that we understand the world differently, we understand that not everybody can show up in the same way and have the same skills and etc. But that there's also ability to learn and grow outside of the traditional stuff.

Yes, yes to all of that. And you're absolutely right. That is something I say a lot, you know, the way of schools are now some model that was built in a world that we just don't live in anymore. And you know, the more that we can share this message and our dreams, the more likely they are going to come true. So thank you so much for sharing that.

And so for our listeners want to know more about you, Julie, and the work that you do in this world, what's the easiest way that they can get in touch with you?

Well, you can find me on my website, and that is goconfidentlycoaching.com and I am Julie DeLuca Collins on all the social media platforms. So feel free to connect with me in any of them. And let me know that you found me through Jen, I'd love to get to know you better and talk about all things. Fantastic. And all of those links are going to be in the show notes as well.

So Julie, thank you so much for spending your time with me this afternoon. It's always really great to talk with you.

It's always so fun to chat with you, Jen, continue doing what you're doing and don't forget, Go confidently in the direction of your dreams.

Thank you, same to you and same to all of our listeners. Thank you so much for joining us in our conversation today. Don't forget to like this episode and subscribe to take notes and we'll see you next time on the take notes podcast.


Incredible right. Together, we can revolutionize the face of education. It's all possible and it's all here for you right now. Let's keep the conversation going at empowered educator faculty room on Facebook

As an empowered educator, do you focus on the inner work it takes to help create a better quality of life?
Being a teacher and creating a space that is accepting, healing and nurturing helps cultivate community- not just inside your classroom, but for society as a whole.
Welcome to episode 22 of the Take Notes podcast with Jen Rafferty! In this episode, I’m speaking with trauma informed subconscious mindset coach, Amanda Bolzau.

She's a mentor and advocate who works with women on the rise who want to self actualize, grow, and live a more expansive life.

I'm so excited to delve into her expertise on trauma, neuroplasticity, metacognition, and various somatic and subconscious modalities that really help break apart old conditioning, in order to live a truly free life.

Her work empowers people to peel away the layers of inauthentic versions of themselves and reclaim who they were always meant to be.

As we dive deep into this conversation, Amanda shares the importance of doing the inner work in efforts to disrupt your old way of thinking and free yourself- because you have the power- ALL OF IT!

Today is all about raising the consciousness of the world, by unlocking your own power!

If you’re ready to gain that freedom in your life, join us in this insightful conversation!


Stay empowered,

Jen

Let’s keep the conversation going! Find me at:

Click here to learn all the ways you can work with me:
 Jen Rafferty | Instagram, YouTube, Facebook | Linktree
Instagram: @jenrafferty_
Facebook: Empowered Educator Faculty Room

About Amanda :
Amanda is a Trauma-Informed Subconscious Success Coach, Mentor and Advocate working with women on the rise who want to Self-actualize, Grow, and live a more Expansive life. Amanda's expertise in trauma education and processing, neuroplasticity, metacognition, and various somatic and subconscious modalities helps you break apart your old conditioning so you can live a truly free life. Her work empowers you to peel away the layers of inauthentic versions of yourself in order to reclaim who you were always meant to be. She partners with you on your deeply personal journey to freedom, wherein you gain access to the most valuable lesson you'll ever learn... YOU have all the power... all of it... and you always have.

Connect with Amanda here:
Website: TheLittFactor.com

TRANSCRIPT:  For those of you who have been in my world for a while, you know that I talk a lot about the inner work. But what does that even mean? What is inner work? Well, I spoke about this with an incredible mindset coach and my good friend who describes it as the work of you. The inner work is about choosing to heal and to grow to become your best self, and at the same time become an expander for other people, showing other people what's possible as you move through your newfound discoveries of how to human in this world, and what a gift to give to our students. Again, we're just taking a mirror and holding it up to ourselves in order to take better care of others around us. This conversation is juicy, and I am so excited to share it with you. And if you're feeling stressed, my book 24 ways to find calm in your busy world is now available to podcast listeners for free at empowered educator.com/ebook. Here you will find 24 ways to feel more ease and more joy by noticing the things that are all around you that are usually out of sight. I did all the work for you. And it's yours FREE. download your copy today at empowered educator.com/ebook. Remember all the passion and vision you had when you first went into teaching. Feeling like building young minds and creating community through your work would make a lasting impact on this world? Well, those days may feel like they're behind you now because you're exhausted, stressed and overwhelmed and frustrated. But I'm here to tell you it doesn't have to be like this. In fact, the love of teaching never really went away. But it absolutely needs transformation. Welcome to The Take notes Podcast. I'm Jen Rafferty, former music teacher, mom of two, and certified emotional intelligence practitioner, and I'm here to light the way for you. In order to create a generational change for our kids, we need to shift the paradigm away from the perpetual stress and overwhelm and into a life of joy, and fulfillment. This is education 2.0, where you become the priority, shift how you live your life, and how you show up both at work, and at home. So take a sip of steamy morning coffee, and grab your notebook, it's time to take notes. Hello, and welcome back to another fabulous episode of take notes. Today's guest is incredible, obviously, because she's here on this podcast. And I only have incredible people on this podcast. But this particular person is someone I've known for quite some time. And I'm so excited to start this conversation and share it with you. Because Amanda is a trauma and Forbes subconscious success coach. She's a mentor and advocate who works with women on the rise who wants to self actualize, grow, and live a more expansive life. And I just want to pause here for a second because although she works pretty exclusively with women, you just like separate that word, just put the word human in there. Because I would like to think that as teachers, we get to do this too for our kids. So this is why I'm so excited about having her here and her expertise in trauma, education and processing and neuroplasticity and metacognition, in various somatic and subconscious modalities really helped break apart old conditioning in order to live a truly free life. Her work empowers people to just peel away the layers of inauthentic versions of themselves and reclaim who they always meant to be. And helps people understand that. You have all the power, all of it. And you always have, huh, yes, that is so juicy. Menza thank you so much for being here.


Thank you for having me that is juicy when you read it. I'm like, what? That's amazing.


Who is that? Right? It's you? I do. So I would just love to start with what brought you to this work. I feel like this is very much a part of my life right now. The people who come to empowered educator are ready to do this work. So it seems very familiar, but it wasn't always familiar. So what brought you to this point where this was something you really wanted to pursue and then share?


Yeah, so I mean, at the core, what brought me here was my own deep inner work as I leaned into parts of myself, like the flashing neon sign over my head that I had my whole life that said, like come tell me all about you and your problems and let me help you like I always had that neon flashing sign. And as I leaned into using that and recognizing that about myself, it really kind of started to open my eyes to the deep inner work journey that I really needed and wanted for myself. And as I went there, I found myself really, really, really wanting to increase that work with other people and create my actual life around what it means to do your own inner work and teach other people how to do their own inner work, and really raise the consciousness of the world. So for me, that's really a big part of the journey that brought me here.


And that neon sign is something I think a lot of people can relate to, you know, oftentimes, I've observed, especially teachers, you're the person that people go to, for help, you're the person who people go to for support or advice or whatever. And in coming to this space of raising consciousness, understanding our brain, we know that in order to serve, we have to actually do the work ourselves. And when you say inner work, I would love to just explore that a little bit on unpacking, what does that what does that even mean, in our work in your worlds?


Okay, concisely, we would subject it, we would title it the work of us so that the beliefs you hold the way you feel, the way you think the way you learn the way you emit your energy, the way you manage your own energy, the way you experience the world around you, then inner work is the core, the root of every single thing that you experience throughout your entire life. If you are a constant learner and worker of your own inner environment, then you continue to actualize and experience things externally, that are elevated and expanded and bigger and better. And so inner work means choosing to heal choosing to grow, choosing to expand so that you can then become someone who is an expander. For other people, who is somebody who can take what you've done with yourself and drip it all over the people who are around you. That's what I call inner work. I love


the visual images that I'm getting here big, expansive, almost paint, like drips on people who are in your world. But as someone who has also been doing this inner work for several years, and you know, that's really part of what empowered educator is all about. It's holding up a mirror with compassion, with the intention of understanding, you need to go deep in order to grow up, you know, you can't see me right now you're listening. But I'm kind of like doing this opposite hand motion with my hands growing up in one way, but going deep in the other way, you have to do both. And if we really want to show our kids, our students that really the next generation the way to live this highly conscious life, we have to do that ourselves.


100% the deeper you go, the higher you go, like it's correlative,


right. And so for those people who are just coming to this work, it can sound very heavy and daunting. And I think even now, a lot of that stigma is getting taken away about even seeing a therapist, right? No one thinks twice about joining a gym or having a personal trainer are going to nutritionist. But up until very, very recently. I won't even say COVID was probably the shifting catalyst for this change in conversation about oh, yeah, like we've all gone through this collective trauma. Of course, we're all seeing a therapist, therapists are booked out until 2025 right now. So it's coming around. But even just being comfortable saying, I would love coaching support guidance on some of those things that you were talking about, just like I would go to see a nutritionist or a personal trainer. So how is your experience been? or what have you observed in just that shift of that conversation?


Because I imagine people listening are either like, yeah, or they're like on fitness. Because if your your Heck no, you're probably listening to this podcast.


Right? I was just gonna say that audience is not here. Right? And so my observations are, number one, we are in a consciousness revolution, no question. The amount of waking up that's taking place, gives me goosebumps. And with that energy that's in the collective energy in the world right now. We're growing our self awareness we're growing our awareness of other people and with that comes the ability to be more compassionate, less judgmental, and there are certain stigmas that are breaking down organically because of that, because the more aware we are becoming, the more we are are open, the more we are accepting and non judgmental, the more we are increasing our own consciousness and the consciousness around us. So I really feel like it's similar to like a domino effect, the more people who are waking up and who are in like engaging in this new way, the ripple effect is starting, it's starting to dismantle all that stuff.


Yeah, for sure. And you keep coming back to this phrase non judgments. And I guess I want to start there. Can we talk about non judgement, because that is definitely one of the biggest obstacles that I've observed. People have when they just either first start getting this work, or first coming to this work or when they're in the process of doing it. It's quieting that voice of judgments. Can we talk a little bit about that? And how do you approach that with the people that you work with?


Absolutely, I could talk about that for days, if you'd like. The way to non judgement is true, choosing curiosity instead. So as a natural byproduct of people waking up, and opening to more possibilities and more ways of doing things, that breeds curiosity, which then naturally starts to erode judgment. So non judgment is, from a place of non judgment, anything is available to you, the moment you begin to experience judgment around things, is the moment you start closing doors, closing opportunities, closing options, so it's a massively important part of the inner work that we get to do is to become that non judgmental observer of ourselves so that we can lead our own life and our own learning journeys with curiosity and teach in the same way.


Yeah, and that is a place to unlock a whole new worlds of existing. And what I've also seen, and, you know, I just feel like we just kind of, we're gonna keep creeping down these rabbit holes over here, you know, once we have this non judgmental space, and we open up to new possibilities and curiosity, well, then that starts to lead to desire. And that's a place that can be really scary, because if you are living in this world in this role in a way that you've always been, perhaps, because that's the only thing that was available to you, or perhaps you're living with expectations placed on you, either explicitly or implicitly, when we start to get rid of this judgment, and we live in this land of curiosity, and then we start to think about, well, what do we actually wants? That can be really scary, especially when we start questioning things like what are my values? What's important to me? It might even worthy of wanting more, right? So yeah, let's I want to talk a little bit about that.


Okay, yeah, totally. First of all, I'll keep down rabbit holes with you anytime. Next on the list. I love that you use the word desire, because, and desire and want. And all of that goes hand in hand. And what would likely surprise people is the frequency of people with whom I work, who say they want things and say they want like, for example, freedom, that I'm going to go with freedom with the big one in the work that I do. And once they recognize that's available to them, that becomes incredibly scary, because with freedom, there are no more of those safety conditions that you grew up with right now. Everything is available to you now, you feel more responsibility for claiming the things that you say that you want, and all of your desires, the way you start thinking about what you want and desire changes. And what we know about the brain is that change is unfamiliar. So the moment we disrupt that old way of being that kind of like cocooned conditional way of being we are in the unfamiliar, and the second we get there, the brain is starting to shut it down. So when we look at wants and desires, freedom, whatever to that same lens, it's important to remember we're gonna go down a rabbit hole if I if I say this, I know we are because I know you know this, when we start working through the unfamiliar and we get into that space, then we get to start working with our nervous system, because then it's important to start making it safe to have everything that we want and to hold the freedom and the space and the wants and the desires and the new ways of being. So this type of thing starts to stack you know everything is connected, and wanting and desiring through the lens of a more open more aware space. isn't always as amazing as we would want it to be. But it is so so worth it once you start to do the work.


Yeah, you know, self regulation is one of The most important integrative tools that we do in Empower educator because it's one thing to be inspired. It's quite another thing to integrate the practices when you're actually living your life, right. So that self regulation piece is essential. But I want to go back. So can we kind of go through a scenario together, because one of the things that is something that keeps popping up is time. And from time to time, and never enough time. There's always stuff to do get up at 530 in the morning and make the kids their lunches, and we're getting everybody breakfast and dress and finally in the car, and they're dropped off at school or on the bus, and then we get to work. And then everyone comes in. And then already it's 330. But I have papers to grade. And then I pick up the kids and they have violin practice and soccer and then it's making dinner, and then all of a sudden, it's getting everyone ready for bed and I have to go to bed, and then I have to do it up again morning. That's the thing, which even saying those things out loud. I feel like I need to take a breath myself. So I would love to just go back and use that example that you gave about freedom. And talk about that scenario, which I know so many listeners right now can resonate with. Right?


I'm regulating myself right now. Because as you were doing that I was like, Okay, calm down, calm down, calm down, right, because what's so interesting about the concept of freedom and how we think about the things that we want and desire. And all of that is when you have a list like that, and that is the way you are thinking about the things that you need to do in your day, right? That's the running on list like that is how it comes through. What if I said that the reason it comes through like that is not actually because it's like that. But it's because that's how you believe about it. That's how you think about it. That's how you view it. And therefore, the result of that is that's how the day plays out every single day after day after day after day. That is one of the biggest moments that goosebump moments is what I call them awareness moments that people have in this type of work is, wow, I can create a completely different experience based on how I think about things, how I perceive things, how I believe about things, what I do with things like a task oriented day, right? So when you are running through that list, and I was over here, tapping, that is one of the most common things I experience when people first come into this work is that's how they truly believe that that is their reality, when in fact, their reality is a product of how they think about what's going on. Simply put, simply stated,


yeah, so let's dive into that. Because this sounds so real, because that was me, right. And I know that throughout all of the people that I've worked with, through this work, so many of these task oriented days, and structures come through as the reality. And it's pervasive, and then everything. And part of the reason why this work is so important for you as the teacher in the room, is because you're not only able to experience your day differently, but your students are experiencing you differently. Your partner is experiencing you differently. Your kids are experiencing you differently. Your dog is experiencing differently, right. So this is the work, this is the work, that's the lifelong journey work. But to kind of just crack the door open a little bit. Where do we start? Where's a safe place to start? Every time


I get asked this question, I answer it in the exact same way. The answer always is awareness, non judgmental awareness, preferably that will come but awareness. The truth is that we can't do anything about what we can't actually see. And notice. So anytime we look at okay, what's step one step one is always, always always awareness, noticing, and not noticing, outside of ourselves noticing, inside of ourselves, noticing what we may be producing what may be coming through us out into the external, noticing how we feel when we run through a task oriented day like that. Versus if we imagined and chose to imagine running through our task oriented day with more ease with more flow with more breathing with more relaxation involved. noticing the difference in how we feel noticing how we feel when we are doing things in that old chaotic way, right. Noticing how we speak, noticing how we react, how we respond, awareness and metacognition, the self self awareness and meta cognate shouldn't go hand in hand in, in life in the world and in the classroom, including kids, two parts of the same thing, self awareness, and metacognition, they rely upon each other. So step one, awareness, preferably non judgmental awareness.


Well, that's a huge piece of everything, building blocks to everything else has to be that because like you said, you can't change what you don't notice. And something that you talk about that I talk about is data, right? We're just kind of collecting data. And once we start looking at it like that, that's when the Curiosity can come in, because we're not making it mean anything. So I got home from a busy day, and I snapped at my kids. Hmm, that's interesting. And it doesn't have to mean, I'm a bad mom, it doesn't have to mean, I'm fill in the blank, whatever. But that is a moment where you can pause, reflect and just get curious about, okay, well, what am I feeling in this moment? Are my needs being met? What's happening here?


Is that kind of that's, that's it? Yes. And I want to add to this, and something that oftentimes, it's not talked about as frequently, but it's super important to what you just said, in the example that you gave, like, I came home and I, you know, snapped at my kids, huh, that's so interesting, when we talked about curiosity versus judgment. And the importance of self awareness is the first step. What I want to make sure that your audience hears around this is when we approach something with curiosity. And we notice it, if we turn around on the other side of that, and judge it and make meaning that must mean I am such and such kind of parent, that must mean I'm blah, blah, blah, we have removed our own visibility, our own awareness into what we need to see in order to shift and change it. The second week, judges, we closed the door on what we noticed. So it's very, very important to use the data analogy, it is information, it is awareness, it is what we need to know, in order to be in a different way. And


what I want to just highlight here, too, is again, this work. While yes, it's about you, it's also about the kids in your worlds, who are developing their own sense of self, their own sense of self concept, their self identity, developing their self efficacy in different contexts. And when they see the adults in their lives consistently, I mean, this is I could cry, just talking about this, you know, consistently looking at their actions as data so they can learn and be better. That example, is so much stronger than any social emotional learning video, you can stick up on YouTube. I mean, like, that's the stuff that just drives me crazy. Like, that's not it, that is missing the mark. This work that we're talking about right now serves such a greater purpose that goes beyond you, it goes into the people that you interact with, especially the kids. So I know that you do work with a lot of women, you work with a lot of moms, a lot of people who have children in their lives. Can you talk a little bit about the impact that this work has, as that ripple effects?


I absolutely can and would likely go on for days if you let me. So as you mentioned, I do primarily work with women, but I have all boys, all sons, right. And I grew up with all boys in my house. So when we talk about this is the goes into the drip effect situation that I talked about earlier, when we talk about the children, we'll just say the children the next generations, right, whether they are hours or hours in our classroom, or hours, whatever. Being a highly conscious expander for them, is the way we don't really recognize or understand and this is in large part because of of where we come from. It's the it's the historical ways of being that has taught us that things like Do as I say, not as I do, right? That's one of the things that will send my my rooftop ablaze, right? It's very frustrating here, but it's okay because it comes from where we come from. And it's our responsibility as adult humans in the consciousness revolution, to embody what it means to be highly conscious and non judgmental, and be the example that we want our children to then take for into the next generations beyond them. Change is not coming because of what we say and it's coming because of what we do. And whether you are being a highly conscious teacher or a highly conscious parent or a highly conscious therapists or fill in the blank, if what we want our children to do is learn how to optimize their own trajectory through this human experience and how they experience it internally and externally, then we need to model what that looks like. In the end, what that looks like is choosing to continuously do this inner work and raise our own consciousness level and elevate our self awareness and become the example of what it means to be highly conscious. I could go on about this for days, I'm going to stop there. So we can like put a pin in this and you can ask a question if you want. But I could talk about highly conscious XYZ thing for the rest of this podcast and whatever else is left in your episode dark.


Yes, and that sounds wonderful. And I think maybe we do need to continue this conversation. But I want to clarify something because I know what this means. And you know what this means. But I want to make sure that everybody listening knows what this means. What does highly conscious mean? What does living consciously mean?


highly conscious, I'll take it in the direction of highly conscious parenting is blind by to talk about most. And so as I'll use that as an example of how to explain what it really means highly conscious parenting, for example, means recognising the importance of self regulating and self growing and self expanding, in order to impact an effect outside of you beyond you, you are the cause of the effect you are the drip, you are the expander everything flows from you, and to be someone who is highly conscious, whether it's parent or teacher or whoever means that you recognize the distinct difference in what it means to tell something versus do something. And that you recognize that while we all have separate trajectories and paths, that there's still a connectedness, that means what we do is what matters most not only to our own experience, but to the experience of literally everyone and everything around us, it is a higher level way of thinking about where we contribute and how we contribute, are we contributing to the increase in enlightenment and consciousness and things like that? are we contributing in the opposite direction, being so self aware that you can make new choices for your own self, that you become someone who is inherently aware that what you do ripples out from you. So it is about making sure that you choose to demonstrate what it means to do what we have all been sent here to do in this human experience, which is heal, grow and expand for not only the benefit of our own soul and our own souls divine journey, but that of the other humans who are here sharing this experience with us?


And correct me if I'm wrong, but this is what you mean, when you say that you


have all of the power, you always have 1,000% Absolutely, absolutely, absolutely. Everything flows from us everything. And that's a big responsibility. It is a big responsibility. And therefore I'm sure I'm triggering all the people who are like, Okay, well, I thought that I wanted to be highly conscious, I thought that I wanted to do this work, right. But this isn't, it's important to like the where we went in the beginning of this conversation, like come becoming aware and understanding things like desire and one freedom and how big of a responsibility that feels like so as the same with highly conscious anything. But here's the cool thing, when we just co regulate everyone who might be listening, here's the cool thing, when you lean in to what it really means to be highly conscious and do the work and become more highly conscious, you begin to open up the spaces and around things like freedom and wants and desires. And that becomes a lot less big and a lot less scary. the more open you become as a highly conscious person. So you're going to choose one thing to go after and become super self aware about. Let's go for highly consciousness, highly consciousness, high consciousness.


I think either those work yeah, because that's it, you either are there or you're not. And that big responsibility, I think at first can feel heavy, but as someone who has done the work herself, and the people that I surround myself with and empowered educator touches on these things like this is highly conscious education. This is about making informed choices and being self aware and understanding you self regulation and knowing this higher purpose that you have all of this is connected. That is where the freedom is. Sometimes this false sense of freedom because it feels comfortable. But if we really sit with that, we can see where our limitations are until we start to open this door. And we realize those limitations are always self imposed and As we get curious as to what's beyond them, and what a beautiful example to set for that next generation.


Yes, absolutely. And I love the way you said that because it opens curiosity further, we get more serious about how good can it get? How much can I actually expand become from this very, very, very myopic set of paradigms and conditioning in the world and our upbringing, but the truth is, is that because everything flows from you, when you are becoming a highly conscious, XYZ are everything from that lens, everything really, truly is available to you, right? Because if you correlate that everything flows from me, great, then I get to choose literally anything and everything that I want, and I can then from me, create it. It's an incredible journey to be on. And freedom takes on a whole new meaning. It's not as scary things like freedom. So yeah,


so to bring it back to that example of that task oriented day, in this right now, if we kind of peel the layers a little bit, and we start to look at that same day, through the lens of a higher consciousness, what can that look like? And it could really look like anything, there's no reason why it didn't say, what does that look like? What can that look like? Because it looks like something different for everybody? But what can that look like from a higher conscious perspective?


Yeah, well, the general answer to that is it can look like like abundance, there's an abundance of time, there's an abundance of minutes in between everything, there's an A, but you know, it can look like that it can. But really, ultimately, what it comes down to is it can look like choice all over the place. That's one of the things that we lose inside of a task oriented day in the way that you described it, right. So in that description, we don't, we are not at choice, anywhere in that we are at the effect of, and when you're at the effect of including a day, or, or a set of tasks, you are living through victimhood energy unintentionally. And that is a very low level of consciousness. And so when we look at how it can be becoming more aware and approaching it through a higher level of consciousness, the very first thing we gain is choice, we gain our choice back, we gain our ability to choose to delegate to choose to take things off the plate to choose to slide in moments of breathing or meditation in between things that would shock you as to how much time you would feel like you gained if you actually took away the time from the task oriented list and used it for breathing or meditation. Instead, when we gain our choice back and we are approaching things like that from a higher consciousness, everything expands because we expand. So the time doesn't feel the same way. The tasks don't feel the same way. Be minutes in between don't feel the same way. Because we are not feeling the same way. So that's for me, the most significant shift in looking at something like that task oriented day through the lens of higher consciousness is the ability to regain your agency over choice that changes everything.


Yeah, agency is everything. And that's really also one of the fundamental things about being empowered. You know, it doesn't feel very empowering, when you are feeling victim to your day. And seeing it through the lens of where in this day, do I have agency or were in this day, can I reclaim my agency that in and of itself is a game changer and your right can certainly have a huge impact on what your day feels like, which ultimately, is the entire goal is how you are feeling?


Yes, 100%. And when you do that, the way that everything else around you is experienced by you and because of you changes so we when we talk about like teachers in the classroom, for example, or parents who have a massive task list, or a combination of both. Let's take the teacher parent with a massive task list. In that scenario, the options that you have things like stopping every hour, and taking a breathing break with either your classroom kids or your children, or before you go into the grocery store with your kids. We're going to sit and we're going to regulate for a second we're going to make sure that we walk in there feeling how we want to feel not feeling how we feel because of everything else that's happened today. Right? So yeah, the point is to do everything Feeling exactly how you want to feel. And that is something that people, I think, really underestimate. People really underestimate the fact that not only is that important, but it's 100% possible, you can become someone who chooses how you move through your day, feeling how you want to feel. And the result of that is you're teaching the people around you, that the same as possible. So when we do this work, when we prioritize these things, when we expand, it changes everything that comes behind us, in our wake. And that just gives me goosebumps.


Yeah, same. And that, again, just reinforces that you have all the power, always, all the time. I love that you keep saying that. It's so so true, you do have all of it. Maybe I'm saying it, because I also need to hear it today. Moments of vulnerability there, you know, and I think that's important. I wanted to share, you know, in that moment, I suppose, because this work is never done. These are practices that you and I practice every day ourselves. Because every time we reach a ceiling, it then becomes our floor. And the process starts all over again. And I think this is one of the most beautiful pieces about being human is this work. And I'm grateful that I found it. I'm grateful that you are here as part of my world and all of this too. And I'm grateful for the folks who are totally on board being like, yes, yes, this is really the way we change everything.


Yes, I received that and saying, watching you do this in this area of the world is when I think about it, it makes me emotionally happy. Because the access that educators have to the little humans who are going to be coming after us and living in the aftermath of the consciousness revolution. Like this is the time, this is the time for everyone who has access to little humans to become what it like what they want to see for those humans, you know that to to model to expand to start that ripple and make it louder and make it bigger. So yeah, 100% Yeah.


Which leads me of course, to the question I asked everybody. What is your dream? I know, I get all choked up to you. I mean, this is the stuff that fuels me to what is it? What is your dream for the future of education?


Oh, boy, that more amazing humans like you, and those who you serve, will choose to do their own inner work. So they become a highly conscious drip source for every student everywhere every day, because that, how we send the ripple effect deep enough to really see it return a massive wave in the consciousness revolution.


Yes. And I know, personally, I have already seen it with my own children. I know you've seen it with your children. I've seen it through the stories that my clients talk to me about with their children, and not just their students, their students also, but their children, too. They're watching us very closely. And if we're going to live this life and leave it better than how we had it, this is really, this is the good stuff. This is the way. Yes, manda thank you so much for your time, and your gorgeous talents. This has been spectacular. Thank you for having me. It's been a blast. So if there are people who want to know more about you and your work, or how to get in touch with some of these new ways of experiencing this journey, how can we


do that? The spaces and places that I'm in most is through belief factor, which you know, because that's where we hang out. So that's the easiest, best, most relevant place that you can get in contact with me that is where I am doing this work on a daily basis, living and breathing it into every single human who comes across my path. And it is the coolest way to become what it is that we've been talking about today, in my personal opinion. So yeah, get in touch with me go to lift factor.com That's where you can find all of


us. Amazing. And yeah, I will put all of those links obviously in the show notes too. And yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes to all of it. So thank you again, thank you everyone for listening today. If you enjoyed today's episode, be sure to leave a nice written review and we will see you next time on take notes. Incredible, right? Together, we can revolutionize the face of education. It's all possible. And it's all here for you right now. Let's keep the conversation going and empowered educator faculty room on Facebook.

Going through a divorce can be one of the most emotionally draining experiences a person can go through.
It's filled with a range of emotions such as anger, resentment, grief, and regret. The demands of managing these emotions can often feel overwhelming, making it difficult to manage everyday tasks and obligations- like showing up for your students.
But, with the right guidance and tools, it’s possible to take back control of the situation and move towards a more peaceful future.
Welcome to episode 21 of the Take Notes with Jen Rafferty podcast! In this episode, I’m speaking with juris doctorate, certified divorce coach, and a certified Mind Magic practitioner, Sharri Freedman.
She helps people manage the difficult emotions of dealing with divorce.Through her work, she provides clients with tools that create a sense of peace and calm that regulate the nervous system so they can transition from simply reacting to the situation to being able to respond in a more constructive way.
Divorce stress is real, and it's all encompassing. It’s not about “just showing up”, whether it's by distraction or compartmentalizing. Because, pushing through and keeping it together is not what we do here.
Today, it’s all about highlighting the real feeling of loss associated with divorce in a way that normalizes the grief you feel with the same space and mass as the loss of a life.
And, most importantly, to let you know that you are not alone.
Stay empowered,

Jen


Let’s keep the conversation going! Find me at:

Click here to learn all the ways you can work with me:
 Jen Rafferty | Instagram, YouTube, Facebook | Linktree
Instagram: @jenrafferty_
Facebook: Empowered Educator Faculty Room


About Sharri:

Sharri Freedman, JD, CDC, CMMMP is a family law attorney with almost 30 years experience as a divorce professional now practicing exclusively as a divorce, co-parenting and relationship coach. Using a trauma informed lens, she combines her legal wisdom with mindset and somatic practices to help women ditch the drama and do divorce differently. Sharri helps clients strategize the next best steps, improve communication and begin to heal, before, during and after divorce.


Connect with Sharri here:

Website: potomaccoaching.com
Email: Sharri@potomaccoaching.com
Instagram: @yourdivorcecoach



Referenced in this episode:

The Choice: Escaping the Past and Embracing the Possible, by Dr. Edith Eva Eger

TRANSCRIPT: 
Going through a divorce sucks. And the amount of emotional energy required can often feel debilitating, everyday stuff can start to feel extra challenging because the baseline is a rocky Foundation. And teaching and going through a divorce requires navigating the anger and regret, resentment and grief that comes along with it on top of finding a way to show up for the kids in front of you. Now, for those of you who have been hanging with me for a while, you know that pushing through and keeping it together is not what we do here.


Which is why I invited Sharri Freedman here today. And she is a divorce coach, and helps people ditch the drama and do divorce differently by giving people the tools to manage their emotions, and get out of the constant feeling of activation to get into a place of peace and calm, which yes, is very possible. So if you are thinking about divorce or going through a divorce, maybe you've gone through a divorce or even if you are supporting a friend who is going through it, you're going to want to listen up and take notes on this episode, Sherry brings a wealth of knowledge and experience that will pave the way for a new perspective and going through this very trying time. And if you're feeling burned out, make sure to download my free resource 10 ways to beat the burnout for strategies that you can start today. So go to empowered educator.com/resources.


Remember all the passion and vision you had when you first went into teaching. Feeling like building young minds and creating community through your work would make a lasting impact on this world? Well, those days may feel like they're behind you now because you're exhausted, stressed and overwhelmed and frustrated. But I'm here to tell you it doesn't have to be like this. In fact, the love of teaching never really went away. But it absolutely needs transformation. Welcome to The Take notes Podcast. I'm Jen Rafferty, former music teacher, mom of two, and certified emotional intelligence practitioner, and I'm here to light the way for you. In order to create a generational change for our kids, we need to shift the paradigm away from the perpetual stress and overwhelm and into a life of joy, and fulfillment. This is education 2.0, where you become the priority, shift how you live your life, and how you show up both at work, and at home. So take a sip of steamy morning coffee, and grab your notebook. It's time to take notes.


Hello, everyone. And welcome back to another fantastic episode of take notes. I'm really excited to share this conversation with you today because this is something that is near and dear to my heart and something that we don't often talk about. So I am here with the incredible Sherry Friedman, who is a juris doctorate, a certified divorce coach and a certified mind magic practitioner.


And she is a family law attorney with almost 30 years of experience as a divorce professional now practicing exclusively as a divorce co parenting and relationship coach. And she uses a trauma informed lens to combine her legal wisdom with mindset and somatic practices to help women ditch the drama and do divorce differently. And Sherry helps clients strategize the next best steps to improve communication and begin to heal before, during and after divorce. So Sharri, thank you so much for being here. Thank you so much for having me here. I'm really excited to dive in to this conversation because there is a lot of stress, shame, judgment around divorce and being in a professional setting, especially around kids.


There is always this feeling of just showing up. You have to just show up whether it's by distraction or maybe compartmentalizing, but there's all of this underlying stuff that happens when you're going through a divorce that makes doing the everyday stuff really difficult. So I'm really excited to dive into that today. So just thank you. Thank you again for being here. I want to go first before we even dive into that stuff. Why divorce coaching? Why is this something that you were interested in? So as you mentioned, I have been a divorce professional for almost 30 years. It's crazy, right? I practice family law for over 17 years.


I'm trained in mediation, I'm changing the collaborative practice. But there was a point in my life several years ago where I was kind of at a crossroads I had been working part time I was taking took a step back from actively practicing and I was figuring out what to do next. As I was my children were getting older and I was getting ready to re enter into the world of working full time and I discovered divorce coaching and when I became certified as a divorce


As coach, I realized this is the missing piece for pretty much everybody who is going through divorce and beyond divorce, and even thinking about divorce. Because if you are not able to manage your emotions, if you're not able to regulate your nervous system, if you're not able to sort of step back, you're constantly being activated, you're constantly reacting instead of responding. And you will never have that sense of peace and calm. That is possible when you have the right tools in your toolbox. So peace and calm and divorce.


In the same sentence, still actually do something physically to my body, you know, and I am somebody who has gone through divorce, I've gone through the mediation process, you know, this is something that I consistently work on. But can you talk a little bit more about that missing piece, as you explained and how you can even think about peace and calm in a time that is so chaotic and emotionally driven, I would argue that it is essential to be able to find that neutral, write that peace and calm.


Because if you aren't able to get there, like I had mentioned before, you're constantly reacting. And so when you have to interact with your student to be x, or your co parent, and someone that you really don't like very much, or someone who activates you triggers you constantly, if you're not able to get to that place of calm, you carry that activation that trigger with you, wherever you go. So while you're parenting your own children, when you show up at work, if you open up your email, and you notice an email from your send to be x or your co parent, and you automatically go into like, oh my god, what does he want now? Or you get a text write a text message, and you try to ignore it. And you get another one and another one and another one. And your whole system is just like oh my god, like why can you just leave me alone on that work? Doesn't he realize I'm at work.


So disrespectful, he doesn't respect my boundaries, all the things and here you are spiraling, spiraling, spiraling, spiraling down the rabbit hole. But when you're able to recognize, oh, nothing has meaning until I give it meaning. And oh, I don't have to respond to that unless it's truly an emergency, which most of the time it's not. So being able to step back and say, I don't have to open that email. I don't have to respond to that text is huge, especially when you have to show up and be teaching or co parenting your own children. Right? If you're constantly in that state of chaos and anxiety, you're not showing up as your best.


Yeah, completely. And I'm being very aware of my own body as we're having these conversations, which is so interesting, because even as someone who is far out and have been doing all this work, this is a practice, right, this doesn't ever go away. And I just want to highlight that too, that this is something that is a continuous part of your life. Because like you said, it's so easy to get triggered, and activated, even when we're having these peripheral conversations about it. Right. So I want to go back, there's two things that you said that I would love for you to talk about a little bit more at first is neutrality.


And can you explain a little bit what you mean, when you say that nothing has meaning unless you give it meaning? And how do we get to a place of neutrality because again, this is so emotionally driven, right? And there's there's so much backstory and narrative that comes along that with every interaction, it just brings up this wave of all of it all of the time. So how do we even get to a point where we can say, Okay, this thing has happened, and I am neutral about it. What does that look like? And how do we get there. So like you said, it is a practice, and it is ongoing. And I'm so glad that you brought up the fact that you're far out like you're several years out from your divorce, but yet you're still doing the work and you're still get activated.


And this is why working with a coach post-divorce is as important if not more important than actually while you're going through the process. So there's a lot of value in working with a coach while you're going through the process. But there's also a benefit to working with a coach, even if you're already years past divorce, because it is a practice. All right, I kind of got off track and yeah, I was asking you about neutrality. And so you know, it's even as someone who has been doing all of this work for so long, keeping that neutrality and not putting meaning on it is challenging. So I'd love to know, what does that neutrality look like and how do we even get there? So it's being aware. Noticing, right noticing, oh, that email came in and I odd


manically went down the rabbit hole, and then not beating yourself up about it, just being aware and then putting into place the tools that you will have in your toolbox to say, Okay, what do I want to do about it now, if I don't have to give that meaning because truly nothing has meaning until you give it meaning. So when you come into it with your biases, your backstory, your narratives, you give it all this meaning when in fact, it may mean something totally different. And so it's just not easy.


But you can choose to just let it be neutral, have no meaning. Because when you don't assign it, meaning, that's how you can remain neutral, when you start to give it that backstory, the biases, the narratives, your old default emotional triggers, right? When you bring all that in, that's when you give it all that meaning. And that's when you get pulled away from your focus, which if you're working, your focus is on your work and your students. And when you get activated and triggered, you get your focus gets pulled away. Yeah. And I think the thing that you said that hit the hardest for me was the choice, it's a choice.


And we forget, right? We give away our power so easily because we were overcome by emotion and the story, that the idea that you can choose how you want to respond to any situation seems so far gone. And that moments because you're so activated, so I think you're spot on with getting in touch with yourself noticing the activation, so you can come from a place of conscious choices, and take back your agency. And so you know, the other thing to that which what you said before that I want to ask for a follow up about is when he said you know, you don't have to respond. And I think there seems to be this urgency, right? So something happens, and then you want to just take care of it right away. But even in that time, then it seems like you're giving away your agency there too, because you don't realize you actually don't have to.


So I imagine this kind of falls under the category of like boundaries or something it's you know, so can you talk a little bit more about how you can create some of those things when you get that text message, or you get that phone call, or you have an interaction where you have a moment where you get to say, Do I need to respond to this right now or at all? Yeah, absolutely. And this is something that again, takes practice, and that I do a lot of work with my clients on just recognizing you have a choice, do I respond right away? Or do I put it aside and come back to it later, because unless it is truly an emergency, it doesn't need to be responded to.


And in fact, when you give yourself that pause, it allows you to respond instead of react. If you respond right away, you're reacting, you're reacting on what you're reading, you're reacting from emotion. And it usually doesn't go the way that you would want it to go in, you're responding. If you're trying to get a certain point across or you want your son to be x or your co parent to do something and you're responding in a reactionary way. It's also filled with emotion, and it's likely to trigger and activate them. But when you're able to step back, and either not respond at all, not even read it right away. Or if you read it and you're like, I just felt that like you said, you know, when I was talking about it, you just felt it in your body, you feel it, you're able to say okay, I'm not going to respond to this right now. And I'm going to come back and read it at a later time.


And then even if you're still activated when you read it at a later time, what I suggest is writing the response, not sending it sitting on it for at least 24 hours. And then going back to it again. And I work a lot with clients on a method called this B I S F which was created by Bill Eddie, who is the high conflict guru I studied under him I trained under him for his high conflict for coaches. And the F stands for brief, informative, firm, friendly. So all correspondence with your co parent or your soon to be x, it should fall under that category. Right? Is it brief? Is it informative? Is it firm? Is it friendly? And then there's three A's that you look for as well. Am I giving advice and my admonishing and where am I apologizing because those three A's will also create activation or trigger in an especially high conflict situation. So if you are assumed to be extra co parent is a high conflict personality. Those are the things you want to try to avoid when you're corresponding via email.


I wish I knew those things.


You know, my divorce happened during COVID. So even besides the fact that we don't talk about this, this is not generally something that you want to share all the time.


I'm and for me, I'm a highly compartmentalized person. So work is work and my emotions are something that I'm dealing with at home is over here, and this is over here, and I'm getting better at weaving those things. But on top of that, there was the isolation to have the pandemic while I was going through this thing. And I didn't even know these tools were out there, right? These are things that are available, that when we're so in it, we can't really see pastor knows. Right salutely That's one of the things that when you're so in it, and you can't see, like you said, past your nose, it's like you're in the basement, you're in this dark basement, and you can just see like, what's right in front of you. And so when you're able to, and this goes back to getting to neutrality, when you're able to so it's dark in that basement, right? No windows, no hope.


That's where all your low level energy lies, your fear, your frustration, your anger, your shame, your blame, your embarrassment, all of that, right that within that dark basement. But when you're able to come up to the ground floor, where there's a little bit of light, a little bit of hope. It's still it's peaceful, it's neutral. And that's where I try to get teach clients how to get there. Because sometimes we want to go all the way up to the rooftop, where we have 360 degree view, and there's perspective, and there's light, and there's hope. And there's all of the wonderful, beautiful feelings that we feel.


Sometimes we just need to get to the ground floor. And that's where that neutrality is, Hmm, yes, that resonates completely. And so when you are having to do work, being a parent, going through divorce, juggling all of these things, while dealing with a very significant traumatic and life changing event, what are some of the things that you suggest, I'm even hesitant to use the word self care, because when people said that, to me, when I was going through this, I just wanted to punch him in the face.

So I don't want to call it self care. But this is, I think, a better way to describe it. How do you make yourself the priority, so you can show up as the person you want to be in all of those spaces. So my suggestion would be to allow yourself to feel what you need to feel and not try to push it away. Not try to say I need to put on a brave face, it's weak to feel sad or angry or frustrated. giving yourself the space to feel your feelings to maybe not punch someone in the face, but maybe punch a pillow, right?


Or maybe do a little screaming, scream release. And there's proper ways to do that. And working with a coach or even a therapist right will help you with the proper ways to do this. There's a rage room, which I know you're familiar with rage room love the rage. And I think it is genius for people going through divorce, especially if you're feeling a lot of those feelings of anger and rage and hate to go to a rage room and just release it because once it's released, right, there's this heavy weight lifted off of you.


So those are in in and of itself, forms of self care. Yes, you know, you can take bubble baths, and you can take walks and drink water and exercise all really important when you're going through divorce. But also finding ways to release the emotion and not beating yourself up. If you are feeling sad, if you are crying, if you go home, and you're just like curled up in a ball sobbing, and you know, want to eat a pint of ice cream, and then allowing yourself permission to do that. As long as you don't get stuck there. As long as that doesn't become your go to. And you're only right, that's where you live, you don't want to live in those feelings.


But we want to be able to release those feelings so that we can move up to the ground floor to the neutrality and then eventually all the way up to the rooftop. Yes to all of that. And the thing that comes up for me and then I've heard from other people going through divorce going through loss, you know, several other areas of kind of this can relate to, it's when you open up the door to the feeling and the crying if you have not been a person who has done that in the past, there is this fear that okay, I don't know what's on the other side of the door.


 And so if I open the door, then I start crying in the middle class, I start crying to my colleagues, you know, when someone asks, How are you doing, then the tears just start to come? How do you navigate that in relation to wanting to release but wanting to do it appropriately in a way that makes it feel safe? Sure. So one thing would be that if you do allow yourself to release in a private space, it lessens the feelings of release when you are in a public space, like in front of your classroom or with your co workers.


but not always, because this is an emotional time. And divorce is painful. And Pain is inevitable. But suffering is optional. And so when you think of it that way, can you just repeat that for the back? That was? See, I want to just want to date on that for a second. Yeah, absolutely. Divorce is painful. Pain is inevitable. Suffering is optional. Yes. And what I mean by that is suffering is when you allow yourself to bathe in and wallow in and cover yourself in the pain. But when you allow yourself to feel it, because it is a grief process, divorce is a death. It's a death of your marriage. It's a death of the life that you envisioned.


Even if you're the one who's initiating the divorce, it's still a loss. If you have young children, you no longer are with them. 100% of the time, that's a loss. Friends that you thought were friends might no longer be your friends. That's a loss. Family members who are your inlaws may no longer spend time with you. That's a loss. There's so much loss associated with divorce, not just the dissolution of the marriage and the loss of your partner, but so many other pieces. And so it's important to understand that and to allow yourself and give yourself the space to grieve not only while you're going through the process, but also after because what I have found is that people will say, Well, I've already grieved I've already cried, I've cried, I can't cry anymore.


And then a year later, they might say, Oh, my God, I can't believe why am I feeling like I'm grieving all over again. And it's because they cried, but they were releasing, but it wasn't in the context of all of the loss that was yet to come. That makes sense. Oh, yeah. And so there's, you know, mourning is a huge part of this. And again, at least going back to my experience, there was mourning for that. But at the same time, it was literally the same weekend that the world shut down. So then the morning of the life that I had the day before the job that had standing in front of all of my kids in a choir situation directing that and homeschooling all of a sudden, so the tremendous losses that happened, we don't look at those losses generated as a society as sort of having the same weight as an actual death.


And I think this is maybe one of the reasons why I wanted to have this conversation on this podcast to to highlight this loss in a way that normalizes grief, of divorce, with the same space and mass as the loss of a life. Because we don't treat them the same way. And it's why do they feel the same? Absolutely. And it's arguably, more difficult because when you have a loss of a life, people come around you, right? Food is brought, flowers are sensed, people want to help you people want to spend time with you, to help you through the mourning process. When you go through divorce, it tends to be the opposite. People run away.


People don't want to be associated because of fear that maybe their marriage isn't as strong as they thought it was, or whatever the thought process may be. But you tend to be alone and feel very lonely. And that is something that I agree with you there needs to be a shift a change as to how society perceives divorce. And one of the things that you mentioned earlier that made me think about failure, and how people think of divorce as a failure. And it's embarrassing, and there's a lot of shame around it.


But there doesn't need to be because it's not a failure. Yes, your marriage may have failed, but you are not a failure. And what I have found and why I am so passionate about the work that I do is that the people that come to me, their self esteem is in the toilet when they're going through divorce. And it's so important to understand that regardless of what happened in your marriage, whether you were the one who initiated it, whether your spouse is the one who initiated it, you are enough. You have always been enough.


And divorce doesn't change that. Yeah, that is very powerful. And an important lesson to learn through that because it's not always easy to find it through. It's not. And that's why it's what became very apparent to me is that the people who I have worked with, it doesn't matter whether they are super successful entrepreneurs or business people or whether they were a stay at home mom, everyone who comes to me, feels less than you


feels like they are not deserving. Feels like they are no longer worthy. And that breaks my heart. Because these are beautiful, smart, loving people who deserve and are deserving of everything they want, and everything that they dream about. And yet they feel as though they no longer are worthy of wanting those things. Yes. And that I think, brings me to this self forgiveness piece. Right? Can we talk about that a little bit? Because that has been an ongoing process for me as well. Because even after the initial, okay, younger Gen, you made decisions based on the information you had, and the best decisions you could have made at that time.


And the reason I'm here right now, in this moment, and context and time and space is because younger Gen made those decisions and whether or not they always felt good, is kind of besides the point, right. But there had to be an active dialogue that went on between me and my younger self regarding that forgiveness piece that even with all the work still comes up to this day. So how do you walk through your clients through that process so they can forgive and then understand that they are worthy of everything they want? So first, they have to be open to even the notion of self forgiveness.


Not everybody is and not everybody's ready. So you actually Yeah, can I pause you right here for a second too, because this came up something too. I thought for a long time, I had to forgive my acts. That was something that was really I was like, I'm angry, I'm resentful. And I thought I was resentful at him. But it was really actually about younger versions of me. So I think being open to doing something like that you're right is really important asking those questions, because otherwise the doors shut. Right, exactly. And you're right. A lot of people think, well, I could never forgive. And forgiveness isn't about the other person has zero to do with your axe. Zero. Yes, you know, there are benefits to forgiving that person, if you can get yourself there.


But really, the forgiveness has nothing to do with them. It's all about you. Because when you carry around that bitterness, that resentment, that anger, that hatred, it doesn't hurt them at all, but it's killing you. Yep. It's that quote about drinking poison and expecting the other person to die. Yeah, you're feeling yourself it's digger a long time ago, right? We're thinking like, damn, they read me big time. Yeah. Because the stories that you're telling yourself those narratives, and if you're not willing and able to let go of them, you're going to remain that anger, bitter person. And if that's not who you want to be, then something has to change. Because you can't continue to tell yourself the same stories and expect yourself to change. It's impossible.


So we have to figure out a way to rewire to rethink to formulate new beliefs, so that you can begin to heal and you can begin to change. Yes, I want to go back to something that you had said earlier, too, about, you know, changing our societal view about this last two, because I think because of a lot of these pressures, it makes things like self forgiveness difficult, because then we have to look in a mirror of something that's not necessarily looked highly upon when people around us and one of the things that prevented me from feeling comfortable and open to sharing my stories that people say really stupid things.


And like, I'm not interested in hearing your opinion, or judgment or advice, necessarily. And so we don't talk about it. And I think that's one of the things that keeps us quiet is because we just don't want to have conversation and interact with someone who's not actually giving us what we need. In fact, they're giving us more of what we don't need. So how do we navigate that? And if you are someone on the outside, how can you interact with someone who's going through a divorce that is helpful and productive?


Okay, so going to how do you if you are going through divorce, how do you interact with people who are not providing you with the support that you want, or are sharing views that maybe you don't agree with? And one of the things that it's really important to understand, but not always easy to understand is what other people think is none of my business. And when you can really lean into that. It won't matter if other people are judging you, or what other people are thinking about your situation. It will matter because truly it doesn't matter what other people think about you and your divorce and your marriage and how your co parent


Doing and the agreements that you're making, the choices that you're making, the only person that it matters to is you and your children and the family that you have now together, which is, you're no longer a family and one home, you're a family and two homes. And this is if you're if you have young children, but even if your children are grown and Slone or if you've never had children, being able to hold on to what other people think of me, or my situation is none of my business will allow you to rise above whatever it is they're saying.


The other piece that I also wanted to mention is when you start to get into Oh, my God, I can't believe they said that, or why can't they understand my viewpoint? Or I don't understand why they don't understand my viewpoint. Recognize think that you're judging their judgment. And getting really curious maybe about well, isn't it interesting that they said XY and Z, A, B, and C? I wonder why that is. And perhaps it's because whatever it is, like they're coming in at it with their own baggage, their own trauma, we don't know what goes on behind closed doors. So understanding and being able to go oh, okay, right, I get it, their parents divorced, or they're flailing in their own marriage, and this is their way of reassuring themselves that it's not going to happen to me, has nothing to do with you. Yeah, so that's huge. And that takes a lot of practice, right? It's like, I think of those moments in the work that we do in our own arenas. And we're like training for these moments, right?


As if we're going to like this mental emotional gym. And we're training and training. So when that interaction comes, you actually get to be in a place of what I'm going to take it back to what you said at the beginning of neutrality of totally being unaffected by what another person responds with when you're sharing your story. That takes a lot of practice. It does. And you're right. It is like a mental gym, I think you said it is that it's like when you go to the gym, and you lift weights, to tone your muscles, and you get toned and then you stop lifting. And then you're wondering, Well, where did my muscles go, right? It's the same thing. You do the work, you do the work, you do the work, and then you're like, I'm good.


And then you stop. And three months later, you're like, holy crap, why am I back in the basement, down the rabbit hole, it's because you have to constantly be working the mindset muscles, and the rewiring of your beliefs and your thoughts. Because your old default programming is so strong. And it's so easy to slip back into those old patterns, those old beliefs because those old patterns and old beliefs were planted in your subconscious at a very early age. And so they've been there a really long time. And this new work, this new thought process, this new way of being and thinking and doing is in infancy, basically.


Right, compared to all of that programming that goes back to when you were a child. Does that make sense? Oh, yeah, it absolutely makes sense. Yes. So constantly working the work, and also taking responsibility for how you show up. That's a big piece of this also. And that can be confronting in of itself. And I'm glad you brought that up. Because taking personal responsibility for your choices. And recognizing that every single thing is a choice, even the divorce itself. And a lot of people say well, how can that even be like, I didn't want this divorce, this is not a choice, like I have no option.


And I would argue, while you may not have an option with regard to the divorce, because the laws allow people to get divorced, even if only one of the parties wants it. But you do have a choice as to how you're going to show up how you're going to approach that the divorce. That's where you have the choice. That's where choice can be made. Because when you say this wasn't my choice, you become the victim, you put yourself in victimhood, and you're powerless. And so when you can get to a place where you're able to say, okay, maybe I didn't want this, but there are options and choices that I get to make now.


And you choose them with information and thought around what your choice is going to be and then you decide and you take personal responsibility for that choice. All the power comes back to you. Yeah, it's so important to recognize that, you know, at every step of the divorce process and beyond, every single thing is a choice. There is nothing where you have no options. Now the choices may not be good, right? It may be choice A which sucks and choice B which is even worse, but you still have a choice. When you say I don't like either one. So I'm just going to do nothing. And the choice gets made for you. That's where you become the victim again. Yes, and


then this, of course reminds me of the book The choice which have you read that one? I haven't. But it is on my list. I know I need to read it out. It is a life changing book. I will put that in the show notes as well by Dr. Edith Eger, who is a Holocaust survivor and just brilliant woman. But that's that's exactly what she talks about is everything being a choice, and finding your power. And that is how we get through and survive. So I want to bring it back. Before I ask you the last question about if you are a person on kind of on the periphery, and you're watching someone go through divorce, you know, how can you show up and do something supportive instead of putting your foot in your mouth? So first, recognizing that you might put your foot in your mouth, and just being open to saying, I don't really know what to say in this moment.


But I just want you to know that I'm here for you. What do you need? I think that goes a long way to just say I'm here for you. What do you need, rather than assuming or presuming, I think that could be really helpful. Also, if you do know, if you're close enough to the person to just show up and be there, be there for your friend or your sister or your mother or brother, right? Your family member, like just be there for them and not judge them. So. So really get curious about your own judgments like oh, right, am I judging the marriage and the fact that they're getting divorced? And can I get curious about it? And be like, Oh, isn't it interesting? And I wonder what they were thinking or feeling? And how can you come at it from a place of compassion, as opposed to a place of like, like, I can't believe you, whatever it is that you can't believe, right? That you're breaking your family apart? Or what? Like all the things right, and I'm sure you've heard, like, I can't believe you're breaking your family apart, or it wasn't that bad, right? There. no broken bones, he didn't hit you, right. So there's a lot of shame and blame around that, too, because there are many marriages that fall apart.


And there really is no big like, Oh, my God, right, there was no infidelity, there was no domestic violence, but there might have been some emotional abuse going on. But there doesn't even have to beat that though, it could just be that you're just no longer compatible as lovers, you're no longer compatible as a team together in one house. It doesn't mean you can't be better as a team for your children, if you have children in two different households. And sometimes you're actually a better team, if you are in two separate households. Yeah. And you know, I chuckled there because it hits home. And it's interesting too, because again, like you said, it feels really lonely. And because we don't talk about it, it seems even more isolating.


Whereas if we were able to talk about it, there are so many people going through the exact same thing, which is what I really wanted to highlight this, because whether you're listening and you're going through it yourself, or you know, somebody who's going through it, you know, talking about it is going to change the way we interact with each other around this loss, and support each other and humanize it in a way that we can all grow and move forward together. Because you know, these, there are only so many themes, right? You're not alone. And this is sometimes part of the human experience, which is okay.


 It's what makes us human. Absolutely. So in regards to the conversation we've had, and how we want people to show up, especially in a place where interacting with colleagues, we have this work family, but also we're in front of kids all the time. I asked this question to everybody. And so I'm curious to know, through the lens of what we just talked about, you know, what is your dream for the future of education and how teachers can show up? I don't want to say despite what's going on at home, but as a complete person, right? This isn't about compartmentalize, well, this is home stuff. And this is work stuff, like leave your BS at the door. It doesn't work that way.


Wherever you go, there you are, how do we do that? What is the dream there for you? And I love how you said wherever we go, here we are, because it is so true, right? You are who you are, and you can't as much as you try to compartmentalize, right things are going to seep in wherever you are. And so when you ask me that question, I think that as an educator, if you are able to feel what you need to feel, believe in yourself, and believe that it's okay to feel your emotions, to have the tools to regulate your nervous system, like breathing, tapping, which we didn't really talk about, but these are all ways to, you know, regulate your nervous system. You can carry that with you into your classroom, because your students have also can gain insight and perspective from you. They're looking to you. And I want to give an example because it's something that I can relate more to as a


practitioner with individuals and their families. Many of my clients use the tools that I give them, the breathing, the tapping the regulating the nervous system, the being able to get to neutral with their children. And so your students may also be experiencing divorce, and they're home. And so if you are able to share tools for them to be able to regulate their nervous system to get to neutral, what a gift. And so many of my clients have come back to me and said, I shared this with my child who was really struggling and we breathe together, we've punched pillows together, we've done all these things, and it has helped with the transitions.


It's helped with that them to release their emotions about the divorce. This is such a gift, like this is my dream for people in divorce and families. And so it can translate to you as an educator in the classroom as well, for your students who may also be experiencing traumas at home. Divorce, trauma, separation, domestic violence, all the things. Yes, yes, yes to all of it. Yes. That's kind of the whole thing. That's why I do what I do. And that's why you do what you do. This is really how we make change.


That doesn't just affect us, but the generations after us. Absolutely. Remarkable. So I can't thank you enough for being here. Sherry, people want to know more about you and your work. How can they find you my website, which is Potomac, coaching.com or they can email me at Shari sh A R R i at Potomac, coaching.com. Fantastic. And all those links will be in the show notes as well. Thank you for this very important conversation. It was really great to talk with you today. Thank you.


If you enjoyed today's episode and know somebody who could benefit from it, please share it. And make sure you subscribe to take notes so you can get all of the new episodes downloaded right away as they come out. Stay well, everyone. We'll see you next time on take notes.


Incredible write. Together, we can revolutionize the face of education. It's all possible. And it's all here for you right now. Let's keep the conversation going and empowered educator faculty room on Facebook.

Have you ever felt lost and disconnected from self?

Do you wish you could tap into your inner power and trust your instincts again?

In today's society, there’s intense pressure to suppress your emotions and not show your true self, which can lead to burnout and disconnection from yourself and others.

But what if we could talk about our emotions? Not only in therapy, but in all aspects of our lives?

Welcome to episode 20 of the Take Notes with Jen Rafferty podcast! Today, I’m speaking with researcher, social worker and personal development coach based in Austin, Texas: Abi Mallick!

Abi’s journey into this field began as a public school teacher, where she taught bilingual kindergarten and first grade. Her passion for research led her to delve into the world of social work, where she worked with young people dealing with trauma and substance abuse.

Now she works with adults to replace unhealthy coping skills and improve relationships with themselves and others.

Today, Abi and I are discussing the research based self coaching tools she uses to help individuals and groups overcome self doubt and self sabotaging beliefs.

So, let’s empower ourselves and take control of our lives!

Because, we can only deepen our connections with the people around us (especially our students) when we are in tune with our gut feelings, authenticity, and humanity.

Stay empowered,

Jen


Let’s keep the conversation going! Find me at:

Click here to learn all the ways you can work with me:
 Jen Rafferty | Instagram, YouTube, Facebook | Linktree
Instagram: @jenrafferty_
Facebook: Empowered Educator Faculty Room


About Abi:

Abi Mallick (She/They) is a researcher, social worker and personal development coach in Austin, Texas. She teaches research-based self-coaching tools to individuals and groups, so that they can heal self-doubt and self-sabotaging beliefs.


Connect with Abi here:

Website: The Existential Coach
Instagram: @theexistentialcoach

TRANSCRIPT:  Do you trust yourself? I mean, really trust yourself. My guest today talked with me about how she believes we are all born with an incredible ability to connect to our instincts and intuition. But as we get older, we seem to unlearn that in her work, Abby Malick teaches people how to trust themselves again, so they realize that they have everything they need inside of them already. It's about learning the skills to have a better relationship with yourself.

And when we are more in tune with our gut feelings, we make a strong connection to our humanity. And of course, as a result, we get to model it for our students, and have deeper connections with the people around us.

So after the show, make sure you download your copy of my ebook 24 ways to find calm in your busy world, which is free for podcast listeners at empowered educator.com/ebook. And here you'll find 24 ways to feel more ease and more joy by noticing the things that are around you already all of the time that are usually out of sight. I found them all for you did all the work for you. And it is yours for free to download your copy today at empowered educator.com/ebook.


Hello, and welcome back to another fantastic episode of Take Notes. I have a very special guest with me today. She is a researcher, social worker and personal development coach in Austin, Texas. She teaches research based self coaching tools to individuals and groups so they can heal self doubt, and self sabotaging beliefs.

Abby Malik, welcome to Take Notes. Thank you so much for being here. Hi, Jen, I'm so excited to be here. I would love for you to share how you came into this work. Because some of the things that got me really excited about learning what you do in the world is teaching people how to self coach is really important. Because I think a lot of times we have this idea that we need to always depend on someone else to help us.

But we really have all the tools we need within ourselves and in coaching people to self coach themselves. You really empower people to do that. So I'd love to know how you came to even start this work in this journey in this world. Yeah, absolutely. A little background on me. I started out as a public school elementary teacher, I taught bilingual, kinder, and first grade here in Austin, Texas. But then I fell in love with research. And I moved into social work, where I was working with young people with trauma history and substance abuse. And I loved that job and trying to advocate for kids. Because unfortunately, a lot of treatment centers and schools and juvenile court systems are not functioning in a way that's in line with current research when it comes to helping our most vulnerable kids.


A lot of places are using old old methodologies for kids and teens from the 80s that have plenty of racism and classism showing. So I had to fight hard to say, hey, let's try a different treatment plan that's based on actual current data. And then eventually I got a master's of science and social work because I wanted to do more research. And I got really into happiness research and positive psychology and what is actually good for people and what are the ways that our current society functions that is not that great for human brains and how they actually work. So right now, I am still a researcher and also a personal development coach.


Now I'm working with adults on replacing unhealthy coping skills that no longer serve them and having better relationships with themselves and others. And as you said, a lot of that is through self coaching tools through learning these skills to say, Okay, here's this pattern that I have. Let me figure out how I developed that and why has it served me in the past, is it serving me now, then it's really fun, exciting concern about being seen as overly emotional work for just advocating for their needs. So there's a lot of pressure to not be emotional, and not kind of show your humanity at work. And that's really unhealthy for us in the long term. And it's part of what's leading to a lot of this burnout. Oh, I totally agree. It's interesting that you said that, because just yesterday I was doing a workshop and with teachers when we started getting to feelings, and one of them said, you know, I feel like I'm in therapy right now. And we kind of had a moment of isn't that interesting?


Because we have been taught that the only spaces that are appropriate to talk about our emotions are once a week, twice a week with a therapist, where here we are, in this space, trying to normalize our humanity, normalized talking about emotions, because that's part of how we exist in this world, that it is something to be celebrated and honored and is a strength that we have. Exactly, exactly. And that's also how you end up building relationships and building coalitions. And making big changes to the system is by sharing your emotions, sharing your struggles and your triumphs with other teachers and other people in the educational community so that you don't feel like you're isolated and you're this lone crazy person who's not able to do this impossible job of working in underfunded schools and advocating for yourself and advocating for your students all alone.


When you do share and get vulnerable. That's how people start connecting and start saying, Oh, we're all in this situation together. And we can build some changes together. Yeah, that's where the magic happens. It's Very powerful. And when we deny that it actually perpetuates problems. Yes. So interesting. So I want to get back to what you said about self trust. Because as you were talking, I was picturing my own two kids, right? When they're little, when we're all little. That's all we have is self trust. That's all we know. We follow our instincts, we follow our intuitions, our emotions are what guide us. And we are taught not to trust ourselves as we get older. And coming back to this self trust can really be a game changer for how everyone shows up in the world.


So how do we start even approaching this idea of trusting ourselves when we have been taught explicitly and implicitly that we really can't? Yeah, that's such an important question. And I think it starts with just looking at investigating, how did you lose yourself trust and I think with for people who have kids and who work with kids, they definitely see that they see some of the ways that self trust gets eroded, either through pressure to conform peer pressure, bullying, you see it through the way people talk to kids about not showing certain emotions, you know, which is oftentimes gendered. Oftentimes, boys are told not to show sadness, weakness, vulnerability, girls are told oftentimes to not show anger, not be too confrontational, not upset anyone.


And you see kids, especially little kids, like toddlers, they're very comfortable saying, when they're tired, when they're grumpy, when they're overwhelmed, they show it they're big, you can't not notice when a toddler is overwhelmed and wants to go home. But we slowly start teaching our kids, no, you have to stay in this situation, even though you'd rather be doing something else, you have to be polite to this person even hug this person, even if they make you uncomfortable. So I think that for adults, looking back at your own childhood, how did your parents talk about emotion? How did your parents talk about rest and taking breaks or working hard? Or whether it's earning food or earning play time or earning a vacation? And look at how did you build those ideas about whether or not it's okay to show certain emotions, whether or not it's okay to rest and listen to your body when you need to.


And I think that listening to your body piece is really the gateway to all of that, because we can feel what's happening in our body, you know, when you're in a situation, and you are being asked or expected to do something, or even if it's in your own head, and you feel like you should be doing this or should be doing that. But there's some disconnect with your body, you feel that dip in your emotion and your energy, that knot in your stomach that's like Something about this doesn't align. But more often than not people who aren't familiar with this work yet, push that aside, and just do the thing anyway, without really acknowledging or recognizing something's not quite right here. This doesn't feel right. Exactly, exactly. So that's kind of where you get to the next step, that first step is looking back at how did I lose my trust in my body, and in my natural right to rest and experience joy?


And then after you've done that kind of examination of the past, looking at your life now and really thinking about what emotions do I feel at different parts of my day? What parts of my day energize me or drain me? Who are the people who lift me up? Where are the places where I can be vulnerable and open and honest. And if there aren't a lot of those places, especially at work, try to kind of build those places, find your community, find your people? Sure. I'm trying to think of just a really good example here. We take us through some sort of example, either like perfectionism or people pleasing, or something that we can kind of walk people through. Here's how this could have gone down. And here's how it presents right now in your life.


Yeah, absolutely. People pleasing is a great one. Because I think that teaching is very female dominated. A lot of women struggle with self advocacy and being open and honest about their feelings and their experiences when it can create a conflict or make people uncomfortable. So say you have someone who acknowledges that they have a lot of trouble having healthy conflict, they tend to please people pleaser, to avoid conflict, smooth things over. So first of all, look at the family you grew up in and look at the culture you grew up in and try to figure out where that people's pleasing habit come from?


Was it from watching adults around you? And kind of passively learning? Was it from things adults specifically told you about how you were expected to act? Was it how people reacted when you did try to set boundaries as a kid or speak about your feelings? So once you've looked at that, then look at your current life. Are there places in your life where you can have healthy conflict? Are there certain relationships where you can be more open? Even if it's uncomfortable and difficult? So kind of looking at? Where is it worse? Where's it better, and other places in your life where you can slowly in a way that feels comfortable for you work on healthy conflict and healthy confrontation.


So for some people, it might start with the people who are closest to them who know them and feel safe. For others, it might feel better to start with strangers with people they don't know very well. For some people, it's easier to start with your personal life. For others, it's easier to start at work, but try to figure out where are the places where I am being drained or not being able to be my authentic self, or not being able to advocate for myself or my students or my co workers? And what are some small things that I can do there to just gently take those small steps.


Yeah, we're kind of looking at our lives through the lens of investigation and curiosity. So we can uncover some of these things. So we can make different choices that lead us to a place of authenticity. Exactly. I love the way you phrase that because there's so much shame around these different patterns to whether it's people pleasing, perfectionism, procrastination, there's this idea of like, oh, there's just this thing wrong with me. And I'm just a screw up. And I need to fix all these things. Because I don't have good relationships. And I'm not happy. But part of that self investigation is really removing the shame, right?


You learned these patterns for a reason. And there was probably at some point, when these patterns were helpful to you and made sense in your life, right? If you grew up in a family, that where you weren't able to express yourself, where you weren't able to have healthy conflict, it makes sense that you develop some people pleasing patterns. So be gentle with yourself, and then moving slowly and gently and acknowledging that changing these old patterns is going to be emotionally draining, especially at first, that's really important too, because another part of our wellness culture is kind of glorifying these huge breakthroughs. But the truth is that breakthroughs happen with lots of small steps generally, and not in these huge leaps and bounds 100%. And first of all, I want to go back and highlight what you said, you were not broken.


Nobody's broken. Here, we are products of our upbringing, which is nobody's fault, because our parents are products of their upbringing, and so on, and so forth. So is this our wiring, and when we do this investigation, we get to uncover where the wiring came from. So then we can make these changes. And like you said, for me, the amount of change that has happened for me personally in the last two and a half years is unreal. And in doing all of those many steps to reiterate myself, and reiterate myself and reinvent myself and recreate new things, it didn't always feel good. Because this work is sometimes painful. But when you zoom out, and you understand that in going deep, you get to go high, you get to grow, all of those emotions that you experience become part of this beautiful journey of growth and expansion, which is kind of the whole idea about our humanity and being here.


Because if we're not growing and expanding and learning and like, what's the point? Yes, exactly. That's so important to remember. Because if you're used to not advocating for yourself and not standing up when you see something wrong, and then you start to do it, you might imagine, oh, it's gonna feel so good to be my authentic self. And I guess it totally will eventually, but many steps along the way, will be exhausting and hard and you'll need to kind of emotionally recover from that. And even when we talk about perfectionism and overwork, and this glorification of not getting enough rest and working all the time. If that's something that you know, you kind of learned those ideals growing up and you want to work on it and you want to have more rest and more joy in your life.


At first, it might not feel good, right? It might not feel good to stop checking emails after 5pm. If that's not what you're used to, it might not feel good to say, Okay, I'm not going to do any work this weekend, it might be hard on your nervous system to adjust to a new pattern. And that's okay. That's a normal part of the process. Yes. And leaning into that process, knowing that's just part of our biology of how we rewire your brain desperately wants you to stay the same. So anything that you're going to try to do differently, you're going to get some resistance. And in my experience, the smarter you are, the smarter your resistance is, it'll come up in all sorts of sneaky ways. Yes, your brain loves habits and patterns and routines.


Which is why even if it's not good for you, even if it's exhausting for you, even if you're burnt out, I absolutely did that when I went from teaching in an underfunded public school, and I was working all the time. And I thought, Okay, I gotta try something else. And I went into research and social work, and I was doing the exact same thing. And that's part of the reason why we start slow. Because in order to rewire your brain, you have to create those pathways first, and then strengthen those pathways. If you just go really big, really hard all at once, you won't have a path to travel you right. And then it's self sabotage. Exactly. Right. So I want to ask you about something that's on your website, because you said what you do is coaching based in neuroscience and informed by justice. And I love that tagline. Because as a fellow neuroscience nerd, I'm like, Yes. And then I would just love for you to expand a little bit about what does that look like for you? Because it's so powerful? That is such a great question, Jen.

Thank you for asking. Because I do think that when we're looking at self trust and healing and growth, we absolutely have to have a justice, informed focus, and a systems informed focus. Because we live in a culture, we live in a society and everything that all these habits, we've learned all these expectations on your life, the things you're told that you're supposed to want, that comes from the culture that is all around you. So when we're working on healing and growing, it's not something that you necessarily need to do completely alone. There are some things like journaling and meditation that are wonderful practices for healing and growth. But we are social creatures, we need community, we need to find people that we can heal with and process our emotions with. And it's not a coincidence that having community building relationships is good for your immune system, it's good for your nervous system. It's good for keeping your brain from getting overwhelmed.


And it protects you from burnout during times of stress. So I think that working on healing and growth from a justice informed space means looking at how your growth happens in a community and how it's impacted by the systems around you, and how you can positively impact the systems around you through your healing and grow. That's tremendous. And I think that's one of the most important pieces. When we look outward, it's so easy to point fingers about who's to blame, and what's wrong. But until we point the fingers at ourselves, we're not actually able to make any of those changes externally. And I love this idea of the lens of justice. You know, we hear a lot trauma informed lenses and safety lenses and neuroscience lens.


But this idea of justice is, I think, really profound, because we don't exist in a vacuum. We developed our belief systems and these ideas about how we are supposed to operate in this world because like you said, the communities and cultures which we came from, and without acknowledging that those greater systems that we live in, we're missing a piece. And so I think that's really profound. Yeah. When you work on yourself, when you advocate for yourself, you're giving other people permission to do that as well. And when you get together and advocate in a community, that's how cultures change. That's how these unhealthy norms whether it's work norms or social norms,


And up changing is not through individual work, but through individuals talking about their collective traumas and collective stressors and working together. That's beautiful. And that is really how we create change in this world. Yes, exactly, exactly. We get our trauma and our unhealthy coping skills, from family, from community from other humans. And we heal and grow in community and with other humans and for other humans. Yes, yes, yes. So if there's someone listening right now, and they're like, all right, Abby, like I'm picking up what you're putting down? Where do I start? What's one thing that you can share today that can maybe make a difference in someone as they're first approaching this kind of work?


Remember that you are not alone. And it's not your fault. But there is something you can do about it. Right? If you have these unhealthy patterns, or coping skills, or relational skills that you're just really frustrated about, and you have shame about, remember that these came up for a reason that they may have been protecting you at some point or helpful at some point. And that is really, I think, one of the big keys to eliminating shame. And then the other one, as I said before, is finding other people who are dealing with the same issues, find the other recovering people pleasers, the other recovering workaholics, the other burnt out teachers, and share with them and be vulnerable and talk about how it's not okay, but it's not our fault.


And we can grow together. And we can change these systems together. Yes, I love that. So I'm going to ask you the same thing that I asked all of my guests at the end of our conversations together. And that's really, what is your dream for the future of education, looking through the lens of the things that we've talked about today? My dream for the future of education is a place where teachers, school social workers, administrators, everyone is treated like whole human beings, and has enough workers rights and room for expressing their emotions and advocating for themselves that they can listen to their bodies and lead with their values, both in the classroom and in school leadership, when that'd be a great world. work, you know, everyone's journey is different. So it never gets boring. It's the best work. I couldn't agree more. And I want to put a pin in the learn skills for a second, because that's important, I want to get back to it.


But something that just gets to me is these organizational structures that exist, are using outdated information. And the current data is out there, the research is happening, there are researchers actively creating studies to provide qualitative and quantitative data for people to use and make policy, but they're just not.


Which is, I think, what makes the work that you do in the world, the work that I do in this world, so important, because we are looking at the most recent information, and that's what's informing our practices, which can hopefully inform other practices. And I'm just always amazed by how outdated everything is. Yes, absolutely. And especially when you look at some of our current crises and education, you have teachers burning out, or quiet, quitting, or just actual quitting in droves. And we have all this research on what's best for workers and how to help people avoid burnout. And schools are not using that research to treat teachers like whole human beings, right.

And then, of course, that filters down to the kids who see all of the things that are happening around them, and then it just perpetuates this cycle. But we break the cycle by doing what you said, of teaching these skills. And I think it's important that I want to highlight you said, these are skills that we need to learn. Sometimes we come to this work, and we think, Well, shouldn't we just know this already? No.


We're not born knowing that we're not our thoughts. We're not born knowing how to process through our emotions, these are things we have to learn. So what are some of the processes or strategies that you guide your clients through as they're first coming to this work? So I think that's interesting that you say, there's a lot of skills that we're not born knowing. And that's very true. There's a lot of social emotional skills and self advocacy and healthy communication skills that can and should be taught. But also, this aspect of self trust that I really talk about is something that I think in many ways we are born knowing, and our society and our culture kind of does a lot of things to chip away at that self trust. And particularly in professional settings, where you're supposed to be completely unemotional at work.


And you're not supposed to be seen as showing weakness or showing too much of your personality, you're just supposed to go along with the motions, because that's what we consider professional. And especially for women, for queer folks, for people of color, people with disabilities, there's a genuine concern about being seen as overly emotional for just advocating fot their needs.


Yes, that's the dream. That is the dream. I love that. So for those people who are listening, how do they get in touch with you or learn more about you and your work? I am a researcher and personal development coach in Austin, Texas, but I work with folks all over the world on healing unhealthy coping skills. And you can find me at theexistentialcoach.com. I'm also the existential coach on Instagram. And I love talking to people. I love talking about this work. I love talking about the intersection of wellness and social justice.


So please reach out to me, that's fantastic. And all of those links will be right there in the program notes will be super easy for people to get to know you and your work. So thank you so much, Abby for your time and your talents today. This has been a really fantastic and important conversation. Thank you, Jan, for having this conversation with me. This has been great. Yes. So if you enjoyed today's episode, please leave a five star review. And then nice comment, and we will see you next time on Take Notes.

We all have those days.

You know, the ones where you feel stressed out, overwhelmed, and ready to snap at the slightest disruption in the classroom?

But let's face it - being a teacher is tough work, and caring for others is no easy task.

Welcome to episode 19 of the Take Notes with Jen Rafferty podcast! In this episode, I’m speaking with stress coach for moms, Elizabeth Andreyevskiy. She’s sharing her journey of discovering how to prioritize her own needs and taking care of herself so she could become a more patient and grounded mother.

I’m excited to have Elizabeth on the podcast today, because while you may not be a biological parent, as a teacher, you are taking on a similar role of caregiver to your students.

Elizabeth believes that taking the time to prioritize yourself is essential in order to avoid teacher burnout and become the most effective educators you can be. She understands that many of us are feeling overwhelmed and exhausted due to our unmet needs and wants to provide support to normalize self-care. By taking the time to care for yourself, you can be better equipped to support your students and energize your teaching.

Today, it’s all about sharing practical tips for identifying and addressing your unmet needs so you can better regulate your emotions and avoid reacting to difficult situations.

So, let go of the guilt holding you back from putting yourself first, and join us in this conversation to find more joy in your teaching journey!


Stay empowered,

Jen


Let’s keep the conversation going! Find me at:

Click here to learn all the ways you can work with me:
 Jen Rafferty | Instagram, YouTube, Facebook | Linktree
Instagram: @jenrafferty_
Facebook: Empowered Educator Faculty Room


About Elizabeth:
Elizabeth is a stress coach for moms. She is the host of Emotionally Healthy Legacy podcast and a mom of 4. Elizabeth is super passionate about mental health and emotional wellness in motherhood. She helps overwhelmed moms reduce the mental stress so they can respond with patience and calm towards their kids. She teaches proactive ways to be less stressed, prioritizing moms' needs without guilt and ways to regulate emotions when feeling triggered.


Contact Elizabeth here:

Website: Emotionally Healthy Legacy
Instagram: @emotionally_healthy_legacy

TRANSCRIPT:  
Sometimes when our kids and students are in the middle of a big emotion, it can cause us as the adult to react instead of respond. And underneath that knee jerk reaction is usually an unmet need. When we focus so much on the needs of our students and our kids, we often forget about our own needs, which is usually in the name of selflessness and martyrdom. However, when we start to make connections with our own emotions and prioritize our own needs, we can show a better for everyone around us. Even something as simple as asking yourself, What am I feeling right now? Am I hungry, my thirsty, am I tired, we usually can't make rational choices if our basic needs aren't being met. And my guest today talks with me about how we can prioritize ourselves, and how to drop the guilt so we can hold space for our kids, especially when they need us most. And we are going through a lot of very practical strategies that you can start today to learn how to respond instead of react. And after the show, go ahead to empowered educator.com/ebook where you can download my free book 24 ways to find calm in your busy world. And here you will find 24 ways to feel more ease and joy by noticing the things that are all around you that are usually out of sight. I did all the work for you. And it's yours for free. So download your copy today at empowered educator.com/ebook.


Remember all the passion and vision you had when you first went into teaching. Feeling like building young minds and creating community through your work would make a lasting impact on this world? Well, those days may feel like they're behind you now because you're exhausted, stressed and overwhelmed and frustrated. But I'm here to tell you it doesn't have to be like this. In fact, the love of teaching never really went away. But it absolutely needs transformation. Welcome to The Take notes Podcast. I'm Jen Rafferty, former music teacher, mom of two, and certified emotional intelligence practitioner, and I'm here to light the way for you. In order to create a generational change for our kids. We need to shift the paradigm away from the perpetual stress and overwhelm and into a life of joy, and fulfillment. This is education 2.0, where you become the priority, shift how you live your life, and how you show up both at work, and at home. So take a sip of steamy morning coffee, and grab your notebook. It's time to take notes.


Hello, and welcome back to take notes. I cannot wait to share our conversation today with Elizabeth Andrzejewski. She is a stress coach for moms and is the host of emotionally healthy legacy podcast and also a mom of four. She is super passionate about mental health and emotional wellness and motherhood and really helps overwhelmed moms reduce the mental stress. So they can respond with patience and calm towards their kids. She teaches proactive ways to be less stressed prioritizing mom's needs without guilt and ways to regulate emotions when you're feeling triggered. And I cannot wait to dive into this conversation, Elizabeth, because while some of the people who are listening might not be biological parents, we as teachers certainly use this role that we have and take on this role of parents sometimes to our kids, so I cannot wait to dive in.


So thank you so much for being here. I'm so glad to be here. I'm excited for this conversation. Yes, yeah. So I would love to know, how did you come to be a stress coach? What was this path that led you here to where you are today? Yeah. So my story started a few years ago when i At that time, I had three kids and my youngest boy, he was just one of those that you constantly had to keep an eye on. It seemed like he was like a Curious George on steroids, you'd possibly get into trouble. And so one of my friends suggested for me to go to counseling like parenting counseling. I did. And I was introduced to a whole new world of parenting. There's a big shift right now. They talk about it a lot on social media, but it's a gentle parenting approach.


I was raised in a traditional type of parenting home and that's what I was doing with my kids until that point. And I've never heard of gentle parenting before. So this was like the first time I came across it. And it was a lot about allowing our kids to have emotions, but teaching them safe ways to express it Focusing on emotional connection with your kids, therefore cooperation, co regulation, staying calm when the kids are having emotional outbursts and I tried a lot implementing it at first and I kept like I was failing more than I was succeeding. I kept trying to come alongside my kids when they were struggling.


I kept being triggered, I kept feeling like their emotions would suck me into it, I felt so reactive, instead of like being calm and patient and present. Around the same time, I ended up buying a course that taught me how to prioritize my needs and take care of myself. without guilt, I ended up getting up in the mornings before my kids. And using that time to set myself up for success, I started incorporating healthy habits that would call my nervous system down that supported my mental and physical well being. And I noticed a significant change throughout the day that I was able to be a lot more calm and grounded, I felt a lot less triggered by my kids, I felt like I had more tolerance room when things weren't going my way.


And I was just a lot more patient and able to actually have the mental space and energy to implement the parenting strategies. I was learning in counseling, I was kind of thinking about it. I'm like, Oh, my gosh, more moms need to know this. So many moms feel like they're failing at motherhood because they're reacting, raising their voice, maybe experiencing mom rage. And the root of that is they have unmet needs that are completely running an empty, they're so exhausted, and all they need is extra support, instead of beating themselves up with mom guilt. Wow, that's huge. And I know that that resonates with so many people, especially people who are listening right now, because I think it's even more exponential as moms. But you could even just take away the word mom and say, teacher, and really all of that is true. And I want to talk something about unmet needs. You know, something that I talk a lot about in empowered educator spaces is that the most generous thing we can do for other people is take care of ourselves. And I love that how you're saying that when we're feeling reactive, when we're feeling triggered, or we're feeling that rage or that overwhelming emotion?


A lot of the root of that comes from our unmet needs. And we often don't think about it in that way. So I'm hoping Can you talk a little bit more about how do we discover some of our unmet needs? Yeah, so with my clients, we start out with the basics, like basic basic, and we go back to getting enough sleep and eating meals. Why? Because when you're sleep deprived, your brain literally doesn't have the energy to make positive choices, it shifts to the emotional part of the brain. And you're going to be more reactive. Just like when you have a baby and you haven't had a good night's sleep in a while, you're so much more triggered, you're so much more snappy are so much more frustrated. And it's not because like you're bad mom or anything, you're just struggling, your brain literally is focused on your unmet need and has a hard time regulating your emotions.


Same thing when you're hungry, you're hangry your kids are hangry, right? When they're hungry, they're so much more likely to get into a fight with their sibling, everything seems to bother them when they're tired and they're hungry. So we oftentimes as moms kind of don't even notice that like well just get up in the mornings we go go go make breakfast, we drop the kids off, we come home, we rush, rush, rush rush, we just had one cup of coffee, a handful of games, gummy bears, and it's 4pm. And we're yelling at our kids and not even recognizing that we literally had no food all day long, right. And so I always start out with the basics. And I also teach my moms when you find yourself reacting, like you're getting all frustrated, if at all possible.


Let's take a moment and take a break and remove yourself from the situation. Yes, if you're driving in the car, that's not possible. But if you're at home with the kids, you're making dinner, everything seems chaotic, you feel like you're getting all tense and frustrated and raising your voice. That's like a sign for you that something's going on. We got to address it. Okay, so you might be overstimulated, right, like with all the noise and chaos, because you haven't had a moment just to like breathe, you might be hungry, you might be just exhausted, you might be just pulled in so many different directions at the same time, right? So if you can remove yourself from a situation and tell your kids hey, I need a minute or like five minutes, Mama needs to take a break and go to the bathroom. Go to your room. If you need to turn on screen time for them. I do that with my kids and like, I take that I lay down on my bed and close my eyes. It takes some breath and I'm like, Okay, what is going on? I'm feeling really overwhelmed right now. What am I feeling overwhelmed? I feel like so overstimulated. There's so much noise happening. What is going on?


I feel like I've been in a conflict with my husband and I haven't had time to just like process it. It's just all sitting up inside of me. And my kids are like triggering. I didn't feel seen or heard by him. And that's the word you know, you It's kind of like go backwards and work through it. Or it's like, I feel like I'm pulled in so many different directions. Why? Because I said yes to too many things. Why? Because I'm a people pleaser, okay? We gotta like, work through that. So what can I do? Right? That's what I help you figure out what is going on? What's the root of you being so overwhelmed? And so triggered, there's always an underlying thing. And we get to it, and then we address it, we take action, right? It's like if you're hungry, Okay, grab yourself like a granola bar, or some protein or something like that, to just fill you up a little bit. Are you just thirsty? Do you need to put the kids to bed a little bit earlier? So you can go to bed a little bit earlier? Right? Do you need to take some things off your plate? Do you need to ask for more help, right?


Like, there's always a reason why you're reacting. Always, always. You know, I love that you took us through some of those scenarios, because that makes it so real, you know, you can certainly identify yourself within those stories or kind of fill in the blanks Right? And, and fill in your own stories there. Because it's so real. And we don't often talk about it, because there's so much shame and guilt that goes along with this. But you know, when you said when your child is acting in a certain way, you go through those questions did they eat? Are they hungry? Do they need to poop? Like they these are all things that we asked about our kids, right? But we don't often take the time to be reflective about how we're feeling because taking time for ourselves, opens up a door for needing something. And because of this world that we live in, right, this patriarchal world that is just in the air that we breathe, needing something is often times more often than not associated with shame, guilt, self judgment, as in, I should be able to do it all, I should be able to have everything together. What's wrong with me?


So how would you go about walking your clients through giving themselves permission to have needs and to ask for what they need. So their needs are met. So here's my view on this. Technically, you could try to do it all. But what happens when you do you get overwhelmed, you get stressed out, something's gonna give right? When you try to do it all something's gonna give and it's going to be you your mental, physical or emotional well being, it's always going to be right, if you try to do it all. And technically, some people do. But they get to a point where they are completely burned out completely exhausted, it creates so much tension with their family, their physical health is suffering, like it will come at a cost, eventually, it's going to get to that point.


So see it from that lens, that yes, technically, I could do it all. But is it sustainable? It's not? Is it actually serving me and my family? It's not. So think about the moment you try to do it all. When you put that pressure on yourself, when you put that expectation, what happens? You get so overwhelmed, you get so stressed out, I heard this analogy, and I thought this was great. There's no CEO of a company that is truly successful, that does everything themselves. They always have help. Like, they have people on their team, they do designated things. If one person tries to do absolutely everything, they will eventually burn out, okay, and they're gonna crumble. And if you don't take a time to rest, your body's gonna pick it for you. And it will be at a very inconvenient time. I'm so glad you said that. Because you're right, your body talks to you all the time.


But we're not very good at listening, because we have this idea that we can get by or function without acknowledging what our body is trying to tell us. But my question there is, is just getting by good enough. Is that good enough for you? Is it good enough for your family is good enough for you, the people in your life? So what kind of ways can you start to listen to your body because you're right, if you don't, your body is going to tell you what it needs. And it's going to smack you across the face and make sure you are in bed resting, whether it's from a backache or a headache, or illness or something more serious. It's going to make you listen if you don't so how do we even start that process of becoming aware of what we need? I think what helps to do that is like reflection, and you need to kind of pause.


Oftentimes what I work through with my clients is like we need to see what are things in your life that are not serving you some commitments that you took on that we need to kind of release and just like go up for this season and that will give you some space in your day to just have a time to reflect because if you go Go, go, go go, you can't even realize what you need. Because you're just constantly going, you don't have the room, like the physical time or the mental time to like, reflect. So we do work through, like, what is not serving you, what can we delete out of your life right now? Okay, what are we going to focus on? All right? So what are some things that we can do today to support you? So I teach my clients to journal all the time journaling really helps you like process and figure out kind of like, what is going on? I've been feeling so depleted, I've been feeling so overwhelmed.


I feel so bitter at my family. Why? Because I feel like I'm doing everything, and nobody helps me out. And everybody keeps asking me to do stuff. And I'm just one person. Okay, so we kind of go through it like, Okay, well, maybe we need to delegate things to your kids, right? Maybe we need to hire some help. Like, we kind of like go backwards and work through all those things and figure out what is the root? And how can we actually address something to create change that will trickle down into the rest of like the family? Yeah. And I think asking for help in those concrete ways, you're really important giving your kids jobs, I guess, when you fall into this role, we just like do all the things because that's what we think we're supposed to do.


But as soon as you give your kids jobs, or you ask your partner for help, or you hire someone to clean your house for you, so you have time, so on a Sunday, you're not spending your day off cleaning your house, you can spend it with your family. These are really important life changing choices, it's going to really affect how you show up for everybody in your life. Because when you're good, everyone's good. Yes, for sure. I think a lot of moms don't realize that when they're struggling. And the energy that kind of comes out when you're frustrated and snappy, like it seeps into the rest of the family, like have you ever had a day where you're just in a bad mood, and it just seems to radiate through the house, and then like, everyone's in a bad mood, and then everybody's reacting. But what if like, you wake up and you feel good, you feel grounded, you feel supported, you feel like calm and peaceful.


And even when your kids wake up in a cranky mood, you're able to come alongside them and just share some of that calm with them, instead of getting sucked into their energy or like, give negative energy to them. And so that's what I teach you. Those are the things that I teach moms to feel supported, to feel grounded to feel calm. So then the rest of the family benefits from it. It's not just you know, it's the rest of the family. And you get to teach your kids so many positive examples, how to prioritize your needs, how to set healthy boundaries, and say no to things that are not serving you right? How to get over some of the mental blocks that were like, well, I have to Well, I should be able to do it all. But who said that that's just something that you've put on yourself, like, we choose to let go of that you can choose to shift the way you think, and it's gonna completely change the way you do life. Oh, 100%. I think that's something that was so interesting to me about about you.


And the work that you do in the world and really aligns with what I do here in my work with educators is that we have so much more agency than we realize that we are truly in the driver's seat and can decide, yes, no, I want to attach to this belief, I don't want to attach to this belief, this thought is serving me this thought is not serving me, this expectation that came from my mother that came from her mother that came from her mother does not exist in this world that we're living in right now. I'm going to let go of that one. And until we start taking the time to do any sort of reflection, like what you were saying that pausing that questioning, we're always going to be on this autopilot default, which is going to keep us safe, the same and same old doing the things that we're not actually working towards. We're saying we want something else.


But the things that we're thinking, doing, believing aren't aligned with that. So everything that you're saying is so onpoint and one of the things I would love for you to talk a little bit more about is the boundaries piece. Because while it can be really easy sometimes to say to your kids, okay, I'm tired of picking up after you. You need to pick up after yourself now. And if you don't, these are some of the consequences when we talk about boundaries with the other adults in our lives. With the people we have emotional connections to that can sometimes get a little bit tricky. So can you walk us through some of that process of how do you know that you need a boundary and then how do you communicate it so that you can uphold it?


So I retagging but like commitments if somebody's asking you to do something, or Yeah, okay, that's something that people have a hard time with boundaries. is because they feel guilty or feel bad saying no. So if somebody, let's say, your plate feels full, and then somebody comes up to you, and asks you to plan a baby shower, because while you're good at it, right, like, that's just something you're good at, and they're asking you, but when you think about it, they asked you that and you're like, oh my gosh, another thing to do, and you feel like this heaviness and dread, that is a sign from your body, that there needs to be a boundary there. If somebody asked you the same thing, and you're like, oh, my gosh, I'm so excited.


Like, I can't wait to do that. And like, you truly feel that and you feel expansive, and you feel like light about it. Because you do have the space in your schedule to do that, then that's a sign for you that it's a good thing to do. So there's a saying that every time you say yes to something, you say no to something else. Okay. So keep that in mind. That is really, really important.


When it comes to like commitments, when people ask you to do something, and you want to say no, it makes me think of Phoebe from friends in the first season. She's like, you know, I'd love to, but I don't want to. But like, no, so if somebody asks you to, like be committed to something, and you can't fully say yes, you can't say yes, 100%, that's a sign for you to say, No. And you can say thank you for thanking me, I appreciate you asking me at this time, I cannot fully give it the time that it deserves. And that's it, you don't have to explain more, if they try to push it, you say, I appreciate it. But I'm done talking about this topic, it may seem rude, but those people were benefiting from you not having boundaries, if you say to a commitment that you don't fully feel passionate about, and that is truly draining you. It's taking time from your family, it's taking time from you to connect with your kids after school. It's taking time from your family dinners, right?


It's taking time away from your self care to actually refill and feel restored. So then you can show up to your family like I am a person that I have very little commitments, and it's on purpose, because I know that I get drained quickly with things like that. And whenever somebody asks me something, I need to truly want to say 100% Yes, otherwise, I say no. And it's uncomfortable at first. But the more you practice it, the easier it does get and less uncomfortable, I guess it's kind of hard. It's uncomfortable to make other people not like you're not be happy with you, especially if you're a people pleaser. That's definitely something that a lot of us, I think struggle. And that was one of my things that I had to work through. Like I like when people like me, I don't want to disappoint them. But saying no is really, really important. It's really important.


Well, you're either putting other people's comfort before your own, or you're deciding No, my comfort is more important. And the reason that your comfort is more important, not because you love that person any less because you love them so much that you want to be able to say yes, 100% Because in that scenario, let's say you're planning this party, and you're resentful about it. What kind of party are you throwing when you're coming from a place of emotional resentment? So because actually who I need to say no right now, because I can't give it 100%. And I'm happy to Yeah, help you in this way or not, you know, there's so many different things. And like, God, you're placing your value in someone else's hands, when you want to please them to affirm your own self worth.


That's where the boundaries become really uncomfortable. But like you said, once you start practicing them, you get so goodness, you get better with practice. Yes, every time you start out something like this, it's uncomfortable at first. And there's this quote that I really like, I don't know who said it, but it's like, if you don't prioritize your life, someone else will do it for you. This is your life, and you get to live it once. Right? It is really important for you to pick what is important, valuable to you. Because if you don't, other people will pick it for you. And then that's when you are resentful and better and overwhelmed and burnout and stress that and end up yelling and screaming at your kids because you haven't had any time to yourself and you're completely stretched thin and you feel like a complete failure. Well, let's kind of go backwards.


Sometimes it's like people pleasing. We just have to work on that and it's gonna take care of everything else, right 100% And the good news about all of this as well, you might be the person who is causing all of your effects in your life, you are also the solution to making it best. And that's when that empowerment comes in. When we feel empowered to again be in the driver's seat of our own life. That's when you realize like anything's possible. For sure you get to decide I love that. I heard this phrase from the influence through that really transformed my life. But she says this phrase, you get to decide this is your life, I get to decide what I take on what I say no to what boundaries, I said, I get to decide because this is my life, okay?


And I'm telling your listeners, you get to decide this is your life, you get to decide what's important to you what your values are, what really matters to you, and you can create a life around that. That's beautiful. And something else I want to just touch on that you said that it's so important to highlight here is that that moment when your body shifts, you know whether or not it's an all in Yes, or a no. But when we think about boundaries, and communicating, oftentimes, we go to our mind, but what's our bigger communicator is actually our body. Because when someone's asking you that thing, you will know what this feels like, you sense that body shift. That's the thing that we need to be listening to, not the justifications in your mind. And like, you'll figure it out. And I love this person's I'm gonna make it work. It's your body giving you those messages.


And it's finding that time and space to practice listening to your body, that's really going to make all the difference. Yeah. And what you said was great. And if you like, somebody asked you something like that in person, you feel uncomfortable, too uncomfortable, or you freeze and you can't say no, you can say thanks for thanking me, I'll think about it. And I'll let you know. And then the next day, send them a text message. Thanks for thinking of me, I appreciate it. Right now, I can't commit to it. I can't give it the time that it deserves. That's it, you don't have to explain. And if that person truly loves you, and respects you, and they're going to respect that answer, they're not going to be pushy. And if they are, they're manipulative, right?


Those are some red flags, right, that needs to be addressed. Absolutely. And I love how you created a scenario where you, again, are empowered to create space for yourself, you because you might not be comfortable just yet saying thank you. But no, thank you. There's more of a things we're thinking of you. Let me think about it. And then you have that time and space to figure out exactly how you're going to communicate this respectful decline of whatever. And the thing about those manipulating conversations when someone's pushing you. Oftentimes, this comes from within our family, right? When, for example, your mom has had this expectation of you all along, when now here you are as a full grown adult, making a new boundary.


Sometimes those family dynamics can be tricky. How do you navigate through that? Yeah, so I think one other thing is like expectation already coming in. And knowing that if a person like that who's maybe a little bit unhealthy emotionally has been like pushing your boundaries, they will get upset, knowing that they will get upset, the only people that can get upset for you setting boundaries are the ones that have been benefiting from you not having any, okay, so expect that they are going to be upset, expect that you're gonna feel uncomfortable. And I think what is super crucial in order for you to stick with your answer is having a support system, having like either another friend, or a coach, or a co worker, or a therapist, somebody that is helping you to make these boundaries, but to stay strong with your answer.


And the more you stick with it, that better it gets with time, like it's going to take practice, it's going to be uncomfortable, some people might get even angry and mad. And guess what, they'll just get over it. Right? Because this is how we create a healthier legacy with breaking some unhealthy patterns of the way things have been in our family for generations. Yes. And I'm so glad you said that about support and community. Because we need that we cannot do this in a vacuum. And that's why we have coaches, we have therapists, we have communities, like empowered educator like the Creating healthy legacy, like when you're creating as well we have these places and spaces where people who have woken up to their agency don't have to do this by themselves.


I say often, you can't read the label from inside the wine bottle. And yes, you need somebody on the other side to just hold up a mirror sometimes. And that is a sign of strength. It is a sign of awareness. It is a sign of acknowledgement of our humanity and how we get through this life through community. So I'm so glad that you said that. I had do need to ask like I just asked everybody at the end of our interviews together in your world and what you see in your dream for the future. or of what could be what is your dream for the future of education? i My dream is for I think, for moms to get in a better place themselves so that they can educate their kids, right and be role models for their kids. Because if we want our kids to grow up in like a healthier generation and have healthy boundaries and healthy mental health and emotional well being emotional regulation, it starts with us as moms because you want it or not, you're the CEO of your home.


And like your kids model and reflect a lot of things you do. So if you want the future generations to change, especially with your kids, or if you're a teacher in school, it starts with you from that inner work, and then it's going to spill out into the rest. Yes, yes to all of that. So how can listeners learn more about you, Elizabeth, and learn more about the work that you do in this world? Yeah, so you can follow me along and emotionally happy legacy at Instagram, that's where I hang out. Most of the time, I do have a podcast. Also, I give you a lot of helpful support over there emotionally healthy, like a C.


And then if you go to my website on there, you can find my course or free stress management call for 30 minutes, we can go through some things that are weighing you down, I can give you some tips and guidance. Or if you're looking for actually one on one support and you're ready to implement change and see the change in your life. I do have a one on one coaching program. Fantastic. And all of those links will be right in the podcast notes will be super easy for people to learn more about you, Elizabeth, thank you so much for your time today. Your message is so important and it's been a true pleasure just talking with you and getting to know you. Ah, thanks for having me. I appreciate it. Well, if you enjoyed today's episode, please make sure you leave a five star review. And we'll see you next time on take notes.


Incredible, right? Together, we can revolutionize the face of education. It's all possible. And it's all here for you right now. Let's keep the conversation going and empowered educator faculty room on Facebook.

As an empowered educator how can you make an even bigger impact in the world?

What if teacher performance indicators were based on leading with curiosity and openness, rather than grades and test scores?

Everyone deserves respect and kindness, and this is an important mindset to have when connecting with others- especially students.

When we create spaces rooted in collaboration and discovery we gain new insights and experiences far beyond the classroom walls.

Welcome to episode 18 of the Take Notes with Jen Rafferty podcast! In this episode, I’m speaking with kindness coach, Kevin Huntting! He loves nothing more than connecting with people seeking their own personal growth, so they can make an even bigger impact in their lives and in this world.

Kevin supports lots of overwhelmed leaders and purpose driven organizations develop the emotional intelligence in leadership that is necessary to create greater ease, kindness, and inspiration.

We delve into how social emotional learning approaches have a significant impact on not only students, but also the adults around them. Because, ultimately we have to be the change that we want to see in our kids.

Today is all about looking inward with curiosity about ourselves so that we can become better leaders and fully appreciate the beauty and diversity around us all.

Stay empowered,

Jen


Let’s keep the conversation going! Find me at:

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Facebook: Empowered Educator Faculty Room


About Kevin:

Hi, I am Kevin the KINDNESS Coach. I support overwhelmed leaders & purpose driven organizations develop the EQ necessary to lead with greater ease, kindness, inspiration and impact!

Connect with Kevin here:

Instagram: 2stepsforwardcoaching
Facebook: 2 Steps Forward Coaching
Website: 2 Steps Forward Coaching

TRANSCRIPTS:  
There is so much beauty in the diversity of this world. However, people can be so quick to judge one another. And these judgments and limiting beliefs about other people can sometimes lead to life altering events, which can cause us to view ourselves and the world differently. It can happen in the grocery store, or going for a walk in your neighborhood, and even on the school ground. These events leave us asking Who are we as individuals? And what does that mean about this world? So today, I'm speaking with Kevin hunting the kindness coach, who talked with me about how we can cultivate more understanding, compassion and love for each other. By looking inward with curiosity about ourselves. Kevin describes himself as a humanist whose mission is to lead the way for people to live with reverence of each other as fellow humans, I'm so glad I can share our conversation with you. And after the show, my ebook 24 ways to find calm in your busy world is now available for you, podcast listeners for free at empowered educator.com/ebook. Here you will find 24 ways to feel more ease and joy by noticing the things that are all around you that usually are out of sight. I did all the work for you, and it's yours for free. So download your copy today at empowered educator.com/ebook.


Remember all the passion and vision you had when you first went into teaching. Feeling like building young minds and creating community through your work would make a lasting impact on this world? Well, those days may feel like they're behind you now because you're exhausted, stressed and overwhelmed and frustrated. But I'm here to tell you, it doesn't have to be like this. In fact, the love of teaching never really went away. But it absolutely needs transformation. Welcome to The Take notes Podcast. I'm Jen Rafferty, former music teacher, mom of two, and certified emotional intelligence practitioner, and I'm here to light the way for you. In order to create a generational change for our kids, we need to shift the paradigm away from the perpetual stress and overwhelm and into a life of joy, and fulfillment. This is education 2.0, where you become the priority, shift how you live your life, and how you show up both at work, and at home. So take a sip of steamy morning coffee, and grab your notebook, it's time to take notes.


Welcome back to a another fabulous episode of take notes. I cannot wait to get started into this conversation with Kevin hunting, who is the kindness coach, and is a devout humanist kindness and compassion are two of his biggest drivers because he believes that every individual deserves respects for being human period. And his big why is to create a kinder and more compassionate world and he loves nothing more than to connect with people who are seeking their own personal growth. So they can make an even bigger impact in their lives and in this world. And he supports lots of overwhelmed leaders and purpose driven organizations and help them develop their emotional intelligence that is necessary to lead with greater ease with more kindness, inspiration, and of course, impact. So thank you so much, Kevin, for talking with me on take notes today.


Absolutely. Thanks for having me.


I would love to know your journey that led you to be the kindness coach and a devout humanist. How did that get started for you? Why are you here?


Yep, like to get all the way back, I can tell you that there have been very specific events in my life, I think that have helped shaped that part of being a humanist, and just sort of I do believe that every single human being deserves respect and kindness like period, again, regardless of all the other stuff that we want to layer on top in terms of our perceptions or the preconceived notions of who we have, or who we think a person is. And I can tell you that two significant I think things that played out when I was younger was I was bullied at a young age, I played a lot with the girls on recess, because I kicked ass on the bars, which is where all the girls played. And because they excelled at it, you know, I remember there was one guy that really stood out and actually started calling me names called new girl called me, I think that bag, whatever.


And at that age, I was just like, I'm having fun, right? I'm just enjoying my time playing bars with the girls. But it was the first time it was significant because it was the first time that someone made me aware of something that I was just, you know, having a good time but maybe start to question I think as a young child a what did that mean and what was behind it and I remember leaving recess crying, he made me cry. So I left and went back into the school. And that stuck with me that you know, that's one of those life events that sticks with you and certainly shaped the way that I was viewing the world I think and even doing myself but that was just one thing where I believe that had a big impact on me. Obviously, and then also just coming to terms with myself and my own sexual identity was a huge event in my life that really forced me to look at myself in a much more deeper way about who I was sexually, who I was attracted to, what did that mean for me, and even the coming out process was pretty heavy with my mom and my brother, who I came out with when I was probably about 20 years old.


And then I think the other piece that kind of has shaped me, and it's just, I grew up with my youngest uncle had Down syndrome. And so I was always around him as a young child. And I remember, again, not really, at first understanding that he had Down syndrome or that that made him different. And I remember that when we would go out as a family to either have dinner, or you would be in public with us, people would stare, they would balk. And it really set me off, because I was like, why are people being so insensitive? You know, he is who he is. He's my uncle. And he has Down syndrome, I mean, and I started to come to realize that, honestly, he taught me a lot about unconditional love, just the grace of giving, like someone who was always giving and sort of, honestly, to me, an angel on this planet, I was like, you know, what, you're such a beautiful human being.


And I feel like it's what I saw when I was younger. And growing up was I was just always drawn to understanding people, but also understanding people who were, quote unquote, different than myself, we really weren't different. But the we learn are different. We learn that says children, that it's through our parents that we receive a lot of those messages. And I felt like I was fortunate enough that it was always that sense of input, like curiousness, and being inquisitive and wanting to better understand people that I that's what I connected with. And then I studied sociology. So it really is what I study, I took gender studies, I took Latin American Studies, women's studies, horses, African American Studies, horses, and so I just did like, what this road is beautiful, like all the diversity that is out there. To me, it's just the beauty of creation.


And really, the it is creation. To me, that is what humanity is. And so that's just what I believe, wholeheartedly, and I know, it's really tough for me, when I see it, that people are so quick to judge others, it's just, there's so much beauty to be found to have a connection that at first maybe you feel a little bit uncomfortable entering into but once you do, it could be life changing. So I think that's where I'd say my, when I call myself a humanist, I just feel like we all are deeply connected in one way or the other.


I couldn't agree with you more. And thank you for sharing your stories, as teachers, which is mostly an educators that the audience that's listening to this podcast, you know, we are in a position to be there, when some of these interactions that you're describing take place. And these moments that matter. And these moments where we start to create meaning and start to be curious as Okay, well, who am I right, as you know, seven year old Jen or her 10 year old Kevin, right, you know, who am I?


And what does that mean in relationship to the other people around me? And then what do we learn about ourselves in those moments. And what's so interesting is educators try to set up structures that are comfortable for kids to safely discover who they are, as best they can listen, I'd like to think so I like to wear my rose colored glasses. However, at the same time, if we ourselves as the adults in these spaces are an actively practicing this with the other adults may spaces, those are actually the messages that are louder than anything you could possibly say to a kid. So I would love to talk more about the adults in these spaces and how we can essentially be the change that we want to see in our kids. And I love how you said curiosity versus judgment. How do we move from judgment to curiosity?


I mean, I think the first step is what you sort of touched on, which is, I think that it comes with awareness, you have to step into it really better understanding who you are as an adult, especially for Turkey, talking about education, people who are in the educational space, who are adults, I think it's understanding what you are bringing to the table. And I think it's understanding some of those preconceived notions or even the messages that you may have received growing up. It's only through awareness that you can start to better understand I think, what that means in relationship to understanding a child and then discovering for themselves who they are.


And I say that because I think many times like you said, it's that adults own message and their view of who they think this person is that's coming through. And so to me, getting to almost a place of emotional neutrality or like neutrality, in terms of judgment is where I would say like a young child is going to thrive with an adult because you're really just allowing the child to explore who they are or in be that maybe a sounding board or just someone who can listen versus maybe providing direction when it's necessary in cases where, of course, the child might be thinking about harming themselves or something like that to step down.


But what I'm saying is, is that I think for many adults, it's easy to want to go to a place where you immediately want to tell a child what to do, or what to think or who to be, versus the more emotional neutrality and judgment that you can sort of hold space for when you're with the child, but let the child just sort of express themselves in a way that allows them to either get clarity or say like, oh, wow, you know, I'm learning something about myself in that process, I think that would be sort of an ideal state, and that is looking at it through very rose colored glasses as well. But I also believe that it is a really critical space, like you said, for children.


I mean, from a developmental standpoint, right, they're spending more time bonding with the teacher than they may be with their own parents, and they're in school for such a large period of time. I mean, we spend how many years of our lives in total, with really influential people, and that there's a lot of power there, there's a lot of power and responsibility. And I think it's beautiful, when hopefully teachers can understand that about themselves, and maybe have the awareness of what they might be bringing, so that they can better understand how that might impact the child who is questioning themselves or just coming to terms with who they are and wanting to make sense of it. I mean, not to get off track, but I do live in the state of Florida.


And as you know, they passed a bill that was that's a you know, they don't say gay bill, which has been created a lot of implications for children who might be going through that period of trying to understand their their gender identity, their sexual identity, their gender expression, and a lot of that, imagine the harm that could be done tip, now someone really can't even be there, or that child or has to overthink what they're saying, or fear of litigation or liability, because of this law, that it's pretty ambiguous in terms of how the news and that's an example, of course, in Florida, and I'm sure this exists across the nation, but all your beautiful teachers out there that are connecting with your children and allowing them that space to just express themselves. I mean, I send lots of love to you, because I know it is such a critical role. It's a very important role.


Sure, and getting back to really the heart of what you are talking about. And there's actually a big heart, right. And behind Kevin, by the way, for those of you listening who can't see, yes, there's this beautiful graphic of this gorgeous heart. Getting back to that it's really about understanding who you are. And I like what you said about emotional neutrality. And when we're talking about interactions between the adults in these spaces, these are the examples that these kids are also watching. Because in order to provide spaces for inclusion, and kindness and compassion for these kids, you know, with that example, that you just use, many of whom are just trying to figure themselves out, we need to figure ourselves, that's the adults.


So this idea of what you were saying, we often come to a situation with an idea of what we want this other person who we're talking to what, who they should be, how they should be what they should say. And those two, like you said, come from our upbringing and the beliefs that we've had. And when we come to a conversation, a conflict and interaction with those preconceived notions, we don't actually see the person who is in front of us anymore. So can you talk a little bit about that communication piece that interaction? And how in learning more about ourselves? Can we show up for others better?


One example that I use all the time with a lot of people that I work with, is when the word getting curious to me. And curiosity is a very powerful place to operate from in any leadership role. And we're talking here about education. And when I say getting curious, I think there's sometimes more power, and either just listening, or perhaps asking questions that would help a child either gain their own clarity for themselves about what they need, versus maybe making statements, which is so easy to do.


And that's kind of how we talk, the language that we learn is one where I don't want to say it sounds absolute, but it's a lot of times, right, it's more directive, and typically might sound something like, well, you should feel this way, when maybe the child is saying something completely different about how their theory and just getting curious might be well, like why are you feeling okay? Or what is making you feel the way that you feel? And so that, to me, the idea of getting curious, it can be creates that space, and also creates I think the foundation for a child to be able to really fully open up and feel that they're able to express themselves and be listened to in a way where you're not making statements. You're actually just trying to understand better or understand more.


It's a weird thing because with the clients I've worked with, it doesn't come naturally. That approach doesn't come naturally. Because again, we're not really taught this. And we're also not taught you'll be I'd say as adults, I can say for myself, I was never really taught how to understand my emotions. There was no course that I took and faceful that was like how to make sense of your emotions, or building emotional intelligence. And what's that process of doing it. And I feel like that is another big step for adults is to start to understand what your emotions are telling you, and to really tune into them, because they are telling you something.


 And that's where sometimes you can get into more of that reflective piece and understand better what's going on and why maybe you believe certain things and by understanding the emotion that you're experiencing, I feel like that's something that shouldn't be in our educational system. Is it some coursework around, I don't understand what your emotions are telling


ya. And there are right now, which is great news, you know, there is a big push in many places, there are places where it's not allowed. But there are many places there are promoting social emotional learning, because that is part of our humaneness. And where empowered educator comes in is, I am very aware that a lot of these programs leapfrog over the adults. And so empowered educator is really about focusing on the social emotional well being the adults, so they can provide an incredible foundation of social emotional learning for their kids, because you can't teach something that you aren't fluent in yourself. So this is also your area of expertise, this emotional intelligence world. So how can people get started understanding their emotions and just kind of crack open the door a little bit to emotional intelligence, if they're not quite familiar, yet there's a very simple steps like three steps that you can take, or what I call power questions that can I think be a starting point for a lot of people in this may be through journaling, it could be through either some mindfulness type practices, if you're into that. But the first question that you simply could ask yourself is, what am I feeling?


And to be able to name the emotion that you're feeling first, but then to go a little bit deeper? And understand that? What are the thoughts that are resulting in whatever I'm feeling? So then you're able to connect the idea that there is a deep connection between our thoughts and emotions? Because emotions are happening? Because some something that we're thinking, and then you can take it even one step further? And understand in what ways are those thoughts either like, is there any evidence to support the thoughts that I've been telling myself that are resulting in what I'm feeling? And typically, a lot of times what we're hearing is those own preconceived notions of what we think it should be.


And when you typically will ask that question about, is there any evidence to support what I'm thinking? Nine times out of 10 answered, probably going to be no. And so then you can work on understanding how to maybe change that perspective, or come from a more empowering place where the person can start to operate differently than they normally would or what I call like our programming, sort of that wiring that we all that default programming that we all have, based on our own life experiences and growing up. So just simply asking yourself, like three or four simple questions is a great starting place to start to make sense of your emotions. And then of course, you can build on that, but that's a great place to start.


So can we put an example in there that I think is would be really helpful to just kind of conceptualize what does this even look like? I'll give you


an example. Like probably in relationships, because I know everyone has either family relationships, intimate relationship, whatever relationship, it could be. One thing that this could be a good example is your spouse, your significant other, whoever you share your life with, that you do, baby comes in, in a hastily fashion walks through the front door, and kind of makes a beeline for their own space and the room or whatever. And immediately, you might start to feel like, wow, like what's going on? You're getting to start asking, you know, this person seems so distant when they came in.


And now they're, they didn't even really say hi, like they normally do. And so our thoughts, probably our most logic begins to go to a place where we think we start to question, Hey, what's going on? But most people might even take it a step further and think was it something that I did? Like, what did I do that I accept this person, and so you start to immediately go to a place where you are making it about yourself. And that's that place where the thought that thought pattern is coming in where you can stop and say, Wait a minute, what evidence do I have to support the idea that I am somehow at fault for this person's state of being and typically there's nothing that you could probably come up with that you're like, why haven't done anything?


So it's a really simple example but it's like we go through these microseconds and those these types of things daily, where what's the possibility of what that thought that the to write? What if you grew up there, and you want to connect with the person and you want to be there in a way where you're caring, but you're thinking that so your first thing is going to be like, um, you know, what happened? Like, what did I do like what did you just verbalize that and the person then like, What do you mean what if you didn't do a damn thing like I just and then it's gonna give you the real story, the actual story which is Maybe they just got picked up by somebody in traffic. Or maybe they just had a horrible experience. If they just went to the supermarket and came back were a really crappy day at the office. And so these are examples that typically or seriously, they're bringing out all the time. And imagine the emotional neutrality ease to connect it back. Like if you just stayed emotionally neutral, what would that even look like then in terms of the thoughts that you would have? Because it has nothing to do it? But yeah, immediately our votes, you might be like, Well, I did something wrong, or what did I do? And that, that has huge implications?


Yeah, it sure does. And I love this idea of emotional neutrality in those moments, but you need to be aware first, which is the whole thing about your first step, and you're 100%, right, these things happen all day, all day. And when we're constantly making these narratives about us, and false rate, or name, or judgments, then we continue to think those thoughts and then feel crappy all the time. And then it of course, will affect how we show up in all of the spaces and places where we need to be. So if awareness is step one, what's step two,


I think step two is doing the work to understand how you can shift those perspectives and become really in touch in tune with, when you are telling yourself a narrative that is taking you to a place that's probably going to either create stress, self doubt, some worrying anxiety, or whatever it is that you're experiencing, because of it, it's understanding that that there is an alternative to that, that there can be an alternative to that, because what you thought that you were telling yourself were false. And so you then start to replace that with what might be a more empowering thought for me to use or to think in this particular circumstance. And in that one, the one that I just gave, it could be just recognizing that you're like, you know what, my thought is, that Will something happen. I don't know what happened. But what I am going to do is the narrative, I am going to tell myself, I'm going to show up like the loving spouse or partner or person that I want to show up as, and I'm going to go enter into that from that level, from a different perspective.


And so imagine what the conversation might look like and how different it might be, you went into it being that loving, caring, compassionate person, and to the person that obviously is upset, or something happened in these. I mean, in the educational system, there's so many things going on, I'm sure in every single moment that it's hard, it takes a lot of mindfulness and practice to be able to do that it doesn't just happen is just like you can wave a wand. And somehow you're able to step into a different space of how the thoughts that you're having that really takes practice. And that's where I think it gets challenging for people to do is to be able to a first be aware of it, but then start to challenge it and then work through it in a way that you it becomes it feels more normal versus always talking to people, we want to just make it about ourselves.


Yeah, and it is always a practice. You know, I would love if one day, we all just woke up and we're like, oh, we're empowered now. It doesn't work that way. And you know, these are practices that I practice that you practice every day, this is the work. This is the beautiful work that we get to do to create that impact. In that example, I just thought of, you know, something that happened years ago, I was in the office of one of my administrators, and another one of my administrators was in there, he looked at me and made a face and like, stormed out of the room. And then I was there with my other administrator, he had mentioned something to me that I needed to follow up on or whatever it was. And in my mind, the narrative was this other person was angry, but couldn't tell me the thing that this other administrator had to tell me. And I sat with that. And I remember thinking like, is this true? Is this is this actually true? So I actually went to that other person. And I sat down with him and they said, Listen, this thing happened. What was that about? If you have something to tell me, I would love it. If you could just tell me. It had nothing to do with me. But what did happen was that I was able to open a door to communication, where if there was any misunderstanding moving forward, we were then able to have a conversation. And that was safe. Now it wasn't scary. It wasn't intimidating. So awareness is important. But then it's like, okay, well, like, well, then what?


Right and funny, I said between mindfulness and practice and shifting sort of the way that we think is the next step. But one of the, again, tools that you can use, which I think you're also I hear you saying is is just get curious, because getting curious as you're getting the evidence that you need or the data that you need to understand where that person is, and so instead of maybe even going in with it with anything, you could just say, Hey, what's going on? I noticed that you were kind of came in and very hasty fashion and sort of made a beeline to your office or your room or whatever to have your own space, he explained what's going on, like, a simple question like that gives already creates the space where you're like, I don't even even I don't, I'm not going to tell myself anything, I'm not going to feed myself any narrative, I'm just gonna go get information that I need, because I recognize that I could feel that there was something happening here in this situation.


And again, it that does not come naturally to us. It's like that takes practice, that's where curiosity to me in almost any situation is so much more beneficial, because it eliminates the need for you to even have to think about whatever it is, you're just getting the real information from whatever the source, and then you can work with that. If it is, if it doesn't include you, hey, let's talk about it. Let's talk about this. Because I want to make sure that we're both in a great place or in a better place. So how do we work together to do that, and I mean, it sounds simple. But again, none of us I think, are really armed like this, we're not armed with this type of information, and that it's powerful leadership from a place of curiosity. As always, it's empowering. It is empowering by nature, because the curiosity is the place of empowerment, you're not making any judgments, you're trying to stay again, as neutral as possible, until you have more information. Rather than imagine how many people's right days are ruined, because they already had themselves a narrative that a there's no evidence to support. And people can spend hours stewing and like they've built this narrative up. And it's like a bulldozer, like it'll literally just take over your day. And as you mentioned, then every interaction or anything that's happening during that time period, you may not even be showing up in the best way that you know is going to be really represents you and who you are, it's representing a part of you that when you think about it's kind of crazy, you're like, well, there's, it's just what I'm telling myself, that's all it is,


right? And you know, instead of those rose colored glasses or prescription lenses, we both have this lens of this crappy story. And so how can you show up to a meeting to a conference to a class that you're teaching truly your most authentic self ready to hold space for other people, if your mind is clouded by this narrative? And in this example, to have a really getting curious, what a great exercise in finding your voice and using your voice. So often, we just want to shrink and be quiet and not be heard. But when we speak up in curiosity, and with compassion, that's when we really start to open doors to change culture, in the organizations which we exist in.

Absolutely. That's why it's so important. I feel like it's, you know, again, a lot of narratives are happening based on information that we're just telling ourselves the which, again, there's no evidence to support. And that's leading teams of people, groups of people, whoever you're interacting with a down a certain path. And is that optimal? No, that probably isn't optimal. Imagine if your conversations in any work environment, were kind of bound by this idea of curiosity and compassion more, what would you need to do? If you're listening out there? What would you need to do in order to step into that space where you, you can have more curiosity and compassion in your data thing? And the conversations that you're having?


You know, one thing that comes to mind right away is ego, you know, a lot of people and this is also just a human thing. This is the job of our ego, right? We just need to be right, because when we're right, then it's safe. And so how do you talk with people who are kind of navigating that? Because that can be an obstacle in curiosity is just kind of telling your ego to just take a back seat place?


That's a great question. And it's a tough one. It's, yeah, I mean, to me, that's the idea of ego is also a place where I think it does shut things down. I think it's rather than creating an open space where people can feel comfortable, safe, and open to be able to share what they want. That also creates, I think, cultures where you get into, you know, like, the guests type of cultures where people are just saying yes to people, even though they may disagree or have a differing opinion or perspective, but because you know that that person is so attached to what they believe it should be, or what you know, being right, this idea of being right, that's a false narrative as well, I'll tell you that because one question that you can always ask yourself is, well, what's your measure to know that you're right?


How are you measuring? And you know, with evidence that you're right, and in most circumstances, when you stop and have someone that it just sort of shuts it down? Because you're like, well, there is none. And so to me, then it's well, then it's just what you think you're saying is what you believe to be right. But that doesn't mean that it is it just means that that that's what you think, and that there's five other people in this room that may be thinking other things, and wouldn't it be beautiful to be able to listen to five or other perspectives at the same time? And so that we can choose what might be the best. Honestly, it's a very stressful place to operate from, if you're running around thinking that I need to be writing, I have to be writing, trying to control all of that. It's just, it's exhausting. I mean, it is an exhausting place to operate from. And there's a lot more ease and beauty.


And just sort of taking a step back. And being an understanding that I'm going to share my own opinion, because I do have an opinion as a leader. And so I'm going to put that forward. But I also recognize that that's exactly what it is. That's not that I'm right. It's just what I think. And I want to engage other people. Because in that sense, right, what do you think the stronger just one person always been saying what they think it is? And then that's it, end of story? How is that really moving things forward and creating a better culture or a better environment or a smarter environment? You know, I mean, I think great leaders in any area, recognize that they're like, You know what, I have amazing people that work with me, I want to listen to them. That's why they're here, too. And that builds respect, collaboration, all of these, the dynamic is so different, and the outcomes are going to be so different depending on like you said, if someone's just really attached to that idea of being right, there is no right just swinging thing.


Well, that's right. You're right. That's right. But you know, that is really fundamental to creating these cultures of kindness and compassion as going back to really what it is that you do in this world is helping leaders and organizations get there, that curiosity piece is, is really just the seedling to all of the things it sounds like


it is I mean, I think the other thing I would put out there is we talk a lot a lot about like the the scenarios that we're playing out in terms of this idea of what we think then also correlates to like what we feel it's really important that I think, you know, most leaders out there understand that it shouldn't be something that you're looking at in terms of your performance, like what you feel should be a measure of how effectively you're leading yourself and those around. Can you say that one more time for the people in the back? Yes. So one of the primary measures in any environment should be how you're gearing as it relates to your ability to effectively lead people. So you should be understanding what you're doing. And that should be a measure. And your weekly when you have dashboards are whatever you're using to measure your success.


And if you're out there, constantly dealing 60% of the time in a week that you're overwhelmed, stress, anxiety, there's all of those things that are going on in your mind. And that's where you're kind of operating from, to me, that would be a sign that I'm like, you know, what, what's the opportunity for me to actually be a better leader? And all of this because no one wants to feel that way all the time. I don't know when person that's like, you know what, bring it on. Like, I want more stress than anxiety. Just bring it on? I love it. But I can take it from 60% to 90%. No, most people are like, I'm tired. I don't want to feel this way. Yet. What they don't understand is they're the answer to their own prop conundrum, you technically are the one making yourself feel this way no one else is. And so I think there's also a notion of accountability there as well, you know, that did does take a pretty big person to be able to understand that that's the case. And to sort of step into that taking responsibility for themselves and what they really want.


Yes, and at the end of the day, that is social emotional learning that needs to take place. That is the social emotional learning that never ever stops. That is the learning that we get to use and provide examples for as the adults in the rooms to show our kids what it means to be human, and live a life feeling great. And when we're not how to navigate through that so we can feel great, and do the things we want to do in this world. That's it. It's simple, but it's not easy. It's that's it?


It is like you said, This just needs to be I think more people that they would allow themselves to step into it. That notion of accountability. There's just such a lighter place that you could be operating from more of the time, it's not that you're never going to not experience some frustration or anger or whatever, that's totally normal and human. But if you're living in that space, it certainly is going to have patience on how you're living your life and where you're at in your life.


Yeah. 100%. So I end every episode of take notes with the same question. What is your dream for the future of education?


I think my dream is based on my own experience, which is I wish that every child has the ability to really understand and explore who they are in an environment that is bound by kindness, love, compassion and respect, so that that child has the ability to a understanding embody that themselves and not feel like they're being judged, but to also be able to then understand better for themselves what that even means. I mean, what a beautiful gift to give a young child, which is the space and the beauty and the love that allows them to flourish, versus perhaps creating a different environment where the child starts to second guess themselves, or like you said, pull us back, where disengagements for, that's what's going to meet some really amazing, beautiful leaders in this world. And so I think that's my desire is that every child would have that hopefully ability to have that experience, yet the adults, you're a part of this equation. And so that's why your role is so powerful and critical. And all of this.


Yes, absolutely is. And this is really how we get started doing that. So thank you for sharing your time and your expertise with us. It's been a real pleasure talking with you today, Kevin, thank you for having so if you liked today's episode, be sure to leave a fantastic review. And we'll see you next time on take notes.


Incredible write together we can revolutionize the face of education. It's all possible. And it's all here for you right now. Let's keep the conversation going and empowered educator faculty room on Facebook.

Where are health and nutrition on your list of priorities?

Does the idea of losing weight and getting healthy feel more like a roller coaster ride than a path to teacher well-being?

When you start looking at food through the lens of fueling your body and get out of the dieter's mindset of lack and scarcity, it starts to become an integral part of your well-being as a whole person.

But, how can you shift your mindset for good?

Welcome to episode 17 of the Take Notes podcast with Jen Rafferty! In this episode, I’m speaking with weight loss coach for teachers, Sonia Dhaliwal. She helps teacher moms lose weight through self-care and exploring how their unique bodies work- rather than a one size fits all approach.

Sonia believes in getting back to basics through learning which foods fuel AND help you shed some pounds. She feels that if you're going to be on your feet all day delivering engaging lessons and then run home to your own children, you need to figure out what's going to give you sustained energy!

Teacher self-care is incredibly multifaceted- and nutrition and health is a piece of the empowered educator puzzle.

Today is all about aligning what you say with your habits! We’re taking a whole body approach for the long term, no longer just worrying about losing weight- but truly taking care of yourself.



Stay empowered,

Jen


Let’s keep the conversation going! Find me at:

Click here to learn all the ways you can work with me:
 Jen Rafferty | Instagram, YouTube, Facebook | Links
Instagram: @jenrafferty_
Facebook: Empowered Educator Faculty Room


About Sonia:

Sonia Dhaliwal, a weight loss coach for teachers, is all about helping teacher moms struggling with the weight loss roller coaster. She helps them lose weight for good with one-on-one coaching. She believes in finding foods that help teachers feel fueled, learning ways to sneak in some self-care, and exploring how areas off the plate can affect the progress of one's weight-loss goals. Sonia feels that if you're going to be on your feet all day delivering engaging lessons and then run home to your little cherubs waiting for you, we need to figure out what's going to give you your second wind. Teacher Moms deserve to be in front of students with all the confidence in the world and overhear their own kiddos say things like, "Mom is so much more fun now that she plays games with us!" Getting back to basics and learning which foods fuel you, but also help you shed some pounds are the go-to strategies in all of Sonia’s training and core philosophy.


Connect with Sonia here:

Instagram: @wildheartmommas

Facebook: Wild Heart Mommas

Website: Holistic Health Coaching | Wild Heart Mommas

TRANSCRIPT:   
Our health and nutrition sometimes get pushed super low on the totem pole of our priorities, and losing weight and getting healthy can feel a bit like a roller coaster. But my guest today shows teachers a new path to health and well being Sonia Dali, well believes that we need to look at food through the lens of fuel, because this is how we get out of a dieters mindset and take a look at nutrition as an integral part of our overall well being as a whole person, you are definitely going to want to take notes for this episode. And after you listen, be sure to check out break time, which is the monthly empowered educator subscription that gives you access to an incredible video library of self regulation strategies as well as monthly group coaching calls with me. So head on over to empowered educator.com/resources after the show.


Remember all the passion and vision you had when you first went into teaching. Feeling like building young minds and creating community through your work would make a lasting impact on this world? Well, those days may feel like they're behind you now because you're exhausted, stressed and overwhelmed and frustrated. But I'm here to tell you it doesn't have to be like this. In fact, the love of teaching never really went away. But it absolutely needs transformation. Welcome to The Take notes Podcast. I'm Jen Rafferty, former music teacher, mom of two and certified emotional intelligence practitioner, and I'm here to light the way for you. In order to create a generational change for our kids. We need to shift the paradigm away from the perpetual stress and overwhelm and into a life of joy, and fulfillment. This is education 2.0, where you become the priority, shift how you live your life, and how you show up both at work, and at home. So take a sip of steamy morning coffee and grab your notebook. It's time to take notes.


Hello everyone and welcome back to another episode of take notes. I am Jen Rafferty, of course, and it's so good to share with you this spectacular guests that I have today. This is Sonia Dhaliwal, and she is a weight loss coach for teachers, and is all about helping teacher moms struggling with the weight loss roller coaster, she helps him lose weight for good with one on one coaching and believes in finding foods that help teachers feel fueled, learning ways to sneak in some self care and exploring how areas off the plate can affect the progress of one's weight loss goals. This is such an important conversation to have.


Because there are so many of us who are on this journey to get really healthy with our bodies. You know, when we talk about self care and empowered educator world, it is so multifaceted nutrition and health is a piece of that puzzle. It's really easy to kind of get into a rut about what we're eating, I know that we oftentimes just eat the same things or we eat for convenience. And so while we say we want to lose weight and get healthy, oftentimes our habits tell us or dictate what we do otherwise.

So I'm really excited to have this conversation today. Thank you so much, Sonia for being here. Thank you, Jen for having me on. Very excited to be here. I would just love to go, you know how you got started on this journey. And what led you here to making this part of your passion in helping teachers getting healthy this way? Yeah, I have a background in elementary education have been teaching a little over 11 years, you know, kindergarten all the way through sixth grade, I loved working with them, but have always kind of in the back of my mind been playing a lot with health, especially in the weight loss realm, I would find myself driving to school listening to podcasts or books on audio, a lot about weight loss, trying to figure out if there was some kind of secret that's out there that I just didn't know about. It's been a struggle probably since I was back in elementary school, always very well aware of my body size, being a bit larger. Having kind of that background, even in our house of just always having dieters mindset going on, and just noticing that that struggle was kind of consuming a lot of my everyday activities.


My Wake Up Call was actually during my second pregnancy where I battled preeclampsia, just in the last weeks, you know, where you have the high blood pressure and the one way to deal with that is unfortunately inducing labor. That was the one thing I didn't want to go through again, I had it with my daughter, but they didn't suspect it would happen. So we didn't really prepare for that. And as I'm laying there kind of having these thoughts in my head, I said this is it enough's enough. This was not what you anticipated. And I feel like this was in my control to an extent even though I have doctors saying there's nothing you could have done to prevent this episode after I'm done.


and kind of having him and getting back home, it's time to do some research and see if we can kind of figure out was there something that could be done. And as I came home, I started researching a little bit about preeclampsia noticing that women who are obese tend to have a higher chance of having that happen to them, unfortunately. And that's where it just kind of hit home. It was like, Okay, now it's no longer just you now this is affecting your family, and what's going to happen in the long run.

And I started to hear it about heart complications that can come up after you've battled preeclampsia. And I sit down, like, I'm ready to be here for them forever. I want to see their kids someday, this has got to change. And so I started kind of looking around at different nutrition schools, I found the Institute for Integrative Nutrition, loved their model loved the fact that they were really trying to help people get out of the dieters mindset looking at true Holistic Health. And so the thought started, well, maybe I was never really, truly taught what I should be eating, what I should be doing to take care of myself. So I joined I said, Well, I'm home nursing him, the other one's going to be going off to preschool, I've got time. So I started studying really got into it started kind of playing around with the idea of health coaching.


And I said, You know what, there's women that need this, there's women that don't know these concepts. And fortunately, that I'm being taught a lot of people just see calories in calories out. And it's just that mindset shift that just kind of all of a sudden was like, we're taking care of the whole person here. And as soon as I started thinking that way, I didn't have to start measuring things on my plate any longer, I started playing with all these different ways of eating, and the weight started coming off, you know, I would journal but it was journaling in a new way. And as soon as I started thinking in this kind of whole body concept for the long term, no longer just worrying about the losing of weight.


But truly, what are you doing to take care of yourself, the pounds started coming off. And as I started thinking about that, I thought about educators, and I thought of a lot of the educators that I've been around my entire life, and the talks we'd have in the lunchroom, you know, we'd all sit down with our salads, and somebody's doing keto, somebody's doing paleo, everybody had their talk about that. And I said, we could use this, even an education teachers could use that extra support all around the place. And that's kind of what brought me full circle back into working with educators. Because I just feel like especially in the past couple of years, they've just been pulled through knot holes. And I said they need that support.


And so that kind of what led me back to working with teacher moms and helping them accomplish some of these goals and learn how to truly take care of themselves so that they can lose the weight and actually feel comfortable again, that's fantastic. And that's something that was immediately why I was kind of drawn to you and why I wanted to have you on this podcast is because you do focus on educators. And it's such an interesting spot to focus on. Because, again, educators need as much support as they can get, and community and a way for them to just feel as if they can lean on that community.


And we need to build that it's so nice to hear there are these pockets of people who are building community for educators to really focus on themselves. So they can show up as their best self to teach the kids and have the impact that they want to make. There are so many things that you said that I wanted to hit on. But the first thing is your mindset at the beginning of your journey of always thinking that there was this secret that you are missing. I think that's really an important thing to talk about. Because oftentimes when we're in this lack or scarcity mindset, we're thinking to ourselves, Well, if I just did this one thing, I just feel like I'm missing it. But you seem to have discovered that the secret was actually something that you knew, and you had in you all along. Is that accurate? Yes. I think it was just that, like you said, The Secret being is there one certain way to do this.


And I think just hearing it's going to be different for everybody was almost like a sigh of relief. You know, everybody keeps seeing these ads. And I'm going to try this. I'm going to try this. And I think just knowing that it's not like you do this kind of like it's my fault, unfortunately, game in your head. And finally realizing that No, it's not. It's just you haven't been shown in this way, was just a definite breath of fresh air to hear that. Yes. Perhaps the secret if we're going to call it that is that this is a skill set that needs to be learned explicitly. And you have to discover a skill set that works for you.


Yep, all about that we call it term I learned was bio individuality at IGN. And it's just this what works for you may not work for me and it's okay. Right. And it is all perfectly beautifully. Okay. You know, the other thing you talked about is this dieters mindset and I would love for you to just take some time to explain that a little bit because I think that's so much a part of the air that we breathe that we don't even know that we're in this mindset. To me, it's this idea of kind of the good food versus the bad food whether it's been counting calories for years, or porn


Eat, or even just growing up in a way where people would put food on your plate and say, Well, if you don't eat your veggies, you're not going to get your dessert and this clean plate kind of group that some of us grew up with this idea that these veggies this produce, these are the good foods, but you're not going to get that dessert because it's kind of termed because of the high calorie content or the sugar level to it. No longer is it just about the nutrition, but it's really about what's it going to do to your body, you know, it's going to plump us up. So we shouldn't be eating these kinds of things. And the more you hear it in the house, even just subtly, it's amazing how we pick up on that. And for years, we hold on to it even even on weekends, I'll still kind of feel myself thinking about well, should I have that little piece of birthday cake at the party? Well, what's it going to do to me? Yes, you know, you can choose to have it, but you need to be thinking about, well, what's it doing truly to me? Does it feel okay, after a habit.


And so teaching that idea of we're gonna start to kind of go more inward, and not so much just be thinking about this good food versus bad food mindset. Because we grew up with that. I'm so glad you said that. Yeah, I mean, all of that resonates with me, I remember being a kid and watching my mom either count calories, or points as a kid preteen, even before that, now that I'm thinking it was all of those things that you're saying are completely resonating, it was finish your plate, there was some shame or guilt about that too, right. And that just again, no fault of our parents, they grew up with parents who are the generation of the Depression, you didn't waste anything, you know.


So even those generational values about food are dripped down to us. So we inherit them whether we realize it or not. But you're totally right, that that affects the way that even now as I consider myself, someone who has done the work around nutrition and food, and I have like a whole team, I like my nutritionist, and I have my chiropractor, and I have my fitness trainer, you know, like all of these people, but even still, it's so deeply ingrained in us of the negative feelings that are attached to food. And I really like what you said is if you're going to make a choice, it's about going inward. And does this feel good? That's a huge shift. looking inward. Yeah, very much. So. So how do you teach that when you're working with clients? How do you talk about going from the external calorie counting, and points and whatever other system you're going for carbs, you know, whatever,


you know, to the list fat, right? And remember, the whole sat breathing? was a thing, you know, how do you then shift it to what's happening introspectively, I introduced them to a concept called crowding out. And I really, in the beginning, it's a lot of weeks focusing on instead of taking off of our plate, let's try putting some of these things that we know can be really wholesome, nutritious food for us on the plate, so really pushing for a lot more produce and saying, you know, it's okay, if you're gonna make that beautiful, cheesy, layered lasagna. But let's really focus on what's on this other half of the plate, let's get some roasted broccoli on there. Let's get some fruit on there.

I feel like we do it with our little ones at home. And we forget to do it on our own plates, unfortunately. And just this idea of, we're slowly going to get more of this nutritious food on our plate, and I want you to start paying attention to how do you feel after that meal. So I give them a little food journal where they can just kind of quick jot down, do I feel bloated after this? Do I feel energetic? Could I go get some movement? And after? Or am I so full, I have to go sit down for a long period of time. So really teaching them to kind of journal and I even in the beginning give them kind of more of a little grid that they put like little smiley faces or things that if they can't have the time, because some of us I know are so on the go and busy or have done who tracking for so long, unfortunately brings this whole negativity to it.


So shifting it and really focusing on how can we really quickly just evaluate how do we feel before the meal, you know, what's our hunger level? And then how do I feel after and if after I had that sandwich, I'm noticing I'm really tired in the afternoon, maybe we need to start swapping some things that are on that plate and I slowly get them to start doing some more healthy swaps. After they start to understand this idea of that crowding out just so just really starting with, we're not going to take stuff off, or we're going to really start to focus on what do I have, what can I add? And how do I feel after that is so important.


And I think that awareness is everything. Like you said, sometimes a new program or new initiatives seems really cumbersome. And there might be a past history with some negativity about it. Or it's like, oh, this is just another thing now that I have to do. But I think again, it's just changing that mindset, as you said of prioritizing that evaluation. Because if you're truly make your body your number one priority, there would be no question that you would take a moment after a meal. There's something that you were committing to, to evaluate what's going on and that's I think


Also the difference between being interested in something and being really committed to doing something. Absolutely, it is about getting that right cap on in the morning and thinking about, I am going to start to put myself first I am going to take a moment to pause and understand what's happening, whether it needs to be food wise, or even movement wise fitness people, I feel like start to tune in with that piece and realizing what should I work on today, because this feels kind of sore. And just really treating this as your number one priority, right. And it's again, living with that intention, which is really all about what empowered educator is about it's having this idea of who you are now, but more importantly, where you want to be, and then making decisions that align with your future self, not your current self. Because if your current self had all the things, you'd be there.


Yeah, you have to continue to make those decisions. And that means being really intentional, when you get up in the morning is waking up and being that person, what would that person do? That person would take a moment after an evaluate how I'm feeling and multiple times throughout the day. The other thing that I think is important here that I'm assuming here that you work on with your clients is changing that perspective of putting yourself first because especially as women, mom's teachers, and if you're all three, and of course, men experience this too, but women experience is at a much different level, shifting from being the martyr and being a selfless person to everyone else in your life to wait a second, I now need to shift my mindset to I am my number one priority.


That's a huge radical shift. So how do you talk your clients through that process? That's one of the pieces that we do probably kind of as they're starting to feel more comfortable with the food piece, we start talking about what I call the primary foods, and those are the things off the plate, what are the things that bring us joy? How do we feel about our career at the moment? How do I feel about the physical activity I'm getting in the day, and I explained that this is just as important as what's on the plate. And that's probably the piece that when I first start with the client, they're a little bit more hesitant on because they feel Hey, my circles complete, we do a little activity called the circle of lights.


And they evaluate how all of those pillars are and how do I feel in the current moment? Is it a complete circle? Or is it looking more like a fancy cobweb and there's some areas that I need to go back and look into, I think we forget just how much that affects what's coming on that plate, that motivation piece in the morning, you know, we just especially as educators have this, you know, gumption and this, I can do it all, I'm not going to do it, who else is going to do it, and it comes out in the home very strongly as well. And you know, it's great that we're go getters, but I think we're just so much into that we, like you said just kind of forget to take care of us and to put that cap on in the morning and say that we do need to start thinking about what's going to help us get through that day.


And I like to tell clients, I want you to imagine what it's going to look like six months from now, who is that woman going to be? Let's start being here today. Start thinking you're there. Instead of that, oh, I wish I could wear that dress. But I have this pear shape and the audit. It's that negative self talk that starts in, we do go through that circle of life tool one by one, I have them evaluate it. And then if there's a spot that they feel like, I'd actually like to look into this area a little bit more, we can dive into that together, you talk kind of generally about what specific things are a part of that, that model that circle of life model that let's see joy is on there, your career, your physical activity, spirituality, relationships, you know, do you feel like you're getting that social piece time and even that relationship in the home, if you're married to somebody, a lot of kind of a social emotional piece is what's really being tapped into. Right.


And that plays a huge role. You know, if even if you're eating all the right things, but you're feeling stressed out all the time, you're not metabolizing them in a way that is helpful either. So that's a really important piece. And again, super aligns you know, with what we talked about here, it's well being and self care is not just one thing, it's real, holistic idea of who are you in that present moment? How do you feel and where do you want to go and having all those pieces aligned is really important.


So I want to know, for people listening, what's something that you can share that they can do today? Well, one of the things I like to offer I do kind of a little short, call it kind of like an E course it's four little videos with a handout with a lot of this just kind of briefly introduced and in each of the videos I do go over I call it my pillars of the weight loss piece, starting out with the concept of what is the problem with dieting, kind of looking back as to where am I coming from before I want to start this journey. And then we look a little bit into I teach the hunger cues and it's quite a lengthy little almost like a number line. Right? Teach them to look at it your bodies can go all the way from the negatives all the way to the positive


If the positive 10 be a way to fool to more of a neutral, yeah, I could think about food right now or I'm okay to all the way to the negatives of I need to have something my body, my blood sugar levels going all over. Because a lot of us, I think, have that fear of being hungry, and I'm trying to help us understand it's okay. Sometimes when you're hungry, that's just your body's way of letting you know what it needs, I do teach the process of crowding out. So kind of walking through of what you can start to make your plate look like. So just these tiny little steps. So it's not feeling that overwhelm. And then even just that body check, and I have like a little chart on this cheat sheet, we'll call it just a little one page handout of how you can start to track that today.


So it's just tiny little steps I can implement, it doesn't feel like this big, heavy shift that you have to make. It's just tiny little steps today, we can do believe it or not, that will actually start to kind of cue you into what's happening. And you can actually start to lose, believe it or not, in your first couple of weeks just paying attention to these things. Yeah. So you know, you're someone who's like, Oh, I'm kind of feeling stuck. And I think there's this negative feedback loop that happens, you know, at least for me, my go to is when I'm stressed or when I'm feeling activated by something, even if my kiddos are like having a day and they're just like, ah, and then my go to is go to the frigerator or go to the freezer. But my awareness of that has been a game changer.


Because now even if I'm walking, even if the door is open, even if my hand goes into the freezer, there's this moment now of awareness that I can then make a conscious choice. Is this something that I'm doing? Because I'm feeling good? Because I'm hungry? Or is this actually a stress response? Right? I have a lot of women come to me and say, what do you do about these cravings? And it's not just a black and white? Answer it it is going back into what's causing this what's happening right before it like you said, you know, the kids are acting out or I had a negative teacher evaluation when she came in to observe me today.


And there could be something actually causing this to happen. We walked through the steps of even just, it could be a family foods that I've had for years. And all of a sudden, I've said nope, can't have that anymore, because it's too high in calories or fat, or even something you just even hormonally might even just need in the moment, it's just your body's way of saying you need this. And maybe you do need to give it just a little dose of it. But a lot of them come to me scared, you know, and always craving this at night. Even just a simple fix up. Why don't we throw some more fruit on in the evening and your plate, maybe that's why you need that chocolate. At the end of every meal. You don't give yourself something truly sweet. And your body's saying hello, you've had a lot of salty food, give me something else. Now, you know, it's just the founder of the Institute for Integrative Nutrition says think of your body like computer. And I said he's right. You know, it really does send you messages.


It's just slowing down to get in tune with that. Absolutely. Because you're right. Their body sends us messages all the time. We're just terrible listeners. Yeah, yeah, there's just too much on the go. Right. And no one ever taught us or modeled for us the importance of listening to our body, which is again, why I think serving teachers in this way is so important, because not only are you allowing the teachers to then have enough space to hold for the children that they serve and the other people in their life. But we're also modeling a different way for our kids, right? We're showing them that there's something else that it doesn't always have to be, we don't listen to our body. They see the adults in their lives making that a priority.


And that's truly as the game changer. Absolutely. I feel like it's easy for us, especially as educators to go in and do that talk. But if we're not really living in ourselves, they're not going to whether it's the kids in the classroom, even your own kids, especially your own kids at home, they get to see the background of that and absolutely being that role model piece. Yeah, that is huge. And so I want to take it back to the faculty room for the like the lunch room for a second because it's the place where you know, when you describe that we all know what that's like, we're all sitting there with their salads.


And, oh, I'm having a little spray dressing because the dressing is very too much or like this one or this one. We're comparing recipes and whatever. We're all so familiar with that space. So if there's somebody who is actively making changes in their lives and surrounded by other people who are immersed in this dieters mindset, what are some ways that they can communicate or navigate those spaces when they're changing, but everyone else around them seems to still be in that lack and scarcity. dieters mindset, I actually had a gal this week, say as they're going back in for all these peds, the admins bringing lunch and I want to make healthier choices, but I don't want the talk to start. And I said a lot of us if we're not familiar with this, we're all going to come in with their own background knowledge.


We're all going to come in with just you know, unfortunately what we know and you can go back added a couple of ways you can make your healthy swaps of what's brought in. So you're not bringing something completely different. You know, like, I know that a lot of times districts will bring in, you know, subway kind of sandwich things. And we talked about have that if that does feel okay to you and you feel okay, having those items. And then let's think about some things you can tweak with it or bring something on the side, so that you feel like you're having that same food with your colleagues. But you also feel like you need something more to keep you going in the day.


And so you know, don't be afraid to share with them, I've decided over the summer, some healthier shifts that I can make. And I realized that when I'm having a salad with no dressing, that I'm not feeling full, you know, within an hour, I hit a slump, and I'm hungry and cranky, and I've decided that I need to try these things. And I'll let you know how it goes. You know, just I think putting it on yourself that you're trying something is okay to share that I feel like we tell our kids all the time to kind of use those iMessages. And don't be afraid to share that with them. And you know, there is no maybe specific name for what you're doing or philosophy necessarily, you can just say, um, you know, I'm trying out these new ways, and I'll let you know how it goes. And there's a lot of power in using our voice in that way. You know, and when you say it out loud, it's declarative.


Every time we say the word that lever lips are always declarative and affirmative, whether we realize it or not, we underestimate the power in that. And if that's comfortable to share, it's more for you almost for that other person. Yeah. And they may take interest. It's amazing. We hear about it, and we say, hey, maybe there's something I'm lacking, right? Being willing to try it and maybe have a little buddy system is always awesome, if it does work out that way. But you are going to have those people that have done all these different diets and say, you know, I'll tell you exactly what will work. And you've got to just kind of, unfortunately tune that out sometimes Sure.


Because at the end of the day, what other people think is none of your business. Right? And yours is really the only opinion that matters to you. Right? That's the most important opinion for you is your own opinion. But yeah, navigating that is definitely something to consider and always do what feels good, even if not means maybe not saying anything. It's got to feel good. And like anything else that's new or different. There's going to be levels of discomfort and growing pains as you kind of shift and expand into this new version of yourself, even as you're going through the process. And leaning into that is where the joy comes in. Absolutely. Well, that's fantastic.


And before we go, I would love to ask you the question that I asked, everyone who comes on this podcast is what is your dream for the future of education? Well, I would love to see teachers not thinking of it as selfish to start putting their needs first, whether it be being okay with taking off the least 510 minutes after the kids leave the bells done. Not feeling this need that I have to stay here for this many hours, not comparing themselves to the colleagues who are around them. And just knowing that I'm doing what I need to be doing right now for the season that I'm in and just not beating themselves up.


So that when you do return to the classroom, you're in this mindset of this positivity, this joy is radiating from you know, that these kids are attracted to they feel it, they're learning even as a career standpoint, after I go to college, I can do this job. And I can look how happy I'm still going to be. And just this understanding that the light at the end of the tunnel is bright and just radiating. And that motivation is just coming out of you so much because you take in that time to truly learn what you yourself need and knowing it's okay, if it's different from that colleague next door. Yes, that is a game changer. So you mentioned a mini course that they can take but I'm wondering if you can share how can people get in touch with you if they want to learn more about the work that you do or want to work with you? Sure.


So I've got a website that's called Wildheart mamas, I'm the founder of that. So if you go to www Wildheart Mama's and it's M O M M E s, that can be confusing.com, you can find out a little bit more about me there. And you can actually download a little jumpstart guide. It's called Teachers objective losing for the last time because that's what we want to do is be losing. And that's the end of this story of the life long journey. But it's going to be the end of that. And you can click get that free guide and I will email that right out to you. I do have a little community on Facebook. It's a Facebook group called weight loss for teacher moms. And that's a great way to kind of be introduced to I know for some listeners, they've never looked into health coaching and it's just kind of a nice way to dip your feet in gently and do a lot of workshops, challenges, a lot of content that I feel like is very valuable.


And it just kind of gives you some ways you can start now and if it feels like something that will be worthwhile and that you want to dive into deeper then you can start. Leave just direct message me on there. Or you can sign up for a free discovery call. And in that is a good spot where we can talk a little bit about my program and see if you know it's a good match to work one on one together, just so you've got that kind of accountability partner, it's not just going to be me meeting with you saying,


Okay, you're going to do this and this and this, and then we're done and you're cured for life. But it's really walking through the steps of what you're already doing what you want to start doing. So you've just got that person in your back pocket to always reach out to and I do keep in touch with my clients just almost, if it's not a daily basis, it's definitely weekly, we meet once a week, but then we chat in between, and they're sending me photos and asking questions. And we've got kind of a little text messaging system going. And that was one piece that I really wanted to offer. Because I knew that in the past, when I did programs, I might have a health coach, but we met once a week, and then we had our 15 minutes the next week, and it just there was a disconnect.


I couldn't do things in real life, because I felt like I had to do what she said. And we would only meet once a week and you need that person you can go to and ask things along the way. And I love to be that for my teacher, moms, oh 100%. And that is so valuable, just again, feel supported, where you can really lean in to this and lean on someone and I love coaching. Like I said before, I have a whole team, you know, I just mentioned a couple of the people, I have coaches in lots of different areas too, because you can't read the label from inside the wine bottle. You just You just can't. And so you need somebody who is looking at it from another perspective, again, not to tell you what to do, but oftentimes just reflect back to you on the things that you're doing and saying, and whether that's in the arena of health coaching or something else.


This is how we truly learn and grow and expand is by again, I'm gonna say leaning on community that that we built for ourselves. And there's something that's incredibly valuable in creating that and modeling that for the people in your life too. Yeah, amazing. Well, I am so glad that we had a chance to chat today. And I admire the work that you're doing. And it's very exciting. And the healthier we can be the longer we can be around and maintain a healthy longevity, not just in our careers, but in our lifetimes for our kids and our grandkids. So thank you. Thank you. I enjoyed getting to sit and chat with you. Yes, I know this will not be the last time that we chatted. That's right. Fantastic. So if you enjoyed today's episode and want to learn more about Sonia, go ahead and check out those podcasts notes at the bottom. And we'll see you next time on take notes.


Incredible, right? Together, we can revolutionize the face of education. It's all possible. And it's all here for you right now. Let's keep the conversation going at empowered educator faculty room on Facebook.

What does it mean to create safe and courageous spaces in school where students feel comfortable taking risks?

How can we encourage high achievers to use the creative arts to lean into the beauty of making messy mistakes?

Self care routines can come in many forms. But, few modalities help you tune into self trust and personal expansion like the arts.

Welcome to episode 16 of the Take Notes with Jen Rafferty podcast! In this episode, I’m speaking with Sharon Costianes. She has helped introduce freedom and mobility to people through her Feldenkrais practice at Body Song. She has worked with a wide variety of people: performers, athletes, elders, and children.

Sharon holds a Bachelor of Music from Ithaca College in vocal performance and sociology with a minor in theater and a certification from Feldenkrais resources in Manhattan, as well as a professional certification from the Feldenkrais guild of North America.

In this conversation, we dive deep into discovering the true value of wellbeing, how to get quiet, and empowering educators by reassuring you that it’s okay to give yourself permission to relax for a minute!

Today, it's all about breaking away from perfectionism, encouraging teacher well-being, and leveraging your own wellness to create safe and brave spaces for learning that support equity and inclusion!


Stay empowered,

Jen


Let’s keep the conversation going! Find me at:

Click here to learn all the ways you can work with me:
 Jen Rafferty | Instagram, YouTube, Facebook | Links
Instagram: @jenrafferty_
Facebook: Empowered Educator Faculty Room


Contact Sharon here:
Instagram: @sharon_costianes
Website: Flight Performing Arts
Click here for a special gift from Sharon: https://mailchi.mp/93fbb705d9fc/socialactiongift

About Sharon:

Sharon holds a BMu from Ithaca College in vocal performance and sociology with a minor in theater, certification from Feldenkrais Resources in Manhattan, as well as Professional Certification from The Feldenkrais Guild® of North America (2006). She has studied extensively and volunteers at the Clinic with Sheryl Field at the Field Center for Children's Integrated Development. She is also the founder and director of Flight Performing Arts in Ithaca, NY.

Sharon has helped introduce freedom and mobility to people with chronic pain, arthritis, as well as people recovering from injury, trauma, and surgery through her Feldenkrais practice at Body Song.

Sharon has been teaching private voice lessons for nearly 20. In that time, she has earned a reputation for being the “voice whisperer” helping each singer find their own unique sound. Possessing unique insight and skill into the physical organization of the singer, she can assess and correct tension patterns that hinder proper vocal technique quickly and effectively, allowing each student to find more power and ease with beautiful tone and sound quality.

Sharon has had the distinct honor of serving on the faculty at Ithaca College, and the Community School of Music and Arts, and as a guest lecturer at Cornell University. She is a regular theatrical director and music director with the Ithaca School District. She has taught classes and workshops for organizations such as local homeschooling groups, the Finger Lakes School of Massage, Bridges for Youth and Families Runaway and Homeless Youth Program, and Lifelong Senior Center.

She has worked with a wide variety of people: performers, athletes, elders, and children.

A graduate of Heartstone Herbal School she continues to work intimately with Kris Miller and Tammi Sweet where she regularly feeds the masses with healthy, delicious food. After 10 + years of requests, a cookbook is currently in the works!

Sharon has had the distinct honor of serving on the faculty at Ithaca College, and the Community School of Music and Arts, and as a guest lecturer at Cornell University. She is a regular theatrical director and music director with the Ithaca School District. 

TRANSCRIPT:  
What does it mean to create safe and courageous spaces in school? What does it have to do with self awareness? And how can we use the creative arts to process big emotions? Well, today I'm talking with Sharon cost Yiannis, and we address some of these very questions. We talk about how high achievers can lean on perfectionism and pressure, and leads us away from the part of us that can be creative and artistic. But leaning into learning into the mess in the mistakes provides an opportunity to create a sense of safety within these intellectual spaces. When we are truly embodied in mind, body and spirit. It is how we can perform and achieve as our best selves. And throughout her life experiences, she discovered a pathway for her own healing, and continues to light the way for others.

And if you're ready to move from surviving to thriving, head on over to empowered educator.com/thrive and sign up for the five week online course that will change the game for how you show up at work, and at home, start to feel less stress and more ease, less pressure, more calm, less frustration, and of course, more joy, it is time for you to thrive. So head on over to empowered educator.com/thrive. And I also want to mention that in this conversation, we briefly talk about some sensitive topics, including domestic abuse and suicide, please take care of yourself.

Remember all the passion and vision you had when you first went into teaching. Feeling like building young minds and creating community through your work would make a lasting impact on this world? Well, those days may feel like they're behind you now because you're exhausted, stressed and overwhelmed and frustrated. But I'm here to tell you it doesn't have to be like this. In fact, the love of teaching never really went away. But it absolutely needs transformation. Welcome to The Take notes Podcast. I'm Jen Rafferty, former music teacher, mom of two and certified emotional intelligence practitioner, and I'm here to light the way for you. In order to create a generational change for our kids. We need to shift the paradigm away from the perpetual stress and overwhelm and into a life of joy and fulfillment. This is education 2.0 where you become the priority, shift how you live your life, and how you show up both at work and at home. So take a sip of steamy morning coffee and grab your notebook. It's time to take notes.

Hello and welcome back to take notes. I am so excited to start this next episode and introduce you to a spectacular human. This is Sharon Kosta Yanis and she has a Bachelor of Music from Ithaca College where I also went to college in vocal performance and sociology with a minor in theater and a certification from Feldenkrais resources in Manhattan, as well as a professional certification from the Feldenkrais guild of North America and we're gonna dive into all about Feldenkrais and what that means and how cool it is and how helpful it will be for your overall well being. Sharon has studied extensively and volunteers at the clinic with Cheryl field at the field Center for Children's integrated development, and is also the founder and director of slight Performing Arts in Ithaca, New York. Sharon has helped introduce freedom and mobility to people with chronic pain or arthritis as well as people recovering injury, trauma and surgery through her Feldenkrais practice at body song, and has worked with a wide variety of people, performers, athletes, elders, children, and today, educators. And as a graduate of Hearthstone, herbal school, a cookbook is currently in the works, which I'm so excited to hear about that too. And as part of all of the things that she does do, we're going to talk especially today about how we can engage in self care, develop our own sense of self awareness and leverage our own wellness to create safe and brave spaces for learning that support equity and inclusion in all of our places and spaces. So thank you so much, Aaron, for being here with me today. Thanks for having me, Jen. I'm so excited for this conversation. And I'm so excited for the work that you do. Thank you. Yes. And it just let you know, I'm reading your bio, and isn't just cool. Just sit back and listen and be like, Yeah, that's me. It's true.


Right? I mean, you are a powerhouse. And I am so excited to dive into some of these things. You can share your expertise with me and obviously everyone listening. So I'd love to start with your journey into self awareness. I too have been on this journey of my own self awareness for many years. And everyone kind of gets there differently and at different times in their life. So what was it like for you and how is that really inspired the work that you do now? That's a great question. Thank you. I mean, I feel like my journey of self awareness starts a long, long, long time ago when I was a teenager actually.


My home life wasn't great. I grew up in an abusive home as something that I don't talk about much. I'm just starting to talk about a little bit more unrecognized for myself how connected it is to the arts for me as a person, and also the importance of safe space in the arts for kids as an educator. So growing up in an abusive home, I remember hiding under a blanket with my sister on the stairs, listening to my parents fight. At some point, my mom and my sister and I fled. And nobody knew. I was one of those kids who was like in gifted and talented programs and participating in every single music ensemble. I played the trumpet and the French horn and sang in the choir and in the Select choir and was a prisoner of the drama club. Like I was outwardly, this super high functioning kid with great grades who was involved in a whole lot of extracurriculars. And meanwhile, I was in a ton of pain. I was suicidal, I was self harming, and the arts was the place that was safe for me. In theater, I could explore a literally scripted version of how people work out issues, right, it was so comforting to know that there was a beginning, middle and end, and I didn't have to figure it out for myself, the playwright had already figured that out. And I could have big feelings on stage. I was incredibly therapeutic. And similarly with music, it was more about emotions, and less intellectual storytelling, I think as music is, it was my escape. It was how I didn't have to be home because I was involved in all of these other things. So I didn't have to face the pain at home. And so that kind of led me that's why, you know, I started therapy. But luckily, my parents knew enough to get me talking with somebody to help me stay alive. And so that was kind of the beginning of self awareness and a deep connection to the arts for me. I then went to study music at Ithaca College and studied with Carol McCain s who is also a Feldenkrais practitioner and an amazing hero. Yes. Got here eventually do good. Yeah, she's a magical human. And so I started doing Feldenkrais work and knew that like, oh, it's making me a better singer. Great. And it can be really transformative for singers. And it was for me, but it wasn't actually until I graduated from college. And I was like, any good musician with a music degree and performance, I was working as a barista, and waiting tables.


The gig, right?


Like, I'm a musician, I'm gonna go work in service. That's what we do. So I threw my back out. And I had a history of chronic back pain. You know, it was like before, people were still on their parent's insurance until 21, or five, or whatever it is. So I had no health insurance, I had no means of making money. I couldn't walk for like a week. And I panicked and called Carol and said, Is there anything I can do at home, tell me some movement that I can do. Help me out. She said, just have somebody throw you in the car and bring you down here. And so I hobbled into her house, I could barely move any of the joints in my low back. And I spent about a half an hour on her Phil and Chris table and walked out of her house. And I went, Whoa, wow, this is way more than just, I'm a better singer, something just happened. To me. That was pretty transformative. And it wasn't completely pain free. That took a lot more work. But it was a huge moment for me. And it totally changed the trajectory of what I thought my life was gonna look like as a 21 year old. So I went to study Phil and Chris work over the course of those four years. I mean, it's all self awareness. And that's the beautiful thing about Feldenkrais is that while it's a movement practice, and it looks like body work, it's really about neurology, and how it is that we learn to be in ourselves. So you can't like work on movement issues without working on all of your issues. Like it's all in there. I'm so glad you said that. Because that is the opposite of what I usually say in regards. You can't do mindset work without involving your body. And here you are saying you cannot do body work without involving your mind. And I just really want to highlight this, we so often forget, we have a body, we forget we have bodies unless they're in pain or with disease or illness, and then we're angry about it. But any sort of work that we're doing with the mind or the body has to be both. I'm so glad that you said that. Absolutely. And I think that as educators too, we have to create spaces in which our students can work intellectually, but also that their bodies feel safe. Right, if their bodies don't feel safe, they can't do the learning and vice versa. So it's huge. Yeah. So when I went into my Feldenkrais training, I had chronic back pain. I was severely overweight. I was also married to a man and got married right out of college to my high school best friend who was a dear human and I adore to this day, but in the course of these four years, I lost it.


80 pounds, discovered that I'm gay, got divorced, and feel my back pain. And so it was this like, all of life just shifted. Still in therapy, my mental health was much better. And I have to say that level of awareness, that self awareness and taking the time to be embodied, because I had to, because for my education,


it changed everything about the way I think about music, everything about the way I think about teaching how I think about interacting with other people. And it's the lens that I have looked through as a teacher for the past 20 years. It's the lens that I looked through as I created flight, performing arts and really expanding into all of the performing arts and supporting an environment for kids to be expressive, so much of that I can go so many different places with it, because there's so much juiciness. First of all, thank you for sharing your story, because again, I think we were talking about even before we started recording is that, the more we share, that's where the connections happen. And so I receive that, and I'm grateful that you shared here and with everyone, and how beautifully important that is even to just set an example of that being okay for other people to share. Thank you. Yes, that's huge. And then taking that pain and turning it into something beautiful, and discovering a pathway where you can not just heal yourself, but allow people to come to their own healing. That's huge. So flight performing arts, can you talk a little bit about that, and how you're able to do that through the vehicle of arts, flight, performing arts, my voice students, I'm primarily a voice teacher, I have voice students who are really were pre professional musical theater singers, and doing really high level work and auditioning for programs that have a two and 3% acceptance rate. And getting in, I'm happy to say I'm proud to say they did the work, they did it, but it's intense. And they didn't have ways to work in dance that supported them also being on stage and doing shows, they didn't have acting training, they just had voice lessons with me.


And so I went, Oh, they need this. So we created flight Performing Arts in 2017. And it's a space where kids can and adults can take dance class and acting classes and summer camps and voice lessons, pre pandemic times had masterclasses special workshops and wellness classes. And the idea is that it's a safe space, equity and inclusion is super important. training staff to be responsive and inclusive is super important at flight. And we're doing pre professional work and really challenging and trusting kids with hard work in the performing arts. And at the same time, saying to them, this is an environment where you can take risks, this is an environment where you can be brave. And we're going to find this high level of performance. But without perfectionism. Without this, like Dr. Of the teacher is always the expert. We know a lot of things and we can share a lot of things as teachers. And we also can learn a lot of things from our students. That's a huge part of flight. And so there's the teaching and the technique, and that is as high level of work. And then there is this environmental piece, which is very intentional, and creates learning in a way that I think is in some ways unique to the arts and also sometimes elusive for us in the arts. Because there is this history and this tradition of performing to a high standard like that perfectionism of you have to practice, practice, practice, and it has to be perfect. In order to be relevant in order to be competitive in order to get into that two or 3% acceptance rate school, the pressure of that level of performance can let us forget what it actually means to be creative. And we can override the parts of ourselves that we need to trust and have faith in and make space for in the creative space. So then we find ourselves really technically perfect, but not with a lot of artistry. Right, and we actually need both. So if we can get rid of the perfectionism if we can create safe space where mistakes are good mistakes, we learn from them, and we celebrate them. Sometimes we do the mistake on purpose actually, so that we can learn from it in a way that detaches it from self worth. Right? You're still a good human, even though you made a mistake. You're still loved, you're still wanted, you're still valued here. And then we'll just get curious about it. We'll play with it. And then ultimately, we're going to discover something that helps us get to that high level of artistry that we never would have known was possible if we just ran away from the mistake from the beginning. Girl I'm like welling up here because it's true. You're hitting on so many things that I hold dear and if we just took out the word art for a second


and use just general education. This is it, you're describing my dream for the future of education. Because when we say the words mistakes are okay. But when we define success in the classroom as you how many hundreds or A's that you get, there is a disconnect. So not only are we creating places of pressure and perfectionism, we either have learners that can achieve without heart, or we turn kids off completely to their own learning, we're not actually getting to the meat of it, which is, again, like you said, trusting yourself, trusting the process, creating a space to have kids discover a means to their own learning and use the word artistry there, but I'm gonna say learning. And here's the rub. It's us, it's the educators who are doing this, and it's not your fault. And that's okay. It's not our fault, because we are products of our own experiences that were touched by us, you know, and this is why this podcast and having these conversations are so important is because we get to expose another paradigm and another way to function and be so we make this transformative generational change, which is the magic behind all of it. And the purpose of empowered educator in the first place. Yeah, absolutely. I think you're 100%, right. I mean, I know I feel it in my own body. Sometimes, the anxiety that comes from I'm about to do something different from what I was taught, like, I'm about to take a risk. And I'm about to ask the student to explore something that is not in the learning that I gleaned in college or grad school, or whatever it might be, it took me a long time to feel like we can experiment a little bit, not to the degree that like students are at risk, right? Like, it's okay for me to change the paradigm. It's okay for me to change and explore some new way of learning with my students, nothing changes, if nothing changes. Exactly. And you're the variable like you're the one that gets, but that's scary. And it's just scary, because it's different. And that's, I think, the rub here, that's important that when we bump up against these limitations or boundaries that we've put on ourselves, that go out of our comfort zone, there is going to be that element of fear, because that's just our biology keeping us safe and alive, which, great, you're doing a great job, we made it we're alive, we're here. But it's also preventing us from reaching our dreams, trying something different becoming our fullest potential, or even just, you know, as you were describing your own journey, having the journey of becoming, right. So in your experience, have you navigated that fear, as you've been expansive in your own life and your own work to be perfectly transparent. Sometimes I'm more successful than others, right? Like, Oh, perfect. Sure, yeah. Cuz you're a human. And that's beautiful, of course. And at the risk of sounding like a felon Christ fanatic, like, honestly, the process that you go through in a Feldenkrais lesson is so helpful to me because it's exactly this process, right? Yeah, walk us through in like a group class, you would lie on the floor, and I can still hear my trainers voice saying, Please lie on your back. I'm like my whole system, relax, relaxes. And then you go through the series of like, you do a body scan, you pay attention to where you are in space and time. And then you're given this instruction to like, move your arm, slowly, in a certain direction. And then you're just asked to do these little bits of movement. And the question that I love the most in that process, and that I asked my students in lessons also is and what do you notice, without attachment to it being better or worse? Just what do you notice as you explore this thing? What do you observe in yourself? How does your body change in its contact with the floor? How does gravity interact with your body? Are you breathing? Are you nervous? Can you stay present while you move? And so just those little questions of awareness, help me not get attached to the outcome, right? I mean, sure, I want my back to feel better. Of course I do. But because it's not constantly like, if you move your arm to the right, your back pain will get better. That's not the instruction and a Feldenkrais lesson. It's just notice, just notice what this is. And as the teacher at leading that lesson, I know that eventually we're going to come around, right? And I can imagine some possible outcomes for the lesson. But here's the really humbling thing as an educator is that almost always there's an outcome that I never would have anticipated. And people have these transformative experiences that there's no way I could have taken aim at and brought them to, but the process of just slowing down resting. Here's another important moment is like you do 30 movement.


And then you rest for 30 seconds. And then you do another few movements. And then you rest. And you notice, right? It's this very meditative sweet process, that model. Sometimes I put myself on the floor, so I remember how to do it. But that's the process that I take myself through, when I don't feel safe. Like, Okay, where am I in space and time? What do I notice? Where do I have ease? And where can I reduce the effort? What can I simplify? And that's just the next step. Yes, so all of that. Now, there's a couple of things there too. You know, first of all, that noticing is something that I talked about a lot, it's like, we're just kind of strengthening that notice muscle all the time, because you can't actually change something you don't notice. Sure. And we walk around, not noticing most things. And I'm the brains are wired for that, right? Essentially, how we make sense of the world is to develop patterns and habits so that we don't have to be deciding things all the time. It's too much for us to be having to process all of that constantly. So we create patterning and habits, and sometimes they serve us and sometimes they don't. But the intention is always good. It's always our body's trying to keep us safe. And in that separation of I am not my nervous system, this is happening really allows you to then also separate your own worth about it too, because it isn't about your own worthiness or your own value. It's your back hurts because your body's trying to tell you something and we need to be better listeners and what's happening and we can only listen when we notice. It's funny because as a former Hustler, go neck upper. As you're describing Feldenkrais. It took me right back to when I was a senior in college taking curls class, and me being like, what is this doesn't have time? No, whatever this crazy crap is, I'm going to just like sit and breathe a little like, what is this? You know, right. And it wasn't until relatively recently, within the last couple of years that I have discovered the true value to my own well being amount how to get quiet, and to notice and making these small movements and doing the breathing and this and that, and having permission to relax for a minute. So can you talk to that someone who is potentially new to meditation is new to Feldenkrais? How do you even get to a point where you're like, if you're so afraid to just stop, because what's going to happen, if I stopped, the world's gonna fall apart, if I stop, I can feel like that for sure. And I would say, you don't have to be perfect at it. If all you can do is stop for 30 seconds and stop for 30 seconds, it doesn't have to be a half hour. It's like there I meditate every single morning. Some days, it's five minutes, some days, it's 20. But what I noticed in myself is if I don't do it, then I'm like in this anxiety, we all and I don't feel like myself. I wake up early before my child is awake before my wife is awake, like it's quiet. And I just take the time to do it. And I think sometimes what gets hidden in there in not wanting to take the time is not wanting to invest in or maybe I'll say this a different way. So we don't quite believe that we're worth the time. Yes, yes, say more. So I'm reading and listening. And I've read this book many times. Now, the body is not apology by samruddhi Taylor. And it's all about radical self love, and how that can be transformative and change the world in these amazing ways. But it's such a good reminder for me that taking the time for myself is not only transformative for me, but it's transformative for the people around me. And so that investment in myself helps everybody else. And I need that reminder. Because I think like a lot of educators and certainly like a lot of women, I take care of a lot of different people. I'm holding space for a lot of different people. I'm supporting my families through all kinds of things, not just their educational process, but things that are coming up in their lives. And as a mentor to kids, especially when you create safe space for them. They tell you a lot of different things, right. So it's a lot to hold a lot to hold. And when I'm in the right space for myself, then I can do it without sacrificing myself. It's not at my expense. And I can still show up for them. Well, let's just sit because you can't hold space, if you're not in a place to hold space, right? Unless you start doing some of this work. You don't even know what that feels like yet. There's a whole world that's available to you, in a way of being that's available to you that you might not even realizing this kind of practice is a gateway into understanding how that's possible. Right? Yeah. And I think that it's also fair to say that sometimes when we stop and pay attention, what we notice is that we're on pinion and that's hard to face, right? It's not like oh, it's all sunshine and roses every time I meditate, right? Sometimes I show up and I'm like, Oh man, I'm really pissed right now. Like this thing that's happening in my personal life is really painful. I


I don't want to sit with that. Like, I don't want to be with that any more than I have to be. But I think for me, what happens when I do sit with it is that I do start to recognize what's me and what's not me? Where do I end? And where does the problem begin? And how can I give myself the self care and love and compassion, that I need to then approach the problem and solve the problem, again, without sacrificing myself, instead of just reacting? I guess, right, because you actually can't do that, unless you're centered and calm, your nervous system is safe, you are able to solve problems in a way that's helpful necessarily, if you're activated. And sometimes we don't even realize we're activated, because it's just again, in the air we breathe, especially since the pandemic, people wake up and are activated. Yes, they're animated in their sleep, because they can't sleep or they're having all these stress dreams, right? You can't find that quiet unless you create that for yourself. And like you said, Before, I want to reiterate it, you are worthy of that quiet, because one of the most fundamental principles of the work that I do is most generous thing you can do for other people is take care of yourself. Yeah, which is a radical idea in a lot of places that I go into, because as educators and like you said, also, as women, we tend to take on everyone else's stuff. But that leaves us feeling depleted and consistently pouring from an empty vessel. And it's not sustainable. Oh, for sure. And I think with my family background, the message that I got, in this kind of toxic environment that I was growing up in was everybody else's comfort is more important than your own. And so do sacrifice yourself as much as you possibly can, so that everybody else is happy, so that you're putting out the landmines so that nobody has to yell, and everybody can stay safe. But what that meant for me is that I did take it all on. And it was so painful that it was hard for me to figure out whether it was worth living another day. And so raising my own child, my daughter is nine, it is so important for me that she gets this message that you are the most important one to take care of. Right, you're not responsible for anybody else's feelings, you're not responsible for taking care of whatever difficulty they're having your responsibility is to yourself. And then everybody else will also be taken care of, but do not sacrifice yourself, for everybody else. I mean, I don't know how much more painful it can get when kids are suicidal and self harming and just gotta change. Imagine that that was the message. It wasn't math class. It's not science class. Class. We're here to teach you how to be a human being. Because we are on that journey, also as your teachers. And we're going to do that today through math through science, because if we're not doing that, we are perpetuating these problems. And we're not looking at them in a way that's helpful. And is it confronting? Yes. Does it always feel good? No.


End of the day, we're not healing our wounds, and growing and expanding as human beings. And then what are we doing? What does math mean? If we're not able to be whole? What does music mean? What does art mean? If we're not able to connect with that part of our humaneness, which is often why it gets so frustrated with the social emotional programs, like we spoke about before we were recording, it's like, you know, you can't teach Spanish if you don't have conversational Spanish skills. We can't teach social emotional skills unless we ourselves as the adults are able to embody them not just speak the words of empathy and community and kindness. It's actually self love. Putting yourself first and knowing that that is the truly the most generous thing you can do for the people around you. Yeah. And we're not going to be good at it sometimes. Yeah, that's right. Right, because like, I can go to that place where like, I can get perfectionistic about not being perfectionistic. Like, it's so bad. Like, why do I need a feedback loop there? Right, exactly. It's like, okay, well, I really have to hold space. So am I doing a good job being a good human? And I'm, like, no, just being able to say sometimes I'm sorry, I just made a mistake. My bad, no big deal. And I also then can't beat myself up, right? Like if I'm trying to teach my students not to beat themselves up because they've made mistakes. It means that I can't indulge myself in beating myself up when I've made a mistake. But the beautiful thing is that then it gets modeled for my students, right, who then are like, Oh, Sharon just made a mistake. And look, she's fine. We're moving on and maybe she doesn't have the answer, but she's gonna find it or like, however it gets handled, it gets handled. Yeah. And then sometimes I get afraid that then the conversation amongst my students or their parents is gonna be like, Oh, Sharon doesn't really know what she's talking about. It


Isn't that interesting? And so right and that's like just some of that old programming, right? Because even that indulging, isn't you, it's your old programming of beating above about being a perfectionist, you know, and even separating that like you yourself as this spiritual being having this human experience from like your biology is really important in this process to and you know what I love talking about, you know, when you get into that kind of space, it's that spiritual wellness of us as humans, that is in the neuroscience research, like it's really important here, because when I talk about some of the stuff, it can get high on the woowoo scale. Same and that all my listeners are like super high on the hoosegow. So it's also super, it was just cool, like, you know, deja zone. But I also want to just grounded and like, this is actual science. This is about how our brains work and the function of what we are as human beings, and being able to even just have some levity about it. Right. I think when people work with me, too, they think I go around singing Kumbaya with my kids. But like, it's not that my kids this morning, like it happens because we're human. But again, it's making that conscious decision, like, Okay, I'm human, I made a mistake, apologize for the things, acknowledging to my children that I am also human, I make mistakes, too. And it's learning for everybody. Because how we show up is how we model for the people around us. Yeah, for sure. I'm a big neuroscience geek, because again, like Feldenkrais can feel really woowoo. And what we're learning because there's a lot we don't know about the brain, like, there's so much that we don't know about the brain. But as we're learning more and more, especially recently, the science is really showing us that, yeah, there's a lot of conversation happening in these different parts of the brain that like signals are firing and triggering, from one to the next and to the next. And so mind body is actually a thing, right? It actually happens in our brain, we're not a mind or a body, or a spiritual being, or an emotional being like we are all of it all the time. And all of those different parts of the brain trigger other parts. And they're all in concert with one another at all times, right. And so, I know that there's many educators listening, who are not musicians, but I can go a long way with music metaphors, right, then when you have an ensemble of people, and you have all these different parts of your brain, and everyone is working together to create beautiful music. Sometimes when there's that one little thing that just gets off, then everything else just, it changes the entire experience. But if we can just stop and hold space for this one little thing that needs to just kind of align with everything else, then beautiful things happen that like bring us to tears, right? Yes. Oh, and we can totally go down a rabbit hole there. So yeah.


To be continued, I want to just ask you this last question, because it's something I asked everybody, because I think it's important that we share our dreams out loud. So that's the first step for them becoming reality. What is your dream for the future of education? My dream for the future of education is that every child feel safe and seen, and the spaces that they're learning in our safe spaces, and also brave spaces, where they can be challenged and invigorated and held as whole humans. And educators can also be seen and held and acknowledged as humans and administrators can be seen an L that acknowledges will humans, and will have compassion for our humanity and more connection, less pain. Yes, we're that. So how can people work with you get in touch with you? What's new? What's coming up next? Yeah, so I'm in the process of developing an online course. And one of the things that's going to be coming up soon, is a very exclusive opportunity to work with me live via zoom, before the course goes on autopilot, there will be an opportunity coming up to be able to do some of this work is grounded and felt in Christ, and coupled with self awareness. So it's doing gentle movement, helping your body feel better, and also really thinking deeply about who you are as a human, and what superpowers you get from just who you are. So there is a link that I'll share with you where people can get a brief short example of what that might be like a little Feldenkrais lesson, it's 10 minutes, when they sign up for my email list, and then they'll be on the list and can learn about how to engage in that exclusive class once it launches. Amazing. And all of that will be put in the podcast notes too. So it'll be super easy for people to access. I am excited for you. I'm excited for just where this is going and your new venture with this. This stuff really is important and needs to be shared. So I encourage folks who are listening, go ahead and check out share and stuff because it is juicy. Thank you. Oh, yeah, I'm excited. Thank you so much for spending your morning with me. I so appreciate you and this beautiful conversation we had and I'm looking forward to hopefully connecting and

doing some more of this great conversation. I would love that. And thank you so much for all of the work that you're doing in the world. I think it's huge and it's needed so deeply appreciative of you. Thank you everyone for listening. And if you liked today's episode, go ahead and write a great review. And we will see you next time on take notes. Incredible, right? Together, we can revolutionize the face of education. It's all possible and it's all here for you right now. Let's keep the conversation going and empowered educator faculty room on Facebook.

Students come into our classrooms with a multitude of different needs.

And, oftentimes you get an IEP or a 504- and then it's go time!

Problem is, teachers don’t receive any formal training on how to handle these needs in a way that fully supports the student and helps them flourish.

So, how do we come up with creative ways to teach self-regulation and executive function skills without it leading to frustration?

Welcome to the Take Notes with Jen Rafferty podcast! In this episode, I’m speaking with ADHD-academic and parenting coach, Leslie Josel. She is the founder of Order Out of Chaos, a virtual company whose mission it is to help parents guide their students to success in learning and in life.

Leslie is the creator of the award-winning Academic Planner: A Tool for Time Management®, the author of three books, weekly writer of “Dear ADHD Family Coach®” for ADDitude magazine, (the premier magazine for adults and children with ADHD), and speaks to audiences all over the world on the subject.

In our chat, Leslie describes her own experiences when her son was first diagnosed with ADHD- in a time when there was limited understanding and resources available to families like hers.

She shares how she made it her mission to “untangle” her son's world- and has been dedicated to defining systems and structures that would help other families do the same for the last 19 years.

Today, it’s all about understanding how the ADHD brain functions, and how to encourage purposeful action within your classroom environment.

The principles we discuss today are beneficial to all of us, and move us closer to students engineering their own path to learning.


Stay empowered,

Jen


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About Leslie Josel:

Leslie Josel, an ADHD-academic and parenting coach, founded Order Out of Chaos – a virtual company whose mission is to help parents guide their students to success in learning and in life - when her son was first diagnosed with ADHD.

She is the creator of the award-winning Academic Planner: A Tool for Time Management®, a planner that helps students develop time management skills, and the award-winning author of 3 books including the recently published, “How to Do it Now Because it’s Not Going Away: An Expert Guide to Getting Stuff Done.” (Lerner Publishing)

A respected resource on ADHD and Executive Functioning, Leslie writes the weekly “Dear ADHD Family Coach®” column for ADDitude Magazine, the premiere magazine for adults and children with ADHD. She speaks to audiences all over the world helping them utilize their resources to best navigate the task-driven world in which they live. Last year, Leslie’s line of student organizing products – a collaboration with Samsill Corp – was released.
And for the last six years, Leslie has been named by Global Gurus as one of the top 20 Time Management experts in the world.

TRANSCRIPT:   
teachers generally don't have much formal training on how to support neurodivergent students. And we also don't really have the supports in place in schools for the adults who are neurodivergent themselves. And while awareness is the first step in supporting everyone, we really need to do more. So today I'm speaking with ADHD academic and parenting coach Lesley Jo SEL, who is the founder of order out of chaos. And their mission is to help parents and educators guide their students to success, both in learning and in life. And lovely and I talked about her own experiences when her son was first diagnosed with ADHD in a time where there was really limited understanding and resources available to families like hers. She shares how she made it her mission to untangle her son's world, and has been dedicated to defining systems and structures that would help other families do the same for the last 19 years. I hope you enjoy our conversation as much as I did. And after this episode, be sure to check out break time, which is the monthly empowered educator subscription that gives you access to an incredible video library of self regulation strategies, as well as monthly group coaching calls with me. So head on over to empowered educator.com/resources Remember all the passion and vision you had when you first went into teaching. Feeling like building young minds and creating community through your work would make a lasting impact on this world? Well, those days may feel like they're behind you now because you're exhausted, stressed and overwhelmed and frustrated. But I'm here to tell you it doesn't have to be like this. In fact, the love of teaching never really went away. But it absolutely needs transformation. Welcome to The Take notes Podcast. I'm Jen Rafferty, former music teacher, mom of two, and certified emotional intelligence practitioner, and I'm here to light the way for you. In order to create a generational change for our kids. We need to shift the paradigm away from the perpetual stress and overwhelm and into a life of joy, and fulfillment. This is education 2.0, where you become the priority, shift how you live your life, and how you show up both at work, and at home. So take a sip of steamy morning coffee, and grab your notebook. It's time to take notes. Hello, everyone. And welcome back to another episode of take notes. I'm so excited to introduce our guests today because first of all the content is going to be absolutely amazing. This conversation is so important. But even beyond that, when I first got to know Lesley, it ended up with a lot in common we grew up in Long Island. We both lived in Ithaca and we both have this incredible Los Angeles connection. So Crazy, right? First of all, I'm just thrilled that you're here. Thank you so much for being here. Oh my pleasure. I'm so excited to be here. I it was like in magic because it really was just meant to be So Leslie is an ADHD academic and parenting coach and founder of order out of chaos, which is a virtual company whose mission is to help parents guide their students to success in learning. And in life, when her son was first diagnosed with ADHD is how this all started. She is the creator of the award winning Academic Planner, a tool for time management, which helps students develop time management skills. And the award winning author of three books, including The recently published how to do it now, because it's not going to go away an expert guide to getting stuff done. And she is the weekly writer of dear ADHD family Coach column for attitude magazine, the premier magazine for adults and children with ADHD, and speaks to audiences all over the world. Lesley. Hello, hi. Well, I've looked into that sometimes I'm like, Oh, well, is that a lot?


Yeah, that bring it in. It's great. And I'm so glad that you wanted to spend your time with us today. Because this is something that continues to be asked of me. You know, Jen, can you talk more about ADHD? Can you talk more about adults with ADHD? And I was really excited when our paths crossed and able to have this conversation. I'd love for you to tell and share your story about how you got here. What is the origin story? So I'm gonna give you the Reader's Digest version, because we only have a certain time. And what I'm going to invite is Venezuelan is very curious about it. And I invite them to go to our website where they can read the story in its entirety. But if you go to the website, it says in big letters, it all started with my son. And I feel like that actually captures a lot of people's attention because I think what I went through is what a lot of people have gone through in all of the years that we've been in existence. I started my company 19 years ago. Fun fact today is our 19th anniversary, but when I want thanks


You but what I want people to know is go back to 2004. The Internet wasn't as massive as it is there weren't podcasts, there weren't conferences, there weren't telephone booths, there wasn't really even people talking about ADHD in a very user friendly way. There was really very little information out there. My son was newly diagnosed at the time, he was four. And I really had to rely on my guts and my instincts to I always say, untangle his world, that is the word I use. And I think that's a really good visual, both at home and at school. Now, what I did back then, was really, some people they would said, Wow, that was like incredible revolutionary are out of the box thinking, maybe not so much now, because we know so much and understand how to help students and adults in an ADHD world. But back then doing what I did like taking doors off closet, so he could see what was behind them. Because what you don't see doesn't exist, taking the dresser out of his room and lining clear bins with pictures of what went in there. And simplifying the steps of finding clothes and getting undress I labeled everything that was hidden in our house blue, because Blue was there soothing for him. And we recognize color before we recognize words. So as you know, now people go, okay, I get it, but go back 19 years ago, it was pretty radical. I want to say that, not that I'm so fabulous. But I spent a lot of time figuring this, trying to keep the claim figuring this out. True story, a friend of mine, who was a therapist, so what I did is that I have a family of four, that I work with all four boys under the age of 10, all with ADHD. And I was working at the time that I didn't do this. And she said, You've got to help me out. And I spent eight hours and goodness of my heart with this family, helping them we do everything within two weeks, I got four phone calls. I saw what you did at least this house, can you come to mind, I turned to my husband who has ADHD and there's a reason I said I'm because I'm such a Virgo, I'm such a type A like everything has to be a coordination like I like but I don't do this for a living. And he just kind of went you do now. And literally, I was working four days a week. So I was doing this on Fridays and Saturdays, going house to house door to door family family working with them to define systems and structures that would help them within a month, a month. I quit my job 19 years later. We are a online global virtual company. We have about 17 countries over 100,000 parents, teachers, related professionals and students who come to us for products, programs, workshops, webinars, coaching, and you read the rest. And it has been a wild ride. But what I still realize 19 years later, with the internet at our fingertips with more information coming our way people are still looking for connection and answers and figuring it out. What I find in our community is they want the how we all know the why. But they really want the how. So that's kind of what we bring to the table at oC is yes, we obviously have to do the why. But we are really bringing them concrete things that they can really wrap their brains around in a very user friendly way. And I think the fact that I bring to the table, I always say I wear three hats, obviously I wear a professional hat, but I wear a parenting hat. And I think that's really you know, there were many nights when I would stand on a stage at a local high school and go, I just let my son lying on the floor screaming, I get you, the guy live you, right. I mean, it's not that way anymore. But I wear the parenting hat, I wear the professional hat. But I also wear the student hat. And I spent all my days with kids. And I feel that we bring a very unique sensibility to what we do that others don't meaning that are in and that my family, I love my colleagues. We all work together on a lot of things. But I think that's what makes us unique. Absolutely. Having that lived experience is everything. Because I think exactly what you said people come looking for connection and community. And they find that with people who have those shared lived experiences, that is the thing that makes you you and yeah, I want to celebrate for a second this 19 year anniversary, because that's huge and speaks volumes as to the need for what you're providing. And there are some things that you said that I want to get back to you. And the first thing that comes to mind is the concrete steps that you just laid out. And you're like, Yeah, I get this. Now it's 2022. I got this, many of us don't. And I want to just put that perspective out there. And we'll talk about that a little bit more because as a teacher in the classroom, we don't have formal training on a lot of this, right, we get an IEP, or we get the 504 and then it's okay go. And they're like, Well, what does that mean? Right? Many of us are missing that how and I think that's part of what gets so frustrating sometimes is because when you're in the class of 2025, sometimes 30 And you have 56789 even more sometimes kids who are dealing with


A variety of things in their life to just function throughout the day and do well, these concrete things that you're saying. I mean, I've been teaching for 15 years, and I was super creative about how I did it. But I never even thought about those things. So can you talk more about that stuff that's so valuable here. It's interesting because I just so much work in the school. And I say this. And it's like, funny, you're a teacher. And it's a very interesting spot to be in when you are not a teacher by training, but your ADHD expert, or you're an academic life coach, and then you're asked to come into a school and tell teachers how to teach. It's a slippery slope, because I would never want to tell a teacher how to teach because I think what you do is like heroes work and never more than in the last few years. And to back that up, we actually had for art. So we are celebrating our 10th plan. aversary You mentioned that we have academic planners. And what we did this year in honor of that is we gave a $5,000 grant to a school in our community. Have you ever had a caste community that was not only doing heroes work for their children, or their students that were neurodiverse, but also all their students. So I love schools, and I love teachers. But I'm humbled to be told, like when I tell a teacher, here's what I tell teachers, and I'm going to share something with everyone that I probably shouldn't yet. But I know you said to me, like, I'm gonna ask you a question and what's your like vision for education. And my vision for education is actually what I work on now, day in and day out on a math and it's called universal learning. And I think that is exactly what you're talking about. So we all know what Universal Design is universal design is when they realized that there was a population of those that had physical impairments that needed curb cuts, that needed access into buildings, that would make it easier for them. Right. And it was specifically done for those that had physical impairments. But what they realized was all of us whether you had a physical impairment, or were completely fine, benefited from it. So if I was a parent with a stroller, or I was walking down a busy street with luggage to go somewhere, those curb cuts benefited everybody are those in the big print on the screens, we all need them, not just those that might have visual impairment. So I talk about universal learning, as very similar. What we are trying to teach teachers and schools is that all the methodologies that we talked about, for those that are neurodiverse are actually beneficial to everybody. So it shouldn't be that this is like, Oh, how do I work with those with executive dysfunction, ADHD, that really should not be the conversation, the conversation really should be? How am I putting in practices and multimodal learning that's going to benefit all of my kids in the classroom? So how am I making time visible? So all of my kids have their time blind? Or maybe they're anxious? Or maybe they How can I make that visible? How can I get my students to see time so they can learn to manage it? How can I modulate the effort level of my teaching? So those kids that struggle with effort, sustaining effort, how can I modulate my teaching, so I can sustain their effort level throughout the entire class period? That's not just for someone who has executive functioning impairment. That's for all think about it, can a 13 year old really sustained 45 minutes of the lecture? I mean, I can give you an example. What we talk about with teachers is we say you actually do it, but you don't even realize that you're doing it in a good way or why you're doing it. So when your student walks in the classroom, sometimes out on like the credenza is they do now, right? We all know what to do now in the do now drop your homework in the red bin, pick up your homework for tomorrow night in the white bed, you come and you sit down, you're asked to sit and do some work, but it's low level effort. Your student who might have executive dysfunction or cannot sustain effort does not have to be listening doesn't have to be processing doesn't have to be understanding doesn't have to have all of his working memory doesn't have to be on fire. low effort. Basically, it's looking around the room and going okay, if Michaels doing this now, I should be doing this now. So it's low level you get you're warming the brain up, then teacher might say, Okay, everyone time put it away, sign for lecture. Now all of a sudden, your student has to go on high alert, right? effort level up process, understand working memory is like snapping at all cylinders. All of that is happening for about 20 months, but then when sometimes a teacher will say okay, great now but what you can all do is finish questions wanted to by yourself, maybe work with your partner, and again, the effort level goes back, what we don't realize is wanting modulate like that. You're actually preserving that student's brain if we have to have that student on


High Alert for 45 minutes, put a fork in them, they're done. So we actually teach teachers this kind of method of teaching. Because that actually mat now imagine a student has that for eight hours. Imagine a student that has effort challenges. Sometimes, if the perception might be lazy, we always say there's a perception of lazy is really a hard time sustaining effort. When a kid comes to me and says, my teachers think I'm lazy, or my parents think I'm lazy, I will say you go back and you tell them, you just have a hard time sustaining effort. Those are some of the very practical things that we actually arrive say, wait, I bring to the table when I'm asked to work with teachers, to really explain to them what a child who has executive dysfunction looks like. But yet that teaching methodology that I just did for you, that benefits every kid in a classroom, right? That's just good teaching. It's just good teaching. It's understanding that no one that's there that sit down, I have teachers who say in the middle of class they get they make everybody stand up and move one desk over. Because we know that movement helps to lay down learning. Yes. And a lot of this, like you said, many teachers do this already. But they without maybe a full understanding as to why exactly. It's really important. It's so all of a sudden, like, I'll be working with teachers, and they'll go, Oh, my God, thank God. I felt like, that's amazing, like, but I never be like, why I was doing that. And even more importantly, what the benefit of it was. Right? So we really, I really spent a lot of time also working with teachers, helping them understand what executive functioning is, but not just executive functioning, is what executive agents, I'll just pause for a second intended three of them parent educator, it's all about brains. Teachers are brain changers, but again, don't have very much training as to how the brain functions. What executive function even is how you yourself can go about doing this. So yes, okay, it is. So I am going to give you what normally takes me four hours, I'm going to do it in two minutes. Here we go. Everyone will describe executive functioning differently. I like six pillars, because I think six pillars are manageable. And remember, I'm also speaking to students all day long, and parents, so I have to speak a language that's incredibly user friendly. How I describe executive functions has been towards purposeful actions. Two really good way of thinking about it. Before we do that, what people don't realize is that executive functioning and ADHD are not one in the same. Here's a fun fact, if you have anyone in your classroom who has been diagnosed with ADHD, they will automatically have executive dysfunction that go hand in hand. Because ADHD is an executive function disorder. It is not about focus, or hyperactivity, that is just too simple. It is all about self regulation, right? It's about doing the right thing. At the right time, purposeful actions, I want you all to remember that I think it is such a good way of thinking about it. But here's the difference. You could have a child in your classroom who has executive dysfunction, but not be diagnosed with ADHD. It does not go that way. Which is why we really spend more time talking about executive functioning than we do ADHD because executive functioning tells the story. It's super granular, it's super day to day, it's super brain specific. So your executive functions are I break them down into six pillars. So the first one is activation, and that actually is organizing and time management together. And yes, a lot of people will go but how is time management and organizing, like in the same category when I'm telling you is if you are time blind, or don't know where you sit in time, that is actually a disorganization of the brand. This organization doesn't necessarily have to be space and stuff. And that's the aha moment. Okay, number two is focus. I think we pretty much understand that one. distractibility bug number three is effort level, okay, and that's different than focus effort level is being up here all the time trying to, I'm just not I always say that's also we're overwhelmed lives. That's where the overwhelm lives. And I know all of you have overwhelmed kids in your classroom. We're overwhelmed. I just did a webinar I kid you not on the overwhelm student. We call them the T O students too much too big, too vague, too, are too loud. We had over 5000 people come to that webinar, because this is the topic right now that everybody is talking about is overwhelm a yes, sure is. Okay. Number four is mood regulation. I'm gonna get back to that one in a minute. Number five is working memory. Working memory is not short term. It's not like what you ate for breakfast. It's not long term. I went with grandma or ate it to Disney. This is how I described working memory and all you teachers out there you go, Oh my God. It's your kid at eight o'clock in the morning going. I'm good. I'm good. I got it. I'm all right at that moment and in that time your student is but let's fast forward to


Eight o'clock at night when your student opens and I'm not picking on your math teachers math and goes on alarmists. I got no idea what that is. That's working memory. It. Did he hear you? Yes. But did he remember not working memory is remembering to remember, information has this ticket, glue it to your brain, and then be able to take it out when you need. It's a two lane highway. Yes. I mean, I'm doing this in like record time, it's so impressed


that the last one is what you would own. That was impulsivity. I hate that word. So I describe it as self leadership. I love that. So much more empowering, more way more empowering. Now mood regulation, that because I'm this is not a science class, but mood regulation is all about. It's the emotion side of the brain. It's the limbic system. And what you have to understand about the right brain, the left brain, left brain has all the logic and linear thinking and reasoning and rationale, the right brain is all like your emotion and all that so of that limbic system, which holds all that is in play, reasoning things away, rationalizing things away, will never work, you have to connect to that right brain first, to bring that limbic system down. It's like a helium balloon, you have to fizzle it out. And then we connect, we always say that to connect to the right and then direct back to the left, you cannot rationalize a reasonable reason that way. But what that looks like might look like in a classroom is a quiet kid. doesn't always mean that explosive kid, it's a frustrated kid. It's an anxious kid. It's a quiet kid. Yeah, they all present in so many.


Sure. And you know, and I'm thinking about this too, from the lens of the adults in the room, who are also maybe reflecting on their own behavior and think wow,


relates, if it resonates with me, right? The self regulation resonates with me, this effort level resonates. And I want to share something that I was really looking forward to asking you one of the teachers who work with me and a power educator asked a question, and I'm gonna pass it to you. She says, I'm newly ADHD diagnosed in my late 40s. And now all my life makes sense. I hear that all the time. She said, I noticed a lot of overlap between burnout symptoms and ADHD and what kinds of things you have to help neurodivergent folks. And I thought with all the six pillars that you're telling me about, I feel like this ties in tremendously, because a lot of that overwhelmed like you were just describing. That's sometimes the first symptom we feel of burnout. But what kind of things do you like you said, we're talking about universal learning, universal design, universal language, just about how it is to be a human being in this world. All of this is relevant to everybody. This is my thing. I always say this, I love teachers. And I am very blessed that I get to travel the world. I've spoken to teachers in Kuwait, in Canada and Brazil, I am very lucky. And actually this webinar was sprayed, but our webinars are free for teachers. We tend to be a why not? Because you guys are doing literally heroes work. Trust me, I never saw it more than during the pandemic because I was on the other side of it. And I was like, whatever. We were giving webinars just for teachers, anything, all of our resources, I couldn't get hard products, but we were giving everything we could because it was just crazy. Anyway, I just want to know that. Yeah, but a lot of you understanding what is tapping into that overwhelm. So for some of my adults, they will come to me and say decision making. So it's interesting. I feel like decision making is like Cinderella, like she's the stepsister in the back. You never see her You never talk about her. But all of a sudden, we started talking about decision making in one of our webinars and it like it's bloated. Believe it or not, that's something you can do in the classroom, even for your kids or even for yourself. So for my adult clients who go I am so overwhelmed by decision making decision fatigue is very real. I am not neurodiverse I make a man 1000 decisions. So I work very long day. So I get it by the time I walk out my door and my husband benignly goes, What do you want for dinner? I'm like, I can't I'm not so I can imagine. So what is work, believe it or not with my adults is narrowing. They're filling out their columns is what I call it. Cubby sizing. We talk a lot in our work about shelves and cubbies. And teachers use that analogy because shelves are unwieldly. They're clutter, you can't see beginning, middle and end. Shelves are parameters. They have spaces on them. So limiting your choices. So what does that look like for my adult clients what it looks like as I get to magazines, not 10 I food shop in two places, not five, I make five meals and that's it. rituals and routines are really really important. Those that are particularly adults are neurodiverse because it takes decision making out of things. And therefore it calms the brain and it saves the brain for what it really needs to be doing which is preparing plans and grading papers.


All right. So all of those decisions that you can narrow down and not have. If you've ever heard Peter Shankman, I don't know if anyone knows who he is. He's this very famous entrepreneur has an ADHD podcast. And I was on it. And we talked about this and he's like, Leslie, that's actually brilliant. I only work out on peloton, I don't go to five different exercises. Now I'm talking about adults, now, I only read one newspaper, I only get two magazines, I only make six meals, like in my rotation, I eat the same breakfast every day. We know there are geniuses who were the same turtleneck every day, right? The same thing every day. They actually weren't neurodiverse or are neurodiverse. But that's how they said they were. That's a huge part of all of this. And huge, we don't talk about decision making. But it's huge, right? And it's finding your strengths. And you know, when we talk a lot about the accommodations that we need to make as adults, or a combination of these make as kids, there's a lot of deficit thinking. But here, the way that you're explaining it is you are taking something that can be completely empowering, for an incredible purpose, for sustaining throughout the day for doing amazing things for having the impact that you want to make with the students in the communities, you serve something like this one change to make those decisions like you just scribe one, day three, trimming fat, we're trimming fat. And what I like about this, and we do a lot of internal work is that it's sustainable. Because we're not going to make radical decision. We're not asking, make radical changes. We're not saying eliminate completely, it's going through your categories and saying and listen again. And this is very meta. But it's not just for those that are neurodiverse. We are a society of information that is coming out of AI for not neurodiverse feel so sensory overloaded in my life right now. Because just there's so much coming at me that I've even done this, because I just can't sustain that I can't sustain that effort of having to make 1000 of where am I getting my information from? Where am I shopping? Where am I doing this from? I know that sounds like we fly a lot back and forth, as you know, but just making things smaller. And so I have less decisions to me have freed up my brain and my clients brains to ever to use that energy for what they really need to be using it for whether it's parenting, your child teaching, creating plans, whatever it is, that's life changing, and it's sustainable, and you can't do it. Because it's not radical, these changes have to be that way. Because otherwise, that's where the self sabotage comes in. And because we do everything on balancing, then we can't do anything. And the other thing I'm going to say too, it's not directly to teaching, but your environment is so important to the overwhelm of your brain. And we don't talk about environment either. So I understand that when you walk into your classroom, that that's kind of fed for you. But whatever you can do within your classroom environment, to we talk a lot about, it's interesting, because when I walk into a school to teach teachers, I'm helping them understand their students. But ultimately what happens is the conversation turns to them. And I get that right. I'm stuck in this classroom all day, I have parameters that I can't change, fine, what can we change? Can you bring in things that change the environment for you. So like teachers will say that they do two things, they make sure their environment as best they can, really helps to engage their brain and sue that. So it might be you can see, it might be aromatherapy, and might be a diffuser going all day in the classroom. Because the sense I'm a set girl, there is a set in my house all day every day I work from home unless I'm traveling. So if it's not aromatherapy, it's a candle. It's not just because it's fun, it really helps do my brain like never thought of that maybe it's a cushion on your chair that really helps. Maybe it's fun colored paper and pencils that speak to you. I know the sound trade, but they're really not anything that you can do in your environment. Maybe it's flowers, fresh flowers every Monday morning to help you because environment is actually the number one thing we have to help us to motivate and feel less overwhelmed. So that's number one. And number two, the other thing we talk a lot about is what I call a work ritual. And I talk about this with adults as well as my students. So what you have to know about the brain is the brain is stone cold, you would never go and like play the big soccer game or you would never go and like be in this you know on the big theater show. I don't know if I said that. Right? You know what I'm talking about right? Without warming up. First, you warm up your muscles, whether it's your voice muscle to get on the shower, your body, the soccer whatever. Working requires muscle, your brain is a muscle so when you walk into a room and you start and you're Stone Cold


It is really, really, you're putting so much effort of your own to get to where you need to be to teach nerds divers are not mean as the teacher. So what we want is a work ritual in place. What do you do every morning to warm up your brain to get it ready to do the work you need to do? And I say that to my students, too. What's your work ritual? And everyone has their own? Some people have some people don't? Do you like I don't know, I just sit down and start. I'm like, Do you know what you're up against? When you do that? Maybe it is lighting a candle? Maybe it's coffee, maybe it's a walk around the blog, maybe it's conversation with your mother? Some people say absolutely not. That's not what I need. But what is your like work ritual that's going to open up the brain because the brain has to warm up. And when we see people doing that, adults in particular, they find themselves less overwhelmed, and able to give more and receive. Yes, that's the whole thing with the work that I do. It's priming yourself as the adult in the room. So you are regulated. So you are calm. So you are centered so you can give and receive because otherwise we're not able to have the ACA salutely 100%. So what are you doing? Like, what are you doing to do that? Listen, I coach all day Mondays. And I start very early, I get up very early on Monday. And I have a ritual that I do before I sit down at the staff so that when I see my students across for me, they have 100% of my intention. Now granted, by the end of it, I'm exhausted at the end of the day, because it's a lot of, but I make sure that I've had coffee, because for me if I do a small like not a big workout, but I have to stretch my body because I'm sitting all day you can't see and I have a candle that is lit I have my books ready to go. Not only is my phone off, it is nowhere even near me. That's research proven that even when you have a phone near you, and that's all your cognitive ability plummets. In other words, it makes you stupid, I hate that word. I'm deciding what they say. So now I'm sitting here at literally I am ready to receive I have warmed up my brain, and I've got ready to give what I need to give, and I'm not as exhausted because I'm not coming in, like, you know, oh my god, you know, I'm saying like, where's my pan, I don't have the books for each, like, I'm calm, I'm centered, and I'm ready to go. That's so important. And that morning time, it can be sacred, I remember when I get up, I press news a couple times, hop in the shower, get the kids ready, forget the instrument in the house, come back run and get the band instrument, go back, you know, get the red light and barely get to work in time. And then by the time you're there, you're already frazzled, you're fried. But here's the other thing. For those of you that are gonna say to me, this is something we work on with students a lot. We have a lot of kids who come home from school, follow me along, follow the bouncing ball, I promise, I have a point that I'm totally with you. Let's go. I wrote a whole book about students and procrastination. We call the tales from the trenches, because we went back and talked to as many kids as we could find that I had coached. So it's not only my stories, it's their stories. And one of the things that was resounding to my kids that Mike well, but you know, when I say my kids, you know what I mean, was we had to eliminate the barrier to entries. And I talked about barriers to entry. And everything I do, it seeps all the way back to where I started my company, when I took the doors off the closet, where I took the dresser out, that was a barrier to entry to my son. So what was a barrier to my entry for my students when they came home, whether it was in high school or college getting worked on, it was too overwhelming. So what we do is we separate the setup from the task, because the setup is a visual reminder of what we have to do. And it eases that it's almost like the bridge to getting it done. And I noticed that with a lot of my teachers, they actually globbed on to that idea for themselves. And what does that look like? So for students coming home, let's say in high school, maybe he sits in the dining room table, maybe it's his room, whatever it is, that's a different podcast for a different day. He lays everything out. He's got his books out, might make popcorn and put that next to it. He's got all what he needs, but he doesn't do anything. So that's what I asked them. I know you need time, but at least get set up. Now you can go off and do what you need fill your tank, but what happens now when they come back? They're not up again to the what do I have to do where they can ease into it. It's a visual cue and they've built the bridge and it really helps the procrastination thing. My college students will do it they even leave like tabs up. So I have kids that the night before will leave all their tabs open. So the next day when they wake up, it's right there. A lot of my teachers do that the night before before they leave their classrooms. Everything is out and ready. It's almost is that the minute they walk into there, so if you're not a morning person, you can actually do your work ritual the night before, to the point where I have what goes on I put my candle and the match right next to thing I have my paper


Ready to go. So like when I walk in, my planner is open things are already out on the desk. So that would I walk in all of those visual cues helped me ease into the day like this. I don't have to think I don't have to exercise my brain. It's kind of done for me. So there's that too, right? So I want everyone to think of it in those ways as well. It doesn't always have to be like, if you're sitting and going, There's no way I can get up at six o'clock in the morning to do all that you don't have to do. And what it does is, again, it takes that decision making out of the equation, I don't need to be asking him, what do I need to be doing right now? Right, and then you get overwhelmed, and and then you don't end up doing anything? I mean, exactly, we've all been there. And you know, again, really looking inwards. Because when we look inwards, not only are we able to show up better, but we're setting these examples for our kids who are watching us, absolutely, man. And in some ways. Also, we talk a lot in the school with teachers about visual cues. Like, are you still hanging analog clocks in the classroom, I'm sorry, I am the queen of analogs, your students need to see time mood to really know where they sit and the relation to the day and digital doesn't cut it digital only gives you one time. And that's the present. And you know, I'm a time management expert. That's really my wheelhouse. And what I explain to teachers too is, the more you can make time visible or visual, the less pressure is off you. And the only thing you're doing is strengthening their brain like we tend to be as coaches and teachers. We tend to be problem solvers, we tend to be fixers, we tend to answer questions, even when none are asked the big thing I ask teachers this all the time, I'm like, do you answer questions when none are asked? And they're like, What the heck do you mean by that? kid goes to you, because you could have little kids? I'm hungry, I'm tired, I don't understand. And we go off and we explain our answer. And I go, but did they ask you anything? No. So why are you answering them? If you truly want to strengthen your students brain? I always say you don't need to know the answer. But they have to be able to ask the question. And I don't know, is not a question, I don't know is a weak executive functioning brain. And that's okay. Your job as the teacher is to work it out is to give them two pound dumbbells. Because the brain has the muscle and to do that is to ask them a question back. So if you have a kid that goes through says I don't understand, or I don't know, I don't understand. Right. Can you tell me what you do now? So great question. That is a great question. And you tell me what you do now. They might have to lead them if they're younger. And when I teach teachers that they're like, Oh, my God, I love that. Because my first response is to go, Okay, let me because we did that. That's a good thing. We're fixers and helpers. And Virgos and our guys, yes. I'm sorry, I get it. But I have really my own coaching had to learn how to shut up. And I'm telling you to shut up, but to ask questions back. So if someone comes to me and says, I don't know, I'm like, Is there something you need? Is there something you need from me? What is it that you're trying to ask me, that opens the door? Because we want them to ask the question. We don't want them just to blurt out, I don't get it. Because when they're doing I don't get it, they're lifting a two pound weight. And we want to get their brains to three pounds and Batman and we want to get them to that their brain can lift and doing that is asking them to formulate the question. So that's a lot of what I teach with, I teach with teachers is is the right kinds of questions to go back and ask your students where have you seen this before? What does this look similar to? What do you think you need to do to get started? Because sometimes your kid is so overwhelmed by everything we want to bring it here. What's the first thing you might need to do? And then I could go on, and I know we have limited time. And think questions is probably the Biden's have come up with one thing that is universal morning, I'm going to you're not going to ask me that question. Because I'm going to keep saying it. Asking your students questions is empowering. You know, it's funny, like we talk about kids coming and saying the word problem. I always say I love the word problem. I start every session with my students going tell me about a problem you solved. I think it needs a makeover. I think it needs a rebranding problems are not horrible. They're not but we need to cast them in a way that shows students that they can problem solve that they have that skill that problem solving is healthy and smart and a good thing. But kind of how I don't know if this is making a lot of sense. It is totally on point I could talk about brains all day with you. I would love to. It's all about the brain and like


a lot of teaching teachers almost I learned from teachers how to teach and sometimes when a teacher will call me as you're teaching me how to coach. Yes. And they just have this visual of just like all of these bodybuilder brains. So what we do what we have this


little brain that he's going like this with that we have like a graphic within these doing dumbbells, and we show it to students, parents, teachers, and like it's a great visual and like, that's what I tell parents all the time. How do you strengthen your child's executive functioning brain? And it's by asking them questions, because that's all I'm tired. I'm hungry. I don't now are not questions. Yeah, they're not so juicy. So I know that we kind of touched a little bit on this. But I would love to ask you, or dream, Leslie, for future of education? What do you want? What's your dream? My dream is that this whole thing about universal learning is not even universal learning that it's just something that we are putting into the schools for all students, because I really firmly believe that what we are doing are working to do for those that are either neurodiverse who have attention deficits or learning challenges, really benefits all students. The other thing I envision, and I'm seeing it our classrooms that are multimodal, because, you know, we didn't really talk about movement, and I attack till I talk to kids, to me, a movement is like a smoothie. It is just filled with all the good stuff. It helps distractibility movement helps to lay down learning movement helps us to stay focused and engaged. So I close my eyes and see like, even for older students, and is classrooms that are not like desk and teacher, but all different multimodal way. And kids really like almost engineering their own path of learning. Yes, and it is moving in that direction slowly. Yeah, it's moving. And you know, because of people like you and work like what I do, we're kind of this how we move the ticker forward a little bit at a time and having these conversations in this kind of a forum. So thank you so much. And how do people get to know more about you and work with you? Oh, okay, that's easy.


We try to make it super easy. So the name of my company is order out of chaos. Our website is order, Oh, chaos.com. And if you go there, from there, you can go everywhere, videos, podcasts, articles, books, products webinar, like whatever you need social if you like, your stuff, and social bytes. But everything, just go to that website, and it will take you to anything and everything you need. It is quite comprehensive. I've been there. Yes.


We've updated and obviously, it doesn't look like what it looked like 15 years ago, but we always say our website is the hardest working member of our teams. Yes, it sure is. That's how it's supposed to be right. The website is fantastic. And there is an incredible amount of resources. Yeah, so head over there I to have us in it for a while and the best possible way because one thing led to another thing. And so what you're doing is fantastic. And I just so appreciate your time and sharing your talents with me and the take notes audience today. I love what you are doing. I don't think there's many of you out there. So when I saw that, I was like, wow, that is just cool and unique and very needed. And so I think what you're doing is amazing. And I think that can support teachers in their away as it should be required. It is a necessity, not a luxury, and I fully receive that. So thank you so much, Leslie. You're so welcome. And thank you everyone for listening today. Yes, and if you love today's episode, make sure you write a great review and we'll see you next time on take notes. Incredible, right? Together, we can revolutionize the face of education. It's all possible. And it's all here for you right now. Let's keep the conversation going at empowered educator faculty room on Facebook.

What if learning about your brain led you to realize how much agency you have over your life?

What if we could supercharge everything we teach students through SEL methodologies in a way that incorporates the whole of their brains?

Taking a deep dive inside the brain can be an amazing catalyst for discovering how you can show up as your best self, and empowered educators as a whole. So, if you want to live a better life as a teacher- this episode is for you!

Welcome to episode 14 of the Take Notes with Jen Rafferty podcast! In this episode, I’m speaking with one of my heroes, Harvard-trained and published neuroscientist: Dr. Jill Bolte Taylor.

In 1996, she experienced a severe hemorrhage and the left hemisphere of her brain causing her to lose the ability to walk, talk, read, write or recall any of her life. She documented her experience in her memoir “Stroke of Insight” which spent 63 weeks on the New York Times nonfiction bestseller list.

Dr. Jill is a dynamic teacher and public speaker who loves educating all age groups and academic levels, as well as corporations and not-for-profit organizations about the beauty of our human brain and focuses on how we can purposely choose to live a more flexible, resilient, and satisfying life.

In our conversation, we take a deep dive into her new book “Whole Brain Living” and the idea that you can achieve a symbiotic relationship with all the “characters” in your brain to live a more full and satisfying life.

Today, we address how to leave overwhelm and teacher burnout behind on a cellular level that is both tangible and enlightening!

This information is truly life-changing and leads to true teacher well-being!

Stay empowered,

Jen


Let’s keep the conversation going! Find me at:

Click here to learn all the ways you can work with me:
 Jen Rafferty | Instagram, YouTube, Facebook | Links
Instagram: @jenrafferty_
Facebook: Empowered Educator Faculty Room

About Dr. Jill Bolte Taylor:

Dr. Jill Bolte Taylor is a Harvard-trained and published neuroscientist. In 1996 she experienced a severe hemorrhage (AVM) in the left hemisphere of her brain causing her to lose the ability to walk, talk, read, write, or recall any of her life. Her memoir, My Stroke of Insight, documenting her experience with stroke and eight-year recovery, spent 63 weeks on the New York Times nonfiction bestseller list and is still routinely the #1 book in the category Stroke in the Amazon marketplace.
Dr. Jill is a dynamic teacher and public speaker who loves educating all age groups, academic levels, as well as corporations and not-for-profit organizations about the beauty of our human brain. She focuses on how we can activate the power of our neuroplasticity to not only recover from neurological trauma, but how we can purposely choose to live a more flexible, resilient, and satisfying life.
In 2008 Dr. Jill gave the first TED talk that ever went viral on the Internet, which now has well over 27.5 million views. Also in 2008, Dr. Jill was chosen as one of Time magazine’s “100 Most Influential People in the World” and was the premiere guest on Oprah Winfrey’s “Soul Series” webcast. Her new book, Whole Brain Living – the Anatomy of Choice and the Four Characters That Drive Our Life is a #1 release on Amazon in categories ranging from Neuroscience to Nervous System Diseases and Stroke.


You can find Books by Dr. Jill Bolte Taylor here:

Books & Products - Dr. Jill Bolte Taylor (drjilltaylor.com)

TRANSCRIPT:   
Today is all about one of my favorite topics, brains. And really, it is my favorite because truly most of us underestimate this incredible tool that we have sitting between our ears. And when you learn more about your brain, you realize how much agency you actually have in your life. So if you want to live a better life, learn about your brain. And so today I am talking with my favorite neuroscientist, Dr. Jill Bolte Taylor, and she has really shaped the way that I think about the work that I do in this world. And the conversation that you're about to hear was truly a dream of mine. And if you don't have them already, grab a copy of both of her books, my Stroke of Insight, and whole brain living, which you can find in the show notes. So hold on to your hats, we are going deep inside the brain to learn about how you can show up as your best self. And after this episode, be sure you check out break time, because this monthly empowered educator subscription will give you access to an incredible video library of self regulation strategies, as well as a monthly group coaching calls with me and other amazing empowered educators. So head on over to empowered educator.com/resources

Remember all the passion and vision you had when you first went into teaching. Feeling like building young minds and creating community through your work would make a lasting impact on this world? Well, those days may feel like they're behind you now because you're exhausted, stressed and overwhelmed and frustrated. But I'm here to tell you it doesn't have to be like this. In fact, the love of teaching never really went away. But it absolutely needs transformation. Welcome to The Take notes Podcast. I'm Jen Rafferty, former music teacher, mom of two and certified emotional intelligence practitioner, and I'm here to light the way for you. In order to create a generational change for our kids. We need to shift the paradigm away from the perpetual stress and overwhelm and into a life of joy and fulfillment. This is education 2.0 where you become the priority shift how you live your life, and how you show up both at work and at home. So take a sip of steamy morning coffee and grab your notebook. It's time to take notes

Welcome to another incredible episode of take notes. I am Jen Rafferty, and today is a very special day I am able to meet one of my heroes today. I can't wait for you to meet her as well. This is Dr. Jill Bolte Taylor and she is a Harvard trained and published neuroscientist. In 1996. She experienced a severe hemorrhage and the left hemisphere of her brain causing her to lose the ability to walk, talk, read, write or recall any of her life. Her memoir my Stroke of Insight documenting her experience with stroke and eight year recovery spent 63 weeks on the New York Times nonfiction bestseller list, and is still routinely the number one book in the category of stroke in the Amazon marketplace. Dr. Jill is a dynamic teacher and public speaker who loves educating all age groups academic levels, as well as corporations and not for profit organizations about the beauty of our human brain. She focuses on how we can activate the power of our neuroplasticity not to only recover from neurological trauma, but how we can purposely choose to live a more flexible, resilient and satisfying life. And in 2008, Dr. Jill get the first TED Talk that everyone viral on the internet, which now has well over 27 point 5 million views. And also in 2008 Dr. Joe was chosen as one of Time magazine's 100 most influential people in the world, and was the premiere guests and Oprah Winfrey's Soul series webcast. Her new book called Brain living the anatomy of choice and the four characters that drive our life is a number one release on Amazon and categories ranging from neuroscience to nervous system diseases and stroke. And on my personal bookshelf number one, thank you so much for being here. Dr. Jill, I'm so excited to get this started. I'm thrilled you and I we care about the same thing. And I think we approach it strategically very similarly and yet a little bit differently. So I'm excited about our chat. Thank you. I would love to start actually with the last chapter of your book, which says, perfect, beautiful and whole. I would love to know why it's so important that we start from a place of wholeness. Well, we've got all these cells in this beautiful brain, why not use all of them? That's kind of how I'm looking at it. We know a lot about the brain. We know a lot about these cells we know about how cells interact with one another. We know how to help them become healthy. We know how to skew away from a hole into the value structure of either hemisphere, the left hemisphere or the right hemisphere. They are very different places they do process the same information but in very different ways based on different values. And so the better we get to know the Oregon at


Self. And we get to know some certain things that we can understand about cellular circuitry, and what we can expect from the brain cells themselves, then why not live a whole life? Why not realize that we have the capacity to choose which part of our brain is going to be dominant and how we want to feel? And what we want to think and based on our value structure? Yeah, so learning about the brain in this way, isn't typical, right, we have to seek out this information. This isn't something we're learning about in the places where we learn about things, you know, my daughter is in third grade right now. And she came home and is talking to me about her nervous system, and she's using all the words, but there's not really any context for her. And so there's a push for social emotional learning right now in schools, where we're kind of touching on some of these things. But I don't think that we go far enough and really understanding what's happening in our brain. So I would love to talk a little bit about these four characters. So we kind of give our listeners a structure as to what it is we're going to be talking about for the rest of this because we're gonna be referring to these four characters quite a bit. So from my understanding, left thinking, identity and ego, that's character, one character to left emotional about past pain and the stories we tell our anxieties or grief, addictions, yes. Also, I've heard you mentioned abridging across time. Yeah, I mean, just consider we have a brain that we're not a living organism that is just right here right now. I'm alive. I'm seeing things I'm feeling things I'm eating things. I'm saying things I'm moving around like an amoeba. I'm have the capacity through this beautiful character to left emotional tissue to take this present moment experience. Step out of the present moment into the past, well, how does our brain do that? I mean, that alone is like an inconceivable idea. If you really stop and you think about at a biological level, how is it I am a bridge across time? What is it I can remember which shoes without looking which shoes I put on this morning? And why I picked those I have the capacity to project my mind into what am I doing later tonight for dinner, I have the capacity to being at some time other than right here right now. Workout. Now if that? And if we'd all look at ourselves and say, Wow, that alone is pretty miraculous. At a biological level. I don't know what is I think we're just not paying attention. But yeah, it is that little character too emotional, that brings information in about the present moment, and compares it to any experience we've had in the past, saying, Give me a reason to say No, give me a reason to push it away, because it's dangerous, based on my past experience. So this ends up being this little part of ourselves that first of all, it's emotional tissue. It never matures. It's not cognitive thinking tissue, so it never matures. So it's one of my little girls inside of me. And it's the part of me that saying, I don't feel safe, and I don't feel safe in the present. Because of my past experience. All my pain from the past is going to be in this little character too. And all of my trauma from the past then is in this character to if you look at the tissue deep inside of that character to there is called the insular cortex. And that's where craving happens. Any of my addictions, I have an addiction in this moment, because I have craving about something that I experienced in my past that I now bring into the present moment say now I want more of that all of those experiences of the past at an emotional level is in that left emotional tissue. Couple things. I have a question about that. So when you say addictions, we're talking also about emotional addictions, any kind of addiction, technology, sex, drugs, alcohol, anything that I can crave and I want more of I want it can be movement. You know, if you ask me what I'm a junkie of, I'm a junkie, a movement, if I don't get my movement in every day, I'm more irritable a lot that your character is freaking out, because you're freaking out. It's like, Hey, I didn't get to do anything. Today, I need my gonna move right? Then let's backtrack a little bit to character one. So we can kind of explore that a little bit, and then we'll move on to the right side of our brain. So left thinking is character one is identity and ego. But let's talk about what that actually means. Yeah, so as we're looking at this miraculous, amazing collection of cells, I don't exist. I am in this lifeforce. I am a right here right now. Collection of 50 trillion magnificent cells that all except for the red blood cells contain the same DNA that began from a single cell and that single cell then multiplied and divided. And those cells then differentiate


Did you know that I have skin cells, I buy cells, I have liver cells, I have movement cells, I have all these different cells that make me up as a single organism. Well, I have an organism, I'm a collection of cells. And then there's a tiny little group of cells in my left thinking tissue that says, well, now I'm going to take all of that. And I'm going to define the boundaries of where I begin and where I end, because what am I if I'm just a cellular experience of the present moment, I'm energy, and I'm cellular atoms and molecules, which are living cells, Joe swabbing their experiences. So there and as that little character two steps out of the present moment and says, I now have a player asked, and I'm going to compare everything to the past character one comes online, because we're feeling creatures who will shake. So we have the emotional tissue first, and then the thinking tissue is what makes us different from other mammals. So now in that thinking tissue, it says, Okay, I now am out of the present moment, I have a past, I have a future, let's give me an identity. And my identity says, Well, where do I begin? And where I do I end? And how is it I know that there's noses, my nose, but these glasses that stay on my nose all day long, but they're not me, then that left thinking character one defines what is me and what is not me, which means it gives me an identity. And part of that identity is language cells that say, part of language now is made to be my ability to say I am I am an individual, I am an identity, I am separate from you and every other atoms and molecules that are spiraling around. And the only reason I have that identity, and that ego is because I have cells in that character, one that are defining me as that it's one thing to say, Oh, it's my identity. It's my ego. But you have to look at what does that really leaning in? at a cellular level? Not just at a psychological, sociological, experiential level? But what does that mean at a cellular level? How do I have an ego? How do I have an identity? How do I have an addiction? How do I have trauma from the past? And that how I think is the missing piece and a lot of the conversation about all of this, we're missing it, like you said, we need to be paying attention. And I don't know that we're paying attention to the right things. I think that we learn and we grow, you know, I mean, it really took a neuroanatomist, someone who studies the anatomy of the brain who thinks cellularly, to lose that character won and lose that character to which happened when I experienced that hemorrhage. And then in the absence of meaning, the individual all that I usually think that I am has gone. What am I now what am I in the absence of that. And because we live in a society that is skewed to dominance of me, the individual and the world revolves around me, and mine and my world and my hierarchy and where I am, and I want more, because that's the value of that left hemisphere is the world revolves around me? Well, the world revolves around me only if I have a left hemisphere, if I don't have me, the individual, then what do I have? I have me human. And that's when this consciousness of the collective whole, we are once human family, we are brothers and sisters on this planet, and everything is a symbiotic relationship. So our relationship with the planet matters, because if we don't have a planet, humanity will die off. So we can't separate humanity from global because we're part of the global right. So that brings us to character three, and character four. Once we have our listeners kind of understand what those two characters are, I do want to ask a question about why we are so focused at our left side where our society is going, but let's talk about character three right now. So this is the emotional part that's fun and playful and present and experiential. Take us back to the difference between a mammal and reptile is the addition of this, these cells, it's just cells and those cells in humans and mammals is the emotional tissue. So we end up with the emotional character, two in the left hemisphere, and we end up with the emotional character three tissue in the right hemisphere, but it's still emotional, but emotional isn't necessarily my deep emotions of sadness, or fear or anger or anxiety, but it is alarm alarm, Alert, alert. So we've have the fight or flight in each of our hemispheres in


Character two, but it's our alarm alarm Alert, alert as it relates to me the individual in my past and my future, the right hemisphere emotional character three is the experience of the present moment. So the two differences between the right hemisphere and the left hemisphere is that the right hemisphere, it's just right here right now, right here, right now I'm as big as the universe. I'm atoms and molecules, I'm energy, everything is one big fluid experience in relationship to everything else, including the planet in our environment. The left hemisphere then comes in and says, Okay, well, that's great, but that I'm not functional. They're just by there. So I need to be an individual. So the left hemisphere creates the individual, and it creates in that character to a past and a future. So the left hemisphere gives me me the individual across time, and the right hemisphere doesn't have me or the past, and future all enhances the present moment. So character three is the emotional tissue of the right hemisphere. And that is experiential. What does it feel like to be in this present moment? What does it feel like? Well, if I don't have really individual, so my past is gone, my job is gone. Because again, somewhere else, my relationships are gone, because they're not right here in my face, that all my stress from my past and future is gone. And I feel pretty good. So the right view right now experience is one of pretty much eat elation, oh, my gosh, I'm excited, I'm alive. And because I'm alive, then all possibility is right here right now. So because I'm not in the box of right and wrong and good and bad, defined by that left hemisphere of who am I? And what color are those leaves supposed to be when I color them? In the present moment, there's no right, wrong, good, bad, there's just the experience. And there's a level of freedom. And in that freedom, I get to be creative to just taking what is and creating something new, I get to come up with new ideas and become entrepreneurial, I get to come up with new ideas and be innovative, and I'm interested, and I'm interesting, and I'm collective whole. So I like to share it with other people. And I like to hang out with others. So all the possibilities of our creativity and our innovation is going to be right there in that character three of impetus, energy and motion, three from all the rights and wrongs and goods and Bad's defined by me the individual in that left hemisphere or which also feels the need to put all of us all of these characters inside of the societal norm. Right now, right hemisphere doesn't fit into the societal norm, it doesn't care about the societal norm.


Right. And that feels like such a happy place when you're describing that. That's the place where I would love to be I wouldn't necessarily know that I got it, it would get things that but I wouldn't know that I got things done because my character one wouldn't be online, you just get different things done. But it's about the process of the product. So we always hear this cliche Chanel, it's about the process. It's about the adventure. It's not about the destination. It's like, huh, yeah, but that's the difference. The right hemisphere is about the experience, I go to my art space, and I don't know what I'm gonna create, all I know is I'm gonna go down there, and I'm gonna discover a new delicious piece of glass and color, and I'm gonna create something new. And they're nine build this creation, based on what comes rather than, okay, here's the pattern, and here's what it's gonna look like. And I'm gonna cut every piece of glass to look just like that. And then this is the perfect panel, and then somebody's gonna be happy with that. And it's like, no, I'm not about that. Because the right hemisphere is about the experience, and what does it feel like when I'm in my art space? What does it feel like when I'm looking at these delicious, it can be the same blue but different textures of glass. And it's like, oh my gosh, I mean, just the experience of the glass, not the well this is ultimately what I'm going to create. Right? So then we go down next to the character for that is the ultimate collective consciousness and wholeness and divine as sometimes people call this Yeah, so think about what that means. So what that means is that I'm in the present moment. So character three is the experiential movement forward there's an impetus toward action, but the thinking tissue is simply blissfully grateful that I'm alive. Oh my god, I'm alive it's the oil on the wonder and so it's the on the wonder that oh my god I am eyes that can see. And I have muscles that allow me to move into the world. And I have capacity to experience through the sensory systems, the energy in the atoms and molecules that I'm designed to perceive


And then for us as because I'm filtering in raw data, and what kind of raw data in late not even capable of law, I'm not capable of echolocation like a bat? Wouldn't that be like, cool? But yeah, that'd be cool. I can't fly like a bird. Wouldn't that be cool? That'd be cool. But I don't have those capacities. So all of these different creatures are filtering different kinds of processing in order to be the creature that they are. And this human creature of what we are is this magnificent collection of all these cells that give us all of these abilities. And I can move I mean, imagine the Oh, when that infant, that new infant born into the world is just a ball of energy, right? It's just ball of energy, and it's flailing and it has no control of anything. But every movement matters, because it's information to the brain, and then one, when incident realizes that's mine, I can wiggle those things that be and it begins that process of differentiating information to get more and more specific. So I gain control of me, and oh, well, you and I are talking about Natto is a differentiation of those four different modules of cells inside of our brain, meaning that we all have, but each of those four groups of cells do very specific skill sets. And because of those skill sets, they represent a personality or a character inside of us that we all exhibit all four of these characters. And then when I learn, oh, that joyful present moment, excitement, Orion and fun and creativity, that's a group of cells in my brain, and I can become that character profile in an instant. And then in another instant, the telephone rings, and it's like, oh, now I gotta go to work. So now I leap into the group of cells in my character, one rational thinking left brain, and I do that part of me. And then I find out that a friend of mine is sick or wounded, or has passed, and I move into the character to emotional deep emotion of oh my gosh, someone I love, who I've known for 20 years, I have now heard, and so I move into that part of me. And then I move into this sense of, oh, my gosh, I am so grateful that I had this person in mind life and how lucky we are to be alive and to be able to connect and to be able to have this experience of being alive. So we're all already bouncing in and out of these four parts of ourselves. And what this material allows you to do is to choose, you have the power to choose. So if you say okay, well, we're on busy, busy, but I'd really like to go play, and what is that relationship like inside of your head? What is the relationship like between the part of you that goes to work and the part of you that wants to go and play in the present moment, and if that's not a healthy negotiation, between those two, then a character one's gonna see character three as a total waste of time, right? And it's gonna be resentful, and then little character two is going to come online and say, well, we reserve the right to have some fun, come on, and I'm not happy because I'm not having my movement. And it's like, come on bully character, one, we need to you need to be nicer to character, it's premium. So we're gonna have some fun. And basically, we all have all four and this ongoing relationship is constant. So why not have some say, in understanding who am I? Who are the Wii inside of me? And what power then do I have to choose? And for me to live the life that is most balanced and makes me happy? Exactly. So one of the most meaningful exercises for me was, like you suggested naming off where these characters. So when you become better at becoming aware of what's happening right now, that makes choice easier, because all of a sudden, you're aware of what's going on? Oh, this is my character, one whose name is Athena, by the way.

Oh, that's my character one. Okay, this is my character to kind of having a little bit of a tantrum right now. So having that removal of that this isn't you this is a part of you allows you to make those choices. So can you talk about that too, because that's something like what you said before about judgment and resentments. Often those conversations happen in our heads, but they're all a part of us via Yeah, and they're all important. So character, one is the rational part that goes to work for most of us. We know that part. That's okay, right. Character three is the law.


little playful card, we're okay with that character for is our holy, authentic divine self, our connection to something that's greater than we are dance, okay? The problem child, right, we all lose what we call character too. But here's why I character to exist and why it's so important to honor this little character. When character two is yelling and screaming, it means it's not safe. And if it's not safe, it is safe in the presence of that which is familiar, it feels scared, so it's going to fight, it's going to flee, or it's gonna play then in relationship to new things. Okay, so let's say I'm a child, and I'm exposed to a lot of different people of different colors. All right, I'm brought up in an environment where it's normal for me to see African Americans to see Asians to see Caucasians, I get to hear a lot of different European languages or different kinds of languages, I get exposed to all these different things, well, then my little character to is feel safe in the presence of all of that, because it's familiar, I grew up with that. But in America, we have all of this different kinds of situations going on all these different cultures, though rarely are we actually exposed to people who are different from us. And so because of that, then I see someone of a different race, or I hear a different language. And I'm automatically that's different in my natural kickback responses, I don't feel safe, because it doesn't feel familiar. So at that level, we are biologically programmed to be racist, if we're going to use that terminology. And racism is I don't feel safe or comfortable in the presence of that, which is different from me, then what do I do with that? Well, then I either hide away, and I pull myself away from and I make myself smaller, and I constrict. And I say, I don't like that it's not familiar, I don't want it in my presence in order to protect myself or I realize I'm okay, I'm safe. In the present moment, I'm fine with these people who are different from me. And then naturally, that character three and four, which are of the present moment. So I give, I bring myself into the present moment, and I see something new that is unfamiliar, then I move toward that with curiosity. The same is true for sports or for crafts, or for music, or for whatever am I is even willing to explore what is hip hop? Right? Okay, that's my character to say, No, I'm going to shut it down. I'm going to push it away. And we're going to call it bad, because the left hemisphere has this hierarchy. And it's going to push something away and say, No, then I either become superior to that, or I become inferior to that. But that's all a conversation of that character to. So in our society, we put all this emphasis on character to this is where we move into social emotional learning. And the difference between wholegrain living and social emotional learning is social emotional learning puts all the focus on the social emotional learning of character DOH. And while wholegrain living does is it says, when I am in that pain, yes, I can root noise into that circuitry and understand what's going on, which is important. But the thing about social emotional learning is you cannot learn about it when you're already emotionally triggered. Do you see what I'm saying? So you're gonna have to be completely advanced and social emotional before you move into the trigger. And then that's not the time to learn. What are your choices? Well, when I'm triggered, I can run my trigger, I can recognize that I think I thought I feel any emotion, I run a physiological response. I'm now triggered, I'm lost in whatever that is. That lasts for less than 90 seconds. Alright, I call that the 92nd rule from beginning to end. Now I can certainly rethink those thoughts and rerun that circuit over and over and over and again for 80 years and hold a grudge against somebody or have the power of whole brain Levinas I'm triggered emotionally right now. I am in my true. How do I save myself? I don't save myself by analyzing my painting. I'm in my pain. I save myself by recognizing character one is right here. And I can look at character one and character one guy can become character one, look around and say in this moment, am I safe? Are we safe? Do we need to fix something in order to change the environment? Are we safe? We're safe, okay. There's no bus coming at us. Character four can then come in as my most compassionate part of myself and say I'm hurting little character to you're in pain and I'm in pain and it's okay, we got you. You're normal.

flown in here? I got you. What do you need? Do you need me to hold you? Do you need me to hear you? Do you need me? What do you need, you're not alone, we your team is right here. And then little character toe is going. Okay. And in the meantime, we're running the 92nd loop so that the anxiety can allow itself to actually dissipate across time, because I'm no longer fueling character to his thoughts on any motions, I'm pulling the energy away from that group of cells. And as I do that, then I start to call, I start to relax. I'm grateful that character one is there, it's like big mommy character, one, you know, Athena gonna fix our things. And then I got my big character for this gonna come in and love me no matter what, and I am safe, and I am okay. And then eventually little character three is going to come in and say, you want to go do something fun. Let's go outside, let's go for a walk. Let's go look at the bugs. Let's go play in the mud puddle. Let's go get ice cream, whatever it is, right. And so the power of whole brain living is that we're not just focused on that bowl of energy of pain, but allowing the other parts to come in. And then once character two has called itself, then that's when we care about social emotional learning. Because then it's like, okay, what happened? How do I look at that? How do I differentiate what happened? What did I hear? What was said? How did I take that? How might I learn from that, so that the next time that kind of thing happens, it doesn't have the same power to do the same trigger. And that's healing. And that's why we absolutely have to have that character to, but we don't put in a weird and never needs to drive the bus, right. And that's where your agency comes in, and how you want to be in any given moment. One of the things that teachers and educators and administrators, school leaders, everyone is not feeling safe. Right now, these conversations are sometimes challenging, because character two is the only thing that's available, people are waking up in the morning feeling activated. And then you go into these classroom situations, we've got this activated teacher with an activated child, and then it escalates and someone's in the office, and then the parents are involved, and then everyone stays there. So that's why I focus on the adults, because we have to start with the people who are caretaking for these children. One way, I would love to know you start to have these conversations. So just at the beginning of this week, we ended a year long research program on training school population. So this is administration, anybody in the school system, not the kids, teachers, administrators, cafeteria workers, bus drivers, anybody who has an interaction with a child, that's one population, we give them three hours of whole brain living training, so that they understand what is whole brain living, we have another person training the parents in whole grain living. Each of these two populations gets our week for three weeks, about whole grain living as it relates to them, what's going on with their brain, parents have different concerns. And then they have their language, they have their concerns, schools have their concerns. And then the last two hours last two weeks, we put those two groups together, so that now all of a sudden you got a group of school, you got a group of parents, and the entire village within which the children are living, they get wholegrain loving and their understanding, whole brain loving. And so Neville there, it's becomes a part of your common language. Someone can call me up and say, Joe, what are you doing? I'd say, Helen, because no one's what I call my character one Helens busy for the next two hours. And they say, Okay, well can Pigpen my character three can pick then go for a walk with, you know, me, you're not and I say, Yeah, I can do that for right. And now we're speaking the same language is like, what are you doing? How are you? How are each of these four characters, and where it becomes a part of the culture. So you have to build this understanding and differentiation into a part of the culture, which I think the biggest difference between typical SEL programming and you said something that I do want to address and you said, there's a push toward SEL, and there's a legislative push away from Sal. Yes, there that is very real right now. And there is a population in the political world that is saying, Oh, my God, we're brainwashing our children. And it's like, that's a miss, unfortunately, for the SEL programming, but the way around that is to do whole brain because if we're doing whole brain, it's not about brainwashing. It's about looking at the anatomy of the brain, differentiating


between the different groups of cells that have different skill sets that result in different profiles, and then encouragingpeople to learn how to recognize become aware, which character Am I in? Which character? Would I like to be in? How do I get there? And then how do I create this negotiation inside of my own head? And then if you have the same language, and you say to me, little Jill, are you okay? What's going on with you, and I can say, little pig pen just stubbed her toe, she's okay, which is very different than little Abby, which was my character, too, I got my feelings hurt, and when so and so said such and such, and it made me think such and such and I took it personally and not enough. So I can be in my pain of my present moment, or I can be in my pain from the past. And that teacher or parent is going to MainPage that character completely differently, depending on which part of me has been triggered. And one of my favorite examples of this is when little children, they fall down, and they scuffed themselves, and they're in the present moment, I just found out, I just stopped myself, but I'm really okay. But who's watching? Should I become my character to instantaneously and become that and then get that retention? Or is nobody really paying attention anyway, so I'm just gonna get up and go play, right? I mean, we are constantly making these decisions, why not make them conscious life, we have to make them consciously so we can change the world, you know, that's my dream. And all of this is teach people about their brain. So you can be your best sell that with twice, you're no longer victim to your circumstances, whatever they are. And I do think it's important, we talk about the political movement away from this, but You're 100%, right. And this has kind of been my angle in this also. And I'm excited to learn more about the work that you're doing in schools, because when we grounded in science, and biology, we're not talking about these woowoo feelings that we have that are kind of off here. And they're not really tangible and actual neurocircuitry that's happening in each of our brains. And the more we can understand ourselves, the more we can show up for other people, particularly the kids that we care for in schools, right up to this point, and time focusing on emotional reactivity has been extremely important, because we can identify that and we can identify what's going on with the circuitry, you know, something happens the amygdala is stimulated, how's it going to find slight fall over and go down? What is my natural response? But my power is not there. Once I'm in that circuitry. I've lost my power. And so where is the power in the brain? Well, that's why with SEL, it's like, okay, well, that's when we turn on other parts of our brain. But let's be very specific about when it is appropriate to do that, when it is appropriate to learn those tools. And which other exactly what is our game plan? What's the game plan of our whole brains team, and so whole brain living to me takes SEL to the next level. And the only reason we know this now is because of brain scientists, who studies the brain at the cellular level, who thinks in circuitry like this, this was my everything. And my focus was how does our brain create our perception of reality? I mean, that's a big question, right? How do these cells do what they're doing. And then to lose half the brain, the left hemisphere lose characters, one And Taro, all I then had was character three, when really didn't have any of that, because I didn't have any energy left. So I became character four. So I existed as character four, and then use that energy healing after time to bring character three back online. And then the right brain skill sets, rebuild the circuitry of character two and character one, and then carry on. And then they came back on full force and character one says, Well, I want to take over and be the boss again. And it's like, oh, wait, you weren't glad you're back. But oh, my gosh, we don't want you to be the boss. And that goes to your question then about why are we skewed to the left? Why do we have this left brain dominance? And I think part of it is because character one is so loud, it's the one that gets done. It's busy. It's reward punishment. It defines what's right, what's wrong, what's good, what's bad. It's all it's the boss, and it wants to be the boss. And in our society, we've shifted to the value structure of that level of hierarchical reward. And so whether we're looking at our school system, or our government, everything's a hierarchy. And we all have a position on that hierarchy. And we all generally we're happy where we are where we want to go


higher, and that left hemisphere just wants more and more and more and more and more reaches a level of achievement, but then it wants more and more and more, and then reaches a new level of achievement, but then it wants more and more and more. So it's this never ending cycle of positive feedback, I want it, I get it, I want more of it, I get more of it, I want more of it. There's no pause. But we're a biological creature. And biologically, you have to biology functions as a negative feedback system if you want it to thrive, which means I'm hungry, I want food, I eat food. And now I'm satiated. And I don't want food anymore. Right? In your hand, then of the poor show, I'm hungry. And then you have to have the pause. Okay, I'm satisfied now. So that push, push, push, push, positive feedback loop of I want more, I get more, I want more, I get more, which is what our society is skewed toward. That's our stress circuitry. So the stress circuitry of that value structure of that left hemisphere is giving you anxiety, we are at this pinnacle of really an anxiety epidemic in our society, which is just stress, stress, stress, alarm, alarm, alarm, alert, Alert, alert. And that's the situation you described as what we're waking up as. And that's what's going on in the schools. And it's like, how do I break that cycle, I have to have the whole brain, I have to recognize the value of the pause, which is why this is so essential, because when we have this value structure, this hierarchy of our left side, what we tend to find too, is people aren't actually happy, they're no, they actually want why they want the craving, though, I think something that they don't realize they have already have access to which side of their brain. And when it comes to these moments, it's like this wizard of oz moment, greatly not the end of the movie. You know, Darth is like everything I ever wanted was right here in my own backyard, you have access to everything you need inside of you already. But we get so lost in the story of what we think we're supposed to want or what we should be like, or we hook into that craving, run on want more, and you're biologically programmed, that's part of the circuitry, I want more whatever it is, I want more, I'm not satisfied. Until I get more, you know, I don't know what you're like, but boy, if I'm gonna buy ice cream, I gotta get the little bit in pain because I don't need to court it right? Yes, of course. Because it's just that I want more, I want more. And I'm saying no, I don't really want more what I really wanted, were those first three bytes. Because those first three bytes was where I had the experience of whatever it is, I'm consuming. After that, I just want more, I just want more, I just want more, right? So why don't we do and I want to talk a little bit about the actual process of the brain huddle of okay, I'm in this 92nd overload of emotional circuitry. And now what I think everybody needs to get to know their four characters, you have to know what your choices are, right? This book is called wholegrain, living the anatomy, the anatomy of choice and the four characters that drive our life. And when we know these four characters, then we know the anatomy underlying our choice. And once we know that, then we can begin to recognize when am I in now, right? Who's became dominant? is an appropriate who's going to answer the question, Is that appropriate? Well, how about the rest of the characters inside of my brain? So let's say I have an appointment with you at noon, while character three is going I didn't get any movement yesterday, I got to go get some movement. So I go out in my yard. And I get lost in time, right. And I'm now often in lala land for in the present moment, having a wonderful time. And then I get this inkling of a hanging my talk minutes and character ones coming in saying, Hey, you gotta get inside writing. And it's like, okay, thank you. And I can create this really healthy relationship. And if I know my character one well enough, what's she gonna do? She's gonna say, okay, Pigpen character three, you can go play but you're gonna set your clock so that you're inside 15 minutes before you need to be there. Right? So character one comes in and says, Okay, I'm going to be responsible. We're going to set that time and now it's like, go play pig pen. Go be Pan Pan. Because otherwise pig pens out. They're going well, what time is it? Is it time to go in? Well, what time is it? Is it time to go in and pick them don't have any fun because she just spent her whole time worried that she was going to miss her appointment? Well, why not have the hell and part of my brain saying we're gonna take care of that we're gonna set a little alarm, everything's gonna be good. So you create these relationships between these different characters, and they work together and they're constantly negotiating everything so that you can really be whatever you are. I tell people, I don't mind if you're miserable, as long as you enjoy. Remember to enjoy being miserable.


Oh my gosh, character two is capable of being miserable. It's so beautiful. There's nothing like being miserable. There's nothing like being angry, there's nothing like being sad. There's nothing like being lost in grief, thank goodness, we all have that capacity, I don't want to cut that out, never experienced that. That's the difference between me being alive and maybe in six feet under, I'm not saying feed under, I want to have my emotions, but run them for 90 seconds and then move on. And then decide, you have power, we have so much more power over what's going on inside of our brain than we were ever taught. Yes. And that's the skill set that I want everybody. And I know that you This is why you do your work, too. And I know that you've said, This is why you wrote the second book, you know, the first book was beautiful. And I think there was some of that reflective piece. But this is very explicit that this is about everybody. And isn't just your story. This is everybody's story. There's so much beauty in that. So I want to be really explicit about how we do that, that brain huddle that you're talking about to get the characters talking to each other. You have this beautiful acronym of vra i n, can you go through that so our listeners can understand exactly like, what do I do? First thing you gotta know is you got to know who's who inside of you. Right? You got to know that. So study your four characters. In this book, there's a chapter on each of the four characters, you get to know the skill sets, you get to know what it feels like inside of me, I encourage you to put yourself in those situations. So you know what it feels like inside you. Well, how does your character one hold your body? What kind of voice doesn't use you know, I know I'm Helen because I have a urine exam. As soon as I'm asked this man earrings are our pink pen does not wear rings, right? So I'm changed my shoes, I'm gonna change my clothes. Now. I mean, it's just a whole different character inside of me. So get to know your four characters. And then think about well, it's not just characters inside of me, it's my relationship with others. Who do I call when I'm Helen, or who calls Helen my character one, because they want to get something done. My friends can call me up on the phone. And Helen answers the phone because Helen answers the phone. And my friends will say Oh, Hi, Helen, can you call us back later this evening? And what they're really saying is, hey, Helen, would you have pigpen? Call us later? You


know, say, Ah, yeah, I'll do that. And I pull and I'll put it on my list. I'll make a No, right. Because that's why Ellen does, she makes a list. And she gets it done. And so then later in the afternoon, when I'm walking or I'm, you know, done work, and it's like, yeah, now I'll call my friends back. And then we'll chat. And we'll have a completely different conversation. So the brain huddle is once you know all these different characters, then I encourage people to literally practice doing a brain huddle 20 times a day, at least 20 times a day. And that means every time you think about it, you do it. And that's important, because you're gonna be your four different characters throughout the day. Let's say character one is busy and at work and so character one's gonna probably say, oh, put the clock on and say every hour on the hour paying me and I'll do a brain huddle. So character one, it's rational, it's organized, it's busy. It's on the last it's a brain huddle. And so character one comes in and says, Okay, we're gonna do a brain huddle. Character two, little Abby. Are you okay? Are you here? Hello. I am just gonna go. I'm just gonna feel right. Ah, yeah, I'm good. I'm okay. And the important thing about doing that when I'm not in my pain is little Abby little character to isn't only when I'm unhappy, little character to is always there. So I want to nurture this part of myself and let her know. Character one cares. Character three cares. Character four cares about Abby when Abby's not thrown a fit. So they went to Abby is thrown a fit because she's run up against some pain and resistance. She knows these other characters have a relationship with her no matter what. So Helen can call on Okay, we're gonna have a brain a little character three. How are you? I'm pigpen. Stone guide because I know you're going to be done in 20 minutes and I get to go clang and go do some fine, I'm happy. And then though character four is always good. I mean, character force us grateful for being alive character for are you here and allow yourself to feel that deep sense of gratitude that oh my gosh, I have eyes that can see I have legs that can move me around. And I'm alive at all. I have bladder capacity. Oh my gosh. Now, for about an hour. It's like, oh my god, I have bladder capacities. Character four is going Yeah, I'm good. And then character three, let's say I'm out playing. And we're I'm in the art space. And I'm in all everything I love. And it's like, yeah, now's a good time for brain huddle. So it's like the heart all huddle. And then it's like halen Are you good and Helen's gone Yom Good. Good. Pigpen you just go have fun and Love Song galloping. Are you good and now he's gone. Yeah. I'm not irritated. Right. I'm not just I'm


Not dysregulated not good for I call mine Queen toe Greenco do good. And I was gone. Yeah. Little little ID I just like had diseases so good. And so that's the huddle where you're getting these four together. So the brain stands for B. And any of them can call this B is breath. Why do we always focus on breath, whether we're doing meditation, whether we're doing prayer, whether we're doing mantra, whether we're doing yoga, we go down breath, because the breath is in the present moment. And the ultimate goal is to bring your mind to the present moment, because right here right now is pretty perfect moment, right? Whatever happens in the present moment, we bring all of ourselves into the present, we can handle it, we're amazingly powerful. So B stands for breath. Bring your mind to the present moment. We're okay, I can change. It's like a train running on our tracks. I can change the amplification and breathe deeply and exhale deep lights where I can change my frequency. I have manipulation of air breath in the present moment. So bring your mind start messing with your breath for a moment. And then you're right here right now be our is recognize which of the four characters called the huddle? Did Helen put it on the clock? Okay, thank you. Alan. was an anime I'm not happy. I need a huddle. You guys. I need a huddle wasn't Pigpen Oh, now let's have a huddle. Everybody liked him a huddle. Recognize who called the huddle. He appreciate the fact that no matter who called the huddle, well, there's four of us, right? So paying breath bring your mind to the present moment. Our recognize who called me appreciate there's four of us a I inquire, okay, well hold on a lot of it. Now, in the next moment, that collective whole, who do we want to be? Now this becomes really important because let's say I have an opportunity to turn it into my character to invite you back because you're in their bind net may pokin. On Me, your anxiety is driving me insane. You're being mean to me. And I can just like I get to choose, do I want to come back as a character to and bite you back? Well, two character twos will never find a resolution. So do I want to step into my character for just kinda like, support you and love you from afar? Not get triggered by you? Do I want to bring character one in in order to fix something? Do you need fixing? Do you need me to do something? Does Pigpen want to come and say, Oh, come on, Jen. Don't be like that. Let's go play. And then you get to choose, inquire. And then N stands for navigate, navigate moment by moment by moment. Because what might be appropriate in this moment, it's like, come on, Jen. Let's go play. And then the phone rings. And then it's like, oh, sorry, Helens got to come in, right? Because business. But it's this ongoing negotiation of consciousness between these four different parts of who we are. And the more often you do not all the more begins to run on automatic, it becomes a natural, what you start with purposely trying to do 20 times a day circuitry circuitry is neuroplasticity, the ability of the brain cells to rearrange who's communicating with home so that we have the power to choose new circuitry, but you can't choose when you don't already have. So that's why you have to work on it for at the beginning in order to establish new habitual patterning inside of the brain cells so that when I am really considering getting really angry in Hebrew, instead, I can say at all, okay, do I really want to fight with my brother right now? Or do I want to maybe go get something done upstairs in the office? Or put it on go play? Or do I just want to sit here and wrap him in love and say he's got 90 seconds to run through that nasty loop. And then if I'm lucky, they'll pick something different, because I'm not fueling his two with by two. That's the power of who we are. It's so powerful. And you know, when people start stepping into their power like that, that's how we make change, changes everything, everything. How do we do this more? That's what I want to know, as we're getting to the end of this podcast. I want to know what now what is the next step that people listening that teachers can do today to really start this new path? Well get to know your four characters take it seriously. Thank you, first of all, for this podcast, because you're bringing this material to a very specific group, which is the school system, the research program that we've been running, we've got over 1000 people who have participated in the program, and now we're doing the data crunch, and there's no question that this material is going to show positive long term impact. And then it's wholegrain living look for it. It's a wonderful book. It's on audiobook. I read it. I'm equally as enthusiastic there as I am here, but it's beautiful material. And I just think we have this magnificent, beautiful brain. Why wouldn't we want to be able to capitalize on making ourselves content


and unhappy and whole, especially this is a population of people is reaching out to other people, children. And the thing about children is when the school program is going on, and you can always write to me more about possibly becoming a part of this, I don't know what they're going to do, because I'm separate from the research, I advise, but I'm separate from that data. But they're going to be hearing more and more about whole brain living because it takes social emotional learning, it takes psychology, it takes neurology neuroscience to the next level of really integrating what do we know about the brain? How can we differentiate better using this beautiful Oregon and the thing about the four characters is you can say to a group of kids, okay, here's character, one character to character three, character four, here are the skill sets. Now, let's think Harry Potter was the character one, they'll tell you.


It's a little academic, right? She's always doing the research post character two, they'll tell you who's character three, they'll tell you those character four, they'll tell you, the younger kids Spongebob, who's character one, they'll tell you, they get this kids get this, the biggest difference between children that we've been noticing between kids getting this material, and adults is that kids are not as attached to holding on to their character to for as long they let it happen. It hit so hard, they run the cycle. And then it's like, okay, well, I might be mad at you for another round or another low. But I'm more apt to give that up because I'm gonna go do this and play some kickball now and be a be my character three. So the adults as we become older, we become more rigid in that pain. And we hold on to our pain tighter, and our trauma. And then as we get older, if we use psychoanalysis, and we focus on the trauma, then we're giving all the energy to the trauma. And the difference between whole brain living and these other programs is I value that trauma, and I want to explore that trauma. But no, while I'm in the trauma, I don't have to re traumatize myself to understand what it is I'm supposed to gain or learn because of that trauma. So I can heal that trauma character to is not going to heal their own trauma characters, one, three and four are the power that's going to help us separate ourselves from the pain so that we can actually analyze that pain using that character of one, we can love ourselves through that trauma and our character four, and character three can help us re align how we're viewing that trauma, with curiosity. And we're not dismissing our character, oh, neither, which is what I think sometimes some of these programs do, its will sprinkle some glitter and rainbows on it, right? We ignore and dismiss the feelings in an effort to just think positive. And that makes it louder. Exactly right. Because it is the character to that is our learning. I don't like it. I've seen it before, I'm going to push it away. Well, character, one can come in and say it's another time. That was three years ago, when that happened, we're safe. Now. That little dog that beat you three years ago, every time you see that same kind of dogs, it's a different dog. So let's have the pain we understand every time I see that dog, I get scared. So I don't like dogs. And then character one comes in and says, but that was one experience. And we're not three years ago in that. And so we can step beyond that. Realize that what we've done is we've said because I had a bad experience with one dog, I don't like any dogs. And it's like, oh, look at it, let's come to the present moment and see, look at all these nice little dogs. These are nice little dogs. And so I can grow. But the only way I can grow is to let the other parts of myself come in and nurture that out so that character two can learn otherwise, character twos just gonna keep screaming every time she sees a dog, right. And there's a beautiful example of that. I'm just so glad to hear this coming from you to this audience. It's so important. And I hope right now everyone at the end of this goes to the show notes, clicks on all of the things where all of the websites are going to be in the links to you, Dr. Jill books. And I'm certainly interested in learning more and more about how I can share this message to the people that I work with. So thank you so much for the work that you do and the time that you took to be with me today means the world to me happy. Thank you. And thank you, everybody. And if you enjoyed today's episode, which I'm sure you all did, make sure you subscribe and write a nice review and I'll see you next time on take notes. Incredible, right? Together, we can revolutionize the face of education. It's all possible and it's all here for you


Right now let's keep the conversation going at empowered educator faculty room on Facebook
    

What if a missing piece to truly empowered educators includes feeling and looking great in your teacher outfits?

What if the best way to fight the status quo of teaching today is to stop being in conflict with ourselves, and start loving our bodies as they are today?

Feeling and looking your best can be an excellent conduit to start seeing yourself in a new light and feeling more confident. So, why not start the healing journey against teacher burnout in your own closet?

Welcome to episode 13 of the Take Notes with Jen Rafferty podcast! In this episode, I’m chatting with fashion therapist, Marisol Colette!

Marisol combines fashion and style with healing and transformation. Using her experience in social work, trauma, healing, emotional intelligence, and fashion, she supports people's journeys in discovering their own personal style.

She believes that when you feel comfortable and powerful in what you're wearing, it leads to feeling confident and powerful in all of the spaces in your life.

Today is all about feeling great from the inside out, and discovering that it’s not vain or self indulgent to have a stylist to support you in feeling more like yourself.

Everybody around you wins when you take care of yourself first!

Stay empowered,

Jen


Let’s keep the conversation going! Find me at:

Click here to learn all the ways you can work with me:
 Jen Rafferty | Instagram, YouTube, Facebook | Links
Instagram: @jenrafferty_
FaceBook: Empowered Educator Faculty Room

About Marisol Colette “The Fashion Therapist”

Marisol Colette is a Personal Stylist and Psychotherapist who has married her expertise in fashion and personal identity with her decade-plus long career working and teaching in the field of trauma healing. Marisol engages clients from the heart, helping clients define and refine their personal style to create life-changing results.

Marisol believes that feeling comfortable and powerful in what you wear leads to feeling comfortable and powerful in everything you do. In one-on-one and group programs, clients find their authentic personal style through writing, personal sessions, Closet Transformations and therapeutic shopping outings.

By looking and feeling good, clients gain the courage to shine their inner beauty on the outside, showing up in the world in new and notable ways. Marisol’s background as a therapist allows her to bring a level of consciousness that is not incorporated in traditional styling, ultimately helping align your style to your soul.


Can’t wait to connect with Marisol? Find her here:

Instagram: @solreflection

Website: Sol Reflection | Soul | Systems | Style

Linktree: solreflection | Facebook | Linktree
Find all her freebies and different ways to work with Marison here!

TRANSCRIPT: 
Do you struggle with finding clothes that feel good? Or do you hate picking out your clothes to wear for the day? Well, today we are meeting a fashion therapist who combines fashion and style with healing and transformation. And with her experience in social work, trauma, healing, emotional intelligence, and fashion. She supports people's journeys in discovering their own personal style, because she believes that when you feel comfortable and powerful in what you're wearing, it leads to feeling confident and powerful in all of the spaces in your life. So today, you get to start to see yourself in a new light, starting in your own closet, we have to get dressed every day, so we might as well enjoy it.

 And if you are ready to move from surviving to thriving, head on over to empowered educator.com/thrive and sign up for the five week online course that will change the game for how you show up both at work and at home, feel less stress and more ease, less pressure and more calm, less frustration and more joy, it is time to thrive. So go to empowered educator.com/thrive.

Remember all the passion and vision you had when you first went into teaching. Feeling like building young minds and creating community through your work would make a lasting impact on this world? Well, those days may feel like they're behind you now because you're exhausted, stressed and overwhelmed and frustrated. But I'm here to tell you it doesn't have to be like this. In fact, the love of teaching never really went away. But it absolutely needs transformation. Welcome to The Take notes Podcast. I'm Jen Rafferty, former music teacher, mom of two and certified emotional intelligence practitioner, and I'm here to light the way for you. In order to create a generational change for our kids. We need to shift the paradigm away from the perpetual stress and overwhelm and into a life of joy and fulfillment. This is education 2.0 where you become the priority shift how you live your life, and how you show up both at work and at home. So take a sip of steamy morning coffee and grab your notebook. It's time to take notes Hello and welcome back to take notes.

I am here with an incredible guests and I cannot wait to start this conversation so you can hear all about her and the work that she is doing. This is Marisol Colette the fashion therapist. Marisol is a personal stylist and psychotherapist who has married her expertise in both fashion and personal identity with her decade plus long career working and teaching in the field of trauma healing. She engages clients from the heart, helping clients define and refine their personal style to create life changing results. And Marisol believes that feeling comfortable and powerful in what you wear leads to feeling comfortable and powerful in everything you do. Her background as a therapist has allowed her to bring a level of consciousness that is not incorporated into traditional styling, and ultimately helping align your style to your soul. Marisol, thank you so much for being here. Yeah. Oh my gosh, it's such an honor to be here with you. It's so fun to get to spend this time with you because I love spending time with you. Yes, same. So Marisol and I met because I was actually a client of hers when I was kind of going through my transformation from educator to entrepreneur, and not just in my career, but there were a lot of personal things that were going on with me I was shifting my identities. And talking with you has been an unexpected change for me in how I show up, even just how I get dressed in the morning. So this is kind of a nod to that and my gratitude to you in my experience with what you do. Thank you. Well, thank you. So I would love to know more about your story of how you came through the land of therapy to fashion and how and why you ended up marrying those two. Yeah, thanks for asking. So I have always loved the idea of getting paid to support and help people that led me right into the world of social work as an undergrad in college. And then I went on to grad school at Columbia in New York City. It was an easy degree because it felt like I got to give love out into the world. And the benefit was that people felt the love and they had growth and transformation. It was a win win situation. At the same time. I grew up in a family of artists. I was really supported in the world of fashion. My parents are painters and graphic designers. We add singers and pianists and other musicians in my family actors. So I grew up in that whole world. So when I was doing social work, it felt like I was leaving a part of my


myself behind. And so what I started to do is I started to offer my friends what I call my closet transformation, for fun and for free, I'd say Let's have dinner together, you can make dinner and I'll go through your closet and help you essentially rework what you already have there. So look at it in a new light I have my tagline is see yourself in a new light to it's like taking what you have, and totally seeing it as a new version of you and reorganizing things and putting them together in new ways. People would say to me, similar to what you said, I'm getting so much more out of this than I ever thought something about me is transforming in a way that I hadn't imagined, based on just looking and playing dress up with you looking at our clothes and playing dress up. And I think that that's the key to what I eventually created my business out of which is that I'm keeping the therapist, right, I'm keeping the part of me that loves to support people in their healing and growth believes that transformation is possible for all of us. And also feeling like it's my natural inclination to do it kind of through the back door or the side door of fun. So being best girlfriends playing dress up, having a good time being in your body, if that's not something you've experienced before, basically loving and celebrating my clients and the way that they look and feel and what they were. And so when I built my business, honestly, it was to make my job more fun. And then in turn, continue to support people through their transformations. So in 2015, I left a federal government job where I was just doing a social work, and I created this business and slowly and slowly it's grown, I have a private practice where I still do trauma healing, I quit teaching in the field of trauma healing, so that I could make more space for the work that I do. And now I support people both in one on one settings. And I do this with people across the globe. I mean, you and I don't live in the same city. And you've traveled and we've talked and you've been in other places and your people that you spend your time with are in other places, too. I can do all of the work from afar. I travel for some of my clients, and then I do branding, photoshoot styling, which is where you and I originally met, that was the first thing that we did together. And it's so much fun. I mean, you and I had a great time, I was not expecting the great time that I was about to embark on.

Because to me when I hear you speaking about clothes and bodies, fun and loving and celebrating was not words that came to mind. But at the start of our journey together. And I still get choked up even just saying those words because it's so raw, and so real for so many people. So for someone who might not be experiencing the fun, and the joy and the love about their bodies, how do you go about even just starting to have that conversation with somebody? Yeah, through my training as a therapist, one of the models that I used was a positive reinforcement model. And what it isn't, is isn't a Pollyanna approach. It isn't a love and light, everything's fine approach, ignoring what doesn't feel good or what's wrong, but it's really focusing our attention on the felt sense of what is going well in our body. We have a natural tendency towards healing, growth and transformation. But often we have this negativity bias where we're focused on what's not going well. So it's like the attention to the negative or what's wrong the What's wrong attention is what my one of my mentors in organic intelligence, Steve Hoskinson would always say, the What's wrong attention. And you know, the world really supports that capitalism says, you need this, you need that you're not enough till you have this and that we do a lot of comparisons. There's a lot of comparisons with Hollywood and famous people, etc, some unattainable standards and the patriarchy, right. It all sets us up as in particular women, but men too, like nobody is actually thriving under the patriarchy, everybody feels at a disadvantage. And you know, I'm coming at it from a completely different approach of like, let's look at what's going well, let's easily connect in with those parts and celebrate the parts of you that are lovely, and good and wonderful, just as you are. Again, I said, I become your best girlfriend, like think about that. Think about your best friend, and think about how they treat you. And they think the world of you, they're your fan club, your biggest fan, and I become your biggest fan. I think that that is just kind of a framework for what I do is so valuable, because people are just not used to getting that kind of love. And it's not easy, but I'm also doing therapy on the side listening in ways that other people aren't listening. So it's not a what to wear, or what not to wear kind of program, because most importantly, those kinds of things don't stick if I were to just tell you what to wear, and it had no resonance or alignment with who you are. I mean, you trash it at the end of the day or you just wouldn't feel as good in it. And secondly, what to wear, what not to wear such as shame based kind of mentality. It's like there were probably things that you chose, like there were things that I helped to choose


For you, things that you brought to the table, and then things that we sort of met in the middle about things that were really meaningful to you, that I would support you in finding the best version of because I know that you know yourself better than anybody else. So instilling that trust in you and supporting you in what you've already got on the table is only going to make it better for you. And we do this benign neglect of all that negative self talk, like I'm not listening, I'm hearing you say it, and I'm going to turn us in a different direction. Yeah, and you need someone on the outside to help you through that. Because when you're in it, you don't see it the same way. Which is why I think having someone a coach or Silas a therapist, or whatever arena, you're going to, there's a team


you know, all of us kind of elevating each other up. We can't do this by ourselves. And I think something that was really interesting, at least my experience in working with you. And what I know about your work is creating a space where that self love becomes habitual, your outsides match your insides. Yeah, so what you're talking about is the retraining of the brain. So a lot of people don't take risks with what they wear, because it feels foreign. And things that feel foreign feel like they take a lot of effort and a lot of risk and vulnerability. So in this process, we practice doing a lot of things together, we try to enclose together on Zoom, you showed me what things actually look like, you took pictures of yourself. And we were able to kind of talk about, like what feels good and what doesn't feel good. So to the piece about the alignment is when your style is aligned to your soul, which again, is another tagline that I have that you mentioned, then the resonance is there. And it doesn't feel like you're an imposter. It doesn't feel like you're wearing something that not you so it just feels like it becomes part of you. And sometimes there's a practice with that. Because with you, for example, you were making big pivots in your life. So we were actually focused on representing the WHO that you were and who you were becoming. So there was definitely a stepping into that, that probably had a little bit of an edge. But we take baby steps. And we work together. And like you said, I mean, in the field of education, collaboration is key. Nobody is doing this alone, you are weaving of colleagues and companions in this world, supporting one another to lift each other up. And similarly, it's not vain. It's not self indulgent, it's not over the top or ridiculous to have a stylist, it's just my job to support you and feeling more like yourself. And that can be really hard to get to, when we're standing alone in a dressing room feeling like shit about how we look and feel. Yeah, and I'm so glad you use those words, because there is a lot of consideration of being vain or self indulgent or too much or too over the top. And so many people and women, especially like Xhosa, that part of them down. And then we ended up making decisions that are in July and that make us feel frumpy or dumpy and not excited about doing these things, because we think of them as extras in the sprinkles. And what I really like about what you're saying is that this is kind of fundamental to how you show up. Yes, we have to get dressed every day, right. So we might as well enjoy getting dressed. I also think about there's a little bit of a similarity with educators and social workers, right the going into these professions that are heart led, that are of service to others, it can feel like the most important thing about our work, which it is, is about that service to others. It's about how we support others. But I know that you're also teaching people how to support themselves, how to have strength in themselves, so that they actually have the energy and the capacity to do this work of service in a long range capacity. I also think about how it's a little flipped on its head, in my opinion, that we would think of ourselves last or think about not elevating ourselves to the highest version of ourselves, because it's this humbleness that gets really, really attached sense of humble. I mean, I know I'm not saying that exactly right. But I know that folks, it's that humility, where it's we can brag we can't be too much we're of service. So there's this meager or meekness.


to it, it happens. And it's important also to consider the context. We don't want to be super flashy when we're working with there's like lots of communities of people that we want to kind of resonate with. And we don't necessarily want to separate ourselves from too much. But the thing that you read in my bio that says we dress in a way that makes us feel comfortable and powerful, or I say comfortable and confident so that we can feel comfortable and powerful or comfortable and confident in everything we do. It's only going to enhance how we show up in the world. It's only going to make that feel like a better experience. 100% You're right that is exactly the fun.


The fundamental principle of empowered educator is the most generous thing you can do for other people as take care of yourself, because feeling dumpy, you're showing up dumpy, you know, you're feeling crappy, you're showing up crappy. And it's so important that we consider what we're wearing, not just how other people see us, but by how we're feeling on the inside. And I think that's the thing that's so interesting about your work and how it's different from the mainstream fashion. It's not about outside looking in, it's inside looking out. Yeah, which means that when I meet a new client, it is a complete mystery to me, it's an opportunity to humble myself to the fact that I'm not going to know what's going to come out of our time together, you were in a cohort of a couple of other women who were working on branding photoshoots. And every single person's imagery looked so different. And they picked locations, photographers, color schemes, and clothing that were specifically aligned to the work that they do and to who they are as a person. So when I show up with somebody, it's not about like, alright, we're working towards that Chanel bag, we're gonna get those name brand clothes, we're going to do all this stuff, because you quote unquote, deserve it. It's like, No, I'm actually really interested in who you are. And then we're going to reverse engineer this. And so I help people with that question, like, who are you? Who are you becoming, that's where some of the therapy plays a part, right? To really get into that deeper exploration. And then we reverse engineer it to find clothes that align with that I'm always finding new brands and clothes and stuff to align with my clients, individual needs and preferences. You know, and especially as we do back to school shopping, right? A lot of what I'm hearing with the people who talk to me about their clothes moving forward is budget, and they're like, Oh, I still haven't gotten rid of this COVID weight, and I can't fit into my jeans that I used to fit into, and I don't feel good anymore. So I'm gonna buy these really super cheap, ugly things, because I'm not planning on wearing them for very long. And so you know, with those kinds of narratives, I would love for you to speak a little bit to how do we change our mindset about this in a way that's practical, where someone listening right now could be like, Okay, that's something I can do today. Yeah, I actually worked with a number of educators going back to school, like just in the past month or so because of the timing of that. And I'll talk a little bit more about that later. But budget is a great consideration, right? I can shop with folks in retail stores. So consignment, I can shop with people at Goodwill. There's a lot of brands out there that are actually high quality, but are working towards affordability and accessibility. I can work with people who are looking for ethical, sustainable clothing or issues around human rights. I mean, there's a lot of places that we can go based on people's values and needs. And what was my newsletter this past week, or the one that's coming out next week? I can't remember. It's like something about like, you can't wait for it. I wish I could remember off the top my head. I just read it the other day, it was like the concept of waiting. Oh, yeah, yeah, I had a client who said to me, it was the most brilliant thing. She said, We can't call today a problem. And I mean, I had this like pause and just take in what that meant. We can't call today a problem. And she was referencing a lot of physical changes that she's had in her life that led her to her work with me, because I was asking her I was like, so as we begin our work together, which is going to be over a long period of time, what do I need to know about your body and about the changes that you've made? And are you making more changes, and she's like, I am exactly where I am today. And I've come to believe and to understand that I can't call today a problem. So this is who I am today. It was this this like, matter of fact, incredible acceptance, lovely perspective on the world and on ourselves. And so we're buying clothes for her today body, and we're investing in those so that you're right, we're not waiting. I mean, everybody knows, like, we don't know what we're gonna get tomorrow, or if we're gonna get tomorrow. And that's so hard to live into. Because we're so consumed with the fact that I'm going to make a change, I'm going to make a change next week, next year, whatever we'll like, let's help that we have that. I am a big proponent of being in your body right now. I also understand that practically speaking, people are changing in two ways. One physically because people have done a lot of shape shifting during the COVID time, so they're physically changing, right? And also, we are not the same people that we went into 2020 Being I mean, in so many ways, there's been a lot of political movement. There's been a lot of racial, social justice movement, there's just been a lot of coming to terms with like, people are reprioritizing their lives making big changes, falling in love getting divorced, like making changes in their lives that they're like, holy crap, I was holding on to this and waiting for this and now COVID really ignited the fire underneath me to make these changes. So a lot of people are dressing in new ways because they're


letting go of their old selves, and they are still evolving. And it's okay to buy clothes for your today body and your today personality. I'm so glad you said that, because that was part of my transformation also was, I had gotten divorced when COVID hit. And I looked in my closet of just all this evidence of old me. And so I physically felt something stagnant about putting on those same clothes. And I felt this need to just redo my closet because I wasn't that person anymore. And you're right, there are so many changes and movements and moments where we have an opportunity to grow, and change our identities shape shift, or what have you. And the things that are in your closet can be a reflection of that, and where you're going. It's all right. I mean, you and I, it's not even been a full year since we work together. And the first experience that we had together was one version of you. And then you got a second opportunity that's catapulting you into yet another layer of your existence as an entrepreneur and in this field. And so when we talked the second time, I mean, we kind of went back to square one I'm like, All right, describe who you are today, describe where you're going. And we're elevating even more like I can see this subtle differences from you know, and that was the first time we worked together was a big change. But I can see the subtle differences that are happening now. And I imagine if we continue to work together over the years, as you continue to grow and have success, it's just gonna keep evolving, but we're not going to projectile you out into the ethers of like some version of yourself that is really yet to arrive. But we're also not going to stay in a stagnant place, we're going to move forward. Yeah. And like what you said there to about just this next level version of yourself, just on the outskirts of where you are now and then moving out and then moving out and moving out. In some of my work, I do a lot of visualization with teachers and school leaders, we talk about that version, whether it's a year from now, or five years from now, or 10 years from now. And connecting to that person allows you, I think, some sort of permission or safety for you to step into that now. And a part of that is how you're feeling and the things that you're wearing. It's such a leap of faith. And so when people buy things, you know, every time I shop with people, I let them pick out a couple of comfortable items like kind of something that they would be drawn to naturally, but has a little bit of a difference, right. So it's like things that are still somewhat within their comfort zone, then we stretch and away. They're like, Oh my gosh, I never would have picked this, but I love it. And then we usually end up with a couple of pieces that are really at the edge of their comfort zone. And they're like, I don't know. And my favorite thing is get these report backs of like that was the first thing I was drawn to, I wore it within a week of buying it, I feel really great, and how quickly we can grow. When we actually do that, like what you're talking about, we visualize out, if it's a week, if it's a month, if it's a year, if it's five or 10 years, we're visualizing out, and we're making the choice to step into some of those habits and behaviors now, which then leads us to support the change happening at a clip really, oh, it's so powerful. So with that I would love to know a little bit more about when someone calls you and says, hey, it's back to school, I want to kind of have a little bit of a facelift for my closet with processes a little human, you talked a little bit about picking some things that you like and picking some things that your client likes. So what is that process. So I work with folks individually in two different capacities. And occasionally I'll do these ala carte, but what I find is that to break them down ala carte sometimes works for people's budget, and also doesn't necessarily have the full effect. So the full effect would be that I would start with a hefty 90 minute discussion about who they are, who they're becoming what they like and don't like about their wardrobe, really that therapeutic elements so that we can connect with each other so I can fully understand the client who I'm working with. So it's like journal prompts and things like that, that they can also really reflect on what they want to get out of this. That's again, where I'm most in that therapeutic role. And then I want to go through their closets. So if it's on Zoom or in person, I want to be looking at the clothes in their closet because people have amazing things. And our intuition is better than we often give credit for. We think that we have nothing right like I hate everything, but my eye is to see where we can utilize some of the stuff that we have. So maybe it's just a couple of pieces to go with that thing. Or maybe it's actually taking two things from opposite ends of the closet and putting them together but in some way transforming your closet and then getting a sense of what we actually do need to get and then that's the shopping together process. So that's like a what I call like my quick one month transformation and then I have a three to six month program where you can work with me on a longer term basis. And that's where I really deep dive into becoming your best girlfriend we Marco Polo and Voxer and we're talking all the time so that we


are doing that retraining of the brain on a consistent basis like habits really get stuck into place with that ongoing communication? Absolutely. And that ultimately you want to enjoy getting dressed in the morning because you get up, get your coffee, you brush your teeth, and then you get dressed. And that first part of your day sucks. Like how are you showing up to the next thing that you're doing either in interaction with your partner or your kids or on the way to work and how you show up with the people there. That makes all the difference? I think it's as essential as eating breakfast. I agree with you. It's whatever it is that you do in the morning to get your day started is extremely essential to how your day goes. I mean, the first what is it? Robin Sharma says like the first 20 minutes stick takes the next 20 hours or something. I feel like I completely made that up. But he does he


does have a 2020 20 rule of like 20 minutes of journaling, 20 minutes of meditation and 20 minutes of exercise to like set yourself up for success. So Robin Sharma, if you take that and run with it, I'll take some of the what do you call it, the kickbacks or whatever. So agreed. And I think that people just bypass this part all the time, they pull the clothes off the back of the chair that they were the day before they just pull out the same thing they've always worn in their closet, they bypass that part because we've really been trained to think it's extremely vain. It's, again, self indulgent. It's like Who do I think I am, I don't want to be seen, I'm afraid to be seen. I don't want to be too much all of those things is like, Okay, well, what a missed opportunity. I mean, what we wear is so essential to who we are, in the same way that how we choose to eat or who we choose to love. Yeah, everything that we consume. But you know, this piece about clothing and fashion is like you said, so undervalued, which is why I'm so grateful that you have this conversation. Because having someone like you are in front of an audience of educators, I think it's unheard of. We don't we don't talk about that what we're wearing is so at the bottom of the conversations, because of all of these other things that we put on top, but in looking at it and what you just said, this could really change your trajectory for your day for how you're having interactions with people throughout the day. And ultimately how you feel about yourself. It is also a teaching moment. So when people see me dressed in alignment with who I am, they can see that right, like, whether I'm wearing something casual or something way out there for out there, right? People are like, wow, that looks so amazing on you. And there's something that they want about that they don't want my clothes, they don't want to be me, there's something that they want about that for themselves. And it's really compelling. And I think that when in the same way that I know that you're teaching your teachers and educators across the board that what they do is, you know, I mean, you're the example for the people you're teaching, right, so we aren't taking care of ourselves, and the students are not learning to take care of themselves. This same thing is like you can really inspire people to be their own individual self. And I know that so many educators are watching, especially at certain ages, like kids try to step in line with their peers, and really the homogeny being the end goal. And that them losing parts of themselves because they don't want to be outcast or different. And so this is really an opportunity to reclaim the parts of ourselves that are different than others, while also being so much more whole in the process. I'm so glad you said all of that, that resonates so much. Because at the end of the day, it's not about looking good. It's about looking aligned. And again, matching those insights and outside, which then make you emit a different emotional and energetic frequency that creates this magnetism that you're talking about that your clients see in you. That's huge. And if you model that for your kids, Whoa, that's a game changer. It's amazing. Yeah, all of it, everything you're teaching anything that I'm teaching, all of it anything in the realm of like self love, self compassion, self forgiveness, self care. I mean, it's all truly the best thing we can do for ourselves. But it really is the best thing we can do. For others, there's this line, when I take care of myself, everyone wins to think about that, like everyone wins, because we're so afraid to take care of ourselves, because we think it's gonna detract from the work that we do, or the way that how we can support or serve others. And it's like, when I take care of myself, everybody wins. Like, if you could believe that across the board. I just like I can't imagine not wanting to go at it from that way, as opposed to when I don't take care of myself. Potentially everybody loses like I lose, and I make myself less available to my students and clients. They lose out an opportunity to see me living my best life. Yeah. Oh, 100%. I think if anyone takes anything from this podcast today, it is that when I take care of myself, everybody wins. That is it. That's the fundamental principle. And I think you might have just described this but I'm wondering if


There is more there, I asked this question to everybody who comes on as far as your dream for the future of education knowing that, you know, this is an audience of educators, what is your dream, I have a lot of dreams for educators. As we know, there's just a lot of inequity across the board around pay around, hours worked around people showing up, like, there's a lot going on that we need to change as a system and that individuals need to participate in changing for themselves. But I'll just talk about style, right? So I shopped recently, with two teachers, one works in higher ed, doing fundraising and one works with She's gonna kill me if she hears this fourth graders, she's an art teacher. And both of these women were going through the clothes and I'm saying, like, look at this one on the hanger, they're like, I don't know, I've never seen anything like that I never would have picked something like that they put it on and it fits like a glove. It's cut from a color perspective, it's really aligned with their colors. And it feels so much like themselves, and then they're living into the truth of who they are. It's a huge transformation. And I from a style perspective, I want everybody to know that they can show up as their best self feeling good and looking good, and what they were, and that that will actually lead them to do their best work. And that that both can be true, they are not mutually exclusive. It is not a give or take that you can have it all like you can actually have it all and that you're a baby, whether you're a man or a woman are on the genders anywhere else on the gender spectrum, like you're a baby and you deserve to be so whole and your baby leanness, baby, late miss. And I see the beauty in everybody that I work with, it's so easy to see. And it's really hard sometimes for us to see it for ourselves. So I just shine that light. And I don't know, the idea that people could love themselves more, thus making this a more loving world. I mean, that's what chokes me up. And what a beautiful example for our next generation. It's just like you are the new sexy, like, wherever you are right now. Like that's, that's it and owning that is part of that beautiful self love. And yeah, that's how we elevate humanity we love. That's right. And I'll just say my I kind of mentioned this before, but like we got to dismantle some systems and structures, right? We got to dismantle the patriarchy, we got to dismantle the way that capitalism really runs and rules our lives, we've got to dismantle lots of oppression that is in this world, racially, socially. excetera. And the only way to do it is to fight against the norm and not in a way that's aggressive, hateful, or in necessarily in like high conflict with other people, but to stop being in conflict with ourselves. That's it. This is how we do it. And it's sometimes quiet, but powerful. Just show up look good. Yes. Ah, this has been spectacular. And I'm so grateful that you wanted to spend your time with me today. And with everyone listening. So for those people who are interested in your work, and wants to know more about you and how to work with you, where can they find you. So you can find me My website is soul reflection.com. And that's Sol that's the last part of my name, Sol Sol, reflection, singular, not plural.com. And then you can find me on Instagram at soul reflection, I do a lot of really fun stuff that's just entertaining and cute there. I also have a Facebook page that's sole reflection. So reflection on my website, and in my link tree in the bio of my Instagram are places where you can sign up for a free 20 minute consultation with me. Also, both those places have freebies, I have a free five day, hashtag stretcher style, simply challenge which is part of that retraining of the brain. It's where we make small changes every day for five days just to kind of notice how you feel without having to completely up in your wardrobe. But just adding one thing every day that makes you feel a little different. It's very subtle, but it's very powerful. I also have a free self guided closet inventory. So it's you taking everything out of your closet and doing your own inventory, which is somewhat similar to my closet transformation. You do it without my eye, but it definitely helps you see your closet in a new light as well. So lots of freebies, my newsletters a great place to get free information. And yeah, free consultation and we can see where we go from there. Yes, highly recommend and your Instagram is always so fun, and colorful and energetic and exciting. So definitely follow up Marisol there. Thank you again, this has been absolutely spectacular. I so appreciate the work that you do in this world. Thank you so much to big. Thank you for having me. Absolutely. So if you liked today's episode, go ahead and leave a five star review. And we will see you next time on take notes. Incredible, right? Together, we can revolutionize the face of education. It's all possible. And it's all here for you right now.


Let's keep the conversation going at empowered educator faculty room on Facebook

What is your conflict style?

Does your conflict resolution strategy consist of throwing your hands up and becoming indifferent and resentful?

Or, do you become aggressive and defensive when you’re met with difficult conversations?

Conflict is not always comfortable. But, we can learn conflict resolution skills that make us feel more confident during these inevitable interactions.

Welcome to episode 12 of the Take Notes with Jen Rafferty podcast! In this episode, I’m speaking with Rachel Teichberg, (my favorite sister, and returning guest) about all things conflict management.

We discuss how conflict makes us feel, and how to manage conflict with more confidence, grace, and ease.

Rachel is head of Learning and Development at Veterinary Growth Partners. She's a content creator, consultant and speaker who creates and delivers interactive leadership training programs that support veterinary practices in establishing or sustaining highly productive teams.

Rachel’s work parallels the work we do at Empowered Educator because leadership skills are transferable and directly related- no matter the industry.

Today, it’s all about discovering how to engage in difficult conversations productively in an effort to have more open and honest relationships- whether they be personal or professional.

You may have not been taught these skills growing up, but if you want to handle things differently- I’m here to help you do the work!

Stay empowered,

Jen


Let’s keep the conversation going! Find me at:

Click here to learn all the ways you can work with me:
 Jen Rafferty | Instagram, YouTube, Facebook | Links
Instagram: @jenrafferty_
FaceBook: Empowered Educator Faculty Room

About Rachel Teichberg

Rachel is the head of learning and development at Veterinary Growth Partners. She works with teams to enhance their culture, boost team morale, and improve overall communication through conflict management and emotional intelligence training. Her goal is to design fun and engaging learning programs that make leaders feel less alone, give them the tools to excel in their roles, while creating beautiful moments of growth and awareness.

Rachel and I have been working behind the scenes together pretty much our entire lives, and sharing her with you brings me so much joy. Her insights offer tremendous value regardless of industry.

TRANSCRIPT:  
My sister is back for another sister episode, Rachel kicked off season two with me and episode one about burnout and emotional intelligence in the workplace and is one of the most listened to podcast episodes this season. So today we are continuing the conversation with conflict management. Because conflict is not always comfortable, but we can learn the skills that make us feel more confident during these inevitable interactions. So today, we are going to get down and dirty about how conflict makes us feel and how we can approach these difficult conversations with more confidence, more ease, and with an open mind. And the best part. After we recorded this podcast, the two of us decided that it really needed to be something more than just a podcast episode. So as a result, we created the confidence and conflict course, which is specifically for school leaders and administrators. In this four part series, you will create more positive relationships to increase morale and develop a culture of trust within your school district. By learning how to engage in these difficult conversations productively, you are definitely going to want to be a part of this incredible workshop which begins on January 4, but doors are now open for registration and empowered educator.com/workshops. I cannot wait to see you there. Remember all the passion and vision you had when you first went into teaching. Feeling like building young minds and creating community through your work would make a lasting impact on this world? Well, those days may feel like they're behind you now because you're exhausted, stressed and overwhelmed and frustrated. But I'm here to tell you it doesn't have to be like this. In fact, the love of teaching never really went away. But it absolutely needs transformation. Welcome to The Take notes Podcast. I'm Jen Rafferty, former music teacher, mom of two, and certified emotional intelligence practitioner, and I'm here to light the way for you. In order to create a generational change for our kids, we need to shift the paradigm away from the perpetual stress and overwhelm and into a life of joy, and fulfillment. This is education 2.0, where you become the priority, shift how you live your life, and how you show up both at work, and at home. So take a sip of steamy morning coffee, and grab your notebook. It's time to take notes. Hello, and welcome back to another fantastic episode of take notes. And today's episode is another sister episode with my favorite sister and only sister Rachel. Hi, Rachel. Hey, so excited to be here. I am so glad you're here. For those of you who haven't listened to episode one of season two, go ahead and make sure you check that one out. That was the beginning of our conversation. And we realized we had so much to talk about that Rachel is going to be a regular guest on take notes. So for those of you who haven't listened to it yet, Rachel is head of learning and development at vetinary Growth Partners. And she's a content creator, consultant and speaker and creates and delivers interactive leadership training programs that support veterinary practices in establishing or sustaining highly productive teams. So you might be thinking, well, veterinary practices, Jen, this is a podcast for educators? Well, I have to tell you that the work that Rachel does is incredibly parallel with the work that I do here at empowered educator because no matter what the industry is, whether it's veterinary industry or education, leadership is leadership is leadership is leadership. And a lot of the same skills are directly related. Wouldn't you agree? Rach? Oh, absolutely. I mean, it's every single time I present or we deliver content, somebody comes up to me. And they're like, Oh, my God, I just realized, like, my partner could use this at their office. And oh, my mom works in this other industry. Like, can you do this for them? So absolutely. I mean, this is universal as far as usage in the workplace. And also personally, of course, Oh, absolutely, personally, and what's been so wonderful is that the two of us have been doing this work in this way, for so long that we've been collaborating kind of behind the scenes with everything that we've been doing. So it's really cool that we finally have this forum to talk about this together in person on this platform. So one of the things I really wanted to dive into, which is, I think, unique to your skill set and your training is conflict management. So specially in a working environment that is service driven. A lot of times we try to avoid conflict. And what usually happens is that we create this toxic piece instead of having these really difficult conversations. So first, why don't you share a little bit of why did you even get into conflict management? Why was that something that was


interesting to you in the first place. Sure, conflict was interesting to me because it scared me a lot. And this is an exercise that we often do when we start presenting this material to a group is sort of a word association. Like when I say the word conflict was the first thing that comes to mind. And often it's fear, anger, aggression, yelling, all of those kind of destructive sort of negative responses that you would expect, most of the time when people think of a conflict. avoidance is a big one, like literally people be like I hear conflict, the word conflicts, I think, run avoid. So I was one of those people, I think, like many of us are, I don't think most of us grow up feeling conflict positive, or view it in any sort of such way. So to me, this was an opportunity, because conflict is inevitable conflict comes in all shapes and sizes, and I was afraid of the very itty bitty conflicts. And I was equally as afraid, and what I thought to be terrible at handling big conflicts, and there were a lot of reasons behind it. So conflict is a part of our everyday life. And so to me, learning more about it, understanding how I handle conflict and opportunities for my own personal growth was the first step in, I wanted to create a more positive relationship with conflict. Because I knew that I wasn't feeling confident in this area, I knew that it scared me to death. And I knew that it was unavoidable. And so the first step that I took in developing a more positive relationship with conflict was learning about how I handle conflict, learning about what my triggers were, what were the construct of in destructive responses to it. So initially, this interest really came from a personal exploration as far as that certification goes, and learning more than about how to help others and train others to be more comfortable in handling regular conflict at work. Yeah, so I want to just highlight one thing, because this is really important, we have to do the inner work first. Otherwise, it's shallow, and it's not going to be as effective unless you really put up the mirror to yourself, and start asking some really difficult question. And this is a theme of wherever you want to grow and develop and learn. We have to start with ourselves. So I'm so glad you know, throughout your journey that you've shared so far with us, especially in that first episode of how you even got started in emotional intelligence, it really did start with your curiosity, of self discovery. So I just not only want to applaud you, but just highlight this as a theme of everything that we're doing, the change always has to start with you. And so why are people afraid of conflict? Let's start there. Because you know, you and I grew up in the same household, you can probably share some of the things that are triggers for you. And the reasons why, you know, we were brought up where our parents didn't like conflict either. So although we lived in what might have been, on the surface, a conflict free households, there was a lot that wasn't said, and that created some level of discomfort that we were able to even feel as kids. Yeah, there's definitely a whole spectrum of how people grow up. Right, we definitely were on the far end of conflict avoidant, I work with somebody who grew up on the flip side. So a lot of the trainings that we do, I work alongside Sean McVeigh, who has been doing this work for a really long time in our industry as well. And it's just really interesting to hear his side too, because he grew up in the complete polar opposite. Conflict was loud conflict was angry conflict was physical, right conflict could be violent. And that was not my experience at all. And what I find most interesting, the more we dig into conflict is that yes, the way that we were raised definitely defines the beliefs that we have around conflict, and the comfort level we have along the skill set that we have or lack. And that is just sort of the tools that were given whether we like it or not as we move forward. And so for us, we never had anything. So naturally, my inclination as I became an adult was to avoid conflict, I naturally yielded a lot because I didn't want to engage. So to me, sometimes it was easier to just throw up my hands and say, You know what, fine, have it your way, and I'll become indifferent and resentful, and our relationship will become destroyed. And I don't necessarily think I always had that thought process in the moment. I obviously see it now in retrospect, the damage that was done by me not using my voice, but I wasn't given the tools. I didn't know how to defend myself how to create a situation where we could look at conflict as a US versus the problem versus US versus each other. And I just always saw conflict as interpersonal and not


Got about problem. So that was really the big paradigm shift that I had to make was, this isn't about you and me, this is really about a problem that's being put in between us. Yeah. And I think you saying that we weren't given the skills, right? We kind of go through our lives without explicitly being taught these skills. Yet. Everyone assumes that once we get to be an adult, or past, our preteen years, when our brains are moving into this adolescent stage, where we're figuring ourselves out in the world out, we're just supposed to know these things based on, I don't know, the air we breathe, I don't even know because we're walking around as examples of the adults who haven't actually learned these skills. We're just learning from each other, and just constantly throwing our old baggage at each other about how we deal with conflict. But when we don't do it, quote, unquote, the way that correctly or in a way that feels good for us, we throw judgment at it. And it's not your fault. It's how you were brought up. But if you want to handle it differently, it is your responsibility then to do that work, and figure out okay, well, how do I really want to handle conflict? So what's next, you know, I am a recovering conflict averse person,


which is always a journey, or perhaps you are on that other side of the spectrum? How do you even start to approach this? So veteran I Growth Partners, and because of the training that I've had, and that Shawn has gone through, we have access to assessments. And so like, of course, that's a great starting point. Because just like with an emotional intelligence assessment, just knowing like the you are here, sign is really great. You can do it without it, I think a big part of that is reflection, and figuring out what you typically lean towards in conflict. And whether these are big or small. You know, you mentioned earlier about creating toxicity. Toxicity isn't necessarily formed just by having like one big blowout, a lot of times the toxicity forms because of little micro events that add up over time. And maybe it doesn't feel like a big deal the first time you avoid a conflict with one person, but on the 20th 30th 40th time you've yielded. And that resentment is building and building, then we have that right? It can equally happen. I mean, we've all had, I'm sure over the course of our lives a situation where things just blew up. And that can happen too. But I would just say to try our best to reflect. So I'll kind of go through the high level of what some of those like hot buttons and triggers are. For instance, I think knowing what sets you off is really important. However, remembering that you are ultimately responsible for how you respond. So you can communicate to a hot button pusher as we call them about how their behavior is triggering for you, and how you'd ideally like to see that change through feedback conversations, which we can talk more about. But ultimately, you knowing that you have a trigger of being micromanage, let's say does not give you the freedom to say, you know, that's my trigger. So I'm always going to respond aggressively or I might yell or scream or I might hide away, you know, kind of that fight flight freeze response through conflict of am I going to fight you about this? Am I going to retreat about this? Am I going to become like paralyzed over this? Those are all the natural responses, but you are responsible. So I think that if we go through what some of those are, we have hot buttons around. Like I said, micromanaging, we have it around hostility that is by and far like the number one hot button that at least exists in the veterinary industry. My gut says it probably wouldn't be very different with teachers. I just think that again, when we think about characteristic traits, attributes of people who are drawn to teaching and people who are drawn to animals, I don't think that it's too far apart. So hostility, and that's just like people getting loud people shouting, throwing just being big, taking up a lot of space, a lot of emotional space, sucking up all that air in the room, you know, and that can be really frightening. So other hot buttons are abrasiveness being aloof. I don't know, that was a big trigger for me as I got older, which is funny because I used to be that way. And a lot of times, we judge and get frustrated by people who actually behave in a similar way to us because it's something maybe we don't like about ourselves. So it's funny, you know, and thinking about it that way, when I was dealing with somebody who was incredibly aloof, that actually made me become very hostile, which is very unusual for me. Like I said, hostility. Micromanaging overly analytical people can be a hot button, somebody who just cannot make decisions. They just have to think over and over and over and over again. self centered. Could be a hot button for some people being unappreciative. That's another one for me. And I know we always say like Millennials always need their like Pat's on the backs and our trophies of participation. But you know what, Rachel, that particular one that you just said under appreciated is something I hear a lot


A time when I ask teachers, school leaders, principals, one of the most common things that they say is that I just want to feel respected. I want to feel appreciated. And that is an underlying theme that creates those low level feelings. I think that is pretty universal, at least in this profession. Oh, 1,000%. I know. And I only say that, and I was joking, because I think a lot of people are so judgmental of the millennials, specifically for being vocal about needing it. And no, I agree, it is unfair of them to judge and also to group everyone in a generation like that. Because I know plenty of people who are not millennials who need appreciation and deserve appreciation and want appreciation. But I find that one interesting because it is a hot button, it is recognized through research that has been done. And it isn't just universal to one age group. And you need to feel appreciated and, and appreciated in a million ways. A lot of us think about appreciation as like a Thank, you know, it's could be so much more than that. And even just through appropriate pay sort of as a baseline. And then on top of all of the other things that we can be appreciative of, and just recognizing people's efforts and showing up for them. Even just being an active listener to somebody can show your appreciation, like I might not be able to help you, but I'm going to hear you and I will do what I can. To me that's like that means a lot to like, I appreciate how you feel. And I appreciate what you need, regardless of what the answer is there. So yeah, unappreciative is definitely a high one for me.


My personal number one, I'd actually might be pretty close with hostility, hostility really does trigger me, but unreliability is a big one for people. Yes. Oh, that's a big one for me, too. Yes. Yeah. You say you're gonna do something, do it? Do it. Me. I mean, like, so I'm seriously dragger. You know, say what you mean. And mean, what you say. And I think part of this to Rachel is, in doing my reflective journey, I have to take a step back and realize that not everyone is me, right? So this is a value of mine. But it might not be of value to everybody else. And I live in a world with lots of people, which is amazing that none of them are me. That's the beauty of how this works. But I think that that value is because I think we talked about this also in episode one, where when there's some sort of conflict, sometimes it also is a conflict because of a value differentiation. Big time. Oh, yeah. And not to say, there's so many other reasons why you could become in conflict with somebody. These are just through the research that was done. And this is actually all through the MTI the mediation training institute at Eckerd. College. And that's where I did the training. And that's the information that we always present to our members. This is essentially through their research, sort of the most common hot buttons that set people off. But like, Absolutely, you might be triggered by something else. But I do want to just add in that last one, which is untrustworthiness. That's another big one. similar, but different than unreliability, obviously, somebody breaking your trust, I always say like, you know, relationships are built on trust, but it's a glass house like one crack, and it all falls down. And it is so hard to build trust back. That is something that takes true effort. And you cannot just say I'm sorry, and expect things to go back to normal. Like, that's a deep one. That's a deep cut. So ultimately, with these hot buttons, it's the ability to say, what's triggering me? How does this fit in? You know, if you have a boss, for instance, that every time they leave, you feel like triggered, you feel like there's a conflict of some way. Like you just feel like there's always sort of this having a different attitude, perception thought about a situation that took place some sort of perception of threat, I want that to be the moment where you maybe can reflect and be like, Why is my heart beating so fast? After I have a meeting with this person? Always? Is there a conflict? Is there something else going on? Is there something that I'm not saying? Do I feel triggered in any of the ways that I just listed? And how can we address that because you can address a hot button for sure. Like I said, you can say, Listen, Jen, I get really overwhelmed. When you check in on me multiple times a day on the project that I'm working on, I understand that you want to know how things are going and you want to have a say. But I'd really appreciate if we can find a better way so that way I can do my most productive work. And we can plan to meet about this at a certain time so I can feel more prepared. I'd also maybe have a conversation that person about is there a lack of trust here, right? Do you feel like I'm the right person to do this job? Is there something that I can be showing you or proving to you to have a little bit more space? That's a conflict conversation.


Like and I think some people forget calling it out and having a conversation


about how someone's making you feel like there's a conflict. And me just saying something that seems so simple as that, like, I didn't raise my voice, I didn't call anyone a name. I didn't point a finger at anybody I just said, this is what's happening. This is how it's making me feel. And I'd like a better way. It's just that simple. So simple when you put it that way, right. And I really appreciated what you said too, about having that moment of reflection, understanding that, okay, my body is talking to me right now, my heart's beating, I'm sweaty, or it's beating quickly, hopefully, it's always beating, but it's beating quickly.


Or my chest is tight, right. So the work that I do with the folks who are here with me and empowered educator no to, that's the first step to everything, because you can't get to that next step of having that conversation with someone if you're still activated. So once you're able to calm your nervous system down to a place where you can really objectively get curious. And I think what was so interesting about that example that you just gave, was that after explaining the situation, from your perspective, when you started asking questions, and that curiosity creates almost a common ground for the two of you, is that accurate? Well, yeah, because it goes back to the theory of us against the problem. I could have a problem with you and say, Jen, I am sick and tired of you coming into my office all day long and making me feel like you don't trust me. And I just can't take it anymore. I could have said that.


But how do we think you're going to respond to that? And your defenses are gonna go straight up? Yeah, my chest is getting tight right now, even in that example? Yeah. So like, my tone was that not that it was bad, it was elevated, you could see that I was feeling big feelings. I'm walking into a conversation with you elevate it, and escalate it and heightened and hot and like ready for a fight. And you can tell. And depending upon how you respond to the conflict, you could be like, whoa, whoa, okay. Or you could be like, What are you talking about? So there's just, the best that we can do is center ourselves, figure out what's going on, really do the work and understand again, what is the behavior, we have a really good way of like labeling and doing verbal pointing of the fingers, like you did this to me and playing victimhood. And my reaction is a product of your behavior. And that is true, but we have to describe it in a way that doesn't put the other person on defense right away. And so curiosity is a great way to get to that we have a problem, which is that I feel that you don't trust me, I feel like maybe there's an issue about my skill set, whatever the case may be, I want to figure out why that exists. And that curiosity 100% always is the foundation. Now when we're having those conversations, the big thing to me is describing the behavior, we say this all the time, we cannot say you don't trust me, right, the starting that sentence with you is a verbal finger pointing right? It is assuming something it is creating this just a blanket statement of how this other person feels, which you don't know for sure. Instead of approaching things that way, we always try to recommend that we change those use statements. So if you're naturally inclined to be like, You don't trust me, you're mean to me? How do we change that? So the first thing is to say, start the sentence with I, I feel like when blank and describe the behavior. So if you feel like that person is mean to you, why, what are the behaviors, I feel like your means me could be, I feel like when you raise your voice, you have a problem with me personally. And that's a lot different than you're so mean to me. When you invite everyone else out after work, and you don't extend an invite to me, I feel disrespected. And that feels a lot different than you have favorites. So a word choice ultimately becomes a big piece of that. But that's why our words are so important. Because we naturally as the person you'd be receiving this feedback, and on the receiving end of this sort of criticism, if somebody were to say you're mean, you probably don't identify as a mean person. So ultimately, you're immediately going to be like, No, not, because you don't identify that way. You don't see yourself in that way. And you probably don't show up every day planning to be mean to anybody. That's not the goal. So naturally, we want to defend ourselves and say, No, that's not true. That's not me. I don't identify that way. So we have to be really careful to avoid labels like that. Because even if in your mind, what you're saying is true. That other person might have sort of an identity brake on to say, but I'm don't have favorites. And I'm not mean and I don't micromanage, but they're not hearing what the real problem is. Right? So in having this conversation, really highlighting the observable objective behaviors is kind of the key


key there. And you know, as you're saying some of these things, one theme, actually, that's come up a lot this week is passive aggressive. And so every time you're saying the word mean, I'm actually thinking like, you know, passive aggressive is something that that keeps coming up to, but again, having a conversation with someone and saying, you know, you're really passive aggressive, that's not going to go well. And I don't know if that's something that if you're dealing with someone who your feeling is, they're being passive aggressive to you, that's certainly not how you're going to even want to approach the conversation anyway. So you just don't have a conversation at all? Definitely. Well, and that kind of brings us into your constructive and destructive responses to conflict. So obviously, in these past examples of me going up to you and having a conversation, that's obviously a very constructive response, it's kind of falls into reaching out like it's an action. So we have passive responses, and we have passive and active responses. And so obviously, the active ones are some sort of over action. Passive is something that happens more internally. And we have active and passive responses in both constructive, so sort of your positive ways of handling conflicts and your destructive your negative ways. So just because for instance, maybe you self criticize, which again, major one in our industry, that's the number one destructive response to conflict in the veterinary industry. My gut says it's probably the same. I'm curious. I just like feel like we up everyone needs to take an assessment, every teacher needs to take an assessment. Well, I'm gonna go do some research. Yes.


But again, it's not just saying that, because I do feel like a lot of those the same traits, qualities, attributes, characteristics that draw people towards teaching, it's very, very similar, but different in Batman, you know, we're called towards animals. Obviously, teachers are often drawn towards children in the future, and all that sort of stuff. But self criticizing is a destructive, passive response. And if you've ever participated in that nasty voice in your head, telling you how awful you are, and how you handled that terribly, and you couldn't believe that you said that, and this person is going to hate you, and how can I show up to work the next day and replaying it over and over and over and over in your mind until you kind of forget what really happened. And sometimes it really does distort reality, you talk about it nonstop, to your family and your friends to a point that it could actually destroy your relationships with those people because it becomes so all consuming that self criticizing. And you might be like, yeah, well of course, it's normal to think about something that happened. That would be called reflection. Self criticizing is like reflection on steroids that is out of control. That you are like literally sleeping and dreaming about this conflict and you cannot let it go. That woulda, shoulda coulda kind of feeling I lived in here. It's gotten a lot better. But I can't even tell you the amount of sleep I lost over the things I said or didn't say the things that I did or didn't do the wishes I would have made. I mean, how many of our listeners probably have like, stood in the shower and been like, I should have said that?


Well, yeah, it's like it's like that Seinfeld episode, right? Yeah, totally dating myself right now. But like, Absolutely. Like, the shrimp store just called and said they ran out a year or whatever it was. Right. But like, that's what it was. You said linkbase Later. Great. But that's totally a thing. It was the jerk store. Not the shrimp store. The shrimp was like another episode with the shrimp. I'm mixing up my Seinfeld episode. That's right. I digress. But yeah, you're right. And this is a scenario that we talk about a lot. Because there are times when you're up at three o'clock in the morning, and you can't shake the thought. Yeah, I mean, have you ever woken up in the night thinking about something embarrassing? You did in third grade?


War? Yes, totally. Yeah, of course, like, and you're just like, and you see memes on the internet about it all the time. Like, Oh, can we just get some sleep like brain? Are you ready to like, go to the Wayback Machine and remember that one time and did great. Yeah, it's a big problem. This definitely requires a lot of work. But really, it's just to say that some of the most destructive things you can do isn't necessarily screaming and yelling and carrying on. And a lot of times we give all of that stuff a lot more weight. But some of the other passive destructive responses are avoiding, which was again, a big thing you and I sort of that was our go to move, yielding. So basically, just essentially saying, Whatever you say, I'm not even going to try to give you my opinion, my thoughts, they don't matter. So again, it's also a very, like kind of, it's a defeatist kind of way of going about it. And ultimately, the conflict will resurface because you're not satisfied and that just won't work for long term. And then of course, hiding emotions is the other passive so essentially saying no, I'm good, everything's fine but like deep down inside, you want to scream and cry and punch somebody in the face and but you're saying all the right things. And then of course, what that really does is deteriorates trust because you


You've told this person that you're in conflict with that things are fine, and they're not. And ultimately, what typically happens is that the conflict continues to build on your side where you feel a certain kind of way. And so, you know, imagine having all these feelings sort of pent up in this big pile inside of you, you know, you tell the person all is fine. They're just going about their day, they're doing their thing. Maybe this is the micromanager. Right, and you're like, oh, no, things are good. I love my job, everything's great. Like, thanks. You're such an attentive boss, you know, it's talking about passive aggressive, right? So great. So you never tell them how you feel. And then the next time they come into the office, they anger you again, you feel so conflicted, it happens again, and again and again and again. And then typically, what that will likely lead to is some outburst at some point, you know, the feeling, emotion and energy about how you feel will come out completely backwards in the wrong place at the wrong time. So yeah, you may lash out at your boss at one point, and you may freak out and be like enough, right? And for you, this was building but for them, this is a shock. It could happen to your family, to your kids, to your friends to a driver on the road, it comes out in road rage, it comes out in all sorts of places, a lot of times we self soothe by eating, drinking, gambling, partying, I mean, you name it. And so this stuff doesn't just disappear. And so that's why especially these destructive passive ones that just essentially eat you up inside, those can be dangerous, for lack of a better word, it is dangerous. And as you're talking, I want to actually put a pin in this for next time.


Because I think what you're talking about right now is what has been happening to teachers in this profession for years, where we have and we you know, royal we write we have been saying it's fine, it's fine or complaining about this complaining about this, but it's okay, I love my job. I do it for the kids for decades, decades and decades and decades. And it has been building and building and building. And this passive deconstructive way of dealing with this macro conflict has led to the great resignation of teachers in this profession. And here we are, we've had it, it's done, it's over. And it is imperative that the folks who are here still, and the folks who are coming into this profession start to handle conflict differently. Otherwise, we're either going to be modeling this unhealthy behavior, or we're not going to make it and the most heartbreaking thing of all of this is, you know, obviously, the thing that you know, drives me is that this is affecting our future generations, we're out of time. We are out of time, this needs to be addressed now. So this conflict that we're talking about is I think threefold. And I this is kind of where I want to put a pin in this. And maybe we can expand on this next time which we chat. It's an interpersonal conflict that we need to deal with and manage. It's this interpersonal conflict that we need to deal with. And this is there's this organizational conflict that we need to maneuver and navigate through. And I think those three tiers is something that at least for starters, you and I can explore perhaps in our next episode, because I think this is really the foundation of what a lot of our problems stemmed from, absolutely leave a lot unsaid. We make a lot of assumptions that people know how we feel. And it's just not true. I actually heard this quote from Sean who I work with, and I just love and I think about it a lot, especially when I start to self criticize or spiral. No one thinks about you as much as you think about you. And so if you're thinking that this person must know how I feel, I was so clearly upset, you're wrong, you are 1,000% Wrong. And maybe there are some people in your life that can read you like a book and who are also willing and able enough to lean into a potentially difficult conversation with you to recognize what's going on and just say like, Hey, are you alright? It's written all over you something's wrong. And that's great. And I hope that there are people in everyone's life that can be that real with you. But don't expect that from your boss necessarily. Don't expect that from your coworker necessarily. Don't think that because this is weighing on you so much, that it's also weighing on that other person so much. And that's why ultimately, one of the biggest things that we have to do as a starting point is leaning in to all of it, leaning into how do I feel inside, leaning into what's really the root of the problem here, leaning into the discomfort of actually having a conversation and knowing I'm not necessarily good at this yet. I am wildly uncomfortable. I think I'm going to throw up all over this person. You know, like I've been there like I literally gone into a meeting like with like active sweat dripping down my face, feeling like I was going to be like stiff


physically ill and having to just do it anyway. And the reality is, is you're not going to die.


And you have to just lean into that discomfort. And for anyone who's feeling inspired, I would say at this point to be like, Okay, I'm going to do a little bit more, maybe I'm going to do some research, you can hop on to the mediation training institutes website, if you want to, like do more learning. In the meantime, a couple of great books that I love, which are I love, thanks for the feedback by Douglas stone and Sheila Hien. Yes, I always mix up their last names. But that's a fantastic book. Fantastic. Yes. And I what I love about that is because it's about receiving feedback. So whether you're the one giving it or receiving it, it's great information. Because if you're in a position of leadership, where you give a lot of feedback, it's just such great perspective about what it's like to receive it. Well, teachers give feedback all the time. That's true. Yeah. So that book is great, difficult conversations. It's also great. Actually think Douglas and Sheila are authors on that one, that might also be crucial conversations, I always get the two confused. But there's just so much out there, I understand like, this is just scratching the surface about what you can do in these kinds of conversations. But I would just say that if you're like still feeling ready, like, Okay, I'm motivated. Now, I can't ignore this conflict anymore, I'm gonna talk to this person, my biggest piece of advice is just to be authentic and transparent about how having this conversation makes you feel, because I think that that is just a really great connector, because chances are, whoever you're talking to, is equally nervous and uncomfortable, and worried about how this is going to go. So even just saying something like, I'm really grateful that you came here to talk to me, and it's important that we have this conversation, I am so nervous, because I've been wanting to have this conversation for so long, it makes me uncomfortable to talk about this. So I hope that you can be patient with me, like, it may take me a little bit to kind of find my words or think about how I feel or whatever. I also think that stating some sort of positive statement of how this is going to go is also really helpful. And I think it sets the tone for the conversation, something like I'm really optimistic for how this conversation will end. Or I'm really hopeful that we'll find some kind of resolution after this talk. And just saying it's sort of an open statement, that's like, I'm not necessarily coming here to win. I'm just hoping that there's some sort of positive ending to this. And I think that that also creates a lot of comfort in the person that you're going to reach out to, to say, Oh, they're not going to like bite my head off. And oh, they don't hate me, or oh, this relationship isn't over. Because that could be their beliefs around conflict is that conflict ends relationships. And so I think that being transparent, and saying some sort of statement around your hopefulness for the conversation is a great way to start. And you can continue to circle back to that if you need to. Because these things are hard, you know, and even with all the right tools, they're still hard, they are still hard. But you know, we can do hard things. And we have all of these tools that are available for us to strengthen our skill set. And when we know better, we do better. That's kind of how this all goes. Yes, exactly. So this is going to be another one of those places where we'll stop for now. But there's so much more to talk about, because I really want to dive into what we kind of pinned before but also having that communication piece, right, because now that we have this avenue to start having these conversations, tying it into emotional intelligence, of relationship management, and social awareness, this all really connects together. And you know, we could just talk for days. So we're just going to parse it out into a couple of podcast segments here. So Rachel, this is always so much fun. And I was just so excited that we get to do this together. Thank you so much for doing it. Thank you. This is great. I could talk about this all day. So I love doing it. Yes. Well, thank you again. And thank you for those of you who are listening. If you enjoyed today's episode as much as I did, go ahead and write a fantastic review. And I can't wait to see you next time on take notes. Incredible, right? Together, we can revolutionize the face of education. It's all possible. And it's all here for you right now. Let's keep the conversation going and empowered educator faculty room on Facebook.

Why did you decide to become a teacher?

Usually, the answer is to create impact and change in their students' lives, and ideally the world at large.

But, these days, after living through a pandemic, the stress of test score expectations, and the role of politics in education- it can be difficult to focus on that original intent.

Welcome to episode 11 of the Take Notes with Jen Rafferty podcast! In this episode, I’m chatting with Dr. Julie Schmidt Hasson.

She is a professor in leadership and school administration at Appalachian State University, former teacher and a principal. Currently, she teaches graduate courses in school leadership and conducts qualitative research in schools.

Julie is also the creator of Chalk & Chances project where she compiles inspirational teacher stories that seeks to answer the question “Who did you become because of a teacher?” Her research on long term teacher impact and classroom culture is the foundation of her books, professional development programs and her TEDx talk.

We discuss helping kids feel safe, seen and stretched, and remembering that although we're planting seeds that we'll never actually see the fruit of- teacher impact is enormous and gratifying.

Break out the tissues, because today is all about reconnecting with your intention and subsequently your attention into why you became a teacher in the first place.

We’re here to leave a beautiful legacy of elevating humanity in a way that creates a better world!

Stay empowered,

Jen


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About Dr. Julie Schmidt Hasson:
Dr. Julie Schmidt Hasson is a professor in Leadership and School Administration at Appalachian State University. A former teacher and principal, she now teaches graduate courses in school leadership and conducts qualitative research in schools. Julie’s research on long term teacher impact and classroom culture is the foundation of her books, professional development programs, and TEDx Talk. Her latest book, Safe, Seen, and Stretched in the Classroom: The Remarkable Ways Teachers Shape Students’ Lives, was published in November 2021. Julie is a third-generation educator and the proud mother of a teacher.

Connect with Julie here:

Instagram: @julieshasson

Website: chalkandchances.com

TRANSCRIPT:  
Who was your favorite teacher? The thing is teachers are one of the most influential people in a child's life. And most people can remember a teacher who made them feel great about themselves, made them feel smart and capable, or whose impact truly changed their life. While these are the stories that Dr. Julie Hasson collects, and in this episode I had the pleasure of talking with Dr. Hasson about the themes she's discovered through these stories, which also happens to be the theme of her website, chalk and chances as well as her books unmapped potential safe seen and stretched in the classroom and her very latest publication. Pause, ponder and persist in the classroom. Get out the tissues, because this conversation got me feeling all the fields. And after the episode, be sure you check out break time. This is the monthly empowered educator subscription that gives you access to an incredible video library of self regulation strategies, as well as monthly group coaching calls with me and other amazing empowered educators. Head on over to empowered educator.com/resources

Remember all the passion and vision you had when you first went into teaching? Feeling like building young minds and creating community through your work would make a lasting impact on this world? Well, those days may feel like they're behind you now because you're exhausted, stressed and overwhelmed and frustrated. But I'm here to tell you it doesn't have to be like this. In fact, the love of teaching never really went away. But it absolutely needs transformation. Welcome to The Take notes Podcast. I'm Jen Rafferty, former music teacher, mom of two and certified emotional intelligence practitioner, and I'm here to light the way for you. In order to create a generational change for our kids. We need to shift the paradigm away from the perpetual stress and overwhelm and into a life of joy and fulfillment. This is education 2.0, where you become the priority, shift how you live your life, and how you show up both at work, and at home. So take a sip of steamy morning coffee and grab your notebook. It's time to take notes.

Hello and welcome back to take notes. I cannot wait to start this conversation with this very special person today. This is Dr. Julie Schmidt Hasson and she is a professor in leadership and school administration at Appalachian State University. She's a former teacher and a principal. And now she teaches graduate courses in school leadership and conducts qualitative research in schools. Julie's research on long term teacher impact and classroom culture is the foundation of her books, professional development programs and her TEDx talk. And her latest book Safe seen and stretched in the classroom through remarkable ways teachers shaped students lives was published in November 2021. Julie is a third generation educator and the proud mother of a teacher. Welcome, Julie.


Hey, Jen, I'm so excited to be here with you today.


Thank you so much for your time and your talents. And I just can't wait to get into it with you, especially as someone who is also super nerdy about qualitative research.


Yeah, cool.


I can't wait to dive in. So before we start to get to really the juicy stuff I want to know about your story and your journey of what really led you to talk and chances are,


it always goes back to Mrs. Russell, my first grade teacher, so I was a struggling reader turned out to be a dyslexic kid, super anxious, did not want to go to first grade, I really wanted to just stay in kindergarten forever and ever. But lucky for me, I ended up in Nancy Russell's first grade classroom. And she was, gosh, like an angel still is so patient and persistent. And she used this creative, multi sensory approach. And I learned to love reading that more confident loved everything about school. So in 2012, I should say I became a teacher, first second grade, just like Mrs. Russell. In 2012. I became a principal, Mrs. Russell was on my faculty, oh, the privilege of my professional life. So I got to spend a few years watching Mrs. Russell teach again and just amazed master. And it really reminded me of what she did for me and I would go in her classroom and sit on the carpet next to her students. And I just wanted to say you're so lucky, because someday you'll know how lucky you are. So in 2015, I left my principal job to start in Ed Leadership program at my undergrad alma mater, Florida Southern College. And that same year, Mrs. Russell retired from teaching so we went out together and my mentor said, your job is not just to teach grad courses is also to do research. So you need to focus what do you really want to know? And all I could think is, I really want to know, what is it that teachers like Mrs. Russell do that make this lasting impact on our lives, because I thought if we know it, we can replicate it, if we can start to use teachers like Miss Russell as models that we set out to ask teachers about their impact, which was a terrible research design, because we don't know. Unless the student comes back to us write this a letter, we have no idea the impact we make, or the things our students carry, I had to talk to former students not hard to find the right there everywhere, too. I worked with this mentor. And we created this kind of strange design, I got a sign from Office Depot that said, let's chat about a teacher, you remember, really shortened like consent form without any jargon in it, and started to go to flea markets, farmers markets, craft fairs, public parks, stick this yard sign in the ground, and people would line up to tell me about their teachers to at first who's going to be an article, you know, like we have to do academia. And a friend who was a teacher said you need to share these on a blog. Because teachers need some affirmation. They need to know what it is they're doing and how much it matters. So that became the chalk and chances blog, because I thought, What did Miss Russell use to impact my life, it was the 70s, then so it was a lot of chalk, a lot of chances. And so that became a blog. And then it just grew from there to so much more than a blog. And I tell people that $25 yard sign is the best $25 I ever spent, because it's changed my life, how I look at the world, how connected I feel to other educators. So that's my story, Jen.


And I'm sitting here, tearing up listening to you talk because teachers go into this, because of that impact. We want to change the world, we want to lighten up the road of possibility for the kids that come into our classrooms. And recently, the climate has led us so far away from that. And so just hearing this story of how you got started reminds me it makes it so vivid that yes, of course we make a difference. Of course there's impact. And I am so interested to know what is it what is the ABS or what came of the research? What was it that Ms. Russell had that we could replicate? Is it something we can replicate


really is and it's so different in different contexts, depending on our own teaching styles, personalities, preferences, the age of the students, we teach the content we teach, it looks different, but the essence is the same. So we qualitative researchers like to take all of our data, lay it out, start to look for codes and common themes. And over and over again, and all of these very detailed stories of small moments in a classroom, people talks about the way they felt. And it came into three different categories. They talked about feeling safe. And for some kids, especially kids who had experienced trauma or who were struggling with identity, that feeling safe was really important. And former students talked about feeling seen. So a teacher recognize their strengths related to them in a way that made them feel accepted and celebrated. And then there were people who talked about feeling stretched. So a teacher saw potential in them and push them toward that potential. And I think if we go into our classrooms with the intention of helping kids feel safe, seen and stretched, that will influence our actions and interactions. And we will be much more likely to make that kind of impact


that makes complete sense. And what's so beautiful about this, it's like something that inherently we know, and seeing it in the research is so affirming, and then can lead us in new directions of the how how do we do that.


And this is so similar to your work, it has to be attention and intention that we have to let you said that we're about that. You have to be fully present where you are in front of your kid paying attention to them, because that's when you recognize needs or bids for connection or moments of opportunity for impact. And then you have to have an intention to respond to that in some way and make that impact, which sounds so simple, but it's not easy, because there's so much noise and there's so many demands on us that we can get lost in all of that and forget to notice the people in front of us.


Sure, well, because when we are feeling that overwhelm and frustration, we actually can't see the people that are in front of us. It's just part of the side effects of having that stress. And that overload of cortisol is we can actually see what's in front of you. So, you know, when you go in and you talk with teachers, and you do workshops, and you go ahead and talk one on one, and teachers are sharing their stories of some of the obstacles that are preventing them from doing just that. It's intention and attention. What kind of things do you have to share about navigating that?


For me, the first few years of my research were that what does this look like? Like taking that abstract notion of teacher impact and making it more concrete thing, here's what it looks like in the classroom. There were so many detailed stories, it's surprising how clear people's memories are of small moments in the classroom. So safe scene and stretch was really me this is what it looks like that there was something else in the data. And I'll share, like one story with you that really made me have to think on this long and hard. It was a man named Marcus who had met working at a food bank, you know, we were putting the peanut butter in boxes. And we start to talk like you do with people when you're doing kind of a mindless task. And he talks about his work out of that marketing director and I talked about my research and he said, I need to tell you about my high school homework teacher, Mrs. Pope. The beautiful thing about my work is when people hear about it, they always have a story, gladly accepted his story. And he said he loved homework because they cooked on Fridays. And this particular Friday, they were making chocolate chip cookies, when they called Mrs. Pope said you can eat one, he knew she had seen him put three more in his pocket when she asked him to stay after class. And we think like as a teacher, all the emotion in that you've given a clear direction and a kid knowingly doesn't follow that direction and you feel frustrated or disrespected. And you make up all these narratives in your head about the kids intentions or character in all of your own stuff. So I thought, okay, you're gonna write him a referral Ludum from cooking lecture. She didn't. She asked a question. She said, Marcus, are you hungry? And he was, there was no food at home dad had left a couple of months ago, mom wasn't doing well. Then she noticed he had stains on his shirt. He realized he had no electricity at home. So she started letting him come in and wash his clothes now make room during school, she and her church ladies would bring like bags of soup for him and change the trajectory of his life. He said those women were the only reason I ate most nights in high school, my clothes were washed more times than I can count in that room. And I thought there's something there about impact coming, not in a welcomed beautiful moment. But in the middle of a challenge or problem. And I thought about okay, if we break it down, what did Mrs. Pope to like, first she paused, got a hold of her own frustration, unwanted emotion, either stop the reaction with couple of deep breaths. Sure, like you teach Ted. Then she pondered, she questioned her own narrative. And then she asked him questions, and then persisted with him. So the next book coming out in spring, is pause, ponder and persist, which is really that this is how you do it. It's a three step process. And again, simple, but not easy.


It's not easy, because we get so easily activated, especially now, when everything is stressful. We just live through a pandemic. So our nervous systems are just jacked up when we get up in the morning. So it is so easy to just snap because we don't have the capacity to take those moments. Which is why I think what's so interesting about the work that you do married with the work that I do is that how do we get to that moment of realization and training and self reflection and skill building of knowing when to take that pause. And I need to take that pause. And I loved that example that you use to moving from judgments, which you described as creating our own narratives and putting our own stuff on it. And then moving into curiosity, because those two things can actually exist in the same space. And curiosity is really where the juicy stuff is.


Yeah. And that's where the opportunity to make an impact is, right? Because we don't really know what's going on with a kid, we connect the dots. And oftentimes, it's wrong, the way we connect to them. So unless we start asking questions, there's no way to know what a student really need. But also, they're not going to share what they really need unless we build trust,


right. And the way to do that, of course, is like what you said before is that they need to feel safe and seen first.


Yes, create that culture, and then practice those three things.


So I would love to hear some more stories. I mean, because what you share with the world is so rich in story and narrative and we can really learn From all of these things people share, what is a story that you can share about creating safety in the classroom.


There are so many stories, my husband always tells me whatever stories come in last is my favorite. Never pick a favorite, but they're actually the first story I ever collected was from a young man named Justin. And he was my first because he's the one that designed the sign at the print shop that I ended up using for all of the research. And he talks about being a sixth grader, in an intensive reading class, having been diagnosed as having a reading disability, and a younger grade being with this same group of boys all the way through sort of an attack them before they attack you mentality where they armored up, they wouldn't read out loud, if you've never raised their hand and answer a question. And you and I know that learning requires risk. It's risky to answer a question offer an opinion shares something, they did not take risks, they were risk averse, therefore, they were not growing and reading, they were just kind of stuck. So he talks about this teacher, Miss Downey, who had these two guinea pigs in her classroom, Lenny, and George, and she would let him go back and read out loud to the guinea pigs and just kind of stand close enough to here. So of course, educators we know she was assessing, and then started to just slowly encourage him to take these risks. And he said, one of the things he remembers about her was there was no teasing. There was no making fun. And when the boys would say, Oh, Miss Downey, we're just playing, she would say we don't play like that in here. And she made this big deal about growth. That was never the highest score. It was never performance, it was effort and growth. And I think from that story, I started to see a culture is really what we celebrate and what we tolerate. And because of what she celebrated, and what she refused to tolerate, it became this really safe space. And he started to take risks, and he started to grow. And I just love that simple story. Because teachers are so brilliant. To think that I need to assess this kid in reading, how can I do it in a way where it's not threatening, where he's enjoying it, either to go back and take go read out loud to be guinea pigs, and then stand close enough to hear it's just brilliant


teachers are brilliant. And I think that's something that as a profession to speaking generally, we forget, because of all of the stuff that keeps getting thrown our way. There is incredible talent. These teachers are some of the smartest, most creative and innovative people in the world. They set the foundation for every other career you have to be otherwise, you know, what are you doing? And yes, we just take a moment and celebrate that.


Oh, I talked to a young man named Ethan at a college campus. And he talks about playing volleyball on the fourth grade playground and the boys would try to spike the ball real hard, and people were getting hurt and everybody quit. And I thought Why would have just taken that ball away that his teacher, Mr. Cribs, that then 15 extra minutes of recess. They couldn't keep the ball going across the net 100 times that the caveat was everyone had to touch the ball, at least one. And he learned a super powerful lesson about collaboration, and why that's more fun than winning from this reset issue. I mean, teachers are amazing problem solvers. So smart,


incredible. And I do just want a moment to just honor that. And I'm just loving every story that you're each one you write is the next I just want more stories. And I kind of want to go on continue on this theme of just what you kind of laid out at the beginning of safe scene and stretched. Can you share an example of how a teacher creates a culture of being seen


for so many teachers, it starts with identifying strengths. And I know we are tempted in education because of accountability measures and all of the things to focus on kids deficits. And for me, like in Mrs. Russell's first grade class, because she had spent all day trying to fill my deficit, I would have been so defeated. But the teachers who find a way to leverage strengths are the ones who really helped students feel seen. And there's also a sense, we know, confidence that comes from becoming more competent. But that's a circle because as we become more confident we take risks and become more competent. So I think that's where they seem comes in. It's Who is this kid? And how do I love and accept them just as they are, but also see their potential, which comes from understanding their strengths.


Absolutely. And that potential is something they don't usually see themselves,


almost always they didn't know. So many kids say I just thought I wasn't a math kid or I just thought I wasn't good at math. And then I had this T teacher who taught in a way that helped me see that I actually had some skill. As a mathematician, I talked to a woman just a couple of weeks ago, who ended up being a math major in college and an engineer, and up until 10th grade thought she was terrible at math.


And the research that I've done with mindset and, and really understanding how we form beliefs about ourselves, you know, this happens really early on in our formative years, you know, by eight years old, you kind of have your belief structure about who you think you are, at that point, based on the things that have gone around you and the meaning that you've created, you know, in relation to yourself, right? So those limiting beliefs carry through to your adulthood and really prevent you from doing the things that you might actually excel at. And so it's so important as a teacher of young children, especially, to open doors and say, you know, this limiting belief, I don't see that I see this limitless opportunity for you, just so they can shift a little bit of their identity.


Yes, but even just showing them like, a scientist can be a young woman of color, you just even those kinds of things to say, This is what a scientist looks like, it looks like all different kinds of people. You know, there's so many students who talk about teachers doing things


like that. Yeah. And being seen as essential for feeling like a valued member in that classroom,


to feel like you belong in a community of learners is everything.


Yeah, it really is everything. Okay, so now I want to know more about stretched, I would love some examples of stories about how kids can be stretched in the classroom.


And stretch comes out as tough love so many times, because it's not like gentle pushing. And students like all humans are a little resistant to that pushing, because the comfort feels really good. And that gentle pushing pushes us outside of what we're comfortable with, in terms of, of our perceptions, in terms of what we believe is possible for us. There was a man who talked about I think I talked about this in the TEDx talk, who talks about his high school math teacher, and he had to pass algebra, and he had already failed that one. And he was so sure that he just wasn't gonna make it and this teacher taught him. All you have to do is show up every day, do the homework problems, go over your notes, prepare for the quiz. The next day, they had a daily quiz at the beginning of class. And he started doing that. And he started to make games and he started to understand algebra, and it's you sort of got one step at a time. All you have to focus on is this less than this day, this little piece of this challenging curriculum, that before long, I was helping other students, I ended up with an A and algebra went on to take more advanced math. It's those little it's support, plus high expectation.


Yeah, it's just beautiful, you know, just kind of marinating all of these beautiful stories. And I don't know that we often take the time when we're in it right to reflect on this impact, because often we are bombarded with expectations of test scores and graduation rates. But you didn't talk about that at all.


No, when and I think I'm over 600 stories. Now in the collection, no one has ever mentioned test scores, they've mentioned graduating, that it's always connected to a teacher who somehow changed their trajectory. They weren't on track to graduate, or they were ready to drop out and something a teacher said or did shifted that for them. But beyond that, all of these things that we measure, are not that important long term to our students, that the beauty of what I get to do is sort of take this bird's eye view, spend all these hours out of the park, which teachers could never do, talking to people and then you saying, this may not be your student, but there's a student who talks about you this way. And the most intense military men have cried talking to me about their teachers, there's some emotion, when people start to tell these stories. It's, it's a mixture of joy and gratitude and love. And often someone will say, she didn't have to do that for me or he didn't have to go out of our way, went above and beyond. It's discretionary effort. And when we give people discretionary effort, they feel worthy of our time and effort. And a kid who feels worthy makes better decisions for themselves for people around them for their future. It's just those small things that say to kids, you're important.


Yes, it's so true. And I think because it's sometimes so easy to forget even just going to your website, John Buchan chances and Just taking a look at those stories, there can be a nice reminder of the impact that you're having. Because like you said, we don't know, we'll never know the impact that we have, unless we're fortunate enough to do work like you're doing. And that's even maybe, right, we might not know, because that's it's


generational. Right. And even for me, you know, I talked for 15 years, and then I was a school administrator, I don't always hear from my former students, sometimes on social media, or I'll run into one somewhere. But even for me, it's affirming, because they think, oh, gosh, you know, there are kids out there who were impacted by just care and kindness in my classroom, and then it's ripples, you know, because that impact influences the way they parent or whatever career they do, or just the kind of the way they go through the world.


Sure, well, even the example of the story you told with the cookies in home at class, you know, because that kid had clean clothes, and food completely changed the trajectory of not just his life, but it's he decided to have children and those children after him, you know, what we're doing is we're planting seeds that we'll never actually see the fruit of. And to me, that's so that's exciting. This is the stuff that gets me really emotional, too, it's part of what I believe is our civic duty is just as members of the human race of elevating humanity, you know, giving in a way that makes the world better than how we left it. And in doing so, and I have to put this caveat in there, doing that well means also taking care of yourself. So you have the ability to give what you do give. And that's just a beautiful legacy that we get to create as teachers and educators.


It definitely isn't that not me, and Marcus, who happened to be working with me in the food bank was working there, because Miss Pope passed away. And he does that in her honor every week, which gets me I'm like, wow, to be honored. Like that by a student is such a big deal. And, you know, she's gone. But now he's impacting other lives in memory of her. It's a beautiful legacy. You're right, Jen.


Yeah. And we are fortunate if we get a taste of what that might be like. But it's also there's beauty in knowing that it's happening, even though we might not see i
Yeah. And I hope that makes teachers proud of their profession, ya know, even if it's not your student or your story, you can know that, that the profession that you work in, that's making this kind of impact on the world. And it's funny, because when I talk to people who are jumping, sort of on that crazy teacher shaming, blaming political bandwagon, I will ask about their favorite teachers. And they will say, Oh, I'm not talking about those teachers. Weird, like, generalized notion of what a teacher is, but they can't tell me any teacher, they know who actually and if you ask them about their favorite teachers, they will have the same kind of stories as all the other people I talked to. So I hope that this gives us like you said, some affirmation and a sense of pride, to know that this is our profession, who changes the trajectory of students lives, who who has this life shaping long term impact,


and really changes the trajectory of the worlds. I mean, this is what we're doing. We are world changers here. And this isn't just an exaggeration, I really believe that this is not hyperbole, we are world changers. And what an interesting way to talk to somebody who maybe is activated in that teacher shaming and blaming place is again, going back to get rid of your Word of the judgment and get curious who was your favorite teacher, and then all of a sudden, how that conversation changes is pretty remarkable, as you described testing,


and anytime I think we pause and we ponder, you take a breath before reacting and just ask a question. Is it much more power? I mean, you know, you're the Empowered educator, it's a much more powerful place to be,


yeah, because we are not abdicating our power to the person sitting in front of us who's activating that we was activating us, we got to actually stand where our feet are, and come from a place of compassion. And that's really what part of this is about to it's just beautiful. And, you know, in my mind, and I'm really thinking here, Julie, everything that you're saying, you know, safe scene stretched, you know, if we took that model, and now I'm thinking about my qualitative work. If we take this model, right, and we move it up to teacher culture, it is truly the same and creating spaces for administrators themselves to understand that teachers need to be safe and seen and stretched in order to survive in order to thrive in this environment. You know, you want to create spaces for students that can't happen in a vacuum.


It's true and we teach from who we Er, and so much of our teaching happens in the context and the culture of the school in which we teach. And when I talk to teachers who are like you do thinking about whether to stay or whether to go, it's often their relationship with a leader that tips this gal one way or the other. And I talked to a former grad student who was one of the best teachers I know, not too long ago, and she was deciding to go and she said, It's not that teaching got harder, it's that it became the wrong kind of heart. So I wonder for us as leaders, how do we help it not be the wrong kind of hard, but the right kind of stretched?


Yes, that's some of the questioning that I do. Because that allows for everybody to feel safe, seen stretched. So we can all just do this beautiful work together and foster all of this learning and potential and growth and extension in truly making generational change. That's ultimately what we want to do.


It's not only what creates better outcomes for kids, but it's what creates more satisfaction. For us. It's the same.


Yeah. And we are also worthy of satisfaction.


Yeah. And our own better outcomes, for sure. All so


good. Yes. So I want to just take a moment to ask you the question, I asked everybody, which is so important, because when we share our dreams with the world, and we say them out loud, that's one step closer to making them a reality. So what is your dream for the future of education?


Oh, my dream is that the policies and all of the things that get laid upon teachers will be decided, based on people thinking about their best teachers. And I challenged my legislators to do this here in North Carolina all the time, before you send something out, would it help or hinder your best teacher, and let's not continue putting out policy that actually hinder impact and satisfaction? Let's give teachers some autonomy. let's affirm the importance of this work through compensation and working conditions and all of those things. So I know that the big ask, but my dream is just that as a profession, we see a brighter future based on the kinds of things that happen through legislators through our district administrators, school administrators.


Yes. And dreams have to be big and stretchy.


And stretchy. Yes.


We need a big stretchy dream. Yes, I love it. And that is a beautiful dream. And I think that even just having conversations like this pushes the needle forward on the way to making those better outcomes for everybody. So thank you so much for your time and your talents and for sharing them with me and the folks listening. Thank you.


Oh, thank you, Tim, thank you for the way you support teachers and teacher well being I'm so grateful for you. I'm grateful


for you. And before we go, I need you to share if you can, how can people get in touch with you? And is there something and easy way for them to know about your work and everything will be in the podcast notes. But please share? How can we work with you or know more about you,


Chuck and chances website is the best way to find me there's you can contact me through the website, if you need an affirming inspiring story. One goes up every Friday. So check those out. There's some resources there as well. But that's the best place.


Fantastic. Thank you again, I hope that this is just the beginning of our conversations together because I just feel like there's more here.


We could talk for days, for sure. Thank you.


Thank you as if you enjoyed today's episode, please make sure to leave a review and I cannot wait to see you next time on take notes. Incredible, right? Together, we can revolutionize the face of education. It's all possible. And it's all here for you right now. Let's keep the conversation going at empowered educator faculty room on Facebook.

What does it take to come back from trauma?

How do you move from surviving to thriving after a traumatic event?

There are amazing strength building opportunities when you come out on the other side of trauma. You don't have to get stuck in the negative parts of your story, and it’s even possible to leverage it into transformation.

Welcome to episode 10 of the Take Notes with Jen Rafferty podcast! In this episode, I’m speaking with Nicole Myles, who weaves together compelling storytelling with experience and expertise to engage listeners in a journey of self-discovery, the ups and the downs of growth, and how to recover from emotional trauma.

Nicole brings more than 20 years of experience in education, nonprofits and leadership. Having gone from a traditional upper middle class life to losing everything living in domestic violence shelters and having to rebuild an entire life while raising three children.

In our conversation we delve into why resilience is important, its true purpose, and how we are wildly overselling it in today’s society. Also,we discuss that trauma informed classrooms and teachers don't have to be heavy or hard- and how to get it right!

Today is all about finding a pathway to healing and feeling empowered about your external circumstances.

Nicole doesn't just speak about post traumatic growth, she's lived it. She teaches how to really lean into these experiences in a way that amplifies your future and moves past survivorship to thrivership!

Stay empowered,

Jen


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About Nicole Myles:
Bringing forward more than 20 years of experience in education, nonprofits, and leadership, Nichole Myles weaves together compelling storytelling with experience and expertise to engage listeners in a journey of self-discovery – the ups and downs of growth – and what it takes to come back from trauma. Having gone from a ‘traditional’ upper-middle class life to losing everything, living in domestic violence shelters, and having rebuilt an entire life while raising 3 children – Nichole doesn’t just speak about post-traumatic growth, she’s lived it.
Nichole carries a CAGS in Nonprofit Management, a CFRE (certified fundraising executive) designation, a DEI (Diversity, Equity, and Inclusion) Certificate, and 2 levels of professional certifications in Trauma and Resilience. Her master’s in Organizational Psychology with a Coaching and Consulting concentration is expected early 2023. She uses her education to hone poignant personal stories into opportunities for participants to glean critical steps to their own growth – to examine what they’ve overcome, and how to lean into that experience to amplify their futures.
Nichole works as an ‘expert companion’ in the position of speaker, facilitator, consultant, or coach, helping move clients from ‘survivorship’ to ‘thrivorship’.
Connect with Nicole here:

Instagram: @myles.2go

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Website: MylestoGo.net

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TRANSCRIPT:  
What does it take to come back from trauma? Well, sometimes that journey can feel like you're just trying to survive, and whether we realize it or not. All of us have gone through the trauma of living through a pandemic. And we are all trying to navigate our lives and move forward as best we can. Well, my guest today turned her personal stories of trauma into opportunities for other people to glean critical steps in their own growth, and move from survivorship to thriver ship. This conversation was truly something special, and I can't wait to share it with you. So if you are ready to move from surviving to thriving, head on over to empowered educator.com/thrive and sign up for the five week online course that will change the game for how you show up at work, and at home, feel less stress and more ease, less pressure, and more calm, less frustration, and so much more joy, it's time to thrive, go to empowered educator.com/thrive. Remember all the passion and vision you had when you first went into teaching. Feeling like building young minds and creating community through your work would make a lasting impact on this world? Well, those days may feel like they're behind you now because you're exhausted, stressed and overwhelmed and frustrated. But I'm here to tell you, it doesn't have to be like this. In fact, the love of teaching never really went away. But it absolutely needs transformation. Welcome to The Take notes Podcast. I'm Jen Rafferty, former music teacher, mom of two, and certified emotional intelligence practitioner, and I'm here to light the way for you. In order to create a generational change for our kids, we need to shift the paradigm away from the perpetual stress and overwhelm and into a life of joy, and fulfillment. This is education 2.0, where you become the priority, shift how you live your life, and how you show up both at work, and at home. So take a sip of steamy morning coffee, and grab your notebook, it's time to take notes.

 Hello, and welcome back to another episode of take notes. Today I have a fabulous guest and I cannot wait to get on with this conversation. She brings more than 20 years of experience in education, nonprofits and leadership, Nicole miles weaves together compelling storytelling with experience and expertise to engage listeners in a journey of self discovery, the ups and the downs of growth and what it takes to come back from trauma. Having gone from a traditional upper middle class life to losing everything living in domestic violence shelters and having to rebuild an entire life while raising three children. The Cole doesn't just speak about post traumatic growth, she's lived it. And she uses her education to hone poignant personal stories into opportunities for participants to glean critical steps into their own growth, and to examine what they've overcome, and how to really lean into that experience to amplify their futures. Nicole, thank you so much for being here and take notes with me today.


Oh, Jen, it's my pleasure. I'm really excited to be here.


I'm excited to get this going. And I know we've spoke a little bit before. So I'm just excited for you to share your origin story about you know, what led you to doing the work that you do now in this world?


Sure, I'd be happy to tell that because it's so interesting how kind of all the parts of our lives in depth weaving together. And there can kind of be that moment of synergy. So as you mentioned, in my intro, I am a domestic abuse survivor. And when I disclose that over time, people will always say you should tell your story you should tell your story. And I really didn't. Because I didn't want to tell a traumatic and damaging story. I didn't want to have one of those Lifetime movie stories, right that it was very dramatic and painful for people. I've wanted it to help. And I am a former teacher, and I've been in nonprofits and in leadership and so I kept trying to come up with ways that I could help people with that story, and not just tell my personal story so that someone else could compare notes on their trauma versus my trauma. And about a year and a half ago, I ran into an article while studying organizational psychology. I ran into an article by positive psychologist Dr. Richard Tedeschi. And he wrote an article for the Harvard Business Review about something he called post traumatic growth. And it was a study that's been done actually, this is a 30 year old study. We just really haven't spent a lot of time exploring it that he and Dr. Robert Levine did on what makes some trauma survivors move forward and some get stuck. What I now call survivorship or thriver ship And I was so compelled by this article, because what he was saying was, he was hoping that there would eventually be what he called expert companions. And these would be people who had come through a trauma and rebuilt their lives, and followed some steps or framework who could guide other people coming out of a trauma, to actually learn how to leverage that for transformation. And when I read that article, it all kind of coalesce that this is what I do. I've been a teacher forever. I've worked in leadership, but I really wanted to help people with the story. And so I ended up actually emailing him and saying, I am not a clinical psychologist, so it'd be very clear, I'm not a therapist, is this a thing that I should be doing, and he was like, You're exactly the person that I want doing this. And so I built this framework and got to work. And now we're here coaching and consulting others, because you don't have to get stuck in the negative parts of your story. They're amazing strength building opportunities in there, and it can reframe and transform your whole life. And that's what I want people to know.


Sure. And, you know, when you are transformed, that's how the people around you are transformed. Also, as I'm sure that you've observed and experienced in your own life, that is absolutely correct. So one of the reasons that I've noticed, and similarly for me, in my experience is one of the reasons why we don't share stories is because the shame that comes from the trauma, so can you talk about how you worked your way through that yourself coming from a place of shame to feeling empowered by your story. I mean, that's a process all within itself


is its own process. And it is, you know, no lies, it is painful, it absolutely is painful, and some of it had to do was really my own personal situation, that when I left my abusive situation, we went through a likely time of shelters and homeless lists and ended up on the other side really penniless, with these three kids. And suddenly, the whole world was different. Financially, everything was different from an employment perspective, everything was different, it was using a different name, to try to get through things. And I kept butting up against my own trauma. I couldn't fill out a rental form without having my credit check, which meant that I'd introduce myself with one name. And now I had to explain that I had a different one. And my credit had blown up, because that's what happens with so many of us in financial trauma, divorce, trauma, abuse, trauma, suddenly, I was having to explain this. And it was not easy to get to the place of saying I'm going to have to disclose. But it became easier to do it in front of what was about to happen, instead of as a cleanup job behind. So for example, when you're filling out that rental application, and then somebody calls you back and says, Hey, like, can you explain why this name is different from what's on your app? Is this somebody else? Or is this still you. And now you're trying to backpedal and explain what happens, I got to the place of saying I can't do that anymore, because then I was reliving it twice, filling out that application and feeling all that shame. And then I was waiting for that call to come back. And I was feeling it again. Like if we are going to do this, it's taken the band aid off and one strip, instead of little inch by inch. I'm going to take care of it. I also eventually learned then, that if I was leading that conversation, I had agency over it, as opposed to somebody else getting to lead and dig into that conversation. I found when I lead with it, people didn't ask as many questions and these aren't friends or family or community that I was working with. These are people like the HR departments in my job are people like potential landlords for whom it is fair to say this is not necessarily anybody's business. But because of the way trauma infiltrates kind of all of our everyday lives. It was there. And I had to be able to deal with it. And so I finally decided I was going to get in front of it instead, and start leading with that story.


Wow. And that shift must have felt so different for you even physically, I imagined to just take control of the narrative.


Yeah, it was a huge mental shift. I tell people, things that have happened for me in the space of years, you know, now in the space of weeks, and now in the space of months, if you are stuck in something and feeling like I don't feel any better yet. This happened over the space of years of being able to have that shift. And it still felt embarrassing for a long time. And I still felt a lot of shame about it. But eventually I got to that place of feeling like okay, I have agency I am in control. I'm going to disclose they're gonna see a different name. And it's because I'm a domestic abuse survivor and there eventually became a little bit of a sobering it. Let's see what happens when I introduce that because people don't really know what to do. If you when you are the person leading that conversation, and I would say that if you eventually get to the place where you build up, that really resilience, that thicker skin to say, I'm going to lead with this, it becomes empowering instead of disempowering. And that shift, it happens in your body, it happens in your mind, it happens throughout your life. And now I can go into spaces, I do go into spaces and publicly say, this is my story. This is what happened. This is what I went through. It changed that shaming piece, that internal shaming space we feel so much victims of trauma are so often that is what we're caught in. Okay, that's part of our abuse cycle. If it was abuse, that goddess there, it's part of recovery, if you had an injury or your sickness, and you couldn't contribute to your family the way you wanted. Shame is really potent. And agency takes away shame.


Wow. And that's incredibly powerful. And the way you described, you know, this is my story, this is what happened to me. I'm noticing your language there that this isn't who you are, your trauma isn't who you are. And I'm wondering if you can speak a little bit about how maybe that piece of it played a role in separating the story from you, which could dissolve a little bit of that shame, too.


Absolutely. It's so interesting, you picked up on that. So that's the first step in post traumatic growth. It's a step that I call education. And it is about removing the person from the story. So it really is there are places throughout post traumatic growth where we need to personalize our story. But the first step is actually to depersonalized the story. Say, this is what happened to me. And it happened to me, because not because I'm flawed, not because there was some Machiavellian universal power, who placed me with an abuser, you know, all of these kinds of toxic language that we use for people, everything happened for a reason, these things that we internalize, it really became this happened to me, because this is a systemic problem. My views happened to happen over 2008, which is the last major financial crisis that we had, I was married to somebody involved in the investment community. So there was a lot of additional stress there. We know that untreated mental illness is a huge problem. And so starting to kind of put together why did this actually happen? If I was not involved in the story? Why did this actually happen. And eventually you get a list of these things happened because of a variety of outside of yourself settings. Whether that is an illness, that is your trauma, or whether it was a car accident, that is your trauma, or whether it was abuse, it is your trauma, there are things that happened outside of you, the personalized things that are outside of you. And that starts to reframe how you can look at those events dramatically, actually,


sure, well, because now you're not making meaning of it in relationship to your worth and your value as a human being.


That's right. That's huge. It is it's a huge step. And it's a massive shift. And it allows you to take the next steps going forward.


So let's talk about some of those next steps and a lot of the work that you do and the words that you use revolve around resilience. And I have to share with you that I used to really hate that word. I'll be totally honest. I was in a therapy session a few years ago, I was in a marriage that was not healthy and not going well. And she said to me, you know, Jen, you're one of the most resilient people I know. And I walked out of that session being like, what, like, No, I was so mad. Because I was like, I don't want to be resilient. I just want this to stop. And I was resentful of that comment. I was even resentful towards her in that moment. Because I didn't feel like I should have to be resilient in this situation. And you know, fast forward now to the work that I'm doing. I understand resilience much differently. But before I share, I really want to know know, how do you define that word? And when you're talking to someone who kind of feels that resentful way about it. What do you address? How do you go about this?


So first of all, I think that's fair, because I think we've done a huge disservice around the word resilience, because we keep presenting it like it's a panacea. Like, it's okay for you to be going through these terrible things because you're resilient. Well, do you know what the option are? It's resilience or failure or sometimes death, like resilience is a response. So that's the first thing I will tell you. The other thing I will tell you about resilience is that we are wildly overselling it. In society generally, as this kind of goal I view resilient. It's as a first step. It's a necessary first step, but it is only the first step. And when we stop at resilience, this is why we have so many problems. There are amazing resilient people and amazing, resilient communities. But what you pointed out is exactly right. Why should they have to be so resilient? Resilience doesn't address a systemic failure. Resilience doesn't address a toxic relationship, resilience just gets you started. And so I tell people, I used to use a metaphor about resilience about riding a boat. And you know, you say things like sometimes Art imitates life. Last month, I had a little bit of a life imitating art moment. I took my son who was a teenager whitewater kayaking for the first time. So we'd like to kayak We live near the ocean. We really, really enjoy that as a hobby. And there are rare things you can do with a teenage boy together when you're a single parent, but this was one of them. But we've never done whitewater before. And I was like, we are gonna go do some whitewater kayaking. We felt really ready for this. And then like we had a little moment of intimidation. Both of us were like, here's your crash helmets and the kayaks had leg straps. And we were like, Well, okay, right. So seven mile kayak trip level three Whitewater, off we go, we kind of get our bearings and everything's going okay, for the first few Little Rapids and then we hit kind of our first major rapid maybe a mile in and his kayak went sideways. And so when it goes sideways on these river rapids, you're stuck. And so he's stuck sideways. And worse, his mother has followed closely behind him too closely behind him, in fact, and I T boned my own child in his kayak at full force rapids, flipped him over rolled him into the rapids upside down in his kayak, and now he's in the water. Good news about the Chattahoochee River is that it is it is a shallow river, but we're in rapids. And so the kayak has slipped over. The paddle has gone one direction, and now he's in the water. And he's stunned because his mother has flipped him. And this is trauma, right? This is trauma. You didn't see it coming. You never expected it. Now you're in the water. What's he doing, he's grabbing for the paddle. He's grabbing for the kayak, which now threatens to suck him under, because of the waves, the way they're moving so fast. The tools he knew when he was upright in the kayak will help him anymore. The boat, the paddle, none of this helps him and I'm stuck. And I'm yelling, Get on your feet, get on your feet, get on your feet, get on your feet. He's done. And he's kind of flailing around. But he finally comes to and he gets on his feet. That that moment. That's resilience. Right? He had a trauma, he's been dumped into the water, the tools we thought we had aren't helping anymore. You got to get on your feet. That's great. He is out of immediate danger, because he's on his feet. Guess what? He's still in the water. We're still with an upside down kayak and a paddle out of reach and water rushing around us. And that's what resilience is. Resilience is that part where we get people to their feet. And then we're like God, Your God, congratulations for your resilience. This is a terrible thing to do to people, because we've not taught them yet how to get out of the water. We've got to finish that step. And that's where the Post Traumatic Growth piece happens. So I think it's fair to be frustrated with resilience. Because we keep getting to that place of like, it's great. You're resilient.


Yeah, well, you're in the water, you're stuck. You're not where you're supposed to be. And you know it, you just keep getting up because the options are what drown or get up. Right, but it isn't helping you. And so, you know, eventually he did, we recovered, he got back in the boat, we got the paddle and kind of had to unpack what we learned. But I think that that's a great metaphor for what is happening with resilience right now. And I do teach specifically resilience skills, because the other thing that happens is we passed off resilience. It's like it's a trait like you're born resilient, or you're born not resilient. And that's just not true. Either. You've had the life experience, unfortunately, where you've had to be resilient, or you haven't yet, or no one's taught you what you actually need to be resilient. And so now I teach something that I call resilience rings, which is about creating your own skills for resilience, which are lean learn and leverage. Those are the three rings and we put different activities in there so that you can fall back on resilience. It's important to know how to get to our feet, it's just important to know that that's not the rest of the journey. And so I really that's how I'm really viewing resilience these days. It's an essential tool. It just isn't the tool we've presented. Why only as a society,


yeah, first of all that story was so spot on what a lesson for, for you and your son and everyone who gets the urine. I mean, my goodness, I think reclaim or reframe that word, because you're right. The problem happens when we get stuck at, we made it through the thing, but then the now what does it feel unexplained? And so when I think about resilience now, after doing the work that I've done, it's that second piece of it, which sounds similar to your three ring paradigm or your framework. But we have to lean in to the emotions of it. Otherwise, it's just emotional bypass where it's, oh, I'm on my feet. Now, I must be fine. It's totally fine, I'm fine. And we call that resilience. But it's really just bypass. And that, of course, leads to all of these other things. And so I really looked into this word. And one of the things that came up in a conversation actually, with a former professor of mine, we were talking about this resilience. And regarding to the definition of really bouncing back, right, you thinking of a bouncing ball, you have to get to the most bottom part in order to bounce back up. Right? It's that leaning in two, doing what you were saying about the growth, and the leaning in doesn't always feel good. But we have to do that if we really want to be resilient in the true definition of what it means. And yeah, and I just, I would love for you to talk more about those rings. Because I think having that step by step way, it's like a roadmap.


Right? So I'm a huge believer in tools. And I think that's one of the other reasons why I've loved working in the space of trauma, you know, people kind of give me the like, why would you do that? Like, because this is so much empowerment for an individual to say, these are the tools. And so when I present these rings, as lien learn and leverage, there's a lot of and there really is a lot of carryover in resilience and self care, which is the other reason why we get resilience wrong, because you presented it just like it happens, right? I'm tough, I made it, let's go. And actually, no, you've got to do a little internal self care, or some external self care, to really be able to have that recovery and your resilience. So when I present the rings to people, I take them through actual activities for them to create what goes in each of those circles. So lean is really about who is in your community? Who is in your world? Who's your 2am phone call? Do you have a therapist? Do you have a community group who is in your lean circle? What's in your learn circle? So it is what are you doing. And it's also a big misnomer about like it has to be meditation or it has to be something Zen. And be very clear that in my learning circle is a batting cage, because I used to be a softball player. And sometimes I am frankly, not a very happy person, and I need to hit some things. And a batting cage is a great place for me to go and kind of get that out.


A rage room is in my learning circle. Absolutely. My kids too. They know we go to the rage room together because it feels great.


I love that like, right, these are the things that help you release. Also, I started painting a few months ago. And so that's in my Learn circle. And it's kind of all of these things that I want to explore for me, these things don't have to cost money. And I will also say to anybody listening, if your version of self care or learn and resilience is causing you kind of like either existential or actual financial dread. It's not going to help you because you're going to feel guilty and bad about it. And this is another one of those societal things where like, you know, this $200 jar of face cream is great self care, not if it is causing you stress. And so I also like to walk but I live in the south, I like to walk at night. So I like moonlight and Starlight like that's part of what's in my Learn circle to see what's out there at night and really get myself moving. And then leverage is what I am learning about myself in Lean and learn. So this is the metacognition part. What am I drawing from myself, for me, it's that I like creative things for me it is that my tenacity rises to the top every single time I get knocked down, I will have to hover in a corner for a little bit, but then my tenacity is going to come back. And when I have that as an actual tool when I can see that, that I know I'm going to go there again, but that I'm going to be able to be a creative problem solver. You know, people who've come back with amazing responses from what's happened to them, even when I don't feel it even when I am lost and I can't possibly tell you what my metacognition is going to be with this. When I've done this exercise for leverage, I can go back and look at it go all right, you know what's gonna happen next. You know, you're going to come back around to this you know, you're going to fight you know, you're going to tell somebody you know, you're going to do what you have to do because you've done it every time this says what's in your leverage ring. And that's going to move you forward. So that's how I'm starting to teach resilience to people now, because I think you can build out those rings and really have yourself a set of tangible and intangible tools that will remind you how to be resilient in an authentic way.


Because that feels amazing because you're standing in your power. Whereas before in the scenario that I explained, I was a victim of my circumstances, and still standing in the water, but I was standing. So look at me, I get to celebrate the fact that I'm standing. And that just made me so mad. And so this reframe is everything. I mean, this is really what it is about, and how we continue to move the needle forward, not just in our own healing. But this transformation, like, I'm going to circle back to what you said at the beginning. When we transform, we create new paradigms for the people around us. And specifically, for a lot of the folks who are listening who are educators, it has to happen in these places where we're in front of kids, because they are watching us, cuz you're always in front of kids, right in front of kids. And when they were seeing the adults in their lives parading around being resilient, we know what are we actually teaching them. And that's the stuff that really gets my fire going, because we need to heal ourselves in order to make this generational change. So I would love to just kind of move the conversation to teachers for a minute. Because when we talk about trauma, and a lot of times, we either have these big broad strokes of what trauma is, sometimes we get the responses from teachers of Well, I'm not a therapist, we weren't trained for this, which yes, you're absolutely right, you were not trained for this. And we don't have the tools to deal with our own trauma ourselves. And that's kind of that third piece is where I come in with my work because we can't do the other two, if we can't understand the other two if we don't actually take care of ourselves. So in regards to being in the classroom, what are some things and trauma informed practices that teachers can do, and principals administrators can do today to just kind of get comfortable with this idea that trauma informed doesn't have to be heavy, or hard.


Those are both exactly right. They don't have to be heavy, they don't have to be hard. Also, because we do paint with big broad strokes around trauma, feeling shame, or embarrassed because your trauma is not big enough, is a huge problem. I find that in education circles, I find that in Human Services and nonprofit circles all the time. Neuro biologically, teachers, listen, because some of you already know this, you've just forgotten neurobiologically, your trauma, whether it is the car accident that happened that wasn't that big of a deal, but it caught you off guard or whether it is an abusive situation, or an addiction or an illness neurobiologically or you are being chased by a bear, it is exactly the same path inside your brain, regardless of what that trauma is. So if you get triggered by that trauma, it has lit up inside your brain, all of those systems have lit up exactly the same way as when it was happening, regardless of how severe that trauma actually is. And that means you've released all the same hormones, that means all that cortisol and adrenaline is flowing. So getting a hold of you have a trauma, I guarantee you do, it's causing your brain to light up in a certain way. And just again, knowing that that's what's happening is super empowering. Because you can have a minute and say like I'm having those feelings. You all know what happens when you get that startle response. And you get that rush of adrenaline and it hits your stomach and you feel anxious and a little bit nauseous. Like that's a trauma response. And having control over what you need to do in those moments is really the first step, knowing that you have them and not being ashamed of the fact that you have them because your trauma response, which by the way, it's no longer just fight or flight. It's now fight flight freeze or fawn, and your trauma response. And my own therapist would be so proud of me for this because this was one of my most difficult things was that when people meet me, they assume that like my trauma response would be fight because that's what I come off as, but it's not it's freeze. And I carried that as a huge amount of shame for a really, really long time. But trauma response is embedded in us when we're children. So the children that you're working with right now they're learning what their trauma response is going to be. And it's going to kind of stick with them. So you it's between six and nine that you're getting your trauma response. So whatever yours is, you didn't cause it. It's not because of something you did like this happened to you in childhood, and that reprogramming is a big, big deal. I think once you get control of that, the next thing to really look at is what's the language you're using? What's the language you're using in your classroom? What's the language you're using at home? What's the self talk language and if anybody goes to my website and signs up for my email list. One of the things I have is a trauma informed language quick reference. And it's 20 phrases to avoid and 12 to say instead, and why. And what we are really looking for is to avoid phrases that take agency, avoid phrases that diminish our legitimate feelings, avoid phrases that disempower us and avoid phrases that depersonalized what's happened to us. So we don't call ourselves victims. And we don't say to children, or to anybody else get out of a victim mindset, we name them. And this is the place where instead of d personalizing, like we did an education we personalize, we bring this to them, Hey, we do not do toxic positivity. Most of us were raised with this from just playing, right, you're playing on the playground, fall down, you get a scrape, what is the response, that same response is resilient, you're fine, brush it off, you're fine. When you do that, you diminish and you disempower. So you have to stop that. And you need to say, healing doesn't happen on a timeline, you're carrying a lot, those feelings are valid, and you got to give space for them. And you really need to avoid these kinds of phrases like everything happens for a reason. This one ranks as probably the highest phrases that drive me crazy and recovery around trauma informed practices is this everything happens for a reason idea that, again, we've been selling as a society. So you and I connected and we connected because if I hadn't been abused, you had been in a terrible marriage, we never would have met. And so we should all be thankful and grateful for these horrible things like that is pure garbage. And if you want to steal somebody's agency, even a child's you tell them everything happens for a reason. And then turn around two minutes later and tell them that they are responsible for what happened. You're not delivering economists messages that make any sense when we do that. Either. There are natural consequences to what happens, or there are universal Machiavellian powers who are placing us like a chessboard out there. Both things cannot be true at the same time. And it really steals our agency, when we start to say those everything happens for a reason this was meant to be. So if you got to work this morning as a teacher and got that parent in your classroom that you just like you see coming, right, you opened the email. And there's an essay right away about you making those kids bring in purple folders that nobody could find a target this year. That is not a do not look at that and go Well, you never get more than you can handle. Everything happens for a reason. And if you are delivering that to a colleague, or if you are a leadership person, and you're delivering that to a teacher, you are not helping them, either feel those emotions or learn to solve their problems. And that is a huge disempowering move in the world of trauma informed spaces, we really have to honor where people are, instead of dismissing them with these kind of quick little bumper sticker phrases everywhere.


I can just sit and talk about this. I just love what we just listened to you talk about this, because you're speaking my language for sure. I mean, this is my language, what you're saying, we don't even think about it. That's the thing. We don't think about it. Because we have been trained just because of the air that we breathe. This is how we've been brought up. These are the things that we say, we don't even think twice about saying these things, right. And so what I find when I'm observing some places, moving into trauma informed practices, there sometimes seems to be this disconnect of Well, now I have to do something else. This is something else on my plate that I have to do now. But this is the stuff that's going to make you better. So you can show up for your colleagues and your students better if we reframe this as to not being about the kids, this is about you. This is about creating culture for you. So you don't bypass so you don't say things that are ridiculous in the vein of toxic positivity when you're actually feeling something, because that's not healing. That's not growth. That's not conscious living, and that's certainly not empowerment. So, yes.


But I think you bring up a really good point that it starts to become like, Oh, this is another thing I have to do and look like this takes practice, and you will screw up and you will screw up because you have been enculturated and continue to be enculturated in a world that absolutely says things like you should just be grateful. If there's an entire industry of people where you just make a journal of gratitude of things, you know, my world is falling apart. But here are the list of 15 things that I feel grateful for. No disrespect to the gratitude folks. There is a place for that. But if you are doing that, in an effort to not deal with what is happening in front of you, that is not a healing process. It is out absolutely not a healing process, you have to look at why you're doing this, it's anything was self care, anything in your resilience rings is the same way, if you are watching six hours of Netflix, because you need a downtime, and you get to release those emotions and ugly cry at whatever series you are watching more power to you, you're watching six hours of Netflix so that you don't have to have a feeling to numb yourself out, you are missing this. And if you are using language and messing up and then saying, I am messing up, you're on the right track, eventually it's going to lock in, if you are not using language, because you don't want to have to deal with you don't want to have to feel things you don't know, look at a kid who's fallen down and say like that is a lot. I'm so sorry, you must be feeling that way. If you want to sit down for a minute, if you are not doing that, because you don't want to have that emotional connection. You got to have a timeout with yourself and really explore what's happening.


I'm so glad you said that. Because again, I think it goes back to the bypass gratitudes great, but you can't gratitude bypass your way through your you know, like you can feel the things and then be grateful for the light switch that you got to turn on separately. It's not an excuse, or a reason to not feel or to be resilient and say, well, at least I have lights at least I'm not something else I talked to it. You know, when we talked about boundaries. Recently I had a workshop. It's like, well, at least I'm not sick, at least at my house. And shouldn't the bar be higher than not said?


Well, this is my whole argument for thriver ship instead of survivorship is that we've quite literally architected an entire society that says, You know what, you're not dead. So be grateful, dammit. And what else should you want? You're not dead, you're still here, you came back from that? Isn't that enough for you. And then it also kind of rolls that tape for you that you feel like crap, because it's not enough for you. And you shouldn't feel bad. You're teaching posts. Well, it's not even post COVID endemically in COVID. And this year, the win is that none of the parents made death threats to you this year over making your kid wear a mask. Listen, that is not winning. That's slightly better than the absolute hellscape you were living in two years ago. And I'm glad for that. But I think that it's a terrible idea to tell people that they should be grateful, or that they should be satisfied with that what's happening around them right now, I think that is an absolutely horrible message to be delivering. Because it sells us short, it makes our lives way too small. Sometimes big wins happen incrementally, but it shouldn't just be tiny little wins that are slightly better than not dead.


Right. And this is just it. This is where our work comes in and helping people understand a pathway to feeling empowered about their external circumstances. And before I ask you the last question, I just also want to say and agree with you and highlight the faculty say everyone has trauma, if you're human, congratulations, right, you have trauma. And it's not just for some people, it is just part of the way of the human experience. And to me, there is beauty in that, that there is a human experience that we can all connect with, even though it's painful, and even when it's painful that you are not unique. We all know what trauma is. And we can use it as a connector instead of feeling shame about it to drive us apart. And I think that's really important.


I think that's so important because it is it is something that brings us together. And the most amazing thing about trauma is that it will distill what's really in you. And I always paint myself because it's real as this I was very polite with a bob and the requisite holiday sweater vest, teacher, but I was silenced. I was silenced as a human and my trauma helped into that I had to find a voice. But I was in there the whole time. And the trauma distill down where those strengths and power is. And I think that that's what is, there's an opportunity in that it's not that we should go rushing for our trauma. But if we really explore it, you will find true moments and zones of genius in yourself and strengthen yourself that you just didn't know what were there.


But it's beautiful. So, first of all, we need to continue this conversation if we do. So we're gonna we're gonna we're gonna have to do some one pin in that one. But for the sake of this episode, I need to ask you, in your work and in your experiences, both in and out of the classroom. You know, what is your dream for the future of education.


I've missed being in the classroom and it's been years since I've been in the classroom. I still have a child in school though. When I think about what education looks like for me III, I envision the perfect education space for me is that we set out to help every single one of our students find their zone of genius. Like that is what an ideal education looks like to me is, I have never ever met a child or a parent who didn't know there was something special inside of them. They didn't necessarily know how to find it. And you know, instead of we were past the sage on the stage piece, we're getting closer with this project based learning. But if we were archaeologists have children instead, and we were digging to find that zone of genius, and just release that zone of genius and kids, I think that that is my ideal setting for everyone. And I would love to see teachers do that, too. When I wrote my master's thesis that was part of it. I'm old enough that it was when we thought Gardner's eight domains were really it. And so my thesis was around uncovering those domains and building classrooms around them. But it was still that same idea that like, if I know you, and I have an arts background, so that creative thought process, we could be matched with those creative thought kids. And as their brains grow and move around, we shift them off to the kinetic spaces, and we shift them off to the analytical spaces, and they get to work where their brains are growing. I just think that so much would change for kids. So much would change about our emotional well being and our health because we'd be working in that strength base place. Corporations are all over this right now with 360 models and the maximal strength based programming. I don't understand why schools aren't there yet. We're still doing the, you're bad at this. So we need to remediate and spend extra time on that instead of letting you do the things you're great at. And I want to find schools that really let kids be great.


Yes, I agree. I mean, having those spaces in places is how we grow. And I think that there are opportunities and my hope, you know, when I asked this question is we say them out loud. So it can be one step closer to becoming a reality. That's right, you know? Yes. So you mentioned a resource. So they want to just make sure that you explicitly tell us what it is about language? Where do we find that?


Sure. So if you visit my website, which is miles to go.net, so it's moi, le s miles to go.net, right on my front homepage, you can sign up for my email list. And when you do, you will automatically receive a download, which is 20 phrases to avoid and 12 to say instead, for trauma informed language, quick reference, and it's just a simple PDF. So you can have it out with the three columns. And it looks very easy to read very fast, and just kind of help you to not only avoid those phrases, but to have something new to put in your lexicon also. Because I think that's really important. I don't want to just tell you what's wrong, I want to give you some tools to be able to use better language.


Amazing. And if people want to know more about you and work with you, all of those links are going to be right there in the program notes. And I'm going to check that out myself, too. I love that. Yeah, come on down. And we will have some more conversations. I cannot wait. So thank you so much, Nicole, for your time and your talents. And this was just a wonderful conversation. And I hope it's just the start of something. Thank you. Me too. Jen,


this was great. And thank you for the work you're doing and teachers hang in there. Have a great, great year. Remember that everything does not necessarily happen for a reason. But you can make good reason out of what is happening. Oh,


I love that. Yes. So if you've enjoyed today's episode, make sure to leave a five star review and write something really nice. And we will see you next time on take notes. Incredible, right? Together, we can revolutionize the face of education. It's all possible. And it's all here for you right now. Let's keep the conversation going at empowered educator faculty room on Facebook.

What does it mean to have a teacher identity?

What makes a “good” teacher?

And, what makes a teacher effective both in the classroom and in their personal lives?

Teaching today can feel like we're putting ourselves in a box, and questioning some of our choices- even when those choices feel right and authentic to us as human beings.

The truth is, the best way for you to create your identity is to be unapologetically and authentically, YOURSELF. And what better example is there to model for our students?

Welcome to episode 9 of the Take Notes with Jen Rafferty podcast! In this episode, I am speaking with former educator, Jenn Mercado. Jenn is currently a real estate agent by trade and an entrepreneur by spirit.

She is the owner of Jen Mercado PA, her luxury real estate brand and Insightful Media LLC, where she provides coaching and direction for realtors and their social media presence. She has the unique gift of seeing people where they are and connecting them to communities that support them. Jenn a mother to two young children, a wife to her best friend and number one fan with whom she's created a seemingly traditional life while rewriting all the rules.

In our conversation, Jenn takes us through her outside the box life trajectory from being a professional clown for many years to becoming an educator, a successful realtor- and everything in between!

This talk with Jenn will serve in empowering teachers to incorporate outside the box thinking in their own lives while strengthening the student teacher relationship.

Today, it’s all about avoiding teacher burnout and self care for teachers using a more unorthodox, yet brilliantly authentic approach of allowing yourself to be happy in ALL the stages of your life!

Teacher wellness is more than one thing, and so are you! Celebrate it!

Stay empowered,

Jen


Let’s keep the conversation going! Find me at:

Click here to learn all the ways you can work with me:
 Jen Rafferty | Instagram, YouTube, Facebook | Links
Instagram: @jenrafferty_
FaceBook: Empowered Educator Faculty Room


About Jenn Mercado, PA

Jennifer Mercado is a real estate agent by trade, and entrepreneur by spirit. She is the owner of Jennifer Mercado, PA, her luxury real estate brand, and Insightful Media, LLC, where she provides coaching and direction for realtors and their social media presence. She has the unique gift of seeing people where they are and connecting them to communities that support them. She is a mother to 2 young children, a wife to her best friend and #1 fan, with whom she's created a seemingly traditional life while rewriting all the rules.

Connect with Jenn here:

IG- @thejennmercado
FB- JenniferMercadoRealtor
TW- PalmBeachesRltr
LinkedIn- JenniferMercadoRealtor


Mentioned in this episode

Never One Thing - May Erlewine

Listen here:
Never One Thing - May Erlewine - YouTube

TRANSCRIPT:  What does it mean to have a teacher identity? What are some things that characterize a good teacher? What does a teacher look like? or sound like? What do they do when they're not at work? Sometimes this idea of teacher identity can feel like we're putting ourselves in a box, and maybe question some of our choices. For example, should I get that tattoo I've always wanted? Or should I take that side job, even though people in the community might see me? Should I dye my hair purple? Well, today, my guest and I talk about identity, and how the only rules are the ones that we make for ourselves. Because truly, the best way to create our identities is to be unapologetically and authentically, yourself. And what a beautiful example that we get to share for our students. And make sure you check out break time, which is the monthly empowered educator subscription that gives you access to an incredible video library of self regulation strategies, as well as a monthly group coaching call with me and other amazing empowered educators. Head on over to empowered educator.com/resources. Remember all the passion and vision you had when you first one into teaching? Feeling like building young minds and creating community through your work would make a lasting impact on this world? Well, those days may feel like they're behind you now because you're exhausted, stressed and overwhelmed and frustrated. But I'm here to tell you, it doesn't have to be like this. In fact, the love of teaching never really went away. But it absolutely needs transformation. Welcome to The Take notes Podcast. I'm Jen Rafferty, former music teacher, mom of two, and certified emotional intelligence practitioner, and I'm here to light the way for you. In order to create a generational change for our kids. We need to shift the paradigm away from the perpetual stress and overwhelm and into a life of joy, and fulfillment. This is education 2.0, where you become the priority, shift how you live your life, and how you show up both at work, and at home. So take a sip of steamy morning coffee, and grab your notebook. It's time to take notes.

Hello, and welcome back to take notes. I'm so excited for this episode today because I'm here with the incredible Jen Mercado and Jen is a real estate agent by trade and an entrepreneur by spirit and a former educator. She is the owner of Jen Mercado pa her luxury real estate brand and insightful media LLC, where she provides coaching and direction for realtors and their social media presence. And she has the unique gift of seeing people where they are and connecting them to communities that support them. She's a mother to two young children, a wife to her best friend and number one fan with whom she's created a seemingly traditional life while rewriting all the rules. Hi,


that's actually on point.


Was Nope. So it's yours, girl.

Jen Mercado 
Yeah, you know, sometimes like you write it and then you hear and you're like, Yeah, that's true. Like it's true. I think when you hear from somebody else, like it just it lands different. So yes, hello. And I am super excited and honored. And thank you. Thank you. Thank you for having me on


today. Oh, it's my pleasure. I'm just so excited to get an excuse to talk to you. That's really what this is. I love

Jen Mercado 
it. Yes. And it's a public conversation. So it's all going to happen right here right now in front of everyone else, which I am. So for


CCS, me too. So one of the things that I love about you, and you know, we've known each other kind of peripherally for a long time now. And so something that I've always just admired about you is that you're so open and public about really showcasing that we're never one thing. And you know, as someone who comes from a traditional backgrounds who took a very traditional path, it's really been inspiring to watch you morph and shape shift into whatever feels right in the moment. And I'm learning how to do that. And it feels great. And I would just love for you to just share a little bit about yourself and how you got to where you are and what that means for you to just kind of I guess shapeshifting is the best way I can describe it right now.

Jen Mercado 
And you know, like, I love it too, because that's exactly what I want to I guess like be remembered by is that whenever Jen did X, Y or Z like it was never out of place. Like it's oh yeah, Jen's doing this new thing. Cool. She's doing great at it. Oh, this other thing. Okay, cool. You know, like never really having anybody kind of like second guess or like think that it's not congruent. So just hearing you say that I'm like, okay, yeah, like it's validating because that's exactly like the life that I want to live that if something feels good for me if something is calling me in one direction to another, that I'm not letting that initial hesitation of what will it look like stop me from like going out and doing the thing, but it's I know that you said that you started in a traditional way, because I did not start traditionally, and yet find myself ending up in what appears to be traditional roles and like traditional things to do, right. So like, even my journey to becoming a teacher, I never thought or saw myself as a teacher, until I became a kid's entertainer as a clown. And then when I started having those interactions with kids, and like, really enjoying seeing the joy in their faces, or like doing some learning activities, like even within the parties, I'm like, I guess I'd like kids, I guess I could do this, like I could be a teacher. And like, my clowning career was 10 years, my education career was almost 10, I think eight or nine, like right before I left. So like I got there in a way that was really unexpected, right? I had no formal schooling for school to become a teacher, or like, my masters has nothing to do with education. And yet, I just found myself so naturally, I think inclined to having that interaction, and like having that impact with kids. That's where I ended up. So you know, from one transition to the next. And I think doing it in a way that I almost purposely have my blinders on. So like, I don't get sidetracked by, well, what is it going to look like? Or what are people going to think? Because I so I just want things to happen. And like that kind of I guess tenacity and having that blind me to just get to where I'm going, I don't stop to think of a what is this look like? Like, right, then after, you know, becoming an educator going into real estate now, trans, like the transferring, I'm not transferring, I'm still doing real estate. But now transitioning into a more educated role, even within real estate now coaching real estate agents with their visibility on social media, doing it in such a way that for me, I don't bat an eye and that the people around me and my family are just super supportive and don't bat an eye that Jen has a new hobby or like, Oh, this is what your passion is calling you to do. Great, you know, and I think having that support really gives me the confidence that in anything I'm going to do, I'm going to excel whether I do or don't, I feel like I could. And that's good enough for me to just get to where I'm going and to try out new things and end up making it look, I guess, like it's traditional, but it's not the behind the scenes is really an interesting roadmap to end up to where I am.


Yeah, and I want to talk about that behind the scenes in a minute. But you totally glossed over being a clown for 10 years. We're going back to your cloud for 10 years, we need to talk about that. I want to know everything because that believe it or not, you are not the first clown that I have encountered. And you're also not the first clown who has gone into education once they were a clown. So who is this person? Well, someone we met in passing, and we had a very interesting conversation. So I would love to know, like how that happens for you and what that was about that's interesting to me.

Jen Mercado 
First, you need to connect me with whoever my sole person is, because that is just uncanny. But cloning also was a happy accident. It's like one of those things where something just randomly pops up and inspires you to look on Craigslist, and you look on Craigslist and you find this job, like it's going back to the things just happen. And if it feels right, I go for it, you know, because what's the worst that can happen? Right? I'm living like trying to figure out whether I should do it or not. But at the time, I was working as a paralegal in a real estate law firm, and I wanted to do more creative stuff, like really feed into that creative part of my soul. Like I'm a singer. I love singing I love performing. And I was looking for like side gigs side hustles on Craigslist for like hosting karaoke or anything like a lounge singer. Just anything that put me in front of a mic with an audience and just belting out. And then the kid entertainer came up and I was like, Oh, this is like an interesting description. So like I clicked on it. And literally the job description was like three to four sentences looking for entertainer available on the weekends works kids parties must have car and must enjoy working with kids contact me for and I was like, Oh, my niece had just been born, I think a few months before. I'm like, okay, like, I like kids, I guess. You know, I just I have this nice. I love her. Like I do anything for her. I just had bought my car, which was exciting. So I'm like, Yeah, let's do it. So I meet up with her. I shadow her at this party in Howard Beach, Queens, because I'm originally from New York. And I like I remember just showing up and like, Oh, wow. Like kids parties are fun. Like, I'm from a Hispanic background. So like our kids parties are very different from like, kids parties. So having that experience where it's like a theme and everybody was dressed up and like their activities for the kids. I'm like, Oh, this is fun. So I was having like a really fun time. Like I was a guest. This one little girl like just was so jiving with me. Like whenever she needed help. She came to find me. So like I walked her under the limbo stick like oh, you want me to open your juice package? Sure, like just really leaning into being there. And my boss will now like my best friend Daphne at the time was like, yeah, like you're a natural like you were not like skeeved out by anything. Like you rolled with it. And I'm like, yeah, like it's kids, you know? And then from then on, she's like, Yeah, I'd love to hire you. I think you also have Princess capability. So I started versus like a clown clown assistant than I graduated to like being a princess and doing like The whole themed parties like for royal tea parties and things like that. That was basically it just that one weekend going out by chance meeting a random stranger from Craigslist and another strangers birthday party. And it was like a match made in heaven. Like there was just an instant, like, yeah, I could do this. And I can do this for a long time. So I did that all the way until I moved from New York to Florida. Here, I started for a little bit my own company. But then I started having kids, and I'm like, I can't be pregnant clowning and jumping around and doing the stuff. So I hung up my clown shoes for real tour shoes.


Wow, you know, the thing about this, that just blows me away is again, I'm gonna go back to the you know, we're never just one thing. And I'll just share a little story about when the pandemic happened, you know, I just gotten divorced and moved out of my house. And then when the world shut down, I was now teaching music from home, I was homeschooling my own kids, I had all of the things I was the day before, it seemed like all of a sudden, overnight, I was not anymore. And when I decided to stay home and homeschool my kids, that's when I started my PhD. And there was this moment in the very first class, when they said Introduce yourself. And I lost it. I was just crying in front of my computer, because everyone was introducing themselves by you know, who they were married to what they had, and their children. And I felt so lost. And you know, here I was, I didn't know who I was anymore. And so hearing you just in this very short time we've been speaking you know, singer, paralegal, real estate clown, Princess educator, voiceover your mom, you know, like, there are all of these things. And I want to highlight this is because it wasn't in that moment that I wasn't anything. I just didn't see myself with all of those facets as these identifiers. And I think this is really important and really ties in nicely to empower educator tenant for of like reflection of who we are as people, we get so pigeonholed in not only who we think we are, but who we think other people want


us to be spot on. So a lot on we have such


blinders on in a way that creates tunnel vision. And we don't actually see ourselves any other way. And I think this is something that ties in so closely to burnout and feelings of exhaustion is because when we put in our selves, our full selves, and we connect it to their identity as being this one thing and just as an example right now for our audiences, just as a teacher, everything else falls to the wayside. And what really I was excited to talk to you about is just this is because you know, when we do see ourselves as multifaceted, almost like sprinkles are coming to mind. All these beautiful wooden dollars of like, like an ice cream sundae all the different parts to it. We are so much richer than we might realize. So how did this happen for you? Was this something you always knew about yourself? Or was this like defining moment where you're like, oh, man, like, I'm not just one thing? I'm everything?

Jen Mercado 
Yeah, I'm so happy that you asked that. Because it was almost like I didn't have a choice but to accept that I am all these different things. And like now as an adult, I embrace it. I'm like, Yeah, you know, oh, I do this. And like, very cavalierly, I can talk about like, the 50 careers. I've had, like, my 34 years of life, like I'm ready for retirement, because all of those subsets of work are exhausting, you know, but I think just going into it, having fun really helped kind of like break down the barriers of that. But I don't think it was something that I had an intention to. But it was something that I came to accept about myself probably at a very early stage because like even my upbringing has been very non traditional, right? Like I had, I guess what I can say, like a progressive parenting, right? I didn't have the normal structure of family. I had like, my single mom raising me on the one side with my siblings. And then like, on the other half, like my dad with a full married life, career 401k like I literally lived in two different worlds as a kid. And I think growing up just trying to figure out in which world I fit in the most. I ended up not, I think attaching to one identity over the other, but just allowing the identity to fit the purpose of wherever I was. So that sounds like I had multiple personalities. I don't, it was just like, situationally, I knew where I was standing. And that it wasn't who I was just my circumstance, just my situation at this time. Like, this is who I am I my dad's daughter with my stepmom and my sister and my brother and then at my mom's house. I was super like rambunctious for my mom's I was always like the ping pong ball bouncing off the walls. So understanding that one over the other wasn't better. They were just different. And they were just me. And that was just a circumstance of my life and learning to not chameleon, but learning to live and exist in both worlds in a way that I didn't feel like an outcast. Because I did a lot of the times I felt like I didn't fit in and I didn't fit in and I'm like well I don't fit in because these are like two different worlds, but I live in them so I don't have to fit in. That's just my life, right? That's just where we are. So then going through high school and going through college and like having more of that time of reflection with myself, and really piecing together my role in my life and what I wanted my life to be, I want to say might have been like in college, where I made the decision that my past and who I was, and like the things that I experienced as a kid didn't define me just informed decisions that I made and the decisions that I can make and who I ultimately want it to be doesn't exist because I've never met anybody who had a similar upbringing to me. So just coming to terms with like, okay, like, I have a story, and everybody has a story and to everyone, their story is unique, and I find mine unique and leaning into that more than fighting it lent to a lot more like growth on my behalf than like getting pigeonholed and fixated on having to find the perfect box for Jen and fitting into it, where it's now like, whatever personality whatever circumstance, whatever resource or tool I have, in my advantage to assimilate, understand, experience and relate to whoever I'm with. That's just the toolkit that I have for having all these different worlds exist within me. Well, it's so freeing. It wasn't but yes, now it is.


Tell me about that. When you mean, it wasn't at first was it scary is that was yeah, it was scary. Because like

Jen Mercado 
when you're in school, you have to know what you want to do when you get to college. And you have to know exactly what profession you're going to do in your profession has to go straight from your college career. And me not ever being able, I think, to hone in on one skill or one industry or one thing that I really wanted to do, I felt like I had no direction. Like I didn't know who I was, because I didn't have this box. This industry, this like clear set path of this is what Jen wants to do, this is how to get there. So it was a lot of just, I'm just gonna do whatever's here. Because I couldn't find where I fit in. And I was attaching so much of my identity to who I had to become and you know, through no fault of school, its own. But that's what you learn in school, you go you follow the rules, you get your education, you do the very best that you can. And then once you're done doing the best to do the best out there, and the thing you decided to do here, and I was not finding that, right, so like even majoring in poli science, but then minoring in philosophy, like why I wasn't gonna go become and create like a whole government creator. Like it's not what I wanted to do. But I found that there were a lot of different skills in community building that I can do with that background, and really understanding nuances of people and just existence through philosophy. And that just informed me to be like, alright, there is no thing that you really want to do. So just do all of it until you can figure out what it is because this box that everybody tells you you need to find and fit in and conform to is just not a thing. Not it wasn't a thing for me personally. Now, I don't think it's a thing for anybody. But I just had to get comfortable quickly with being free and redefining rules, which as a rule follower is very difficult.


Yes. Well, and this is, as a, you know, a really good transition to the next question I was going to ask you, because the work that I do with a parent educator is teacher centered, you know, so when we're talking about the constructs of school, we are products of that same system. Yeah. So it's this kind of macro way of looking at this because not only are we perpetuating it in the systems that we currently work in, but we are products of this as well. And in order to make changes, we have to do it ourselves first, right? So you know, having this reflection of this moment of Wow, am I in this box? You know, do I like the box? Because if you like cool, like, that's great for you? Yeah, if you're feeling like I'm trying to fit into this box, and even if your box is the type of teacher you think you should be or that you're supposed to be, and understanding that most teachers are rule followers.


US teachers were teacher's pet. Yeah, like, that's just I was gonna say it, you become a teacher because you were the teacher's pet.


Great. I love school, or you hated school, and you wanted to do everything that your teachers didn't do. Right. So like, you want to follow some sort of rulebook. Because in our analytical brain that makes the most sense. But understanding that not only can you rewrite the rules, but there are actually no rules. There actually are no rule or

Jen Mercado 
none. Yeah, and there are no limitations, right. And there's no I think structured clean bullet proof, you know, list of if you absolutely do this, this is the guarantee of what you're gonna get like, that doesn't exist, either. But yeah, I mean, to your point, we are products of school and I find myself like overachieving and other moments in my life. And I'm like, I'm not in school anymore. But if I had the opportunity to like, I'd go back to school in a heartbeat. Michael, who wants to teach me something new. Yes. Okay, let's go do that thing. Right. So I think we really are but again, the system that we are, again, because we don't have I think the flexibility or maybe The collective Yeah, this isn't good, right? Like, I think when we get to that point where we're all looking at each other like, Wait, we we've done what we've been doing what, which I think we're getting more to now especially like, as a mom, and I'm looking at like, where I want my kids to go to school. And I'm like, Oh, now that actually is great, because I don't want for my kids to feel like I felt I don't want for them to think that there is a direct correlation between what they did in school, what they learned in school to the rest of their life, because that's not true. So really having that conversation with myself where like, when I want to be super strict, I want to follow the rules, because that's what I was taught to do. Because it's very rewarding to follow the rules to also understand that my kids, one don't know them don't know that they exist two and three, don't know that they can rewrite them for the life that they want to live. So it's really like one of those, okay, we're going to break these rules. And it's okay. And I'm like talking to myself, and the kids are like, so can we do this thing? Or not? Like, it's a yes or no. And I'm having this whole like, consortium inside of me like guys, are we ready to do this? Like, are we ready to rewrite how we've been parented so that my kids can now have a new example. And that when they go to school, that it's okay to push back if something doesn't make them comfortable, but also to show them to do that with respect?


Sure, well, and that's I think, again, being reflective about this in your own classroom, I think we can liken this to this idea of what's happening now with student centered learning and flipped classroom where teachers that become guide on the side, instead of, you know, sage on the stage, right, like this is kind of this idea of loosening up the control that once was part of traditional teaching, and really letting kids lead. But that takes a lot of inner work as a teacher to do that. And not just to do it in the classroom, but to model it yourself. And that's what I think a lot of this work really is about, again, is creating that mindset shift for you. So you're not just saying words, but you're actually embodying what it means to be flexible, and change your minds and do something different. You're not just teaching that you are living that

Jen Mercado 
correct. Yeah. And I think that those are skills that you can generalize at any point, right? You want to embody being flexible, not just in school, not just with your students, but with your family members, with your social circles, like wherever it is, there's a lot to be said, I think about women or teachers in particular, who understand and like, I know that this probably the experienced teachers are like, Yeah, we know that. But like, it's it bears repeating, like, just don't take things personally. Because when you can take yourself out of the equation. And you can just understand that this is a role that I'm doing at this time. And being a teacher as a part of me, it's not my whole life, you can really ease back and start to see who you bring to the table as a teacher, not what the teacher brings to the table as you. And I think having that distinction really is going to help in embodying it. Because now you're not your job anymore. You're what you want for the students to understand. You're giving them an open space to make those mistakes that we say it's okay to make, but freak out when they happen. It's really about having that I think synergy with who you are and what you do that's going to lead to that embodiment and not just seeing it. Oh, like it's I learned this in the school building. So it's going to stay here. No, these are things that I can do throughout other aspects of my life as well.


Yeah. And so for you, I imagine part of this also with rewriting rules, you had to really redefine your definition of success. What are you there? We've had this conversation before about success. And this is something that's super near and dear to my heart, too, because I had to rewrite my own definition to so you know, as someone who is living such this non traditional lifestyle, what does success mean to you?

Jen Mercado 
So I think first and foremost, for me, that success isn't like a fixed destination anymore, where I think that's what it was like, once I did that. And I had that and this validation, like I was successful. So I've learned to become really, I want to say graceful with myself in that my success and definition can change. And that it doesn't have to be like this one fixed point, that it can just look like and be what feels good for me at the time. And what I feel is the journey that I'm meant to be on. So my current definition of success right now is kind of what I'm doing just being able to show up as I want as who I am being able to mess up, mess up on stage, if I need to mess up in front of my kids. It's having a sort of financial independence and freedom that I choose to make investments in my business that I choose to have a supporting role for another company if that's what feels good, and is going to also like give me a skill set. It's not I guess I could probably define success easier than what it's not than what it is for me right now. But like it's not having the hardest working person badge not staying up super late in the hours not being 24/7 available for my customers when we're in a real estate transaction, like having those clear boundaries that yeah, this is what I do. This is my skill set and I'm able to be this good and productive because I have these boundaries. So if we can respect that we're fine. So I think like, yeah, for me right now, success is where I am. So this level of success I have achieved, I can wake up, I get to do what I want, I get to make money through a business, I get to make money on demand, I get to be available for my kids to drop them off at school to pick them up, I get to take care of my body workout, have the time set aside for that, I get to invest in my house and make the improvements that we want. And moreover, I think we get to do the things that we want to do without letting fear dictate whether we do it or not. And I think that probably is my definition of success doing what I want to do not being afraid of not doing it, but doing it maybe because it doesn't feel good, or because it does feel good. But not having that fear be the reason I stopped or don't do something.


Yeah. And I think even just that understanding that we get to define success, however we want. You know, that's another thing with, again, being products of our upbringing, right? Yeah, it's about getting all of the A's and getting the external praise, and acknowledgement. And education is generally a thankless job of service, right? So we're just like, waiting for someone to just say thank you, you know, and when they do within will feel successful, or we'll feel that we meant something or that's important. And perhaps the best thing that we can do for ourselves is shift our definition of what it means to feel successful. Because even what you were saying of success is doing what feels good. That is also a very radical idea for a lot of people, especially as when we first start working together, you know, it's not until we kind of dive into what that really means is they're like, oh, yeah, okay, that makes sense now, because oftentimes, we feel like we have to do things that don't feel good, to be successful, right. And again, in being reflective, this isn't just about what we're teaching our kids, it's about embodying this shift. So we can be examples for another way to live. Because the way we're doing it right now, it's not working, right? It's not sustainable. We cannot maintain healthy longevity, not just in teaching, but just like in every career, right? So you're gonna make the most money and feel burnout, or you're gonna get to retirement and not be able to enjoy it, because you've been stressed out for 30 years, and now you're sick. It's not working.

Jen Mercado 
Well, and also, like, not even allowing yourself to celebrate that success, right? Because I remember Yeah, super straight A student here, like reading commendation cards in the newspaper for being an avid reader, like all the things, but never really like feeling that I can brag about it, or like, celebrate, like, it became a thing that almost made you jaded, like okay, yeah, Jen got another a big deal. And it's like, it is a big deal. But at that age, like, that's just what was expected. So really understanding that shift that yeah, like, we have this external validator, and then we receive it, but also limit it, like don't let that go to your head, don't get super involved in the fact that you did feel like that just means that you have to work harder, because now you put yourself on the spotlight that this is the type of career as a student that you're going to maintain and hold. So really, like when you said that getting the A's I'm like, Oh my gosh, yes. Like having that validation that Yeah, good job. You did it. But also okay, but get over it. Because now you have to do it again. And like, just keep going and keep doing it. And then for teachers who are, I think, still in it. And you know, I say this for myself as well, because I did do it. And I'm like, Yeah, this is a thankless job, like, I'm doing it for the kids. Like, I love the kids, like, of course, what would I do for them? What would I do for them, and it's going back to that mentality, I'm getting validation to be rewarded. But also, don't be happy to be rewarded. So like, just show up all the time until you die. And I think that it's such a powerful shift to that, when we do get those validations. And we're not allowed to celebrate them. Like that could be an awareness for you to like, Wait, why am I not feeling like I can celebrate this? Like, this is what I wanted? Why am I not happy now that I have it? And that's another way for you to be like, maybe this wasn't my success. Maybe this was somebody else's. Maybe this was something that I was raised to think that I need or want or absolutely have to have to be this person in my community be this person in my family, and it doesn't feel right. And that's shit. That's why sorry.


Yeah, right. Well, I think there's a few things that I think you mentioned there first is, again, like living someone else's expectations of you, which is really important and whatever you're doing, and even if it's just in the way you show up, right, and the way you decorate your classroom, or the way that you win or whatever it is, it doesn't matter. You know, it has to be true to you, first of all, because otherwise the successes aren't going to feel good. And then the second thing you had mentioned is that we look at celebrating ourselves as bragging. And a lot of times when I work with teachers and school leaders, they are very uncomfortable celebrating themselves, because we don't want to boast we live we live in this culture where it's not okay. to toot your own horn, or you have to say, I'm going to do my own or like, I don't mean to toot my own horn, but like no to, to please do too. Because if you're not going to take the time and sit in that, you're missing the whole thing, you miss a whole thing. And if this was really what you wanted, then you need to take the time and receive that beautiful success. Sit in that moment where that kid had that light bulb go off, you know, sit in that where you just finished your big assessment project for the thing. And everyone showed up. And it was great, like sit in that thing is because and that just said, tell someone. Yeah, thank you. I was

Jen Mercado 
expand on that train somebody. And also, if you're in the classroom, celebrate your students, right in a way that they all feel included in the celebration. And I'm not just saying like gloss over like this one kid's super success just to include everyone else, but make it so that it's poignant that there is that intention in celebrating what they just accomplished, you know, and we don't do it for ourselves. So it's easier sometimes to do it for others. But then we see how good they feel. Why are we denying that for ourselves? Like when my kids do anything that's like, really exciting or like, even when they mess up? I'm like, Hey, it's okay. And they're like, yeah, like, it's fine, whatever, you know, just letting them know that I'm going to celebrate them. Even like when we have fights. I'm like, Listen, I love you today wasn't the best day tomorrow could be another day. I still love you. You know that right? Like, always just making sure that at any point, you can delineate that, who they are is not this one moment is not this test is not the celebration, that I think is going to go far too. So for teachers who need to hear it also for the students like yes, it's wonderful to celebrate. But I think really, the intentionality is like not to attach yourself to that one thing, because then you're going to keep going for that hit that hit that hit. And at the end, you as a person deserve that hit regardless of where it comes from. So you're not always fixating on doing that same thing over to get that response again.


And that brings us back full circle, because this now then validates when we're celebrating all of these things that we are never one thing, or whatever one thing, and the more we can celebrate all of the beautiful continuum, and the huge spectrum of successes in our lives, the more evidence we start to realize like, oh, wow, I'm not just one thing. And the more rich our lives become, because we see ourselves as all of the different fractals that

Jen Mercado 
Yeah, and I think, you know, we try to do that maybe in a way to compartmentalize like, Oh, I'm this person at home and this person at school, so that you have more maybe control of your emotions, or like, maybe I don't want to say like just the motions. But I think and this was, again, probably something from society, like, if we're compartmentalized and clean cut, then we understand our role in each place. And it's like, no, we're gonna have that bleed through. Because we are the same person, everywhere that we go, we might be functioning in a different facet. But at the heart, that's us. And all of those things make us and I think it's not so much sectioning off those identities. It's bringing them back together and looking at yourself as like a pie a puzzle piece and not a book on the library that oh, this is the book I'm reading today. Like, this is all I am. It's like, No, I'm everything that encompasses that. And that just it leads to self acceptance, I think in ways that people might not expect, like, it took me a while to come to terms with that I'm all of these things. And that again, not that I'm wrong, just that they're different. And they're incompatible. And that's okay, that's okay. You know, I can like when and be married to a man, like there are things that are not compatible, but that it doesn't matter whether it makes sense or not. Because the life that we're creating is just one words like it feels whole. And I think that wholeness just comes from you saying, Yes, this is who I am no apologies, this is my life, this is what I've been through. I can't apologize for my experiences. I can't apologize for the identities that I'm attributing to myself. But also I can change them at any time. And okay, right.


And again, it's making sense is really just about a construct of rules that, again, don't exist. So as long as you show up as your most authentic you, you make sense because you are, that's it. And the sentence, you know, I am is so powerful. And this is an exercise I do with the people that I work with too, is make a list I am and just see what comes up, sit on it for a little while and come back to it a couple of days later. And you'd be surprised the kinds of things that start to come up for you.

Jen Mercado 
Yeah, and I think like the other part of it too, is when you have that awareness of who you are. Also understand that you don't have to be any more like if it's an identity or something that doesn't fit right or doesn't feel good anymore. You can let it go. Nobody's gonna judge you for holding on to it. People might not even know that you subscribe to that identity anymore. Like it is okay for you to just let go of the things that you feel need to be let go of right and I think that there's always this concept in society was like, Oh, you're letting go, you're giving up, like, how dare you give up? It's like, No, I fulfilled the duty, it did what it needed to do. It's okay to let things go and die. Like, that's fine. So I think it's also having that forgiveness of yourself and having that grief moment like, yeah, this was an identity that I thought I was, but seeing where I am, and the things that I've been able to do, like, that's no longer me, and that's okay, too. She brought me here. And I'm saying she, because it's me, we fulfill the purpose, whatever lesson I had to learn from that Jen happened, and I can let her be free in the others to wherever she needs to go and not hold on to that experience or identity anymore.


And that's huge. And for me, personally, that's been a journey for me to have that moment of not just acknowledging, yes, old gen served a purpose. And now new gen comes along. But that moment of grief of letting go an older version of myself, and then that self forgiveness piece of things that I didn't really mean, now looks back with all of the wisdom that I have now, like, how could old me have made those choices, and it's, you know, that self forgiveness piece, and then you come to a sense of like you said, gratitude of, I wouldn't be here right now, if I didn't have that. And it is a journey, but a beautiful one. And I think that's really what we're doing here. You know, we grow and evolve and change and shape shift and figure out who we are. And that's shouldn't change. And I am purposely saying should here, I know, you're a little off and say should, but if you're doing it, right, you cannot be the same person you were 10 years ago, it doesn't work that way. And embracing that beautiful change, which is scary, is really how you're going to become this best version of yourself and self actualize.

Jen Mercado 
Yeah, I mean, and like that just brought me back to, you know, early in the conversation you'd mentioned, like all the things you were going through, like during the pandemic, like, I shifted my entire life to the pandemic, right, like, I mean, you had an experience, and then you are in this new environment, and like, you still have like this old, you kind of like in this new you emerging, and you're like, You're the new who are you? I don't know, you know, like, how could that not have been the answer at that time? Because you literally were in a transition, you had no idea, right. And I think that the pandemic kind of did that, for me, like I was already, I guess, in the throes of like, postpartum depression. And I was just like, something is not right. Like, I couldn't put my finger on it. I didn't know what it was. I didn't know if it was just hormonal. I think it was a moment of collective pause, grief and release. At the same time, everybody, I think, went through some sort of like, metamorphosis, then. And however we emerged at the other side, I think what hasn't been spoken about is that grief period that whoever we walked into, and 20 like is not the person that's here, and whether it's good grief, and you're happy where you are, or it's sad grief, and like things took a turn, like, you're allowed to grieve, I can still grieve that mom that I was. And like all the things that came up for me that year that I never wanted to revisit of my childhood, like, it was necessary, like I had that grief, and it was okay to have it. And it's okay to feel those feelings were like, Yes, everything's fine. Everything's fine. No, it's not, then it's not like, that's okay. I you know, there is no clean cut way to be a human. So, that's all


it is. It's messy. And it's a beautiful mess


if you're alive, and it's messy, mission accomplished, right?


That's just it. Yeah. And you know, before I forget, I'm gonna put in the show notes. There's just beautiful. So I don't know if you know it, but there's a song Never one thing by me or a line. It's a gorgeous song. And I'll send it to you after the podcast you but I'll put it in, in the notes. Because it's just, it has been a repeating theme song for me over the last two years, especially during COVID Kind of getting me through and understanding this identity shifts from everything I talked about before. But even you know, transitioning from being in the classroom to now teaching educators, I had written a book about being a teacher, and it was like, Well, what does this mean, now that I'm not in the classroom anymore, you know, I had to really grieve like you were talking about and then step into this new version of myself, forgiving myself for making this decision with that I thought it needed forgiveness, right. And then being able to work through all those messy feelings to get to where I am today. And no matter what the transitions are, whether it's to paralegal to clown to, to Princess, you know, or moving classrooms or grade levels or shifting from a pandemic, it doesn't matter. We all go through this beautiful process. And once you kind of see this from new fresh eyes and invited in, what are the possibilities there's so many possibilities for us in this lifetime that to pigeonhole ourselves into this one thing, you're selling yourself short and then in terms of what we're modeling for our kids and we are cutting them off at the knees before they even get a chance to get out the door.

Jen Mercado
You know exactly like I think back to like some of the teachers that I had, like I want to say I had the blessing of just some really amazing teachers like I can name you my teachers, probably from like kindergarten to like college because I've just again teacher's pet and I don't want to forget anybody's names. I don't know anybody's name I met yesterday, but my teachers, I'll tell you, I just had the good fortune of having them when there was this like leaning towards you can be whatever you want to be dream it and you'll become it. We're all like crayons and rainbow. Like, I had those teachers like I had that progressive attitude where yeah, like, You excelled at it amazing. Somebody ever did it. Awesome. You know, like, never really bringing anybody down. Although like now as I'm an adult, I'm like, gosh, they totally like knew that I was gonna be like neurotic, because of like how attentive I was to my grades, but really just having that, yes, you can be whatever you can be. And if it was just a slogan, or a campaign that teachers had, like, I drink that shit, I bought into that Kool Aid. And I'm like, You know what, but I can be anything that I want to be. And in my family, there's nobody who's done any of the things that I've done, and like not even saying it as like, Oh, look at me, but like saying it like, it's scary to do these things. And to just have that, well, does it feel good? And what am I going to leave behind in doing? So it's like, oh, okay, and then you're raising everybody with you. And then they start to see themselves in a new way. And they start to believe and drink the Kool Aid that they can do whatever they want. And they start to pivot and change careers. It's like, Yes, and I will champion you, because why not? And if you change your mind, have at it. That's it.

Yes, more of it. So which leads me to the last question, which I asked everybody, considering all the we've talked about, you know, what is your dream for the future of education?

Jen Mercado 
I think for me, the dream is like, I don't want to rewrite everything right. There were some things that I think were Pinnacle's, that worked. And that got us here and that are leading us to have this conversation. Because it didn't all suck, there was a lot of insight and, and beauty in what we did. But I think if I had a dream for the education system, it's just for it, to not encourage the box, I think is the best way that I could describe it, don't encourage, just excelling in a test. And that's all you are doing encourage just getting into college and that college and that career, and that becomes who you are, I think it's yes, you have a skill set in taking a test and reading books and engineering, great cultivate that skill set in a way that it's more generalized and not well, if you're good at this, then you can only do that. So I think that's a huge disservice, to really just allowing kids to and you know, even especially as they get into, like middle school in high school, and I've had thank God, like the fortune of working with kids in middle school, in high school, and elementary and all across the age and like the one thing that I carried away from like, being with all those grades is just the ability to tell them, this does not define you, right, we're all here to do a job. This is what we're spending our day to day. These are my goals as an educator, but please know, at the end of the day, on your last day of life, you are not going to remember this moment that happened in fourth grade, that boy that said he didn't like you, that teacher who maybe had a bad day and was rude to you without having the way to express themselves. So it's really just that this is a moment, this is a phase. And you have skills here that you can cultivate and generalize them across your life. But this is not everything. So that would be my dream for education to let kids see it as a vehicle and not the end all be all and not let it really cataclysmically define who they are becoming as they grow up,


get rid of the boxes, no more. No boxes are no boxes or no boxes. This has been fantastic. I'm like
Jen Mercado 
the best we want to wait, let's just keep going. You know, I know I have like my other job I have to get to. But I'd much rather continue this.


This has been so wonderful. And something I think needs to be talked about more often. Because like you said, I think there have been things that have led us to these sorts of conversations. So let's let's keep having them because they're important for this massive, transformational generational change that we're doing here and empower an educator world because this is really how we change the world is we show up differently ourselves, we understand ourselves better. And we do it better than we had in the past. And we're on a different trajectory now.

Jen Mercado 
Yeah, we are. And honestly like, I love the work that you're doing. And maybe had I been in education, like at the same time, it probably would have been like a different conversation with where my trajectory would have gone. But really being able to look at not just the teacher as a whole, but their role in the education system. And really having that conversation that just because things are doesn't mean they have to remain. And that it's okay for us to see ourselves in a different light, but also empower the teachers to make those decisions within their classroom and to impact the students that they can by being the best versions of themselves. Because just having a good day alone might make an impact on a kid that nobody would have ever considered. So I think that when you have that space and that time to selfishly take care of yourself, reflect on what your needs are, you're showing up in the classroom as a much different person. And that's going to translate a lot more to a student than if you just you know, hit all your benchmarks and everybody's fine.


Yeah. Because you know that taking care of yourself. That is how you serve your students and rewriting the narrative of that being selfish. That's really do you want to serve? Then you better take care of yourself first? Absolutely. So if there are people who want to get in touch with you and learn more about you and your story and all the beautiful things, we didn't even talk about your career as an author. So maybe we'll have you back on and we'll talk about buying a house, particularly in this crazy market right now. How can they get in touch with you?

Jen Mercado 
So I'm mostly on I guess, Instagram at the Jen Mercado, I have website WWW dot Jen mercado.com. Also have a podcast, red carpet living with Jen. And that's on YouTube and anchor and all the places. But yeah, social media is I think maybe the first place you can find me. And also I'm a realtor and like our information super public. So if you were to Google Jennifer Mercado, you would know all the things about me. But yeah, I think I would say start an Instagram and we'll go from


there. Great. And all of those links will be in the show notes, obviously. So thank you so much for your time, and this gorgeous conversation. It needed to happen for me today, personally. Yay, for today. So thank you.

Jen Mercado 
Thank you. Honestly, this was a pleasure. I think long overdue, like you and I have always needed an excuse to just do this one on one. So I'm happy that it happened. But yes, overdue. But really, thank you for having me for sharing the space and for taking the DAT back down memory lane on the 5000 other jobs.


It was amazing. I'm glad you took us on that journey with you.


Thank you. Thank you.


Thank you. Yes. And thank you so much for listening, and we'll be back next week with a new episode. Incredible, right? Together, we can revolutionize the face of education. It's all possible. And it's all here for you right now. Let's keep the conversation going at empowered educator faculty room on Facebook.

What is your strategy for health and longevity?

Are your daily habits supporting and serving you as you age?

Ultimately, your quality of life and overall health is completely up to you. The good news is that becoming an educator no longer resigns you to the traditions of martyrdom and revered selflessness of the past.

Because, the most generous thing you can do for other people is to take care of yourself first.

Welcome to episode 8 of Take Notes with Jen Rafferty! In this episode, I’m speaking with Dr. Otto Janke, chiropractor and owner of Janke Family Chiropractic in Cortland, New York. He is an incredible chiropractor whose mission in life is to get as many people as possible to live their best and healthiest lives.

During our talk, we cover everything you need to know about taking a holistic approach to health in a way that feels expansive and centers on getting your body to a state of optimal functioning, so you can focus on preventive care instead of trying to put out fires when something goes awry.

Also, we discuss the role an optimized nervous system plays in maintaining good health and achieving longevity. All key points Dr. Otto expands upon in his program: Empire Longevity.

Today is all about taking care of our health in gratitude for everything our bodies do, and as a means to ensure we get to enjoy a long life doing the things that light us up inside!

It’s all in your hands, and you can start today!

Stay empowered,

Jen


Let’s keep the conversation going! Find me at:

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FaceBook: Empowered Educator Faculty Room


Find more on Otto Janke:  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0o5pjJwKnMs&feature=youtu.be 

TRANSCRIPT: 
What if you could live your healthiest life for as long as possible? What if you knew that your longevity was completely up to you and the relationship that you have with your body? Well, today we are talking to Dr. Otto Genki an incredible chiropractor whose mission in life is to get as many people as possible to live their best and healthiest lives for as long as possible. And he believes that your health care must focus on getting you to optimal functioning, which means that we must concentrate on preventative care instead of just trying to put out fires when something is wrong. It is my pleasure to share this important conversation with you where we talk about taking back your agency in your own health. And you're definitely going to want to take notes about this episode. And if you're really ready to start thriving, head on over to empowered educator.com/thrive. This game changing five week online course will give you the tools to shift your paradigm of success and create the pathway for you to live your best life, which is how we show up as our best selves, it's time to decide that you want to do more than just survive. It's time to thrive. Registration is now open. So sign up now at empowered educator.com/thrive. Remember all the passion and vision you had when you first went into teaching. Feeling like building young minds and creating community through your work would make a lasting impact on this world? Well, those days may feel like they're behind you now because you're exhausted, stressed and overwhelmed and frustrated. But I'm here to tell you it doesn't have to be like this. In fact, the love of teaching never really went away. But it absolutely needs transformation. Welcome to The Take notes Podcast. I'm Jen Rafferty, former music teacher, mom of two, and certified emotional intelligence practitioner, and I'm here to light the way for you. In order to create a generational change for our kids, we need to shift the paradigm away from the perpetual stress and overwhelm and into a life of joy, and fulfillment. This is education 2.0, where you become the priority, shift how you live your life, and how you show up both at work, and at home. So take a sip of steamy morning coffee, and grab your notebook, it's time to take notes. It is my absolute pleasure, I want to invite you to take a listen to this episode with one of my favorite people. And Otto and I have known each other actually, I've been thinking about this for a little over 10 years now you see me through a lot.


And I wanted to invite him on today to talk about something really important. And that is just overall physical health. And he approaches us in such an interesting, holistic way that I wanted you to hear it straight from his mouth. So thank you so much for being here every time and anytime you know that? Yes, I do. And I so appreciate that. So can you just share a little bit about why chiropractic care? And why is taking care of your spine really that important? Well, first of all, thank you for allowing me to be on here with you. Yes, and your hair does look fabulous. Thank you. So that's yours.


I guarantee you, I cut mine a lot more than you got yours.


I guarantee you why chiropractic care. So it's made out to be much, much more difficult than it should be. And it's simple, is that if the nervous system works at its best, you work at your best. And it's really that easy. And I talked to you for years about the tone of your nervous system, because you knew about the tone of the guitar. And if the guitar is just off, if the low E is off by that much, all six strings just aren't in harmony, therefore they don't function well as a guitar. And so the nervous system is the same exact thing with you. If we can get you in tune all of you in tune as much as possible. You just make beautiful music as a human being. And that's the simplest way we can put it. And it's not about what the guitar looks like. It's not about how old it is. It's not about how much it cost. It's about can we get you in tune with you. And the nervous system is just the simplest way. It's the coolest thing that there ever was. And we are seeing more and more progressive diseases that are coming from a nervous system that's not in tune from just the onslaught and tidal wave of autoimmune syndromes in females doesn't happen as much as the males, because let's be realistic about health care is that there's a diagnostic prejudice that goes with the sex. And if we can get you in tune better, your nervous system functions better. And we don't see as many of those same diseases. So I love that you make this analogy to guitars. That's something that we've talked about quite a lot because it's so concrete and tangible that an instrument is out of tune. It's not going to play its best and


And the same thing works for your nervous system for sure. And so I've kind of two things I want to go. First of all, we talk about nervous system regulation a lot in the work that I do with empowered educator and I would love for you to make an explicit differentiation. When you're talking about the nervous system versus how I talk about it. Regarding regulation, you speak about this in a much different capacity. So can you talk a little bit about what you mean about
regarding the work that you do with people. So for every simple is that I look at your nervous system in multiple ways. First of all, I look at how your posture is and teachers we have seen such a change in teachers in your posture in the last unpressured 30 years. And so the posture that teachers have has changed dramatically in the last 10 to 15 years, it's changed dramatically, to we're seeing that, that forward head syndrome, which that will help you to age so much quicker, we're not going to use the word age, because age is almost too nice, it's going to help you to decay so much quicker. And we don't want that we want you to age gracefully for decades to come. So the first thing I do in my practices, we take digital posture pictures, I want to see how you're built. More importantly, I already know how you're built, I want you to see how you're built. And that's just massively important. Second of all, is this. We do three types of neurological tests in my office, I see how the muscles are functioning, I see how your autonomic nervous system is functioning, then how your heart rate variability is working. That last one is we ask your nervous system and none of this is invasive. We ask your nervous system two very simple questions. One is, do you have enough energy to run this wonderful machine called Gen? Do you have it not? If you feel energized or nervous? Do you have the right energy to run you it's simple like this. So I have a MacBook Pro right there, which I do my editing on, I open that MacBook Pro up and the computer starts. But maybe some of the apps or programs don't start up or they don't communicate, well, that computer is no longer functional. Some people will say it's got enough energy, it doesn't. All those systems have got to be coordinated, working with each other and talking to each other. Your immune system, your digestive system, cardiovascular, your sexual function, hormone, all that stuff has got to be communicating. While all the while you're having 60,000 viruses, bacteria, mold and bugs attacking you every single day. And you don't give a cough or sneeze or a fever at all whatsoever. While you're listening to me while you're digesting the food you had at lunch while you're thinking about this while your asses on that seat, your backs on there, you're right with your head all at the same time. How frickin important could this possibly be? And you look at that and you're like, man, we got to keep the system massively coordinated. So we check that. And the heart rate variability also asks a great question, which is not if you're under stress, but what kind of stress you're under. And that allows us to address our care for you dramatically independently. And we can test this and progress this along the way. And that's we look at that. And probably about 1015 years ago, I stopped asking people how you were feeling? Mainly because the classic is, how did Joe feel? Five minutes before he had his heart attack, Joe felt great. How many people do you know are diagnosed with some kind of disease process the state cancer and they feel okay, we no longer can rely just on that we have to look at what your body says, read what your body says, allow you to tell us what's wrong with you, without having to open up your body to give you all different medications. I'm a firm believer that you need to have two primary care physicians now one is a fireman and one is an architect, Fireman has to be able to put out the diseases, the architect has to help you build to be better for the next decades. All of that stuff is huge. And there's so many places I want to go with this. You know, the first things that you talked about was posture. And as a musician, myself as someone who studied voice and posture was always something I was maybe more familiar with, because I studied some of that in college. But even still, when I first started working you especially in all along, we're constantly talking about that forward head posture. And this is something you don't notice. And this is so much more than when we're kids and our mom says stand up straight sit up straight. It's so much different. So what are some of the causes that keep us in this place of where we're not aligned anymore, that we're almost contorting ourselves. So again, 30 years in practice, I talked about Mrs. Johansen, who was an 82 year old woman from Sweden, when I first started practicing, she was the only person in my practice who was built with that forehead, the only one. Now, when I go do the scoliosis checks in schools, number is almost always 3.2 for girls 2.8% For boys that are going to have some kind of deviation of the spine, but it's going to be over 50 to 60% of these young boys and girls who are going to have that forward head posture. We simply cannot allow this and again, I don't want to sound like the cruel and uncaring kind


I practice around here. But I don't care if the kids in pain or not. Because by the time that happens, we're already a decade behind. And if we're a decade behind with pain, we're also a decade behind with nervous system not functioning at its best, especially in those integral years of them blooming, absolutely blooming into adolescence. So that's the first thing. Second of all, is what's causing it is this son of a bitch right here, this son of a bitch right here. And this stuff we're on right now. For those people who are listening and not watching cell phone and computer, it's like phone and computer, you guys can follow me and look at some of my videos. One was on a computer monitor height. Simplest thing, I'll be honest with you, I get paid a lot of money to go into companies to do Ergonomic evaluations, I see how people are sitting and standing. And I go around, say, lift up the monitor, lift up the monitor, lift up the monitor, lift up the monitor, lift up monitor, and they say, Well, we've got $25,000, buy new furniture, donate the money to a great cause, lift up the bike, get a big phone book from Brooklyn, put it underneath there and lift the monitor up. And they're like, well, we want to so you guys can buy all the chairs that you want. But if you work on a laptop, and the laptop is down, there doesn't matter if you lift the laptop up into a raised desk, it's still going to be too low for you. So we talked about that all the time. The other thing is that we look at how often we sit, we look at how often we spend time on the computer, how often we spend time on the handouts. It is astounding. And we systematically do this for hours a day. And then we don't do anything to combat that. And when we don't combat that, you start to ingrain that into your nervous system. Wow. I mean, it's when we talk about it like this. It's very confronting, but you know, it has to be that's the bad news. Here's the good news. We know how to frickin change it, we know how to improve it. It's this ain't rocket surgery. This ain't rocket surgery, do we know how to change this? And it's a systematizing. You know, we talked about the five aspects of motion. And one of them. The fifth one is posture. And no one talks about that when you're at the gym, they talk about, okay, you got to do cardio, you're weightlifting, we also have to get into balance and flexibility. But last one is posture. If the guitar neck is just tweaked a little bit, not much, I got my Gretch right there I go get my Gretch checked to see if I have proper neck alignment. And if that's not aligned, it doesn't matter what kind of strings I put on. It doesn't matter what kind of pickup it doesn't matter. And it hurts warped just a little bit. And then my guy goes, dude, you didn't see that. It's warped. I'm like, I just kept on tuning that a lot. Man, I skip on the tightening of the strings a bunch. And he's like, Nah, man your neck is. So yes, go in there with a rod, take the neck off, do the thing. That was thing. And same exact thing. Yeah, it's such a great analogy for this. And the other thing that keeps coming up for me is, again, two things.


Seems to be a trend here, I have two things to say for all your


first is, first of all, having a sense of incredible appreciation and gratitude for the amount of work that your body does on a daily basis. It's and here's the other thing, I don't even get up about the whole part about being by the way, let's put it on the table right now. Women are the better sex with time your clothes.


Can you talk talking? Yes.


You frickin grow humans, you grow humans. You never need to go to a watch a documentary, read a book or go to a class ever to know exactly how to do that. That is a frickin nut craziest thing ever. And 99.7 of the babies born worldwide are perfect. The other 5% are because of drugs and or malnutrition. So you look at that and you start going go one cell from this human and this self has come together and the yatse we make this to 4 trillion cells, human being over there. That's perfect. I am astounded, overwhelmed. And not much makes me want to actually stop and cry in practice. But when I start to see these little boys and girls who they say their first words, or they take their first steps, and that is just knowing how to teach them any of that stuff either. And they do it awesome. I only read about four things. That's all I read about in my whole life. I read about four things. And one of them is how the incredible body works and how we can help it maintain that for as long as possible. All the shit you got going on at one time is frickin astounding. Yeah, it's something that we profoundly take for granted until the house is fully engulfed in flames. And we talked about all time, okay, the house isn't fully engulfed in flames. It's only the second floor is engulfed in flames. I can still live downstairs. Don't worry about that. It's like dude, I want like a jet. You know, your house. Your second, it's only the second floor. Don't worry about it. We open the windows, it gets cooler in here. Don't worry about it. You're like your second floor. It's astounding. And the question I get Jen often is then why do we have so many diseases? It's because we screwed up the pro


Abraham, we all have a blueprint for our own health. Yours is a little different than mine is essentially the same. But here's a little differently mine. And we have chosen to go off that blueprint. We've chosen we've made choices. For instance, I want to eat these things. Yeah, but I like those things. That's it on the blueprint. I like these. Someone asked me about desserts. I have traveled for tiramisu, I've traveled distances for tiramisu, tiramisu, and I had a weird thing going on for quite some time, when I was in Italy, last time there for 10 days, I had term a su 14 times, I'm not saying I have a problem, I'm just saying that the tracks


yet, but the reality is, when I come back here, I don't have it at home, I just don't buy it. So if you want to make the most profound changes, you start with a menu at home. That's your grocery list. That's your menu for cooking. That's how you shop. And that's how you stock foods. It's not that hard, we make it so much more difficult. We have gotten away from the simplest, the sheer simplicity of health, health is the natural default mechanism of your body, it always has been. That's why when someone stopped smoking their lungs, start jacking up the stuff, because your body says let's get back to the blueprint, dude, let's get back to the blueprint. And your body has to go through that whole process of change. And to get back into health. It takes awhile. It does. And I think for me, I have been on my own personal health journey for many, many years. Now, you know, when we met that was, I think, some of the very beginning of me, realizing something's going because my second floor was on fire. This was my third floor, that means everything was on fire. And even as I've been moving through this, it hasn't been until very recently. I mean, within the last few weeks, I have realized that I didn't actually love my body enough to make it a priority. And until I figured that piece out, it didn't matter what I did, because at the end of the day, I was fine just having the first floor, because that's all I thought I needed because of a relationship I developed with myself long ago, you know, on all the all the mindset stuff, which is what we kind of get into and dabble in the work that I do. But that is a huge piece of it, too, is understanding the worthiness of having a healthy body. It's fundamental. So the term we use is the selfishness of health. And the selfishness of health is just that, I have to make myself a priority. And so once again, I'll go into the differences in the sexes that I've seen in 30 years, is that moms, and I call it the doom loop that moms get into the doom loop is that a mom comes into my practice, typically in her 30s or 40s, who has been in a certain health status for probably years, if not decades, and she's no longer able to do mom's stuff, not to the level that she would like to. Since she's not able to do that she started to spiral down into I can't, I can't, I'm not worthy, I can't, I can't. And we see not only the physicality of it, but the mental emotional aspects also. So we have to come back then and say, let's be honest about this, there's only one person who's truly concerned about your health. Jen, I hope you and I are friends, I hope we are co mates on your healthy decades. But the reality is, I'm never going to be as entrusted into your health as you are. That's just the reality of it. So you have to then make the best choices for yourself along the way. And you have to say to yourself, no, I'm not going to do that. I'm not going to do this, because I need to have this beautiful machine that I call myself working at optimum levels for as long as possible. And we have to do that. And there's many, many people who don't, and many men do it a different way. That's a different way to say I'm going to dedicate my time to working so I can provide for my family at the levels that I think is necessary, while they then make a second night and a secondary, but not the second burner on the stove. But know that tray underneath where we put the trays are needed for my pants. And yeah, that's where men put their health. And they say, I will take care of this. When I retire. You're already 3040 years behind, you will never make that time. And the reality is that the more and more I read about this is that 30 minutes a day, it takes 30 minutes a day to actually help you to optimize your next 6070 years. So I want to talk about what to do in those 30 minutes. But I do want to say here, which is something you touched on which is so aligned with the work that I do. The fundamental principle of empowered educator is the most generous thing you can do for other people is take care of yourself by far. And that is a radical idea for many people, but I think specifically educators who go into the service industry and are immersed in this tradition of martyrdom and revered selflessness. Yes, top of the soul


Social pressures of being a mom or a dad for some people as well. So this idea of saying put yourself first, I've seen people have struggle with this inner conflict about this before some of them come around. And some of them don't. That's cool, you know, live in love, but hopefully will come around soon. But that's exactly what you're talking about is that you are the only one that's going to be invested in your health and your well being and by health, I mean, holistic health, that more than anybody else, and if you're not going to do it, that's it. There is no one else. There is anybody else to add. On top of that, maybe a religious factor, being a lifelong Catholic, there's, we have to hold guilt that goes along with that. Add all that shit on top of your other shit you got you got a lot of shit. That's a big pile. So people ask me on a regular basis, why do I exercise the way I do? I'm 59. And one half, I'm looking forward to my birthday in November, everybody that invited my birthday party, November 19, in court in New York.


Thank you, I'll be there.


Listening, I hope so I'm gonna be 60 I'm looking forward to 60 my wife turns 60 Next year, she refuses to have any more worth. And so I see the dichotomy and vision right there. But the reality is this, why do I exercise the way I do? Why do I eat the way I do? Why do I do what I do for two very, very important reasons. One is because I don't want to be a physical burden, a health burden upon my wife. So I do what I do now. So I'm not that burden. Second of all, is if my wife ever has a, by the way, this makes me out to be a lot nicer guy than I actually


know a lot, you're actually a very nice guys to have it. Yes, if she ever has a health concern, I'm healthy enough to care for her. And so I do that, because of those two massive reasons. Also, for all of our educators out there, who work your ass off for 40 years, for decades, and you say to yourself, I'm gonna do this, so I can enjoy my golden years, we need to set up you now for retirement, you have set up, for instance, in your T aircraft, or whatever it is, in your retirement programs, you set this up on a daily basis, weekly, monthly, yearly basis to take these monies from here, to make sure that there, you have to make sure you're there. Also, you have to make sure you're there also. And you do that, you do it by depositing small amounts of money every week, month or year, you do the same thing with your health, small deposits every day, leads to you being able to rock rock retirement, you can do one of two things, either rock retirement, or be the average American who lives five to seven years into retirement. And most of those years are highly medicated going to doctors offices, making sure you're filling prescriptions. It's your choice. I mean, it's really simple. And it's interesting to going back to gratitude, there's such a different way to approach some of these new choices you can make. Because if you are approaching it the same way, as you know, I'm putting this money away toward retirement, it's something that I'm super grateful for that I'm able to set this money aside for my future. Instead of oh, I have to eat this or oh, I have to go to the gym, I go to the chiropractor. And I get to because I my first priority. And I'm so grateful that I made this choice that will allow for longevity in retirement or, or whatever. And that energetic shifts and emotional shift is huge. It's a massive change. I don't exercise always because I think I'm gonna be a male model that time was fleeting, gone a long time. Here's the reality, if I don't exercise on a regular basis, if I don't follow my programs, if I don't follow my blueprint, first of all, mentally, emotionally, I'm not the same person. I'm not a happy go lucky person. I don't think as well, I don't think it's progressively as fast or Well, in the future. I don't move as well. I don't do all these things at the level I want to I can't enjoy playing my guitars as much as I want to or enjoying the music I have. I don't get to enjoy that. Because I haven't kept myself at a certain level. I do it because I get to enjoy life more. And there's three things that dear Lord, put your unlife through that's live laugh and love. Let's just do those three things at the best we can. Yeah. And you know, for me, and I'll share something else about my journey with this is, again, up until recently, when I would come to see you I would be in pain it would it would be because something's on fire, and it needs to be put out. And then I would stick with it for a little while and like No, I'm fine, totally fine, it's fine. And there would be this anger and resentment that I would have that like my back went out again, I used to feel such a sense of betrayal about my body. And really I did and then oh, it gets better because it was this negative feedback loop because not only was I angry my body for betraying me, but then I was angry at myself for getting the point where it wanted to be training and it was just angry about it. So even my intentions of going to get the help that I needed was full of this negative charged emotion. But now really, it's been tremendous that I go with a sense of self love and gratitude that again, I'm going to get the help that I need and it's up


work that I need, because I love myself enough to prioritize it and make it my number one priority. So I have to tell you that you would come in and talk about your back as if it was a third person in another room and you'd be like, my flicking back was this. It's like is attached to you, you it's right there. You know you do it. You're like, yeah, my back was it's like, it's right there. Yes. Oh, I know. Because if it wasn't a part of me that I could be respond to me for it. Right. I mean, that's really what it was. It was Oh, my back betrayed me again. It's like no, Jen, get with it. Pass you curse.


And you know that really? It didn't sustain it was his ridiculous looking back at it, you know?


It means No, I didn't prioritize myself enough to want it to be a part of me. I was so angry. There was just this beautiful moment. Again recently that changed everything. And it really does start with having these really important conversations and understanding again, that you are your first priority should be it's not that you're gonna love anyone else less is that you're allowed to love yourself more


than people think it's a zero sum game where if I love myself more on Dolly, I'm taking love away from someone else. And it's just, you're allowed to frickin be awesome. In my book, on page 72. It says it is knowing that it is acceptable to be magnificent and at least one thing in life. We downplay how great we can be. We downplay our own health and how smart we are how beautiful we are. We all have this little bit of genius in us and we shouldn't be allowed to let that just shine. We downplay it because once again, someone else it's like Cheese Louise people, let's just you know, LeBron James is able to shoot a frickin basketball really? Well. I mean, is he going to cure cancer with ads? You're going to help? See, frustrations don't always shoot the frickin basketball. Well, he does a very, very well, he doesn't no one ever asked him by the way. He only by the way, your LSAT scores were pretty low there, LeBron, maybe you should know, man, you know, it's we all have our level of genius, which allow that to shine 100%. So going back to what you said before, in those 30 minutes a day that you described, what can people do in those 30 minutes that can move the needle forward and make a difference? The simplest thing you should do. And by the way I do. One of my longevity lives I'm doing, we talked about motion is that the vast majority, and they looked at the number was today that 49% of women have not done any exertive exercise over the last year. So let's say 50% of women haven't done vigorous exercise over the last year. This is a big problem. Because Hello tidal wave, it's common. The same thing with kids in schools, I get scared that we have taught kids to exercise two or three times a week. And it's difficult to teach an adult to do the same thing when it's been ingrained to you for 12 years not to do that. But when we get into moving, so there's five aspects we talk about. One is cardio, two is power. Three is flexibility. Bounce. And then posture. Posture is the simplest one of them. Cardio, the number they look at is 30 minutes a day have some kind of motion. But if you do exercise, weightlifting of some kind, it can be body weightlifting, it can be soup cans in a plastic grocery bag, it can be bands, doesn't matter what it is, your body doesn't know the difference. You add all those in and you do it consistently hard for 30 minutes along with a bounce. If you do bounce stuff, some of the bounce stuff that I see people do, it's hard. And then you're breaking a sweat doing the stuff. Great. magic numbers. 30 can do more awesome, more intense. Awesome. Now how to do you can find programs on YouTube, left and right, that can easily do it. Everything still available. It's so accessible, so accessible, and the vast majority of it the magic price is usually at no charge, or fundamentals of starting, there's usually a little fee, then you can go on. I mean, I've had personal trainers and numbers of times, they're more expensive. Once again, people have insight into way I move, stand and do things. It's just like, I did not know that. Yeah. Even I've been going to the gym now twice a week, and I actually asked a trainer to join me. And she told me some good tips and things like that, but just having someone there to be like, yeah, Jen. Yeah, I remember that. Yes, it just that was worth the money every once in a while and investing in yourself with time with intention with money, the return on those investments are far greater than anything else you could possibly do. And changing that mindset, I think is the most important thing to actually making this transformational change you're talking about there. The tragic numbers are that 70% of people who start, for instance, January 1, stop exercising by March 1. Well, what changed? Did the location of the gym change? Now? The weather's probably even better than it wasn't January. What's changed


It was your mindset that changed from January 1 to march 1, your mindset change. And so the same thing as you're gonna get your Masters in some kind of program, and you ask someone, how long is it gonna take, and I'll tell you, it's gonna take two to three years. Okay, get a master's in, you get a master's in you from now on your matches and your physical health do that the small amount of time, energy and money you put into it is quadrupled. It's 10x. By time, I mean, it's not even close. Yeah, it's true, you know, intentions are great. And inspiration is great. But integration is so much more important. And once the magic of inspiration fades, you need something that's going to sustain you and keep you going when you lose that initial love affair that you had with this idea. And that's really what's gonna keep you going. I love that analogy, again, about getting a master's degree, just know, this is how long it's gonna take and use it, okay, you just signed up, you do the work. And at the end of it, or you go even though it sucks, and you're halfway there you going like, I'm this is just terrible. I know what I'm even doing here. So the three words we use here is PDC, plan, discipline and consistency. You have to have a plan, you have to have a plan, you have to have a plan, I block out time on my phone to go to the gym. That's a non negotiable time, the discipline is taking that and putting that into a physical action, that consistency is making sure I do that, I can do that. I do that. And I follow through follow through follow through. Once you start doing the plan to the discipline, the consistencies. It becomes part of you to say if you didn't learn how to play the guitar in one day, and the first time you played it, same as everybody else, same as I did is like, I did not know my hands or even attached to my body. And it's this the most uncoordinated thing, then when you start doing it, it's magical. Same thing happens. Yeah, no, you're absolutely right. So you have this amazing program called Empire longevity. And I'd love for you to talk about it just a little bit, because I think the work that you're doing inside of that container is so interesting and focused really on this idea of holistic health even greater than some of the other folks who are doing similar work as you this is something that's special, your special sauce. Absolutely. It's a part of longevity. It started really after my mom died. Last couple months in my mom's life, she suffered with a disease called idiopathic pulmonary fibrosis, idiopathic, we don't know why pulmonary lung fibrosis scar tissue, the inside of her lungs returned to a scar tissue. And it's a typical two year process in which you watch someone slowly suffocate. And it sucks at five different ways. My mom was someone who taught me independence, who taught me that if everybody wants to go to the movies, you don't want to go to you know, go on. If you want to go the movies, no one's wants to go, then you go, you just go, which has led me to being a chiropractor that led me my many, many things. I watched her. And she asked me to walk from our kitchen to her chair, which was 10 steps, she had a stopped three times on our way there, because she had run out of breath three times. And by the time she got to her chair, she was gasping for breath, something you and I grew up and we'd come back and we don't even think about it. And she was gasping for breath. And while she's there, she says to me six words. And they are tattooed on my heart and just inscribed in my skull. And it is without your health, you have nothing. Without your health, you have nothing. And I couldn't realize what those words meant to me because I'm watching my mom slowly die. She was gone within a couple months after that. That's 2005 and 2013. I wrote my book, but then I decided I need to step up my game and my participation in the lives of people I know other people around the world. And so we started Empire longevity. And the focus is this is that if we look at the events of the last couple of years, the statistics are that 93% of the people who have either died with or have COVID are over the age of 54 93% of the people. And you start looking and you go like what did they do wrong? This whole generation of people? What did they do wrong? Answer is they didn't do anything wrong, is our healthcare system has no plan for you past the age of it's really paid about 3540. Now, they really have no plan for you. And so since they don't have a plan, we need to come up with a plan. And so we need to look at your mental emotional, we talked about the mental emotional aspect of you. We talked about the motion. We talked about the thoughts of rocket fuel, we don't talk about dialogue about rocket fuel. And we talked about that optimized nervous system. So part of the pyramid of health we talked about, but we need to integrate the longevity of music which you came in spoke on when you talk about the longevity of how is a finances of your relationships of pets. Because all these things are all tied together and they're all tied together this little beacon inside of this little light that's that's you, that's you. It's not about you getting a better core. It's not about you learn how to cook better. It's not about you being able to it's about all of this we do this all because we want you to enjoy, not your next decades.


But your next best decades. So we start laying a groundwork of how healthy you can be, we show you the fundamental aspects of that. And then start bringing in the teachers, the leaders who then promote you push you and kick you in the ass along the way. So here's the reality, I want you to be the coolest grandmother there ever was on earth, not just the coolest mom, but the coolest grandmother ever was. And to do that, we have to have you be as healthy as possible for as long as possible. And there's two grandparents in your future, the one that at your child's wedding, who's in the back, who is on that chair, with the oxygen up to their nose, and who can barely clap their hands while your child is having their first dance, or you can be the grandmother was up there dancing, gone.


That's my kid, that's my kid, you have opportunity to be one of those, I can tell you what our healthcare system is pushing you towards, it's not the one you want. And so since they're not able to do that, we have to stand up and start showing you how to do that. So briefly, and this is going to be in the program notes too. So it would love for you to just give the listeners a way to know more about you and your work. So if they want to find you, how do they do that? Because first of all, my name is Otto Ott, Oh, please don't screw that up. If you screw it up, we've got much, much bigger problems than anything.


out of it, Empire longevity.com Always feel free to email me always feel free, I guarantee I'll respond back within 24 hours. Second of all is this it's Empire longevity.com. It's one word, if you don't put it one word and just try to find it separately, you'll I don't know where you'll end up. Empire longevity.com. So we have a public facing page, which is you'll see a lot of our stuff there. We also have a membership page. And you'll see up on top there it says become a member, that's $19 a month, whatever it is, I'm not selling that that I'm just telling you let you know what it is. And in that we have a lot more of our interviews, much more of our deeper information. We send out weekly email, video, rent paper from me every week. And it's because once again, we need to start pushing that train over there just a little bit. Because we know what the track you're on. And 54% over the age of 54 93% of people, either with or because of COVID is just massively unacceptable. I mean, I would say some other words along with that. But I want to keep it clean for you. But it's just starkly starkly dangerous that we follow the same path. And coming up in September, we have our next symposium and we get together for a day and we bring those leaders in one of them we have talking about it'll be the longevity of food and growing your vegetables next, and you look at that and go like, what are people doing? Like? Well, here we go. It's neat stuff. And I love this because I get to meet those people also. And I sit down with them. I talk with them, just like Jen is doing here. It's I get to talk to him, I get to ask them the questions at night, the only time I go like son of a bitch, I do not know that. It's this new stuff. That's awesome. One of the things that I really admire about you is that your tail wags unabashedly all the time.


You were just so excited about your mission in this lifetime. And that is something that I've always admired about you. And it is so clear that your decisions about your own personal decisions, your professional decisions, you know, they are also aligned to that. And it's super cool to have seen the evolution of empire longevity, as I've known you. And I'm really excited to see where it goes and all of the people that it helps and really invite them to wake up to their own well being. And it's a gift that you're giving just a gift for me to watch. Thank you. Yes. So our last question that I asked everybody is last questions, everybody


that's watching, ask questions in your experience and what you've seen and what you've observed. And knowing that this particular podcast is really geared towards educators and school leaders. What is your dream for the future of education, the future of education is a system in which we have to have a basis of where kids can learn from, and then allow them to take those talents that they have and allow those talents to be as to be manifested at the best I can. Once again LeBron James, no one ever asked LeBron James about his physics scores. And some kids are put into programs in which their brains don't work that way. I look at after my parents passed, I looked at some my report cards from elementary school. And all of them said Otto has a problem paying attention in class. And he talks with his neighbors a lot. It's like wow, I had no idea I had ADHD when I was five or six years old or wherever it was and you know, that was happening all the time. And


For me, it was because honestly, I wasn't pushed in school, I wasn't allowed to be pushed in school, I was never the sharp I'm not the sharpest tool in the shed, I'm not the cat of the sharpest Claws by any means. I'm a grinder when it comes to education, which means you're gonna get higher scores on me, I'll get there, but I'm not gonna be the first day is that some kids need to are gonna need to learn differently, and allow their talents to be expressed as much as possible. And the toughest part in education is, that means we have to open up the doors as to how we're gonna be able to where we're gonna allow kids to go with their own education, and know that it's just a manifestation is so, so broad, but I'm a guy who's had nine years of postgraduate education, and I don't think college is right for everybody. And so, yeah, and it's question I think, is also so interesting. For me and my perspective. You know, my definition of an educator in my world is really anyone who works with kids in any capacity. And absolutely getting your perspective on that was just great. So thank you for everything. This has been tremendous. This is the Gen show, starring Jim.


My favorite channel.


This one, it's just it's always a joy. And I'm grateful for your time and your talents. And thank you for sharing them with me and everyone else today. As we say here, always and always, always, is there more. Oh,


always. It always


sounds like Phil Collins. always and always. Really. Yeah. You know, I have no Phil Collins music. You know what it is? It's my kids watch. That's that's what it is.


I haven't had no kids.


Or it's Yeah, well, Colin soundtrack has been played frequently in my house over the years. Anyway,


I digress. Thanks again. And I'm hoping to have you back another time to even go further and do some more deep dives. In the meantime, thank you for listening and catch you next time. Thank you so much on the Gen show. Incredible, right. Together, we can revolutionize the face of education. It's all possible. And it's all here for you right now. Let's keep the conversation going and empowered educator faculty room on Facebook.

How has your journey into education changed over time?

More importantly, how has this path changed YOU as a person and an educator?

Do you feel safe being vulnerable enough to reflect upon and express the truth of your experience?

As an educator, you don’t always feel as if you have the time to process your emotions, and oftentimes you push it down and just keep on moving. But, when you start to open up and tell your stories, not only do you heal yourself- but you create a safe space for others to share theirs.

Welcome to episode 7 of Take Notes with Jen Rafferty! In this episode, I’m speaking with distinguished teacher, multidisciplinary theater artist, and educational consultant, Ayesis Clay.

She has flawlessly combined her extensive background in theater and education and founded Sculpted Clay Productions, LLC, where she uses keynote arts-infused residencies and professional development workshops to help schools create trauma-sensitive spaces that are focused on social-emotional wellness, and creativity for both teachers and students.

Ayesis discusses the importance of giving yourself permission to play, and how to deal with the compassion fatigue, and teacher burnout many educators face.

Today is all about re-energizing and reconnecting you with your “why” through art and vulnerability.

In its essence, this conversation is an illustration of the remarkable journey that happens when you allow yourself to heal and move through the process of becoming.

Stay empowered,

Jen


Let’s keep the conversation going! Find me at:

Click here to learn all the ways you can work with me:
 Jen Rafferty | Instagram, YouTube, Facebook | Links
Instagram: @jenrafferty_
FaceBook: Empowered Educator Faculty Room

About Ayesis Clay:

Ayesis Clay is a distinguished teacher, multidisciplinary theater artist, and educational consultant. She is a Featured Speaker and facilitator for the National Educational Theater Association and for SMART Technologies Teacher Summer Reboot Conference. She has developed curricula for the Maryland Department of Juvenile Services, Prince George’s County Public Schools, as well as several educational theater companies across the nation.

Combining her extensive background in theater and education, Ayesis founded Sculpted Clay Productions LLC, where she uses keynotes, arts-infused residencies, and professional development workshops to help schools create trauma-sensitive spaces that are focused on social-emotional wellness and creativity for both teachers and students. She continues to strive for an increased spotlight on teacher mental wellness by inspiring deeper conversations around creativity and humanity in education, as well as complex and important topics like compassion fatigue and burnout.


Connect with Ayesis here:

Instagram: @sculptedclay

Facebook: Ayesis Clay

TikTok: @sculpted_clay

LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/ayesisclay/

Website: www.sculptedclayproductions.com

TRANSCRIPT: 
Creating trauma informed spaces can seem like a big undertaking for schools. For some, it can feel heavy and challenging because a part of doing this well involves a lot of reflection from the adults in schools. Well, enter ISIS clay, who explains that your story is a way to own your own healing. By stepping outside of your experiences and looking at them objectively. She drives home the idea that the most generous thing we can do for our students is take care of ourselves. And ISIS reminds us that while personal reflection and healing is essential, even life saving, it can also be creative and fun. Get ready for this excellent conversation with ISIS. And if you're ready to be your best self, grab your spot in thrive. This five week course will give you the tools to shift your paradigm of success and create the pathway to live your best life, which is how we show up as our best selves both in and out of the classroom, it's time to decide that you want to do more than just survive and get through the day. It's time to thrive. Registration is now open. So sign up at empowered educator.com/thrive. Remember all the passion and vision you had when you first went into teaching. Feeling like building young minds and creating community through your work would make a lasting impact on this world? Well, those days may feel like they're behind you now because you're exhausted, stressed and overwhelmed and frustrated. But I'm here to tell you it doesn't have to be like this. In fact, the love of teaching never really went away. But it absolutely needs transformation. Welcome to The Take notes Podcast. I'm Jen Rafferty, former music teacher, mom of two and certified emotional intelligence practitioner, and I'm here to light the way for you. In order to create a generational change for our kids. We need to shift the paradigm away from the perpetual stress and overwhelm and into a life of joy, and fulfillment. This is education 2.0, where you become the priority, shift how you live your life, and how you show up both at work, and at home. So take a sip of steamy morning coffee and grab your notebook. It's time to take notes. Hello and welcome back to take notes. I am so excited to introduce the next guest today. She and I met a little while ago actually through all of the social medias. And I was a huge fan of her work and we had the pleasure of just chatting and getting to know each other and when I started Season Two I couldn't wait to have her on and have a conversation that all of you can benefit from too. So I says clay is here and she is a distinguished teacher, a multidisciplinary theatre artist and an educational consultant. She is a featured speaker and facilitator for the National Education Theatre Association and for smart technologies teacher summer reboot conference. She has developed a curricula for the Maryland Department of Juvenile Services Prince George's County Public Schools as well as several educational theatre companies across the nation. Combining her extensive background in theatre and education, ISIS founded sculpted clay productions LLC, where she uses keynotes arts infused residencies and professional development workshops to help schools create trauma sensitive spaces that are focused on social emotional wellness and creativity for both teachers and students. Hello. Hi, I am so excited that you're here. Thank you so much for joining me.


Oh, thank you for having me. Jim. I'm excited to sit down and talk to you as well. It's been a second


it has I kept my eye on you. I see what you are busy and I'm just loving everything that I'm seeing and that you're putting out in the world because, for me also as a musician, as growing up as a theatre kid. It's so cool to see the social emotional work, being married to arts, especially when too often Arts is kind of pushed aside as a nice to have where when you come about it, it is a necessity. necessity. Yes. Must have. Yes. It's more than just social emotional learning. And it's more than just arts. It is together always. And that's really how we elevate our understanding of both and our own human creativity.


You got it, Jim, that is it in a tiny nutshell. Actually. That is it. Absolutely. My work always focuses on the arts and infuses the arts and everything that I do whether it's a professional development for teachers, whether it's a residency for students with as a workshop, one law I mean, it always has an element of the arts and element of creativity in it. And just like you said, so many people look at the arts as just art or just that thing. And it can be. But when we're talking about arts in school, we're talking about so much more, so much more. And all these things, all this social and emotional learning, is infused inherently in the arts. And I think it's just now that some people are coming around and understanding the importance of it, and how it does integrate so seamlessly, and the things that we are trying to shore up in our students and in ourselves. So


yeah, and making it explicit, because I think often happens. And I know I can talk to this as a former music teacher in the public schools. As soon as the social emotional learning thing comes right away. Oh, yeah, we do that already. Well, it's already but no, right? Yes. And there is so much more that is possible. And a lot of that comes from going within yourself as a teacher. That's a huge part of your work. So I would love for you to because we can go on off right there and just continue. Your story is so beautiful. And I would love for you to share with our listeners, how you got to where you are and how sculpted clay came to be. Because that is fascinating to me. Yeah, so


I was a theater major in college and had every bit of an understanding that that's what I was going to be I was going to be an actress. And that's it. However, I started a family and moved to the Washington DC area. And I needed a job that supported my family in a way that I was a new actress, so it wasn't really supporting it in a way that I needed. And so I started teaching with the Maryland Department of Juvenile Services, there was a the Maryland Department of Juvenile Justice is what it was called back then. And I went in kicking and screaming, I did not want to teach, because I saw it as a trap, honestly, at the time. And it took I know, maybe a week, maybe two before I fell in love before I just fell in love with teaching. But more importantly, with connecting with young people. I was at the Maryland Department of Juvenile Services for about two and a half years. And as you can imagine, that is an organization where the young people are dealing with heavy amounts of trauma, and V, you know, some of the worst times of their lives, you know, of their young lives. And I wasn't given support to deal with that. I was a theater teacher, I was very empathetic, I had a magic power for connecting with young people. But I did not have the tools to make sure that I was well enough to continue helping those young people. And so I left there, unfortunately. And then I went to public school. And I was thinking yay, no more rough home lives no more of the things that I had to deal with and the things that I had to mentor young people through and the Department of Juvenile Justice. Well, if you've ever taught in public school, you know how ridiculous that sounds. Because whether you are teaching in an urban environment, whether you are teaching in a rural environment, students deal with trauma, families deal with trauma. And so I brought all of that baggage and unresolved and unhealed things that I had dealt with with the state of Maryland, and brought it into the public school and stayed there for many, many years. I left in year 15. And unfortunately, during that time, I lost a couple of students, they passed away. And along with being that teacher, that strong teacher that the students come to to get mentorship from that colleagues come to I was dealing with grief. And I did not know how to fix that and not know what to do with that when a student passes away or there's a loss in the school system, whether it's a teacher or anyone in the school system. There's always that canned response that comes over the intercom, right? That there'll be Grief counselors here, should you need them to any student or staff needs them. And students are getting the latitude and the time someone's in your class and they're having a hard time then you can send them out and they can go see someone teachers do not have that ability. And so a lot of times we push it down, we push all that down and just keep on moving, keep on moving. And I couldn't do that anymore. I had done it to the point of breaking. And so I ended up leaving, although I've loved love teaching theater, I loved what I call my unicorns, those are my students. I realized that I was breaking inside. And so I left thinking okay, you know what, I'm gonna be an actress. That's it. I'm gonna go, now's my time, I'm going to be an actress. And one of my very good friends had a theatre company at the time. And we had lunch. And she was like, Okay, so what's next? What are you gonna do? Oh my God, I don't know audition for something. It's just like, well, I have this opportunity. If you want to write something you can write and perform. I'll give you all the information. Cool. Well, the next week, she told me it was at the Kennedy Center here in Washington, DC, it was a performance for the Kennedy Center. And so I wrote a solo show about my journey in and through education, dealing with what I didn't know at the time was compassion, fatigue, and burnout. And that's what I did. I took my art form and created some healing for myself, and in the process healing and transformation for other teachers.


Wow, it is beautiful. And isn't it interesting, looking back? How could you have ever anticipated that you're creating in hearts hardship, and struggle turned into something like this, I could cry, it's not even my story. And I am here, it is so remarkable to hear that journey. And to see the healing that happens, as you move through the process of becoming, yeah,


it hits me hard. The solo show is now a part of a professional development, that I have been absolutely blessed to tour around the country to many different schools and school systems. And every time that I do it, it hits me in the gut, you would think that after performing it all these times that it would be, I don't know, kind of numb, you know, what's gonna come up, you know, how it's gonna play out. But I am very explicit about some of the losses that we experienced as teachers. I'm also very explicit about some of the joys a lot of the joys that we have. And every time that I perform it, I go through this roller coaster, again, and it takes me a second afterwards to kind of set recenter myself and go forward. But I say this all the time, and writing this, this play this, it was about me, you know, it was about my healing, it was about my students and telling their stories. But in sharing it, I found this empowerment. And I found this sense of camaraderie with teachers, every time I perform it, teachers come up and say, Oh, my gosh, you just told my story. And in a lot of ways, that makes me sad. But then I know that I'm gonna give them this professional development and the supports that I needed at the time, you know, so that we can begin to heal, and they can stay in the classroom if they choose to do so.


And I think that's something that's really important. And something I value so much too, is that community building through sharing stories? Yes, that's I think, oftentimes, we have shame about our emotions connected to our stories, or self judgment about the emotions that we feel about our past. And we don't feel comfortable being vulnerable in certain spaces and places because it doesn't feel safe. However, when you create safety, or you find spaces where it is safe, and you share your story, what starts to happen is that not only do you heal yourself, but as you just said, you make it safe for other people than to share their stories.


Absolutely. And that's one of the main reasons why I share it in the professional development. There are a couple of reasons. One, because I know me personally, I was tired of sitting in PDS that did not get me.


You're unhappy with your professional development experiences when you were?


Right, right, right. And I wanted something that would capture them immediately. But also something that, like you said, you said that word safety that would allow them to begin looking at their journeys and not numbers, you know, not in data. But literally, how has this journey? Or How has my journey and education changed me? And how has it changed? The young people and the adults that I come across daily? What has my journey done? I know this teaching in this pandemic has created Well, you know what, it's not just the pandemics fault. Let me be very clear about that. Education was breaking and tearing at the seams even before the pandemic, and a lot of times, guilt is kind of thrown on teachers and like, used as a battering ram as a carrot even to keep going. I know me personally for many years, I've said, I can't leave if I leave then what about the kids? What about the students who will make sure that they are okay? And so by strapping them on my back, it made me feel like I need to push all this away. I need to push my story down. I need to not focus on that. I need to focus on the ones and the twos the data that's it, get students where they A to B without focusing on me. And we see what happened, I ended up having to leave because of all the other things. So by sharing the story, and empowering others to tell their stories, we get to a point where we don't just see the negatives, you know, we don't just see the frayed edges of education, which are so easy to see. Well, let's not say frayed edges, the cracks, huge, gaping really light. Right?


Yeah, there are cracks are huge, huge cracks,


or craters in education right now. And it's so easy to see that and focus just on that. But when we actually take a step back and look at our journeys, we see the beauty we see the whys, we reconnect with why we started teaching in the first place, but more importantly, why we continue to teach.


Yeah, we you and I have had that conversation too about connecting to your why. And what I think is important to just talk from and hear it and pause here is that sometimes that becomes a little bit faster dies as a way to just say, well remember your why guys because but that's still I think, is the same thing as guilt carrot, which I think it says there's a foul tasting carrot, I'm imagining that guilt care,


it's a little bit grainy and wishing.


It was a disgusting carrot. But it's there. And it's so prevalent in a lot of the way that we think about what we're supposed to do, right. And now we're supposed to show up for our kids. But what we talk about in the work that we do is about embodying something greater than just what's in front of you, it's activating your why it's not just remember it connecting, finding that inspiration, which then leads to an integrative practice of actions of language of thoughts and how we show up. And it's so important to differentiate those two things.


Absolutely. 1,000%. You hit it on the head, because before it was do it for the kids, that was the phrase do it for the students do it for the kids. And then it became remember your why, you know, and it's like, it's the same thing. You're saying the same thing. But you're absolutely right. What does that look like when we are challenging educators to get rid of that negative carrot that's been kind of force fed to us for years and years and years and has become a part of our psyche? How can we get that thought out of place and really re energize and become the teacher that we want to become, you know, no one wants to be a bad teacher, there's no one in you know, in the teaching profession who wants to be a bad teacher, it's just about how to do that. And the way that I go through is with reigniting creativity. And not just about the arts. It's not just about


using yeah, that's, that's what I want to talk about, too, is that you know, how you use your tools and your experience with theater, with writing with creative arts, to get people there. How do they get there? Yeah.


So it's funny when I first started out, and even now, I've focused a lot on Play on adult play, there's this thing that happens is phenomena that happens to a lot of people. The age is different for different people. But there's a point that you hit, and you think, Okay, I'm too old for play. And we forget how important it is, or our mental wellness, or our physical wellness, or our social wellness. And so I started there, I started there, so not necessarily with the word creativity, but with clay. Okay, so what types of things that you like to do when you were younger? How did you like to play, because that's very telling on the type of person that you are, you know, someone who likes to play imaginative games, like, who liked to play school, and they always wanted to be the teacher, or they always wanted to be the principal, or they always wanted to be the parent versus the person who loved puzzles, like putting those puzzles together. Or like me, I was the nerd in school that love the word finds, you know, if teachers give us word finds, it was jackpot day for me. And so what did you like to play? Like, how did you like to play? And how can we start integrating little by little that back into your life?


Yeah. And also just pause there for a second too, because play is so important. And we don't talk about it enough. We don't we don't put value on it. After kindergarten and like play centers. It's we are serious, and it is work and pressure. And so even exploring this thought for people can be uncomfortable. And I'm wondering someone listening to this right now, and is thinking to themselves, that sounds like a really good idea, but I'm not totally sure how I would even start to get there. What would you tell them like Where could they start even just giving themselves permission to do this little piece. And that's


the thing that is it giving themselves permission. So, a lot of times we have these mindsets around our time, right? That we don't have time for it, you know, that's lovely. But I don't have time for play. When am I going to do that? And that's a misconception, because it's what you choose your time is what you choose. And I always start with my clients and my teachers with 10 minutes. Or if you can't pay if 10 minutes seems like daunting five minutes, what can you do in five minutes? What can you do? If you are a physical player? You know, if you like to do things, what can you do on your walk into the school building, or you walk out of the school building? Kick a rock? Or what about if there's a sidewalk, or even close to your car that you did a little hopscotch board. Now, if you did a hopscotch board, how many people can really like walked past the hopscotch board. So nine times out of 10, you're gonna have some of your students use it too, which is helpful for them as well. But just in that mindset of putting little itty bitty things in your day, tiny, little things, choosing you for five minutes, what can you do to choose you for five minutes. And when we say five minutes, that makes it seem like nothing at all, but five minutes starts to add up. And honestly, five minutes starts to get a little longer. But when you invest yourself in the time you realize that, oh, it's been 10 minutes, great. I played for 10 minutes today. So it starts with that, like you said, giving yourself permission on time and realizing that you can choose five minutes, you can choose 10 minutes, you can choose an hour out of your day, but I know an hour can sound daunting. So we start small.


Yeah, that's totally doable. And again, like you said, share it because your kids are people too. Yes. And they got into play also if they're older than five years old. So to not just model it, but encourage everybody.


Exactly, exactly. And then one of the things that that does when you when our students and our children, you know, if your parent sees us playing, they see us even more authentically, a lot of times we have when our teacher mask, or our parent mask, or adult masks, you know, adults don't do that. But when we allow ourselves to just be and give ourselves over to play, and we bring them into the world with it. The authenticity creates a connection that all teachers really are looking for with our students, because we know students learn better when they're connected, and they feel a sense of community with their teacher in their classes.


Absolutely. And you're totally regulated, because you're happy you've just been playing the while. So what's next, then, you know, how do you then make the transition from play to creativity for the purposes of mental well being? Yeah,


so one of the way that I go into this, my path, and some mental wellness for educators is through storytelling. I encourage them to explore whatever creativity, whatever creative means that feels authentic to them. And in my program, that offer teachers, we also do a little bit of visual art, we incorporate music, we don't play the music, but creating playlists that speaks to our soul. That's something really easy that can you can do while you're working. But finding ways to put whatever art form inspires you. But like I said, my way in is through storytelling. Like I was saying earlier, looking at your story, looking at your journey, your journey with your students, and using that as a mental wellness tool. Using that as a way to snap out of sometimes we can get very negative. Again, like I said before, it's so easy. It's easy to fall down that well. But that's not helpful. And so I walk teachers through the journey of writing their own memoirs, many memoirs, and we look at it through poetry. We look at it through the narrative form, just like a memoir. We look at it through performance art, of course, because I'm a theater geek. And so we look at writing monologues and scenes and cleaning those out and using that as a means of okay, stepping outside of my experiences. And looking at it. I coached my teachers all the time, that it's a difference telling your story from inside of it versus on top of it. And when we tell our stories from inside of it, that's that negativity because we can't see the whole of it. We just see this wall of negativity that's coming towards it. But when we're able to get on top of it, and the way we do that is by giving ourselves permission to play by giving ourselves permission to spend time for ourselves. 510 20 minutes Mindfulness is a big thing and what I teach so as well,


yes, Sign me up. Yes, all of that, yes. Because a lot of the work that I am doing for myself personally is a lot of that introspective work, you know, coming out and being objective and being this non judgmental observer kind of outside yourself, because that's where you get the perspective, but then to, on top of that have that creativity and that art, and that writing just adds a whole nother layer of richness and understanding and healing, that I imagine is extremely powerful for everybody who takes your classes it does.


There's also something, you know, a barrier that comes up with a lot of people. And that's this perfectionism. And so the art that we do is meant to be messy. And a lot of people have trouble with that in the first like, week or two that they work with me they're like, Okay, so what is it supposed to look like in the end? I don't know. Neither do you. That's not your business. You know, your business right now is just to write what's on your heart or draw what's on your heart, or create whatever song is calling to you putting that on your list? It's not about I know that I am going to draw a house with the Sun and the Sun has to it's not about that. Which is why I use entangling. Have you ever heard of that? No. Tell me more. Yes, entangling. It's a mindfulness doodling exercise. Honestly, it's something that I have. I started my last year in school as I was teaching and sharing it with my seniors. And it's amazing. So there is no outcome, just like doodling when you're doodling on the paper, you there's no outcome to that you're just going as you go, there are certain strokes, I think there's like, I won't say how many there are. But there are certain strokes that you can use a straight line or wiggle line or curve, that kind of deal. And then you just put it all together as it comes to you. And there's no right or wrong with it. It's very freeing. And so it gives you an opportunity to engage in artistic work without that idea of what it should look like what I should be doing. And it allows you to really focus in on your intuition, which is what we want. Right? How


interesting though. So as educators, yes, there are certain metrics that we want our students to be able to reach, and at the same time, also have a responsibility to foster this other part of the mess, and the mistakes and the creative process that doesn't necessarily have an ending, because let's face it, at the end of the day, when we measure success of a student, I don't care how much we say holistic, holistic, holistic, the kid who gets on the honor roll, the kid who has all the A's. And even if you are in a school district, that has flipped a little bit of that paradigm, there is still a societal culture that is in the air that we breathe, that the kids pick up on an experience themselves, of reaching for the A getting on the honor roll, being the first kid leads the line, or you know, or whatever. And it's redefining success for us as teachers. And how then do we integrate that into our classes for our kids, because what you're doing is teacher centered, just like my work, but at the end of the day, it is really about the kids.


Absolutely. I think what you're saying, though, is a bigger issue than classroom base. You know, it's a cultural base. It's not even just a school base. It could be you know, system base, it could be the educational system base, it could be societal base, that idea of being the best what that looks like, and like you said, what success looks like? I do think as teachers, we can start finding little ways to challenge that norm, unnecessarily. I don't think we can change it, like next week or the school year.


Of course not right? When we start with ourselves


and challenging our own internal meter of perfection, you know, our own mean girl voice that always tells us the you know, we're either not good enough or what how is it supposed to be has to be perfect. When we start challenging that and finding ways to do so we can start putting little things like disentangling for warm up or cool down or whatever it is and classes. And then just subtly getting students to realize that there really are no mistakes, right? It's just an opportunity to learn and to try something different. And I think that would help so much so many people. I wrote a show when I was actually in school, it was based off of and when I was teaching, I keep saying in school, what I was teaching was based off of a journal that I found in my mom's house that I had written in high school, and it was so Little of angst, right? This teenage angst. And, and I was looking at my students, and I was like, wow, they're literally going through some of the same things that I was going through at 15, or 16, or whatever. And so I wrote the show and one of the characters, and the reason why I bring it up is this, this idea of pressure, none of the characters have, they don't say their names. So in the script is bookworm. And they deal with a huge amount of pressure, not peer pressure, but parental pressure, and societal pressure to be perfect, which leads them to making bad choices. You know, we think that it's the one who skips class, that's going to be making this bad choice with drugs and things like that. But it's actually this kid, because it's so much pressure to be perfect. So we have to look at that and how we are approaching that, as teachers, and how we are either encouraging that, or, like I was saying before, disrupt it, little by little,


right. And you're 100% Correct. When you say it starts with yourself, it's so cliche when we say, you know, be the change, but that's the only thing that you have, the ability to change is yourself. And it has to start there. And just kind of circling back to what we were talking about earlier, is when you start to shift and change and share. It paves the way for other people to shift and change and share. And I'm sure that's what you've been observing in the schools that you've been working with. Yeah, absolutely. So powerful. Oh, my gosh, I just continue to want to learn more, and just absorb all of the things that you're putting out into this world because it's just such beautiful growing and healing. And we need to do both. In order to continue to stay on the path of where we want to go. There has to be both and it doesn't have to be so serious all the time. It can be playful and joyful and exciting and beautiful.


I wouldn't even say it has to be not that, you know, it has to be if we're not finding the joy in educating children, that joy that we all had at one point, if we're not actively searching for that, then what are we doing? Yes. You know, we're making kids hate school, we're hating school. There is a joy there. And we just have to find what that spark is that we have to get back to that. It's a must.


Yes, it is not nice to have it is a must have. Yeah. So before we go, I need to ask big question here. What is your dream for the future of education?


My dream for the future of education would have to be that we find a way for teachers to feel supported, and able to turn that magic. I think teachers are magical beings. I really do. And it sounds so weird. And I've every time I say that, I get a look from people, but teachers are magical beings being able to take what you know, and impart it in many different ways to all these different students and then have your influence on their life reverberate. Is that a word? I think that's word. Yeah. You know, through time as magic. It's starting to get brown around the edges and get dough. And my hope for education is that we're able to reignite that magic. And reignite that joy. And not just ourselves. But our students.


Yes. More of that, please. So how can people get in touch with you? What's a way for them to reach out and know more about your work and potentially even work with you and find out more about how they can do that?


Yeah, absolutely. The easiest way is to follow me on social media. And you can follow me on Facebook or Instagram. And it's at sculpted clay all together at sculpted clay. Or if you like, you know what, I don't do social media, you can always send me an email, and it's at ISIS, a ye s is at sculpted clay, productions.com.


Awesome. And of course, all of that will be in the show notes. So you'll have all of that really easily at your disposal. Click away find out more about ISIS and the gorgeous work that she is doing. Thank you so much for your time today.


Thank you, Jen. Thank you. And thank you for the work that you are doing with educators and the positivity and the joy that you are putting out into the world. Thank you.


I received that. Thank you very much. And I am just honored that we got a chance to know each other and that I get to hang out with you occasionally because I did love learning from you and knowing you more so for those of you listening thank you so much for tuning in today. If you liked today's episode, don't forget to write a five star review and we will talk with you next time on take notes. Incredible right together we can revolutionize As the face of education it's all possible and it's all here for you right now let's keep the conversation going at empowered educator faculty room on Facebook

How do you determine when you “deserve” the things that bring you joy in life?

What kind of person do you have to be? How many steps do you have to take? And, how many things do you have to do to prove your worth?

What if I told you that you deserve rest and joy in your life simply because you exist?

There is no need to exchange burnout for deservedness. You can be everything you want to be, have a massive impact on the students and the communities you serve- AND take care of yourself at the same time.

Welcome to episode 6 of Take Notes with Jen Rafferty! In this episode, I’m speaking with sought after success mentor for visionary women leaders, Tracy Litt.

Tracy is a science and spirituality teacher, rapid transformational hypnotherapist (RTT TM), a best selling author, TEDx speaker, the founder of the LITT factor, and creator of Mind Magic. She is a powerhouse, and most importantly opens up the novel concept that we deserve nothing less than EVERYTHING we desire.

We are talking about the paradigm shift from seeking validation, to wholeness and worth being your birthright.

Today, you’re getting out of your own way and opening up your ability to receive unconditionally WITHOUT burnout.

The concepts we discuss in this episode are a gift to us all! Let's go make it happen!


Stay empowered,

Jen


Let’s keep the conversation going! Find me at:

Click here to learn all the ways you can work with me:
 Jen Rafferty | Instagram, YouTube, Facebook | Links
Instagram: @jenrafferty_
FaceBook: Empowered Educator Faculty Room

About Tracy Litt:
Tracy Litt is a sought-after success mentor for visionary women leaders that are navigating huge paradigm shifts and elevating into the next level of themselves, so they can seamlessly generate the next level of their impact, wealth, and holistic success.
Tracy is a science & spirituality teacher, rapid transformational hypnotherapist, best-selling author, and TEDx speaker.
She is the Founder of The Litt Factor, and creator of Mind Magic ®, a proven methodology that marries metacognition and spirituality, neuroscience and quantum law to expand and elevate more quickly.
Her work has served thousands of women across the globe and has been featured in Forbes, Entrepreneur, FastCompany, Thrive Global, Success 125 and Inc.com. Her book Worthy Human is a #1 best seller in Spiritual Growth and Mindset.

Can’t wait to connect with Tracy? Find her here:
The Litt Factor | Facebook
Instagram: @thelittfactor
Website: The Litt Factor | Personal Growth and Coaching Company

TRANSCRIPT: 
What your purpose, desire, mindset and quantum physics have in common? Well, on this next episode, Tracy let brings it all together and shares how understanding your inherent wholeness can open yourself up to realizing that you deserve everything you desire, simply because you are and nothing less. And when fear gets in the way, which it always does, because of our beautiful biology, we get to dance with it and navigate through it. And she walks us through how to change our definition of success. So we can truly be everything we want to be, and have a massive impact on the students and the communities we serve. Buckle your seatbelts, this episode is a trip. And if you're ready to be your best self, grab your spot in thrive. This five week course will give you the tools to shift your paradigm of success and create the pathway to live your best life, which is how we show up as our best selves. We're done with just surviving, it's time to thrive. Sign up now at empowered educator.com/thrive. Remember all the passion and vision you had when you first went into teaching. Feeling like building young minds and creating community through your work would make a lasting impact on this world? Well, those days may feel like they're behind you now because you're exhausted, stressed and overwhelmed and frustrated. But I'm here to tell you it doesn't have to be like this. In fact, the love of teaching never really went away. But it absolutely needs transformation. Welcome to The Take notes Podcast. I'm Jen Rafferty, former music teacher, mom of two and certified emotional intelligence practitioner, and I'm here to light the way for you. In order to create a generational change for our kids. We need to shift the paradigm away from the perpetual stress and overwhelm and into a life of joy and fulfillment. This is education two point o where you become the priority. Shift how you live your life, and how you show up both at work, and at home. So take a sip of steamy morning coffee, and grab your notebook. It's time to take notes. Hello, everyone. And welcome back to another fantastic episode of take notes. I cannot wait to get this conversation started because I am here with the amazing Tracy lit. And Tracy is a sought after success mentor for visionary women leaders that are navigating huge paradigm shifts and elevating into the next level of themselves. So they can seamlessly generate the next level of their impact wealth and holistic success. And she's a science and spirituality teacher rapid transformational hypnotherapist, a best selling author and a TEDx speaker, and is the founder of the lit factor and creator of mind magic, which is a proven methodology that marries metacognition and spirituality, neuroscience and quantum law to expand and elevate more quickly and her work has served 1000s of women across the globe. She has been featured in Forbes entrepreneur, Fast Company Thrive global success, 125 and inc.com. And her book worthy human is a number one bestseller in spiritual growth and mindset. And she is also one of my friends. And I'm so glad that I get to share her with all of you today. So thank you so much, Tracy for being here.


Thank you for having me. I love your face. And I'm so excited to serve your magnificent community.


Thank you. I love your face. And I am just excited to get to look at it for the next half an hour. So let's dive in. Because this work truly was a game changer for me in my world, and what I'm able to share with the educators that I work with, and I would love for you to explain what is my magic?


Yeah, it's always such a big question, right? Mind magic is an entirely new way of being leading and living. It is not a course it is not a program that you checkbox. It is you being able to step into your purpose as a spiritual being having a human experience and come into safe unconditionally loving community and do the healing and the growing and expanding that you deserve to do so that you can experience whatever your all is in life.


Yeah, that's it. And I want to touch on something that is really important in what you said because we're just gonna dive right in. Let's go. We only have half an hour's we're gonna dive right in. You use the word deserve. And that's something that I really want To expand on a lot because especially as teachers, for those teachers who are also women, for those teachers, who are also moms feeling as if you deserve more is sometimes an obstacle and getting that growth that you want. So how do we start? What does that mean? We deserve it.


So we've been raised in a world and a matrix that leads us to believe that we have to earn certain things that we have to earn our worth, that we have to earn our value that we have to earn our enoughness that we have to earn so that we then can validate that we deserve X, Y, Z, and that whole paradigm is twisted. And that whole paradigm is quite frankly, just wrong. Because at the core, your birthright is your wholeness is your inherent worth. And part and parcel to that your deserve unsee, which is a word we made up it lit factor land, right deserve and see, right? Your inherent capacity and ability to deserve simply because you are a beautiful being listening to this podcast right now. Right? So we can leave the game of, Do I deserve this? What kind of person do I have to be? Right? How many steps do I have to take? And how many things do I have to prove in order to deserve XYZ? And we can just literally just get rid of all of that. And open up to the concept, which is a new concept for 99.5% of us. I deserve nothing less than everything I desire, simply because I am.


period that opens up everything. Yes. Because


understand what we're literally interfering with when you're making your ability to receive things conditional on a fictitious fallacy of burning what you deserve. That doesn't even make sense. So then literally, your unconscious not to use the word blocking, right? But you're really putting yourself in your own way, right? We love that term. Like if I could just get on my own way if I could just get out of my own way. So when we open ourselves up to saying, wait a second, so I just deserve it. Because I'm a human. Uh huh. I'm worthy because I woke up to you know it. It's exciting. And then it becomes scary. Right? It's exciting because it's like, oh, shit, okay, now what? And then it's like, oh, 17 seconds later Hey, fear, how you doing now? What now? Everything. Now I have no more excuses and reasons and crutches to lean on as to why I'm not going after what I want and why I'm not getting what I want. Because inherent in who I am just the fact that I deserve it.


Yes. And so we can go so many places with that. And I want to hang on to fear or we're going to put a pin in that for a second. And I want to just break this down into just an example. Because it doesn't have to be so big. Sometimes when we think about our desires, we separate ourselves from saying, well, it's these really big, um, seemingly unattainable things, but weren't even just talking about deserving of feeling relaxed, deserving of feeling happy, deserving of being in a working environment where you feel safe and respected. Right? So can we just kind of talk through maybe one of those examples of what does it mean to just feel like you deserve those things?


Okay, so there's so many ways to go with this tale. For the sake of this entire moment in time, I want to ask every beautiful being listening to just jump on my train. Okay, you can doubt it later. You can question later. You can think the opposite later. You deserve it. That's it. Okay. So that's the lens through which we're coming here. When it comes to like you were saying just feeling better, like rest, right? We tend to think of you coming to do work on yourself, or you're going after your dreams and we think of big, bold things. We think climbing Machu Picchu, right? If that's something it's your vision, or, you know, speaking on a massive stage or being a best selling author, or maybe becoming the administrator of your school superintendent, whatever that big thing is, that's part of it. But to your point, it's actually the things that are applicable to your inner environment that are the most important. And it's also part and parcel to how eight outdated the paradigm of you have to earn it to deserve it is, is reconsidering what success actually looks like. Which we all need to do. Right really reconsider, like wait a minute, what if my measure of success was I deserve rest? I love resting. I love being at ease. I love being chilled. So maybe successes, the hours of my day and how I spend them feeling and the fact that you deserve to feel how you want to feel. You just are nothing less than everything you want. That's internal and external. It feels like I'm speaking Mandarin I know. Because if you're not like in on it feels like it's such a far cry from our society. It's such a far cry from the limited collective consciousness that we were raised in. But that's one of the reasons why we're here, you and I, individually and together doing our work in the world, to help everyone awaken and recognize like, whoa, whoa, whoa, there's a whole new way to live lead be teach, right? A whole new way. And it is our divine responsibility to get on the train of that whole new way. Because that's the only way that we are going to make the impact and the generational change that clearly our world is starving for, like, unless you're living under a rock under a bridge, you see what's happening here?


Yes, absolutely. And we all know this. And then we get stuck in but it's so big, I don't know how to make a difference. Well, this is how we do the inner work on ourselves. And I want to touch on this thing. First of all, you do just need to get on the you deserve a train. There's no easier way to do that, you just have to accept that that's the train that we all need to be on. Period. Right. And you know, when I first kind of got to know this idea of changing the definition of success, I was at your retreat powerhouse this past spring. And I remember sitting in my chair, seething Tracy, like I was hot, my face was red, I was sitting in my chair feeling so angry. Because not only was I personally a product of this outdated view of success, but as teachers and as educators, we are perpetuating this external idea of what success looks like, how many A's do we get? How many referrals did you get? How many checkmarks how many smiles? How many, I mean, we can just stickers right on the sticker chart. It's the world of the external Goldstar. Right? And we teach we explicitly teach that in schools. So here I was in this workshop with you where you were saying to me and you know, a room full of people. We need to change the definition of success in order for you to actually feel successful. And it blew my mind. Because here as educators, we are in a position to not only teach it, but to model that. So I was I was mad because I felt like I've been duped. I felt like I was duped. So can you talk a little bit more about that. Because to me, that was something that really started to change the way I thought about the work that I was doing in this


world. How did it change the way you thought about the work you were doing in this world?


Because that needed to be the priority now, for me? And for the messages that I would give through the work that I do?


Yes, yes, yes, it makes me emotional. And this is actually one of the reasons why I love what you're doing in the world, your work in the world, I have such a personal affinity for because teachers like I just makes me beautifully emotional teachers are have such an incredible position. You are in the most influential seat in the house. Right? Partly because of the way we were raised, right? Think about when we're little little people, coaches, listen to your coaches, listen to your doctor, when they walk in with a white coat, listen to your teacher, listen to your rabbi or your priest, right. So the position you sit in and all of you listening as educators and teachers, it's an imperative that you come inside and do the work of within, which is really what we're talking about. Right? Okay until the system wakes up and changes which is part and parcel to your mission with live zones so that there's so much you can do in your own ripple effect. There's so much you can do when you go within and do this work and shift your definition of success to leave behind what is an all externally driven definition, right? It's like fame, authority, amount of money, title hierarchy, that is the current ish collective consciousness perspective on success. And what I'm inviting everyone to look at is holistic success, which considers all parts of you mental, emotional, physical, environmental, spiritual, all of it and start to prioritize how you feel, how you see yourself, how you treat yourself, how safe you feel in your body, how connected you are your ability to allow yourself to be connected, all of these things. And this is the kicker. Who you be is Your biggest point of influence. So even if you're in an education environment, where your pay increase is dependent on how many kids scored XYZ on the last, ridiculous assessment tests that they give, you still have a huge opportunity, as the individual you are, to do the work of you to change the way you see the world, to raise your energetic frequency, to emit at a whole different vibration, to have an open heart to have healed the wounds that are blocking you from feeling how you want to feel. And to really understand what it means to lead and use your center of influence in a way that creates a ripple effect that you cannot possibly imagine, until you do it.


And that's the stuff that gets me too. I mean, this is it when we go within, not only are we doing all those things for the people around us, but as you've shared with me, and as I've experienced, the people I work with have experience to the people around them change to because they see another way to be oh my


god, like Yeah, like, let's take this super visual into your visual, right? So teacher classroom, let's say 20 kids in the class, right? The attentiveness, the outcomes, the measurable outcomes, the engagement, the social interaction of that classroom, literally, scientifically, must shift in accordance to the leader in training the energy in that classroom. So as the teacher, the educator, right, you are in training the energy Oh, and CO regulating in your nervous system, with everyone in that room. So you come in, you prioritize your nervous system regulation, your energetic state, you raise your level of mind, right? Now, all of a sudden, kids are a little calmer, or a little kinder to each other. So and so's, you know, grade went up on XYZ not because they did anything like sitting in cramming and you coming over them, like with authority, which is how we were taught, right, or saying you're not gonna get recess, and let's XYZ like it's over you guys, it's over, we have to stop doing all the things that were done to us. Right? Same thing, same result, this is, it's not rocket science. So we have to really, really change. And that's the fun thing about being the change. And that's what I really think like Auntie meant, like, be the change, like, you change, everything must change. And you don't have to do anything external. It's literally a byproduct of who you be


100%. And this idea in which is, the whole foundational principle of empowered educator is, the most generous thing you can do for your students is take care of yourself, because that's how you're going to have the impact that you want to make with the students and the communities you serve is by changing yourself, you have to make yourself the priority


now, which then cause you to move through and shift out of generations of influence that taught you the opposite of that, too. Because prioritizing self is definitely not something that we were encouraged to do. Especially if you are someone who identifies as being a woman, and you're a teacher that was super, super low on the things our great grandmother's grandmothers and mothers showed us. If anything, it was martyrdom, and that's what was admired, be exhausted, be burned out, and then have a reason to point out and go. It's because of this, which is also a complete abdication of your power. And that's not how we roll either. Right?


Yeah. 100%. But that paradigm that you just explained, that is what's happening in the teaching profession, right? We see these teachers revered as being selfless. And so what it means to be a successful good teacher is that and what we're trying to do in this world here, is to share the value of this new way. And explain that that old way is not only not helping, it's completely backwards.


Yes, well, it's backwards. It's not helping. It's unhelpful. It's unnecessary. It's unhealthy. And it's like, What other proof do you need? Hello. We're here right now in this moment in time, because of all of the choices that we've made based on what we knew, and it is no discount to all of the magnificent people that came before us. I have depth of gratitude and we know better now we know better now in burnout research. We know better now in neuroplasticity, we know better now, in the advancement of compassion. We know better now in Heart Math and what it means to be myths are an energy into the field, we are talking about measurable science backed information that tells us that shame and hustle and martyrdom and guilt and overworking is harmful, detrimental, and goes directly against the outcomes that we like. That's the funky thing about it is these ways of being disguised themselves as the way to be successful. So you keep doing them. And then once you like, just pause, and you go, Okay, I'm gonna come over here and do what you're doing for like, give us couple months, right? And then you have all this new evidence, you're like, Okay, I got it now, right? So be very aware, because our beliefs, our beliefs, right, and we become what we believe. And all the ways of being we will fight to the death note, like, come on, this is what you need. If I lived not that I'll be lazy, that I'll get anything done. It's like, whoa, not true at all right? So it's just very important. And that's really the place we all start with and that awareness, right, your awareness of yourself, you're noticing of how you feel when you're doing something, your level of burnout? Do you gain personal value when you're exhausted? Do you get a little tick mark internally where you're like, Yeah, I did all the things. I bet all the plates look like. And I can say this, so like, with such playfulness, because I was there. I'm the proof. I'm the first piece of proof before all of you beautiful women, right? I was like a judgmental walk Raizy controlling, super attached, externally driven person, look at you know, give me now


one of the things that prevents us from getting there and acts as a saboteur is fear, we're gonna unpin it now. So let's talk about that. Because even if we're like, okay, Tracy, Jen, like, we get this, I understand, I am deserving of all of this, because I am a human being, I understand about changing my definition of success. Great. And then, ah, that's when the fear comes in. Whether it's, you know, a couple of seconds later or a few hours later, when you start to marinate on some of these things. So what do we do about that?


Well, go watch my TED talk was completely unfair. And I do mean that not right now hang with us, then go watch NAFTA, because I really more thoroughly, right, because at the time allowed it like a really walking through it. The first thing is, is a paradigm shift on Fear Itself, right, we were taught to fear, fear, and understanding right off the bat, the fear that we're talking about in this context, and anything that I ever talk about, or that you ever talk about through the lens of fear is not the helpful kind. It's not the kind that's going to keep you alive, when there's a shark fin in the water and you're sitting on the beach debating, should I take a dip, it's not the kind where you're leaving a dinner with a friend in the city and you don't go down the dark alley, because you see a shadow when you take the main populated Street, that is not what we're talking about. Okay? The fear that we're talking about is the natural biological fear that occurs anytime you start to think about or move outside of what's comfortable and familiar to you. Right, including going from someone who does everything for everyone, to no longer taking responsibility for how people respond to going from pressurized and overwhelmed, to completely chill and at ease, right? To go from never having taken a long walk to running a marathon like it can be an internal or an external, it doesn't matter. anything different than who you are, how you feel. And what feels regular for you on the day to day today is going to tripwire fear response, and is going to signal your whole mind and body that it is unsafe, and it's going to do everything it can to get you to stop. So it becomes a snoop just like first teaching them we're like, okay, so we don't fear fear. We also don't like push through, I'm very anti, the masculine, like let's push through, overcome. No, that makes fear louder. What we want to do is recognize like fear is here doing its job. It's phenomenal. It kept you alive to listen to this fabulous podcast, right? So we want to appreciate it like, Oh, I feel reall That's super interesting. What's going on? Oh, I have that meeting with so and so tomorrow. And I'm really afraid to use my voice because that feels unfamiliar to me. And then as you do the work, you realize, oh, you're really afraid to use your voice because your body has a cellular traumatic memory about the time that you tried to and you were a little girl and your father squash you like a bug and shut you down and set you to your room. And that's where we start to have fun. And I mean that because I think growth is fun. That's where we start to have fun and kind of looking at the web of how you became who you are today. And then taking a look at, well, who do you really want to be and become and who do you need to become, to experience the vision and the version of you that you desire, right? And loving fear the whole way there. Because as you know it all the growth you've had, and the changes you've had, and everything you do, it's not like, oh, I looked fear, and now we're good, right. But also, if that happened, we'd all die, because our fear response would not be doing its job, we need the way we are wired, we need it, let's love that. And then recognize your the being that is more powerful than your mind, your body, your psyche, your subconscious, and your nervous system. And when you understand how to lead yourself, game, you can literally experience anything you want.


While it is wild, because this is the stuff that again, you know, I keep thinking, our kids have brains to joke about this, because, you know, the work that I do is I work pretty exclusively with adults, right? And everything that we're talking about, is applicable to these young humans who are sitting in front of us. So not only is it important that we understand and embody these practices and these concepts, but when we do share that journey with the kids, because the kid who is being asked to do something out of their comfort zone, which is like every day, every minute of every day in school, because they're learning if their nervous system, if their fear isn't acknowledged and loved and nurtured in a way that gets them to become who they want to be, whether it's dwell on that test, or create that thing, or make that beautiful masterpiece in our class or whatever we are, again, perpetuating those old ideas of push through, keep it together, there's no crying in baseball, totally. I


mean, we could go on for days on just the detriment to that to their ability to be creative and innovative and find solutions. We're talking about this context of a child sitting in a learning environment, right? When your fear response is ignited, you are essentially setting your nervous system into a sympathetic state, which is the state that sets off all the alarms, it's the state when you hear about women lifting cars off babies, okay, that's what is pumping through you and various levels, when you're in that fear ignited state, which means you have no access to your brainpower, you have no access to your creativity, to your solutions to your innovation, to be able to really kind of open up and reflect and contemplate, which is like where you need to be from a nervous system state to actually access and learn and let neuro neurons fire together. None of that is happening when you're on. It can't because your biological wiring system is like she's about to die. So nothing matters other than survival. And that's another thing that makes really taking this work into academia so that everybody can learn the way that I teach fear, which is why I did the TED talk on it. Right? Dear fear, it's not you. It's me. Fear is not the issue. It's your perspective of and relationship with fear that makes it a block, when in actual fact, it's a blueprint to your greatness.


Right. And by the way, the link to Tracy's TED talk is going to be in the podcast notes. So after this, make sure you go check that out as well. Because that is really exactly the way she describes fear is going to resonate so much with you. In the example that you gave about using your voice in the meeting, you're actually not able to use your voice in the way that you want to if you are not addressing your fear and your nervous system. You just can't


know. And you can't just say I'm just gonna go in there and do it. No, you're not. No, you're not you're clam up, you'll start to cry, and you'll judge yourself for crying in the meeting, you're going to leave the meeting like Kati, I only saw like 17% of what I really wanted to say. And it's not because there's anything wrong with you. And it's not because you're broken or you need to be fixed. It's because when your fear is ignited, you literally don't have access to your other faculties. Because your system is in a protect, protect, protect, protect, she's in threat, she's in threat, she's in threat, right makes so much sense. It's almost ridiculous.


Well, that's the thing. I mean, it's simple. But because of the way that we've been brought up, it's it's in the air that we breathe. You know that self awareness piece without judgment is really the keys that unlock all of this other stuff. Because when we first start to awaken to this idea of I am more powerful than my systems that you were just explaining, then getting to be in that driver's seat. He does make anything possible. Yeah.


Which then calls you to love your fear even more, because now you're gonna go do the things and I'm like what? Right,


right? And then you start to ask, well, then what? And now what might we say, oh, yeah, How good can this sketch? Right. And again, you know what an incredible example, to give to this next generation, we have to, we have to, we have to, and I do want to touch on one other thing, which is really important. And one of my favorite topics. And all of this is language. Because we just take for granted the things that come out of our mouth. And for me, even before I came to this work, I was always very careful about the words that I chose. And I still had no idea what I was talking about. And so this work, and I was like, Oh, wait, there's a whole nother chapter to this story. And so I would love for you to share a little bit about how language can really be a mirror that we can see in how we're going in these directions.


Yes, and I love the way you said it, because it is a mirror, it is a mirror. So the first thing I want you to know and probably write down is I am grossly under estimating the power of every word that leaves my lips. So there's two things to say about this. It was like 17 days of a class we could talk about. But right now there's two things to say about the words you're speaking, are both giving you a direct indication of what you really believe in think, which brings an awareness again, right? When you hear yourself say certain things, like I don't mean and it's like no, that is the language you used. That is an indication of something in your worldview, something in your belief structure something or the way that you think about something, someone what have you, right, so that's good, because it gives us the data, we need to start shifting that raising your level of mind, etc. And the words that you speak, also act as directives for then how you feel, act behave, what your system reflects back to you and shows you. So you're both reflecting what's happening internally, and then calling in what's coming toward you externally. And that it's crazy. Cool.


Can you share an example of that? Yes.


My husband's driving me crazy. So if I say that I'm having I'm holding some level of discontent toward him, and then I call you on the phone and like, I don't know, I'm just I don't know, if I'm happy. My marriage. I don't know what's going on. Now. I'm all like building a story, right? Because words are connected to narratives connected to story, right? It's all woven together, right? And now I'm like building the story. And then three days later, I call you back. And I'm like, like, honestly, he's been come home from work. He's not even coming over to say hello to me. Like there's no interaction. So now I'm reflecting what I've been really dealing with internally. But I'm also calling in, because what's my energy focused on? And what am I available for? If I'm saying things like, Oh, my husband's driving me crazy. Am I being open and warm then and who I be around him? Absolutely not. So then what am I seeing back I'm seeing reflected back the byproduct of what I'm actually asking for. I'm asking for that disconnection. I'm asking for that frustration. And literally, like, you can play with this like an experiment and you will blow your own mind.


And this is, to me is the fun stuff is fun. It's all fun. This is so fun. Because when you do become hyper aware of the words that you use, that is such an incredible indication of what's again, like you said, internal and then what's available to you on the outside, which you again have power in that is your power.


Yes. At the core, you are the cause of the effect. What is happening within you is generating your lived experience every moment of every day. You are not powerless, you are not a victim. No one and nothing can make you feel anything ever. You are the source, you are the generator, you're the common denominator of whatever's going down personally or professionally. And when you're willing to accept as in you just need to accept it because it is and also accept it because you want to accept it because the only way you can actually shift change, grow and thrive is through acceptance of what is now now we can go somewhere, right? And the irony, which is the reason why my book is called worthy human You're the problem and the solution is the only way to go okay, fine. Yes, some the cause of the effect not right. The only way to take that depth of personal responsibility is to already be on the I'm inherently worthy train, because you're not enoughness stuff will prohibit you Your ability to be like, Yep, I'm the cause of the effect. Because you don't want to take that responsibility, you are going to look at it as faults, it's going to make you believe that, you know, obviously I told you I wasn't enough because my doing this, right? It's like, No, you don't do a growth journey through a place of being defective from a place of needing to be fixed or broken. It's exciting. It's living into your purpose to say, just, I'm the cause of the effect, oh, my God, I can move around some stuff internally, and have a completely different lived experience. I mean, think right now, when you have to have a parent teacher meeting, right? And what goes on inside of you, you know, certain kids, those kids also are gifts, the ones that activate you the most, take a look at yourself, there's a gift in there, too. It's literally everything, which is what makes us so excited. Because I think the biggest piece of divine responsibility in generational change lives in academia, because it is the masses thoroughfare of education, however, you wanted to find that word, right? So we start to really, really get this work into academia, and academia, as the collective starts to raise their conscious awareness and recognize the impact and influence you're having on kids. And we start to teach personal power, shit, now. Now it's on.


That's everything. That's the stuff, which bringing us back to the thing that we first said, is the main primary reason that you need to prioritize yourself. That's it. This is how we do all the things. Exactly. And it's so exciting with you,


like literally Why wake up every day, why wake up every day, and it's on my heart, it's in my soul, it's on my mind. It's like, okay, where else are we going to impact today? Who else needs one, right? Who's coming on the day of the cause of the effect train, because that's when you see everything shift, because you're no longer waiting on anything or anyone to change, including the very well intended but very antiquated academic system. So each individual being that lives in the system must start to go within and do the change, right? Because if everyone just waits for whatever that revolution is going to come, because it's not happening in one fell swoop globally. I'll tell you that, right. That's what makes you showing up for yourself to do it. So imperative.


Yes, that's my vision. My vision of empowered educator schools is just that, where people individually wake up to their own personal power, and start to behave accordingly and teach others in their classrooms, how to find their power, even when they're 456 years old, especially when they're four or five, six


years, you're just taking your words out of your mouth and saying it, especially when, right when I get to sit, and I'm working with beautiful women that have three decades for decades, five decades on Earth, I'm doing a lot, okay, we're on doing a lot. If you're an early education, and academia, you are literally working with kids before they even have a conscious mind how low they are literally until your students are about seven and a half, eight years old. They haven't developed conscious mind yet. They haven't developed you know, the thing you see in like 1011 year old girls where they started to judge themselves, she's skinny, she's fat, she's tall and blonde, she's black, on brown, whatever, all those things. It doesn't even occur to them, because they haven't established a conscious mind yet. Right? How fun is it to be able to take a five or six year old and teach them breathing like I teach to, you know, my nieces, like and call it something fun, like butterfly breathing, make it really relatable. You're literally teaching them how to regulate before they even realize what you're doing. Right. And it also it's like those small things. It's not about coming in and like, you know, changing everything at once. It's literally the small things. It's the way you show up. It's the suggestion you make it's the energy with which you show up to the conversation. It's you kneeling down on the desk. It's you recognizing open and compassionately. I have no idea what happened to that kid this morning, right? It's you not allowing yourself to step inside your sacred classroom environment without shaking it out if you need to, or screaming it out in your car, and regulating yourself and coming in knowing that you are the center of influence. I mean, that's everything.


That's where all of the change gets to happen. Yeah. So in this vein, and we might have touched on it already, but I have a feeling we might have more to say on this. So much to say. What is the dream for the future of education as wiping away the teeth? Yeah, I really


Okay, so the dream for the future of education is that we get At the, I'm gonna just say the leaders of education, whatever that means to start by understanding that the world is starving. And we start to redefine success up here first. And that in that redefinition of success, we stop the lazy river of one size fits all education, that we've really, really take a look at how kids learn what kind of curriculums we're bringing into schools, right? Being able to invest more in the arts, being able to have a mindset class, as equally deemed important. As math, I would argue it's more important, but I'm not delusional, and what's possible, I will get there. But that's not going to happen to way after I'm dead. And to put in curriculum that's not like a club. But that is mandated curriculum that teaches consciousness and personal power, so that we are really setting up our children for success. The whole thing needs an overhaul. The whole thing, there is not one thing that works the way this to start to remove things like detention and suspensions, and have kids do trauma release work, and have kids take time to contemplate. have teachers trained and compassion in mind magic, and HeartMath? Right, we really look at what's going on in this world. There's just millions of people walking around with unhealed trauma that they're not aware of just throwing shit back and forth at each other. Right. And I hold the academic system in a high regard and responsible because it's the system that everybody must go through. That's the kicker about it right after 12th grade, whatever do you and college needs a whole overhaul to? But you have to go to school unless you're going to fall into homeschool. And that's not what we're talking about. So then wouldn't it be this that the biggest center of influence is our government run academic systems, and they need to wake up first. And then they need to change the whole curriculum to match that. That to me is success,


I guess. And my hope is that in starting with the teachers who are boots on the ground right now, they are going to be the ones to move into those positions and or pass the torches to people who are going to be in those positions. So the fruits of this You and I are never ever going to see in this lifetime. And that's what gets me because that's really the legacy that we get to leave behind and we get to leave the world better than we found it. Absolutely. I am right there with you. Yes.


Yeah. It's so exciting. It's so exciting. It really is.


So how do people learn more about you? And the lit factor and my magic? Where can they go?


Come to the website, because it's the hub of all things. So it's the lit factor.com. And it's li T T with two T's. And it's also the lit factor on Instagram, which is a great if you're a social media person, it's a great place to hang and then you won't miss anything.


Fantastic. And all of the links to all the things will also be in the podcast notes. Tracy, thank you so much for your time and your talents and sharing them with this audience today. It's just been


spectacular. is truly like my honor and my gift and I am behind you. 1,000% Let's go make it happen.


Let's do it. Yes. So if you liked today's episode, please be sure to leave a great review and we will see you next time on take notes. Incredible, right? Together, we can revolutionize the face of education. It's all possible. And it's all here for you right now. Let's keep the conversation going at empowered educator faculty room on Facebook.

What’s keeping you from achieving your health and fitness goals?

Is it mom guilt?

Do you think it’s selfish to invest in yourself?

Or, do you keep putting your health on the back burner because you don’t have the time for it?

The truth is, building generational health is as important, (if not more so) than many other things you’re prioritizing in your life.

And, here’s the good news- it can be simple and ENJOYABLE!

Welcome to episode 5 of Take Notes with Jen Rafferty! In this episode, I’m sharing an anxiety reducing and eye opening conversation with CEO of MindStrong Fitness, Rachel Freiman.

She’s a mindset training coach that is passionate about helping others unleash their strongest, most empowered selves through education.

Rachel has more than 15 years of classroom instruction experience, as well as certifications in personal training, sports nutrition and behavior modification. She truly understands the incredible shift that happens in the classroom when teachers are fit, happy, and making time for themselves.

Today is all about the important work of prioritizing your own well being and expanding the definition of what health means.

Rachel is teaching some capital T truths, and showing us that there is way more flexibility and joy in getting healthy and fit than the diet industry would have you believe!


Stay empowered,

Jen


Let’s keep the conversation going! Find me at:

Click here to learn all the ways you can work with me:
 Jen Rafferty | Instagram, YouTube, Facebook | Links
Instagram: @jenrafferty_
FaceBook: Empowered Educator Faculty Room

More on Rachel:  https://www.mindstrongfitnesscoaching.com/ 

TRANSCRIPTS: 
When you Google weight loss, there seem to be as many results as there are stars in the sky. No carbs, more protein, maybe more carbs, just veggies, maybe just organic veggies. What about shakes or fasting? What's that about? It's overwhelming. And it's variety and contradictions. So how can we get healthy when we're already living busy lives and don't have the time to figure it out? And when we think we do, how can we be sure it's right for our body, especially as teachers, physical self care can seem like a luxury. I mean, sometimes it's as if you're lucky to get in a quick bathroom break. So eating right to fuel our bodies can seem a little bit daunting. But today, I'm talking with Rachel Fryman, former teacher and founder of mind strong fitness, where she lays it out for us and reminds us that physical well being is not a luxury. It's a necessity. Rachel makes it easy, or dare I say fun. And if you're an empowered educator and ready to thrive, doors are open now for registration for Thrive live. This five week online course will give you the tools to create the sustainable work life blend you've always wanted. Increase your emotional intelligence and pave the way for more satisfaction at work that you can maintain. It's time to stop surviving, and it's time to thrive. Grab your spot now at empowered educator.com/thrive. Remember all the passion and vision you had when you first went into teaching. Feeling like building young minds and creating community through your work would make a lasting impact on this world? Well, those days may feel like they're behind you now because you're exhausted, stressed and overwhelmed and frustrated. But I'm here to tell you, it doesn't have to be like this. In fact, the love of teaching never really went away. But it absolutely needs transformation. Welcome to The Take notes Podcast. I'm Jen Rafferty, former music teacher, mom of two, and certified emotional intelligence practitioner, and I'm here to light the way for you. In order to create a generational change for our kids. We need to shift the paradigm away from the perpetual stress and overwhelm and into a life of joy, and fulfillment. This is education 2.0, where you become the priority, shift how you live your life, and how you show up both at work, and at home. So take a sip of steamy morning coffee, and grab your notebook, it's time to take notes Hello, and welcome back to take notes. I am so excited about this next episode where I have an incredible guest, Rachel Fryman who is the CEO of Mind, Strong fitness, a lover of lifting heavy things up and down, and a coach passionate about helping others unleash their strongest, most empowered selves through education, and mindset training. So of course, I wanted to have her on the show. Rachel has more than 15 years of classroom instruction and certifications in personal training, sports nutrition and behavior modification. And she is the author of the best selling book becoming mind strong. The truth about health, fitness and the BS that is holding you back. And her inside out approach focuses on both physical and mental attributes and building healthy and sustainable habits. So thank you so much, Rachel, for joining me today.


Oh, thank you. I'm excited about this conversation. Our worlds seem so different. But they're so aligned. So I'm excited to chat.


Yes. So those of you who don't know, Rachel probably don't know that she also started as a music teacher, just like me. And we have just incredible parallels in our lives. And this moment you're witnessing right now is the actual first time we've had a conversation together in the same space, believe it or not. We've known each other through different spaces through other people for so long. So you're hearing all of the joy in my voice because of that. I love it. Yeah,


this is a very meant to be moment. So those listening, you are at the apex of yours in the making,


right? It has. I'm embarrassed to say it's been years. But now that you're here, I would love to hear in your own words. And for everyone who's listening your story about how you came to do this really important work and teaching people to prioritize their own health and well being and expanding the definition of what that even means.


Yeah, I love talking about this in general. And I love that I get to talk about it with you because I've told this story more times than I can count. But the fact that I get to speak to you and other educators just hits differently, because my background, as you said it wasn't education. I was a freelance jazz musician in New York for many years, and eventually moved to Florida and I started teaching middle school music, and I frickin love teaching. I thought I was going to teach for the rest of my life. But as you and most people listening, I would assume no, teaching is a very giving, giving, giving job, right? It's taking deep breaths, it's showing up as your best self, no matter how you're feeling. And I just needed some kind of release at the end of the day. So for me, that release came in the form of the gym, and I had no idea what I was doing. Like, if reels were a thing back then there would be viral reels of what a hot mess I was. Because I knew nothing about nutrition, I knew nothing about workouts. I just knew I needed to let off steam so that I could show up as my best self for these kids. And what started happening was very much aligned with or the reason it started happening was because of the feedback I was hearing from other teachers. So I would have these other teachers come up to me and be like, Man, I wish I could get in shape. I wish I could go to the gym. I wish I could learn about nutrition. But I'm so confused. I don't have time. I don't know where to start. And I would tell them, Listen, I'm going after work anyway, why don't you just come with me and I'll work out together. And I always tell the story. It was a little selfish because selfishly, the feedback I heard from them lit something in me because I would hear these women say like, my husband touched me and I didn't flinch. I looked in a mirror for the first time in 10 years. One lady, this is both heartbreaking and beautiful. She said my students said, is everything okay? Because you seem happy. I was like, Oh, God, that's gut wrenching, right. But at the same time, like selfishly, I was like, I want to help every woman feel this way. And I really think it was my teaching background that lit that sparked for me, because the industry in which I work, the health and fitness industry is just so flooded with Bs, like we all know this go Google weight loss, and you will find 5 billion contrasting pieces of advice of eat carbs, don't eat carbs, eat high fat, don't eat low fat. And the more I learned about it on my own journey, it was very organic progression. I was just flabbergasted because the teacher in me saw Wait a second, this is a skill, like someone could teach you to knit someone could teach you to serve someone can teach you the skill of nutrition. But that's not how it's taught in this industry. Because once you pull back that curtain and see the truth, well, now you're not going to keep shoveling money at the industry. So that was my very long winded answer of I started a company to do things very differently. I will never consider myself a personal trainer, I consider myself an educator. And what I do in an industry full of BS and full of confusion is I teach what we call capital T truth. I show women that fitness, nutrition health are not these big, overwhelming subjects that the industry makes them out to be that they're learnable skills just like we would teach in a classroom.


Wow, there's so much there. And I'm going to start with something that I picked up on where especially as educators, especially as women, that worthiness piece, yes, being worthy enough to take the time to go to the gym. I'm sure you hear that a lot from your clients, how do you approach that in a way where that needs to be the fundamental piece of everything that you're doing?


Yeah, that is, I love how your brain works, that that's where you honed in on because that is the stumbling block for so many women especially I mean men too, but especially women, we tend to be givers, we tend to put everyone else before us. So the vast majority of women that we work with, they've started from a place of, it's selfish for me to take the time for myself, it's selfish for me to invest in myself, right? That's money I can be spending on my kids or my classroom or in certain other person you're taking care of. And one of the things that I get most passionate about in my business is this idea of generational health. So as a society, we talk a lot about generational wealth, right? Like our parents wanted to take care of us so they can pass it down in nowhere secure. But the problem is this topic of health and fitness, especially for women is not something that we just learned on our own. Right, our relationship with food, the fact that we feel like we gained five pounds because we sniffed pizza. You've heard that. I know, we've all been there. And it's because we heard that from our grandparents and from our parents and our aunts and uncles. And that's not to shame anyone that is our society. We were brought up and this all in all out black, white, I'm on my diet, I'm off my diet culture. And it's being passed down generation to generation because we don't know any better. So this is the part as a former teacher that I get most passionate about. Because when you heal your relationship with food, and that is a very real thing. When you learn nutrition as a skill, there's no more guilt. There's no more shame, there's no more I can and I can't, and that becomes so much bigger than you. Because now what your daughters your kids your students are hearing is not Oh, I have to go to the gym today because I had pizza and I feel fat. It's Hey, guys, you want to get pizza afterward. Today I fit it into my nutrition plan. I'm good to go. When we release that shame, guilt and regret that becomes the new relationship that's trickled down to our kids and their kids. And that's how we break this pattern in history. So there's that overused cliche in the self help world of putting the oxygen mask on yourself first. But the reality is, there is truth to that, right? The you that shows up drained and hanging on by a thread and low energy, you're not serving anyone, you're not serving your students, you're not serving your kids. In fact, you're modeling for them that that's how life is. But to me, it goes one step further than that it comes down to what message are we passing along, both in terms of the energy you deserve, and that bigger picture relationship with your health.


And that's really hitting on the fundamental principles of what empowered educator is all about. It's you making transformational generational change has to start with you, like you said, That's twofold, you are allowing an increased capacity to hold space for the people who need you, because you're taking care of yourself, your oxygen mask is on and like you said to, you're modeling a new paradigm for them to see a new way and to make it safe for them to follow in your footsteps.


And I love that term, make it safe for them. You know, we have one of her she's now a coach for us. But she served as a client. And she specializes in moms with young kids. And I use her as an example because when she came to us, she had that mom guilt. That's real for a lot of moms, there's 40 minutes in the morning, where I'm doing my workout or 30 minutes or 20 minutes. That's time I could be spending with my kids. And fast forward a year. What's happened now is that her kids do their little workouts with her like they have their little chip size dumbbells. And the message she has sent them is mommy's health is the top priority. Our health as a family is the top priority. And this past year for the holidays for husband got gym memberships, and the entire family like it became a family affair. Because that message is no longer shaming guilt at the time spent. It's as a family, this is what we prioritize our health is important. You see mommy model it now join me and now everyone's involved and actions speak louder than words you can preach this stuff here, kids, the kids are sponges, they're going to do what they see model. And at the core of this, that's the best thing we doing for the next generation.


Absolutely. And as a person in a role, where are you see 25 To 80 to 150 to 200 kids every single year, that is a beautiful spot for you to be that role model for them. That you're right, they see you. So it doesn't matter how much you preach. Eat healthy foods, make sure you exercise get enough sleep in that example that you've shared with at the beginning of wow, what's changed? You look happy? Are you okay? That's the message there. That's huge and really confronting. Yeah,


I taught middle school, like go ask middle schoolers to describe most of their teachers. And it's words like, cranky, you know, I'm afraid of the straw that's gonna break the camel's back. And you can't fake that stuff, you can put on a smile, you can try to do your best to show up for them. But if your energy is that low, especially as teachers, man, our energy is everything. If you are hanging on by a thread, that is what your students are getting from you, when you walk into that room, and you have more energy than a 12 year old you're teaching, they're gonna naturally be like, holy cow, what is miso or Mr. So and so doing? That's how they show up in this world. They might not have the words to put behind it. But they want a model, that level of energy and the underlying message, the more they get to know you is Oh, I got to take care of my health. I want to do what they're doing.

Yeah. And it's magnetic for sure. And so I want to also hit on a couple of things here. It sounds like your ideas of what health and holistic health is, is almost threefold. It's the physical working out in the gym and exercise. It's the nutrition and also the mindset, is that accurate?


Yes. And of those things, many teachers will be happy to hear the physical part the workouts are far and away the least important part. You can 100% make these changes. Yeah, no, right. You don't even need the gym. You could do it with nutrition and mindset alone.


So let's start there with nutrition and because I was gonna go right to the gym, because that's the thing. I'm afraid enough. Well, I go but as you were like, I'm getting started. I'm a hot mess. That's totally me. I'm going but I'm just like, there are rules that I'm looking at. There are rules now when I'm starting, like please no one day no one recording this thing. But okay, let's not start there. Then let's talk about nutrition then. So what do we need to know about nutrition that we're not getting from Google?


And getting a lot from Google and none of it is the truth, the diet industry because we can't even call it the health and fitness industry. It is the diet industry is very, very black and white. And that appeals to a lot of people because many of us are perfectionist we struggle with black, white, all in all out. And this industry doesn't help because that's how it's designed. You're either eating clean six days a week, or I've eaten the food not aligned with my goal. So I'm off my diet. I'm gonna have to start again next month or next Monday or insert arbitrary date right here either working out five days a week or I'll start again next month and meld into my couch in the meantime. It's very all in all out and on top of that, everything in the day. IT industry is based off of restriction, right? If you name a diet, whether it's keto, any kind of low carb points shakes at their core, every single we have a whole training around this every single diet is the exact same diet, it's telling you what you quote unquote, can and can't eat. And most teachers have some level of psychology training, right? Even if you haven't, don't have a degree in it. That's part of the education background. And one of the things that psychology teaches us is that we are pleasure seeking creatures, we are designed to avoid pain and seek pleasure, but first and foremost, to avoid pain. So here's what that means. Every single time we go on a diet doesn't matter which diet shakes points, frozen meals, low carb, you're putting forced blinders on. And you're saying, I can't, I can't, I can't, I can only eat these foods, I can only drink the shakes, I can't have carbs. And you were literally fighting against your human nature, you're trying to live in a state of restriction, which is discomfort, which is pain. So we go on these diets, we last you know, a couple of weeks, couple months, maybe you have more willpower than I do. So you last a year. And then when we cave, we don't just cave we binge, because we just spent our weeks, months years, living with horse blinders on fighting our human nature. And the problem is, it's never going to last long term, right? We tend especially as women to beat ourselves up and say, Why can't I stick with anything? Why do I lack willpower? Why will nothing work for me. And when we pull back this curtain on the diet industry, we say, of course, it didn't work for you. It's not you it didn't work. For humans. This is human nature. This is not how we were designed. So what we teach when I say I consider myself an educator, I teach a skill. And it's not a skill that I invented, I teach a skill called macro tracking. The reason that I do it well is because I was a teacher I can take, especially as music teachers, right, we can take big complicated subjects and make them very simple, we can make them not overwhelming. So what we teach with macro tracking, is that you have your personal plan your personal nutrition plan. From there, you can eat whatever the heck you want, as long as it fits within your plan. Now, of course, we want to make nutritious choices the majority of the time. But for me, I love doughnuts, like my students knew on my birthday, it was boxes of donuts. And if I have a doughnut, I didn't cheat, I didn't splurge. I'm not off my diet, I can choose to fit a doughnut into my plan, and I can hit my weight loss goals. And by doing that we learn to flow with our human nature. There's no more allowed not allowed foods, good foods, bad foods, there's nutritious and less nutritious, but we step into our power of choice, and we stop trying to fight against that human nature element.


Even just you saying that I feel like a weights been lifted. Right? Every time. It's


like it's not me.


It's not me. And it's not that restriction, because that goes into just lack and scarcity. And that sucks. Like that never


feels good. It's never gonna last either doesn't feel good, good. Because it doesn't feel good. It won't last


right? And I do want to enjoy the ice cream cone with my kids. I don't want to be the mom who takes her kids out for ice cream and says no, I can't, you know, and even when I was I was on a diet. I was on a diet I'm omitting and I'm gonna diet, I would have that moment of I don't want to be on the diet in front of my children. And now that I'm like unraveling all of this, how interesting right? How I couldn't even show up authentically with my kids in that moment where we could have this beautiful summertime events. And even just you saying that kind of relieves this pressure that we all think about what that supposed to look like. Yeah,


and I love that your go to example was an ice cream cone with your kids. Because when we start we have a 12 week program where we teach this skill. And I would say 85% of the time, the first time that someone really starts locking this in their post is I took my kids for ice cream this week. And I sat there and had a cone with them without the shame, guilt or regret and what a different feeling. It's always the ice cream cone with their kids. And I love that. Isn't that interesting?


Because that's, I think that's a real thing. You want to have those moments. And especially with young kids, there might not be the most nutritious choices all the time, or you're celebrating something you're celebrating a birthday or you know, you want to have the piece of cake, you want to have the extra drink, you want to have the ice cream or whatever. And it doesn't feel good to be the person that says no, thank you because I'm restricting myself. Yeah.


And energetically. I mean, the to go to us for most women is either they don't participate, right? It's like no, Mommy's not going to have any or we have some we try to fake it. But the shame, guilt and regret is there and it is apparent and kids can feel that energy from you. So think about from a mindset from an energy perspective. When you are sitting there with zero shame, guilt or regret around that ice cream and you were fully present. You are showing up as a different parent and probably tastes better. It does. Everything gets better without regret.


Yeah, that's a regret tastes terrible. And that's all part of it, right? I mean, you have to eat. This is part of being human. And we might as well enjoy ourselves.


Exactly what we teach is a skill. So if you were gonna learn to surf, right, the first couple of weeks that you surf, it's not gonna be that enjoyable, because you're gonna suck at it. And as humans, we don't like to suck, you're gonna be falling down all the time. Once you have it, I mean, the sky's the limit, you never have to relearn to surf, if you put it down, you might get rusty, but you know how to do it. And that's the thing with macro tracking, there's a learning curve, it's going to take you a couple of weeks, because we've never approached food this way. But once you lock it in, you literally this is not some like sales pitchy thing. You literally never diet again, it's just an approach to how you eat, where there's gonna be days you choose not to track, there's going to be days where you're like, Screw it, I'm gonna go eat everything in sight. But the difference is, this time, we always have that tool in our toolbox. And we just get right back to it. At some point, when you lock this in, you look back, and you say, I can't believe I ever subscribed to diet culture. Because once you pull back that curtain, you can never unsee it,


right. And then of course, the old adage of when we know better, we do better. And we know this too, is as educators we lock this in. But there's such a disconnect when it comes to ourselves, which is so interesting, we can teach the things. But as soon as it becomes introspective, then all of our old stories or old relationships with food that'll kind of creeps up and serves as an obstacle of us moving forward.


Yeah, and that is why the mindset piece of what we do, you know, sometimes people hear mindset, and they think it's rainbows and glitter and unicorns. When people come to us, they say, Well, you know, I want to lose 50 pounds, my coaches and I, we kind of giggled to ourselves because we're like the weight loss isn't given. For us. That's the simple part. It's math and science, you do this, it will work. We know where the fun part is, where we get to dig in as coaches is what's under the surface, right? There are years of wired in neural connections. I'm a big neuroscience nerd, there have been years of wired in neural connections and limiting beliefs and stories and labels that have led to this relationship with food. So yeah, we'll teach you to track macros, you'll lose the weight that that parts have given for us. But what's under the surface, what comes up in the process, that's where we get to roll up our sleeves and really start to do the real life changing work. And that


really gets my Tail Wagon to I mean. That's kind of how this whole thing works. Right? That's what a marriage educator is based on. It's changing your wiring. We're changing our programming. So for those of us who are listening, who are not necessarily well versed in how this goes regarding old narratives, old stories, labels limitations, can you walk us through an example of what that means and how that goes?


Absolutely. So I'll tell you one of my favorite ones. Now, let's say I'm doing a two hour live free workshop, and I'm introducing people to macros for the first time, they're gonna get all hyped up, they're gonna see wow, this changes the game, I see why diets never work, bla bla bla, then we get to the point where you say, Oh, you want to join our 12 week program? Here's the investment level on autopilot, your brain is going to start telling you stories, it's going to say things like, I have spent so much money in my life on dieting, that it's just wrong for me to spend more, right. We touched on one before it's selfish for me to invest in myself, who am I kidding? Like, yeah, I'm hyped up because I'm on this live workshop. But who am I kidding thinking something else is going to actually work this time. The reason that that stuff popped up on autopilot, you didn't consciously think that that just popped in your head, the second you saw a price tag. The reason that happened if we could roll back the tape, and look at your life in slow motion, at some point in your life, every time we think a thought or take an action, a neural connection is formed in our brain, every single time that thought is repeated, or that action is taken. There's a stuff called myelin. Myelin works like cement, and it's coding coding, coding that neural connection when enough mileage has been coded, boom, it's a full fledged habit, right? So think about when we're kids and our parents had to force us to brush our teeth. We didn't just wake up and brush our teeth. It was an argument every night. But now you know, we wake up we start our day. We're like, did I brush it? Yeah, I brush my teeth this morning. We don't even think about it. Because it's myelinated into our brains. Well, that works with stories we've told ourselves over the years. So every single time you've gone on a diet and it didn't last, which now we understand why it didn't last. But your brain didn't know that at the time. Every time you went on that diet and it didn't last. It was now more myelinated proof of this is never going to work for me. Who am I kidding? Some it's gonna work. It's selfish for me to invest. Every one of those thoughts is wired in your brain as a habit and it's showing up on autopilot. I mean, we could have the same conversation about labels we put on ourselves, right? I'm just the big one in the family. My sister's the skinny one, like, pick your label, all the neural connections have been formed. This is all autopilot in our brain. So much of the mindset work that we do. It all starts the same way. It's a little red flag. Are you saying of course that thought popped in right that is not capital T truth. That's a wired and neural connection in my brain. Then we take breath. Okay? I see you, I acknowledge you, I know you're there. And I now know that every diet I've invested in the past, it wasn't investing, I was spending my money on shakes, I was spending my money on frozen meals. This is the first time in my life, that I'm doing something new. I'm doing something that flows with human nature, I'm investing in education. And I bet because this isn't the BS of the past, I bet this is the first time I get to start with a clean slate. And again, that's one of a million examples. But it starts with understanding that the thoughts in your head are not truth, they are thoughts that you've repeated over and over and over again, until they're wired in as what we call a belief. And our job is to red flag to take a breath, whether it's outwardly or inwardly express our new truth. And then most of all, and this is true of workouts, nutrition, everything, to consciously wire in the new habits that we want to build.


And I love how you said new truths, because we can believe whatever we want to believe,


yes, 100%. When you understand neural connections, and you understand how habits are built, as cold and sterile as it sounds, you also understand you can consciously build the person you want to be, it is purely choosing the thoughts on what you ruminate and choosing the thoughts that you repeat over and over again, until they're wired in his habit.


I mean, I don't know what's more empowering than that. Yeah, you're learning almost complete control. Isn't that amazing? In a world where so many of us are struggling with that control, if you just for a second took a breath and realize that the agency is everything, external changes?


100%, it is all about baby steps and momentum, because consistency is what forms habits. How do we get consistency by finding what we need to hold ourselves accountable, and repeating, repeating, repeating. And because that's true of thought and action? There's nothing in this life, I mean, short of death. There's nothing in this life that you can't consciously choose to build through baby steps, momentum and consistency. It's amazing.


And as we get to embody that as educators, that's the stuff that we're teaching our kids.


Yes. 100 Oh, man, talk about like neural connections. And I used to nerd out on neuroscience with my music kids, because I would explain how neuroscience works on a very basic level. So when little Susie would pick up her trumpet for the first time, and her gut reaction is to cry because she sucks at it. We would talk about there's no neural connection right now, how in the world could you know how to do this. So we don't need to go practice. And I'm going to tie this into our conversation. But you don't need to go practice an hour and a half right now, if you did five minutes, five days a week, guess what's happening in your brain right now. And we talk about myelin and cement. And it is the exact same conversation. If you want to rewire your brain as the label of being the big sibling, it's the same conversation if you want to start a workout routine, if you want to start learning macros, all of this comes down to forming a neural connection, and consistency and the power that you take back when you fully understand that


it's beautiful. That's really the only way I can describe it. It's a beautiful space in place to explore. And it's right there are many of us just don't we miss it because we're so busy doing all the other things. But if we just understood how our brains work, like you said, it's actually not about anything else. It's really just about understanding the most powerful tool we have at our disposal.


Yeah, and I think your point is a valid one, you know, we get so busy with life. And that plays into this conversation, because they say that 95% of your life is run by your subconscious brain. That subconscious brain is simply exactly what we've been talking about. It's the neural connections that had been myelinated for so long, that it's your autopilot. So if you're someone who walks around with a lot of anxiety, I don't mean simply to belittle it, but it is simply because your brain has been wired for ruminating thoughts that cause anxiety. If you're someone who walks around with tons of confidence, it's because you have repeated those thoughts and those actions for so long that it's wired that way. So the reason we're so big on pausing and breathing is because that's what takes us out of autopilot. It's Wait a second, I feel myself running on my 95% subconscious loop. Let me pause. Let me breathe. Let me break the cycle. Let me consciously choose what I want to ruminate on the actions I want to take. And then we can build from there.


Yeah, and it could be as simple as what's came up for me right there is going to reach for that donut, having that thought of, oh, I shouldn't have been noticing a while I just thought that I shouldn't do this. And the way he called it as a red flag. It's all done by breathing and then actually being able to eat it because you know, it's fits into your macros.


You can be a coach for us right now. That's exactly what we're saying. Because then what you do is you step into the power of choice, right? Psychology talks about something called reactance which sympton says as humans, don't tell me what you know, middle schoolers get a bad rap for this, but we're all like this. Don't tell me What I can't do, because the second you tell me I want to do it even more. So the second thing you read flagged your thought, like you so beautifully said I shouldn't have this doughnut, we pause, we breed. Interesting, interesting that I just decided I shouldn't is the world going to end? Well, my family loves me no less. No. So I can choose to fit this donut into my macros, I'll still hit my goals. And I know I'm probably gonna get a sugar rush. It's not going to keep me full very long. It's about not very nutritious. So which do I truly choose? And some days you'll choose the doughnut, and that's totally fine. But sometimes just pausing and breathing and doing the work and giving yourself permission, yeah, I could have this if I want. And xy and z will be the result of it. Just that power of choice is enough for us to make other choices.


And I love how you said doing the work. Because when we think about and generalizing, when you think about weight loss, nutrition, we think the work is external, like you said, calories in calories out. Yes, no black, white, but the work that you have been describing really has nothing to do with food.


It's all up here. It's all mindset work. You know, that's why our bike coaches and I like behind the scenes, we joke a little bit because weight loss is math and science. Like for us that is a given. If you take the time to get through the learning curve of macros, you will hit your goals, it is math and science, as sparkly and wonderful as every individual is you don't defy the laws of math and science. The real work is what's going on up here, the All in all out the black, the white, the shame, the guilt, and that's the changes everything you need that part to go along with the logistics.


So if there's someone who's listening right now, who was like, Okay, I want to just try something today. What is something small that they can do right now,


one thing I will tell you what not to do? And then I'll tell you what to do. Let's


start there.


I mean, I talked about macros, the first thing people do and it makes sense, why is they Google Online macro calculator. And I'm a very white person, like I never grew out of that childhood stage of don't just tell me something. Tell me why. If you want to see why I preach from the rooftops, online, macro calculators do not work. Try it yourself Google free online macro calculator and pull up three of them. And you will be more confused than when you start because they are so wildly wrong, that you'll have things that tell you eat 1100 calories, things that tell you to D 2100 calories, they do not work. So if you're hearing this, and you're like, oh, macro sound awesome. Let me go get a calculator, do not do it, you will shoot yourself in the foot before you start. Here's where I suggest everyone starts. I mean, we have people who go through our program self paced at the lowest investment level, we have people who spend 10s of 1000s of dollars to work directly with me, every single human starts in the same place for the next five to seven days. Download a free app, like My Fitness Pal is a good one lose, it's a good one Fitbits a good one doesn't matter, you're just gonna eat the way you normally eat. And I say that knowing it's easier said than done. Because sometimes when we start shining that light of awareness, right, it's like being observed in the classroom here like a very step my game up some rays


that are behave like missiles coming in, right?


Like, there's no play at cool, like everyone's like a beggar to the best of your ability, eat as you normally eat and just track your food. Now, there is no shame around this. There's no guilt. This is where we need to do a little emotional separation, right? If you were in debt right now, and your goal was to get wealthy, nobody wants to have that meeting with the financial counselor. Like it sucks to print out all your credit card statements and see everything on paper. And if you want the end goal, it's a must, we have to shine the light of awareness, we need to see the data. So when we're tracking, we're going to do our best to stay out of a place shame, guilt judgment, it's happening anyway, we're just putting it down on an app. Here, you won't know if these numbers are quote unquote good or bad, you won't know what they mean. But what it is going to do is it's going to give you a bird's eye view of what's happening. A lot of times what people see is like, Oh, I'm actually not eating as many calories as I thought. Or they'll be like, Oh, okay, that's why I thought I was eating healthy. And but I'm not losing it simply gathering data for the first five to seven days. And then from there, we could talk about next steps of what to do with that. But we start every single person with the same place of just shining that light of awareness.


Yeah. And even that, like you said, will create some sort of amount of work to separate yourself from that shame, guilt feelings of judgment. And this is something for those people who've been in my world for a long time, too. We can't change anything if we don't notice it. This is about just the noticing and giving yourself so much self compassion and grace to have the space to do this. Because this is the first step to making changes is noticing.


Absolutely we call shining the light of awareness is the exact same thing you can't my terrible sports metaphor is but a quarterback is going to change their game. They don't just wake up and start changing how they throw the ball. They're going to watch hours and hours of footage to see what's going well what's not. You have to shine the light of awareness. And this also puts us in a position to step into our power of choice, right? A lot of times when people hear track MiFi they're like, oh, that sounds so tedious. It sounds like so much work. And the answer is listen, weight loss is calories in versus calories out. So Do you have to track? Absolutely not? Well, the world? And if you don't know, will anyone love you less? No, you haven't been doing it most your life for most of us. And we know that not doing it hasn't worked. So I wonder if these are conversations we get to have in our head, I wonder what it would feel like, if just for fun. I'm not dedicating myself to 12 weeks not dedicating myself to a year. But what if for the next five days, I just track my food just to see what this Rachel chick is talking about? Right? Sometimes just giving ourselves that brace and stepping into the power of curiosity. Just like that donut analogy that you use, it lets us step into our power of choice.


Yes. So before I asked you about how people could know more about your work and work with you, I always ask this to everybody. Because here we are expanding this idea of empowerment, expanding this idea of holistic well being, as educators who reach so many kids and communities all over the world, we are really shaping the next generations. And what would your dream be for the future of education?


Oh, I love this question. I think we need to flow with what's actually happening. And I think this is true in classroom settings. Right? There's a big divide right now in the educational system of why are we still having kids regurgitate facts, like we live in a world where Google is literally in their pocket? Do they need to know the dates that X, Y and Z happened when they can Google it in 10 seconds? Why aren't we teaching creativity and team building and all the social skills that many of us know our bigger picture. And in my world, it's the same thing, right? We need to stop pushing these black, white all in all out methods that fight against human nature. And we need to get realistic. Like, people want to eat doughnuts, people want to have a glass of wine. Yes, in an ideal world, really perfectly healthy and nutrient dense food. And it's never gonna happen. That's not how human beings are wired. So how do we get healthier and accomplishing our goals and hitting our weight loss goals, while being realistic to what life looks like for people. And I think in general, when we clash as a society, it's people trying to push others into a mold that doesn't fit whether we're talking about how education is run, or health and fitness is run, like we all have a human nature as different as we all are at our core, we're all the same humans that whose brains work the same way. So in every area of life, the more we can learn to flow with it, the more of we're going to advance as a society.


Yes. And those skills that you're describing are everything. And I have to tell you, most of the people that even come on this podcast, have experiences in creativity in arts and music and theater in some way, and have created beautiful lives for themselves because of the critical thinking because their ability to connect their ability to be innovative. And we know this as teachers, and I think you're right, there are constraints, sometimes with what we are and are not able to do in the classroom. But we know what's right. We know and trusting yourself to do that. That's beautiful. Thank you for sharing that. Thank you. That's


a great question. I love that that makes you tap into that creative side to to answer that.


Right? Yeah, you kind of have to look beyond the reality right here. So I want to know, how can people get in touch with you and learn more about your work at mind strong, for sure.


So the best place to find us is our main website, which is simply mind strong fitness.com. I'm assuming people listening our podcast people. So we do have our own podcast called Becoming mind strong, which is the same name as my book. If you're on Facebook, our Facebook community is next level, if you look up mine strong women, it is just a couple 1000 women just like minded different stages of this journey, but all there because they're so sick of not only diet culture, but beating themselves up because of diet culture. So start with our website, mind trunk fitness.com. If you're on Facebook, look up mind strong women. And if you're a podcast person becoming mind strong as our podcast,


awesome. And I do have to say that, first of all, all of that stuff will be in the podcast notes will be super easy to access. But also I've seen your Facebook Lives. I know how active you are in that group. And even as someone who's kind of on the periphery of what you're doing, it has been really eye opening for me. And I just encourage anyone listening, just go right to that Facebook group, because that's where you'll get access to Rachel.


I love that. Thank you. Yeah, I mean, the one thing that I will say about our businesses, we are passionate, because we know as teachers, you never want to see kids struggle, you certainly don't want to see adults struggle. And I just see so many women beating themselves up for something that I am a huge fan of radical personal responsibility, but this is not your fault. The reason it's never worked is not your fault. So I always say I was either gonna get arrested for shouting from the rooftops or I was going to start a company that can teach us truth so that we went with the latter.


Well, thank you so much for this spectacular conversation. It has just been a pleasure talking with you. Finally,


finally. Yes,


thank you so much for having me. This was a blast. And if you enjoyed today's episode, please make sure to leave a five star review. And I'll see you next time on take notes. Incredible right? Together, we can revolutionize the face of education. It's all possible and it's all here for you right now. Let's keep the conversation going on empowered educator faculty room on Facebook.

What effect does a school principals’ approach to collaborative decision making have on teachers and students?

What is the role of creating invitations and agreements versus stringent expectations, constriction and restraint on teachers?

A collaborative leadership style is one that opens the door to conversations and viewpoints that foster an environment of inclusion and spark visionary outcomes. It allows for comfortable and safe buy in from teachers, and exponentially improves students’ experiences.

Welcome to episode 4 of Take Notes with Jen Rafferty! In this episode, I’m speaking with Sean Gaillard, an educator, administrator, author and podcaster who believes that all students are future world changers. As an experienced school leader he is currently principal of Appalachian State University Academy at Middle Fork.

We cover everything from our respective educators “origin stories”, the importance of reconnecting to mission and vision, and how there’s very little the Beatles can’t teach us all about perseverance, and dreaming BIG!

This week is all about remembering our “why” in choosing to become educators, and what a difference feeling valued and included by school leadership makes in our noble profession.

Let’s reconnect to the moments that changed our lives early on and inspired us to become educators WHILE addressing the very real and pressing issues we’re all facing today.

We can do both at the same time- it’s the only way forward.

Stay empowered,

Jen


Let’s keep the conversation going! Find me at:

Click here to learn all the ways you can work with me:
 Jen Rafferty | Instagram, YouTube, Facebook | Links
Instagram: @jenrafferty_
FaceBook: Empowered Educator Faculty Room


About Sean Gaillard

Sean Gaillard is an educator, administrator, author, and podcaster who believes that all students are future world changers. An experienced school leader, Gaillard is currently principal of the Appalachian State University Academy at Middle Fork. In addition to keynoting and presenting at various conferences, Sean is the author of The Pepper Effect: Tap into the Magic of Creativity, Collaboration, and Innovation. He has contributed chapters to Evolving With Gratitude and Because of a Teacher, Volume 2. His various articles have appeared in “Education Week,” “Culture Sonar,” and PBS. He is the host of “The Principal Liner Notes Podcast.” and the upcoming podcast, “The Album That Changed My Life.” In 2018, Sean was named the Lexington City Schools Principal of the Year. The following year, he was awarded the 2019 Wells Fargo Piedmont Triad Regional Principal of the Year and named a finalist for North Carolina Principal of the Year. Follow Sean on Twitter, Instagram, and Linktree.

He is currently writing a book for Routledge titled “Profiles In Educational Courage.”


Connect with Sean at:

Podcast: The Principal Liner Notes Podcast
Instagram: @smgaillard

TRANSCRIPT:  I remember all the passion and vision you had when you first went into teaching. Feeling like building young minds and creating community through your work would make a lasting impact on this world. Well, those days may feel like they're behind you now because you're exhausted, stressed and overwhelmed and frustrated. But I'm here to tell you, it doesn't have to be like this. In fact, the love of teaching never really went away. But it absolutely needs transformation. Welcome to The Take notes Podcast. I'm Jen Rafferty, former music teacher, mom of two, and certified emotional intelligence practitioner, and I'm here to light the way for you. In order to create a generational change for our kids, we need to shift the paradigm away from the perpetual stress and overwhelm and into a life of joy, and fulfillment. This is education 2.0, where you become the priority, shift how you live your life, and how you show up both at work, and at home. So take a sip of steamy morning coffee, and grab your notebook, it's time to take notes.


What do the Beatles and education have in common? Well, my guest today explains that it's more than we might think. Being on a team. Whether a sports team or a team of colleagues can often be similar to being in a band. We all got to know the tune the tempo, and of course make song choices based on our audience. And there's got to be synchrony. We all have to be aligned working towards our goal of making sweet, beautiful music. And my guest today uses this metaphor in his role as a principal and I have to say, I loved talking with him. Not only was this conversation incredible and even emotional at times, but I also learned some pretty cool things about the Beatles. Want to know more about empowered educator programming? Check out the upcoming workshops at empowered educator.com This is Sean Gaillard, an educator, Administrator, author and podcaster who believes that all students are future world changers. Yes, an experienced school leader Gaillard is currently principal of Appalachian State University Academy at Middle Fork and addition to keynoting. And presenting at various conferences. Shawn is the author of the pepper effect tap into the magic of creativity, collaboration and innovation which I am so excited to dive in and talk about. In 2018. Shawn was named the Lexington City Schools Principal of the Year and the following year, he was also awarded the 2019 Wells Fargo Piedmont Triad regional Principal of the Year, and named a finalist for North Carolina Principal of the Year. Wow, Sean, hello.


Hello, Jen, how are you? Thank you for having me on.


So excited to have this conversation with you. We met through though social media, which is how a lot of us meet these days, which is so cool. I admire your work for a while. And I was really looking forward to having this conversation today. So I'd love it if you can just tell our listeners a little bit about why you wanted to be an educator and how you got to where you are now.


Well, thank you, Jen gave me the kind of the quick two part, few invention story of little bottom out there of how that happened. Oh, gosh, I was maybe six or seven. And I remember asking my dad, who is just one of the great forces and examples of love, and understanding and peace in the divine in my life. And I remember asking him once I said, Dad, what's a cool job to have. And I remember my dad kind of thinking about that for a minute. And saying that teaching was the job to do because you got to help a lot of people. And I later learn as I got a little bit older that my father actually had an aspiration to be a PE teacher at one point. So all roads go back to dad and mom. And then the second part of that story or that two part few convention was my fifth grade teacher, Mrs. mcmoneagle, who opened up for me, not just a world, a universe of possibilities. And she saw something in me that that I did not see in myself and opened me up to a world of appreciation for literature, and music, and art, and theater and film and the list goes on. And then we'll fast forward maybe six years or so after that, where I was sitting in a junior English three, three class with my smirky music snob self and I thought that I was this kind of ironic, right, smart aleck listening to Steely Dan. And his rants basically My English teacher opened up a possibility with the book, The Great Gatsby. And at that moment, just like the day that I met my wife, I fell in love and knew not with MS rents, but with the Great Gatsby, and knew this is what I wanted to do. I wanted to teach English I wanted to this kind of solidified the words of wisdom from my father, and then the example and belief from from Mrs. Big monocle, so that those kinds of early actually as a three part few invention there, so those kinds of three moments ignited for me a pursuit of what I call the noble profession,


isn't it though? It is, it really is, I asked people a lot, especially when we do work with mission, and really getting down to your why it's so important to connect to your origin story, right? No, it's like, why did you even want to do this in the first place? Because oftentimes, we get so caught in our current reality, or we're teaching and we're in the weeds and things are difficult or challenging. And yes, and sometimes I think when people initially have this conversation, have we talked about remembering my why we're ignoring the problems? No, that's not what's happening. What we're doing is we're reconnecting to something that changed you earlier on in life. And sometimes when you reconnect to that, your perspective can change. And there are multiple steps there. But knowing that about your stories is so important, and like you said, entering quite a noble profession. And sometimes it just takes one teacher.


It does. And I like how you framed origin story. I'm a big fan of superheroes. I love prequels. And the older I get, the more I appreciate the prequel, the origin story, the prelude before the person becomes the hero, or the icon that we all know and love. So, and along those ways, like if you think about, like, how Batman became Batman, and that tragic event, you know, I always hone in on like, the teachers or the mentor figures, or those formative moments that helped shape, you know, again, we've been talking about music, you're a musician. So I mean, who taught Beethoven? What was it that I'm fascinated by that? Or what was that experience? That led him wanting to become that Beethoven, the iconic bust? That's on a piano someplace, you know? Or how did wonder woman become Wonder Woman? You know, clearly, she was a kid sitting in a classroom on the island of Amazon, you know, not knowing that she was going to be this icon. So we always say start with why. But But part of that, why is that origin story, those formative moments, those teachers, those mentors, those coaches, those figures are those moments that helped shape who we are and what we become, which adds, I think, to that nobility of our profession, and what we do for kids and communities and each other, as I'm talking to you, and I'm learning more about you. I want to know like, well, who taught Jen, was there a vocal teacher? Was there a piano teacher? Was there a piece of music that kind of lit you on fire that said, wow, actually, I'm curious.


Sure, we totally flipped the script here, you just you just took over that. Script. There are very significant people in times in my life where I just knew, I was lucky that I grew up in a home that encouraged music making and performing. So my parents were a big part of that, just allowing me to express myself. And I had a beautiful experience as a music student when I was in middle school. And really, it was a calling for me. I just knew that being a musician was something I wanted to do. And my high school teacher, Eric Williams, he was the one who taught me the importance of sharing. It's because it's important to obviously, know yourself and your voice and your own musicianship. And by the way, if you can talk you can sing. Goes right, understanding that but the power and the magic of music happens in the sharing and in the community and creating emotion in yourself and therefore creating emotion in somebody else. That's magic that's elevating humanity, and I needed to do that and I was fortunate enough to have wonderfully supportive professors along the way. My voice teacher in college, Deborah Montgomery and my music education mentor, Verna brummett. They were people who believed in me and believed in my mission, which was slightly different than maybe your typical pre service teacher in music school. I had a larger mission in mind and I got there and a slightly different Half and I think a lot of other people did. And I think one of the biggest things that I share with people too is I learned how to ask really good questions. My teachers always told me how to ask really good questions. So I might not know all the answers. But I can ask really good questions, I can lead me down some really interesting paths. So yeah, that's kind of my origin story. There was I think, really, the crux of it was Eric Williams in high school and solidifying that community building, which is a big part of who I am today.


Two things to that Gen. Very grateful for Eric Williams, because again, as we talked about earlier, that one teacher ignited something in you that led to this path that is rippling to others in your work. And that's so important and so valuable. And then the notion of music. Yes, it sounds great. It's got a good beat that but the sharing aspect, because I believe is that music, transcends language and transcends boundaries. Because it is a universal language, it is a universal connection that we have transcends time and space and distance. And all of that is through the sharing aspects. I've not heard it frame that way. So thank you for that teachable moment. That's really,


all the things I do have an element of connection. Because that community aspect is most important. That's really one of the reasons I do this podcast. This is a way for me to connect with new people like you, but also connect with a wider audience who are my listeners who are interested in some of the same things, and it's super aligned. And I talk about alignment a lot. And we kind of dancing a little bit around mission. I know right? Before we started recording, we started getting on fire, about some of the stuff about mission, but truly having a mission and a vision is essential. Getting to this next place, because otherwise, we're just kind of wandering around, I like to describe it as kind of a plastic bag at the beginning of American Beauty.


Remember, it's just a great chain, yeah, you're just kind of


floating around and moving, whatever which way the winds is taking you and you abdicate your power when that happens, because you are a victim to all of your external circumstance, right or the wind, so to speak. But when you have a really clear mission and vision, like we talked about with empowered educator intendant, one intended to you then take back your power, and are empowered to make aligned choices to move you forward and to keep moving the needle forward. So I would love to know a little bit about how you approach mission and vision and why it's become so important to you personally. And then, of course, how you share that with the teachers and staff that you work with in schools.


So I'll backwards design that just a little bit for you. And I really believe that the world turns through vision and mission. So I greatly value the work of Simon Sinek. And start with why and I know that is often referenced. And sometimes it is not properly packed. We start with wise, there's a lot of value in what he is saying it's not original. But he captures that in a way that when I first heard that TED talk in my first principalship, it really resonated with me. And sometimes as principals, we often make the criticism to teachers don't be the sage on the stage, okay. And I used to be that guy, but I didn't really practice that either. And sometimes his principles, we are guilty of doing that same thing. And sometimes it's important to get off that stage and help bring others on the stage with you, so to speak, or work the crowd and work the room. So I often use the story of The Beatles band that has ignited a whole lot with but if you think about their move early on as a band, they wanted to be bigger than Elvis Presley. That was their mission. And that was their vision at the time we're going to be be bigger than Elvis we want to be this the greatest music act in the world. And they were very intentional about that. So they set out we want to be the biggest band in Liverpool. All right now we're going to be the biggest band in Blackpool. Now we're going to be the biggest band in London now that we've conquered England, we're gonna go to Scotland, we're gonna go to Wales. They were very clear about that. And as a leader I learned early on Yes, I can have my vision and mission and my core and all these kinds of principal buzzwords things but it's got to be shared. It has to be collective, like the Beatles and I'd sit in the parking lot early on in my principalship and go nobody


likes me nobody understands you know, these teachers and why why me and


and I put on some sad Frank Sinatra and you know, feel sorry for myself. But I realized early on that that vision and mission is something that, that not only should be taught and modeled, but it has to be Invitational because in principle school and in teacher school, we don't teach that we don't roll that way do the law. Some plan, do the unit plan go, you know, we talked about earlier pushing the student teacher in the deep end of the pool and sometimes there with some burnout cooperating teacher, again, I'm being very judgmental, and I don't want to be that way. But because there are a lot of programs out there that get in and prepare teachers well. So I want to say that,


but that happens and it happens. Talk about it in a way that's productive and problem solving about it. Because otherwise, it just gets just shoved under the rug. And that's, I think, perpetuate some of these issues. So yeah, let's hear we're gonna talk about all things.


All right, let's do it. So thank you, Jen. So I'm very transparent about it. So I you know, the school that I get to serve right now, which I'm so excited about, I'm just completely jazzed about being a part of the Academy, I had shared with our faculty and I was very vulnerable about it. I said, in order for me to be the best possible helper in principle for you, I need to know what the gig is, you know, as you know, back in back in my guitar band playing days, what's the gig? What's the setlist? Are we going to start off with this song? Are we going to end with this? Is this a crowd that's going to be be drunk? Is this a crowd that's going to be happy? And I needed to kind of understand all of those things. That's the same way. As a leader, I need to know what's the gig? Where is it that you want us to go? Where is it that you want we to be at where is it that we need to be? And what is the dream? What's the dream? What is it that we have to aspire to for each other? And for kids? And you can't just do that at the beginning of the bloody year, right? You just can't do that in a kumbaya icebreaker. It's got to be relentless. And it has to be Invitational and you have to ask questions I shared with the faculty yesterday, what are your dreams? I'm new to this school, and I'm excited about it. But I want to know what your dreams are. I want to know, I want to support those dreams and celebrate those dreams. And perhaps by doing that, as a faculty together, then that'll ripple to the students to our kids, and a little ripple to our families. How cool would it be if you're in a contentious parent teacher conference, and instead of saying Jen doesn't do her homework about starting the conversation with Okay, hello, how are you? What's her dream? What's your dream? What's your dream today? Earlier when you were talking about origin story? And I thought, Well, I'm really fascinated by Gen Xer origin story. And look what happened. You shared with me which I'm honored by and grateful for a very important part of your origin story. And we learned about this guy named Eric, who taught you and then set off on on this journey. But those that are listening, how cool will it be? And I hope that you guys do that are listening and tuning in. Next person you see today, ask him, what's your dream? What's your origin story. So I think by shifting those conversations and flipping the script, and putting mission and vision, as again, that's something that's stuck in a school improvement plan, or on some torn and frayed poster board that that's in the work room, and nobody looks at it because everybody's looking for the doughnuts. Again, it's got to be organic, it has to start I think with us, and the principal, we have the ability because of our role to raise that conversation up and invite each other in because sometimes teachers aren't going to always do that and feel comfortable or feel psychologically safe doing that. And you mentioned a big part of your work is emotional intelligence. And you got to read the room, just like a musician, you know that like when you were you probably planning your programs, we're gonna have a lot of mommies and daddies and grandmas. And so therefore, we might not do Welcome to the Jungle. Absolutely, I actually would be kind of cool and acapella versions of


like that. I love how you just shared that example of being in that parent teacher conference and starting it off with a dream, because it creates first of all, psychological safety, and then common ground. And that's what's really what mission vision is collectively is about common ground. It's these agreements. And you know, I've been I was writing a whole bunch of things because I could take this in a whole bunch of different ways. I think it's really important though, to go back to something you said about being Invitational because in the work that I'm doing, and especially when we talk about trauma informed teaching, which by the way, trauma informed everything is just about creating safety period for everybody, because we all have trauma responses. It's like everything. What we do is a trauma response. But that's like another podcast for another day. But creating an invitation and agreements versus expectations that allows for a comfortable safe, buy in and opens the door for conversation versus this is what we expect from you and we're Got to get that done. I don't really care what you have to say about it. Who wants to work there who can teach with that constriction and that restraint. And when we have agreements that are invitations, that's a whole different ballgame. So what's been your experience with that? That's been kind of your way? How does that work in creating that safe culture for teachers?


So, very similar to how I used to teach English, I would be required to teach Shakespeare. I enjoy Shakespeare quite a bit. But Shakespeare people go I don't understand the language added editing did it today. It's hard. You know, it's they're wearing tights, what's going on? So, and I stole this line from Al Pacino are great, are great, great actor, you know, Scarface, Michael Corleone I could go on, but I love him to Pacino. Pacino is an accomplished stage actor. He's an accomplished Shakespearean actor. He did a great documentary, years ago, called looking for Richard, where he basically kind of walked the streets of New York, you should check it out, you probably some of those places will be familiar to you. And he basically just asked people, it his whole, his whole mission of the movie was to teach people about Shakespeare, because he and I'm tired of hearing about people complaining about the language and iambic pentameter, we have to tune our ears up. Because the language is the same, we just have to tune our ears just a little bit. And that stayed with me in terms of approaching teaching Shakespeare and I would tell that the students, you have to tune your ear up, it's the same thing as a principle, you have to tune your ear up to the people whom you serve. And you do that by assuming positive intent. And also tuning into and assuming correctly assuming that everyone has a gift, and a strength to add to the gig. Okay, again, very much for my band days. I mean, look at these fingers. These are rhythm guitar fingers, I am not Jimi Hendrix. I don't play like Brian May from from Queen and I wish that I did. I am a rhythm guitarist, I am a rhythm guitarist that wants to be a drummer. Okay. So and so I lock in with with the drums, I lock in with the bass and I will do everything possible to support the melody. I'm great at that. And that's very similar to my principalship. I don't stand on tables, I don't do some of the crazy principal stunts. That doesn't work for me. It's not authentic to me, I find that I'm going to just be this kind of rudimentary rhythm guitarist but you know, who is a great rhythm guitarist John Lennon, you know who appreciated rhythm guitar, Jimi Hendrix in fact, Jimi Hendrix and I have a quote someplace where he said, If you really want to learn how to play guitar, be a great guitarist, be a good rhythm guitarist. So you tune into people's strengths. So just this week, Jen, I had some nerves and some angst about the opening faculty meeting, because it's my first time at the schoolhouse. It is it is a tight, beautiful, supportive community, and I don't want to blow it. And so rather than me being that stage on stage on the stage, you know, I had all these planning meetings, and I was listening to folks on our team. I thought, wow, you've got a great idea there with morning meeting. Could you share that model that at our opening meeting, asked our instructional coach, and she did it and she did a beautiful job. Then I got to thinking about well, and we've got a music teacher in here someplace. Wouldn't it be cool because music is the universal divine language? What if I call the art that music teacher who I hadn't met just yet, I had this kind of crazy idea about what if we all had like random instruments and made a sound together? Because our theme is one band, one sound? Could you lead and facilitate that session, and we had this like, really giant drum circle, and we're all collaborating. And I thought we got a PE teacher. By No, I'm going to assume knows the value of a good brain break. I ran into her and I said, Hey, do you mind doing a brain break? So it's just leveraging other strengths and gifts to create that culture of safety. And all of that is again, tuning your ear up reading the room, and assuming positive intent. And knowing that the people around you all have a gift or a strength to share. It's very similar to music which you said if you can talk you can sing if you if you love music, you can play Sure. Well, no, you're not going to start off singing like Pavarotti. But you're going to start off singing like you. And that voice is important. And how cool is it that we get to have that in the gig. Now sometimes that's, that's hard to it's not always easy. I got lucky with those. You know, sometimes it takes time. And you may not always see you may have some biases, or some preconceptions that you try to get out. But you really have to tune in and listen, that's the other part of music, right and the other part of leadership, sometimes we just have to why At ourselves, pause. For those of you that are watching this, I'm like moving back, then you sit back, and you look at the whole room, and you look at who's there. And you see what comes out. And leaders two were good at eavesdropping, you got to eavesdrop a little bit, right eavesdrop on those conversations in the faculty meeting or when you're at the coffee machine, tune in. And if you hear something, finding that common ground, and I love how you mentioned that, how we got to find that common ground with folks. Wow, you do that to listen to that, or you watch that show, too. Or, oh, wow, I saw you the other day, when I was coming into the schoolhouse, you were doing something really cool with kids, Sharon at the next PLC or I know the perfect bandmate. For you, that's gonna really help you do this even to another level that we didn't dream of. Let's see what happens.


Yeah, and it's really just like, what you were saying before is, is reading the room and understanding what people want what people need. And providing space for that common ground leads to really productive conversations, especially on this kind of meta level of district or school mission vision, because it doesn't matter if you and I disagree about the what we're doing, or the how we're doing it. But if we both agree about this commonality, and this fundamental principle of what we do here, then it doesn't matter at the end of the day, and then the core, but how do we help each other because we're all walking towards the same direction. And I think it's really important to when we were saying I don't remember if it was when we were recording or recording your conversations beforehand. But we were talking about dreaming, I think you had mentioned it here. And you had said sometimes it's difficult for teachers to dream. And I think this is really important because I have observed this in my work as well. And I think a lot of it has to do again with that culture of expectation. Because when we are feeling stress, anxiety, pressure, frustration, overwhelm, I think we just humans, we lose our capacity to dream. We cannot do that anymore. Biologically, our brain is not allowing us to do that. Because we are in fight flight or freeze. And we don't need to dream when we're being chased by a bear. So we actively shut off that part of ourselves. And so when we are in a place that we're asked to dream, oftentimes I get blank brain. I don't know. Or I'm confused about the question, right? Or there's some sort of procrastination about doing that exercise. And it's truly because we haven't created spaces where it's safe to really talk about our dreams. And I'm wondering if you've had that experience, or what has been your experience when you're talking about dreams


thing, too, is when we turn off that part of our brain for dreams, I mean, that can sometimes lead down and I've had all cash experiences that that can lead down a path of anxiety that can lead down a path of unwellness that can lead down so many deep, dark rabbit holes. So the thing with dreams, again, maybe I've listened to too many Beatle records. There's something about I mean, that band for all intensive purposes shouldn't have happened. And their story for me feels this notion, this concept of the impossible becoming possible. And everything that has been created, has been ignited into reality. Started with some sort of dream. And yes, I don't think when Michelangelo woke up, and when he was told by Pope Julius to paint the Sistine Chapel guineas, Michelangelo's sculpture, do you want to pay the Sistine Chapel but the Pope told him and he struggled with that. And if I could travel back in time, I would love to see Michelangelo's doubt and angst when he's staring at the ceiling. And somehow he wrestled with it and he made it happen. But somewhere along the way, he had a dream. He had a vision to do that Mrs. Big monocle. My fifth grade teacher saw something in me that I did not see in myself and ignited that. So to answer your question, that's the first part of that dream. My mother and my father saw something in me unconditionally, that I do not see myself. As a father of three daughters. I really believe that my daughters are going to change the world. And I share this a lot in my leadership that somewhere in our building somewhere if you believe it, and we should believe it is the next gen Rafferty somewhere in our building is the next Katherine Johnson or Michelangelo. And if they are not that next person, then maybe they're going to be the mother, the grandmother, the stepmother. The aunt, the Father, the teacher, the coach, the conductor of that person, that's going to figure out how to get rid of COVID, or is going to be that person that is going to set the stage or the foundation for bringing more harmony and peace in in our American political process. And I call it out. Because I do believe that I mean, somebody had to teach Thomas Edison, somebody had to teach Gen. Rafferty, somebody had to teach Michelangelo how to sculpt and paint, somebody had to teach Katherine Johnson math, somebody had to teach or inspire boy, George, how to sing. Somebody had to come up with the invention, or the idea for the accordion, there we go. Not to that. You know, so I mean, it all had to start somewhere. And in some cases, it started in a school, right? In Oracle classroom, I believe that and how cool that we get to be on the ground floor of that dream for others, because somebody dreamed us into reality, somebody fought hard for us.


Yeah. And it's not hyperbole that we change the world. You know, teachers are world changers, because we propel new generations forward, this is how's the gig, and understanding that having a clear mission as to why you get up in the morning to do the thing. And the vision as to where you're going is important, not just for you as an individual to move the needle forward, because then you get to align all of your choices to that mission and vision. But then, the second part of that is when you collectively do it as a staff and, and the thing is like, now everyone's going back to school, though, you know, when you might be listening to this, we might be deep in the middle of school or possibly summer, but we all know what that's like going back to school. And it's like, okay, mission vision, you're either reconnecting to it. Or if you haven't done it yet, you're you're creating something new. But you know, there's a term that I've heard recently of like, collective ascension, where when we do this together, when we are creating a dream, collectively, that's how we all rise together, because your vision is different than my vision that's different than the vision of the teacher down the hall and the principal at the next building over. We're not moving anywhere, ever, we can't, because we're literally making choices in different directions. But when we have this collective vision, we can move the needle forward and ascend not just who we are as professionals, but our kids and like you said, our families and essentially our communities, because otherwise what are we doing?


I mean, I love that you just man, that's a collective ascension. That sounds like an album. It sounds like a chapter in your next book. It sounds like that. No, I did that. And as you share that what I envision immediately is I think about the and this is a one that that's told a lot is the whole notion of moonshot thinking, right? The notion of the of in the 1960s, the space race and how NASA we were able to put human beings on on the moon. And that just wasn't Neil Armstrong waking up one day going, alright, I'm going on the moon that took a whole group, a whole band to help make that happen, just like when we make a song, right. But the key point that you mentioned as a part of that ascension, is the collectivity of that, and the shared pneus of that. And underneath that is that psychological safety, that belief that support that love because we're humans, and it took some time, but Kennedy said, Hey, we're going to put somebody on the moon, and we're going to do it at this time. And there's that often I don't know if it's an urban legend or not, or if it's true or not, but the story of how Kennedy and sometimes it's told LBJ it's it's interchangeable how they were touring a NASA facility and Kennedy came across a janitor, and he asked the janitor, hey, what do you do hear and the janitor instead of saying I mopped floors, or I clean toilets says I'm here to put a man on the moon.


Yes. That's it. That is it. Everything. That's everything. You know, circling back to what I was saying before about the sharing and the connection. If you're just keeping this to yourself, you're not going to get there. That's not where the magic is right on. The magic happens in the sharing and and the connection with people. This is so connected to my core, I get very even emotional talking about this. Because if we're not doing that, again, what are we doing and what are we teaching our kids? Here we have this beautiful opportunity to change lives, plant seeds, the fruits of which we will never see in this lifetime. And if we are continuing to do things the way we've always done them just because we've always done them or continue to say the same stories over and over again about how hard it is particularly after COVID We're not going to get anywhere and that is just unacceptable to me, which is what fuel owes me in the work that I do. Because we deserve better our kids deserve better our future deserves better, because what you just described right there, but that story that janitor, whether it's true or not, great story, that's how we put the man on the moon. So let's do it.


Yeah. And as educators, and again, there's policies and half tos, and there's accountability, and if we put the dream, and the vision and the mission in the forefront, and it's Invitational man. And if we believe that we can change the world, and that we are part of that spark, and get all that stuff gets lost, it's lost. And usually, it's about this time of the year where we have that joy, and we're ready. I mean, I'm excited about back to school and getting school supplies and get my school shoes and and then usually the honeymoon ends about September, but it doesn't have to, because it does, it can't do that.


No, this is the work that makes everything else work. This is the most important work. And it's that, you know, bring it back to what we were talking about to about pre service. You know, it's all about deliverables and our idea of what success looks like. And some of the stuff that we're talking about dreams. It's not quantifiable. And so it's very difficult for people to understand and place value in something we don't please value and things that are not easy to understand. Dreams are something that's not tangible. So it can be very easy to dismiss, because there's no way to quantify whether or not we've done it or not. So we forget, and that initial inspiration dies. And we forget about that integration. But it's that integration that is essential to again, moving the needle forward and really realizing that big beautiful vision that you have. So then the next year or two years or three years later, you get to create another one because your ceiling is now your floor. And now what do you get to do I mean, the ability is just limitless here,


teaching, and the thing that you just sparked, and indulge me in this analogy. Teaching is like building a cathedral, someone had a vision, that we're going to build this big, beautiful structure. And you know, these cathedrals, some of them take, you know, hundreds of years to build. And the folks that had that that initial thought, or idea or vision or dream, if you will, they didn't live to see it happen. But they knew that they were doing something good and pure and beautiful for the world, for others. And sometimes the teachings were built in that cathedral. And sometimes we're stuck in the ground floor. And we're not we don't get to the spire or the rose window or whatever it may be. But that's the beauty of it is, is there's another person who has that same investment in the dream, that same investment in the gig that's going to help build and make this this beautiful structure, this work of art for the world. And there are cathedrals that are literally standing the test of time for the world. That's the same dream. That's the same gig for it for teaching. We may not you know, it's like Martin Luther King, in his last speech, the mountaintop speech, I may not get there with you all, but I see it. And I know it's there. And I know that you are going to get there, and it's going to happen for the world. So that's an important Hosanna that I think we miss in the gig. And that's why it takes that same relentlessness that shared psychological safety tuning into the room to help each other. Because teaching it is also hard work as well. But we're human and we have limitations. And we've got to take care of ourselves and fill our own buckets and find that peace and balance. That's so key and value that so I appreciate your take on that Jen.


Yeah, yeah, absolutely. You know, and just as a side to that, I don't want to go down this rabbit hole too far, because this is a whole nother podcast you but as far as self care and things like that, and overall well being, again, if your mission is this thing over here, in order for you to reach that mission, you need to be well enough to do that. Do that if you're burnt out and exhausted and sick and tired and anxious. So you know, self care isn't about taking the day because you have to get away it is alignment. Because if you really believe in that mission and that vision, then that means that you need to show up as your best self. So you need to make decisions that allow for that to happen. So all of this you know truly and really all of my work to like I shared with you before is completely mission and vision centric. It has to be otherwise. Again that bag at the beginning of American Beauty You've blown in every which direction. And life's too short, I don't want to abdicate my power to that I want to be empowered to make the decisions of who I want to be and how I want to show up and what I want to do in this world. And I know that every teacher who got into teaching wants to have that impact. And here's, here's a big part of the how we get to do that is being really clear about mission vision,


and part of your work. And that key word that resonates with me and you just shared it is empowerment. And it reminds me of, I'm going to make a plug for a friend of mine and a colleague who I think, actually she's probably would be a better guest on this than I am. But Julie Hasson who is a professor at Appalachian State University and former principal and she teaches and support me and she teaches and supports other school leaders. She's got a great book called Safe seen and stretched in the classroom. And one of the quotes in there is that the best way, and I think she tweeted this out, I may have retweeted this this morning, actually, is that if the best way to take care of students is to take care of teachers. And part of that taking care. Yes, there's doughnuts and breakfast and trinkets and things. But but we also need to, to feed and inspire empowerment. And that empowerment. It comes from guys like me who we do have a role, we do have a say to stage and we have to tune in to that we were like we really want to take care of our kids, we've got to take care of our teachers. Yes, jeans days, and Christmas and surprise, Krispy Kreme Doughnuts are important and are needed and are necessary. But we also need to operate around that realm of empowerment. And you do that by tuning reading the room, and you tune into folks strengths and gifts, and you assume that positive intent because it's there, and people start at all, I mean, you hear that to people. I mean, I used to have those dreams to as a kid play in school, and I'm gonna have my classroom and hear my little Star Wars figures are my students, you know, I'm teaching them I used to do that. That's key, that empowerment piece. And there's other ways there multiple ways to empower educators and teachers and I find one of the best ways, find that gift, Find that strength, find that rhythm guitar player. And even though that rhythm guitar player wants to be Hendrix, that rhythm guitar player has an important role. Call it out. Yeah,


absolutely. Absolutely. And you know, it's funny that the donut days when I talk to people about that school leaders who share this is what we do for our teachers. And so that's great. That Donut Day was Monday. So what happens on Tuesday,


right? Yeah, that was Thursday. Yeah, what


about Thursdays what happens then? So is this consistent thing and again, coming back to those themes that you said about assuming positive intent, which is a huge part of everything that we do when we communicate with people and create community but sharing that invitation to you know, this is just what we're doing here. So I know, you've alluded a lot to your book, I would love to just explicitly talk about it for a second about, obviously, you've shared some of your inspiration for it, but how do you really use that as a tool for the map, if you will, of how you do what you do?


So yeah, the pepper effect which kind of came from that's a whole nother podcast of how that book came to be. But


music and that well, well, we'll talk again for sure.


Totally, yeah, I'm gonna get you on my podcast I've already we're gonna have like a part two and three. This may be attended Shawn crossover series like Law and Order man, Benson and Stabler here, you know, back to back. But really, the book was a bucket list kind of thing that I wanted to do. And I often if you picked upon anything about my leadership, I love to tell stories. And that's the literature teacher in me. And often in faculty meetings, I would reference the Beatles to try to illustrate points just like I did in teaching. I would always find a Beatle song when I taught English to incorporate into to something and I found that just as The Beatles music inspired me their story as a band inspired me and I landed on and it was around the time of the 50th anniversary of the release of the Sergeant Pepper's Lonely Hearts Club Band album and an album that that is considered a masterpiece. You know, there's there's the big debates about that, but but often it's kind of like Beethoven's Ninth Symphony, masterpiece, Sergeant Pepper, it's their it's their masterpiece, and then we talk about how that's crossed over. This is my Sergeant Pepper moment or whatever or artwork. I thought, why in teaching Do we not talk about the art of teaching and the work of teaching as a masterpiece that we're going in there? And we are creating a masterpiece, just like Beethoven did for the Ninth Symphony, just like Brian Wilson did. For Pet Sounds just like Joni Mitchell did for blue just like Miles Davis did for kind of blue. So why can't teachers aspire to that, like we go into the building? Man, we're creating a masterpiece. For Kids. This lesson plan is a masterpiece for kids. The collaborators that I work with are like my bandmates, like Paul McCartney and John Lennon and Ringo Starr. So the book is rooted in four riffs, if you will, that I call the pepper effect. And I use the backdrop of the Beatles story of making Sergeant Pepper and then I crosswalk it to education. And the pepper effect is essentially for riff. So it's Believe in your masterpiece. believe that what you're doing for kids and for the profession? Is that a masterpiece level? Believe in your vision? Believe in your dreams? Believe in your collaborators believe that we are in this together and believe in each other's strengths and gifts? And then Ignore the naysayers ignore those folks that are so willing and ready to tell you, you can't? Or you won't? Or why are you doing this? And all of those four riffs kind of crosswalk back to the Beatles. The famous story I tell, is when they were recording the Sergeant Pepper album, and the Beatles kind of went into their studio isolation time and stopped touring, and stopped making television appearances. And they really focused on on recording that album. Well, the British press began to circulate stories that The Beatles were finished and that The Beatles were over and what are they doing in the studio? How could they? And there was a lot of naysaying and Paul McCartney tells the story of how they were reading those articles, the band, and instead of saying oh my gosh, the British press, they're insulting us and saying that we can't Paul McCartney said that we used to laugh at those articles and went like wait, wait until they hear what we got cooking. You just wait. And when we finish this up, we're gonna blow your mind. And I'm inspired by that I still am get chills when I tell that story. Because so often, we're told as educators, right, that you're not empowered, you can't do this, or why are you teaching that you're not making a difference? You're not making an impact? And yes, there are things in the profession, our noble profession, were under an attack. And there are things that that have diminished the nobility of what we do, don't get me started on a livable wage for teachers and do more than a livable wage, right, and compensation, and advancement and those things. I mean, there are a lot of external forces that are unjustifiable, and just unethical and just wrong. For what we're doing for our world changing work. So that ignoring the naysayers is big for me, I land on the story of The Beatles. Same thing when they their very first failed I write about this in the book when they failed their first kind of major recording audition, and they were told Qatar groups are on their way out. Now, they didn't take that to heart. They didn't take that personally. I mean, they probably did. But that didn't stop them from their vision of we're going to be bigger than Elvis. We're going to be the greatest band in the land. So what did they do? They changed it up. They fire their drummer Pete Best. Sorry, Pete. They hired Ringo Starr. Instead of worrying about covering other people's songs, Lennon and McCartney, kind of up their songwriting game. I mean, they changed things up and kept at it kept gigging kept performing and got it eventually got a recording contract, thanks to George Martin, and Brian Epstein, their manager. So I find that their story, often the inspirational part of the Beatles story, to be creative, to be innovative to be collaborative is missing in some of the Beatles books. And I basically wrote, wrote a book that I wanted to see on a bookshelf that I wanted to that I would want to read, and hopefully I'm grateful that others, I am a delist author, I am not a best selling author. But I'm grateful for those folks that have given me the gift of their time to read the book and to share to share things out. And you know, I you know, when the book first came out in 2018, a school in Canada adopted the book as their school wide theme. And May their drama club adapted the book for stage I was really honored by that, that kids put it like a play version of the book. I just learned recently about a principal who is doing that as her school wide theme. So those kinds of moments are very meaningful to me and make this D D list author very, very proud that my little scrim of a book is making a difference for others on the school level.


Amazing. I am Looking forward to diving into that, and having a conversation about that too, because there's so much there. And I think the big piece of that, you know, is how easy it is for all of that negativity, to affect your decision making. But especially as a teacher, that then is passed on to the kids too. So not just believing in your dream is important for you. It's important for the people who are watching you, too. And just like the Beatles, having their big, beautiful dreams realized. Everything's possible. It is so possible, it is possible. So before we go, I have one last question for you. That is I asked every single person because it is important that we share our dreams out loud, otherwise, we don't know what they are, and neither does anybody else. So what is your dream for the future of education,


I have a two part dream. So the first part is, and I write about this in the book, I want Paul McCartney and Ringo Starr to have a concert at my school. So that's, that's, that's, that's like one of my dreams, like, I'm going to walk in, and Paul and Ringo are going to be there with their instruments. And they're going to say, hey, we need a rhythm guitarist you want to play? And we're going to play on the roof of the school. So that's that's the first dream. My dream for for education. Is that, oh, wow, I have so many that every student, every child has what I had had a Mrs. McMonagle that saw something in me that I did not see in myself. I want every child to have that. And I want every teacher to have that. And to know that they can be empowered to make that impact.


Yes, sorry. No, hey, listen, don't ever be sorry for tears. My people who know me well know that if I'm not crying every day, something's wrong with me. Whether it's beautiful moments of joy, or gratitude, or whatever, it's it's beautiful. And it comes from the heart. And I appreciate so much that you just shared that because of how important that is for people to hear. Hear that enough. I think in this small way, even just this podcast, this is also how we help change the world


right now. And it's that connection. That's the gig. It really


is. And I'm so grateful that you took the time to have this amazing chat with me. We are so not done. No.


Oh, I would love for us to continue the conversation. You have an open invitation to come on my little podcast. And I'm excited to read your book. And it is coming to my town August 22. So

amazing. Isn't that amazing? It's so so quick these days. So I am going to put everything in the podcast notes. So if you're listening, you can follow Shawn and all of the social media handles and find the link to his book right there in the podcast notes. Thank you so much again, Shawn, and thank you for listening. And if you enjoyed today's podcast, don't forget to write a good review. And I will see you next time.


Incredible right. Together we can revolutionize the face of education. It's all possible. And it's all here for you right now. Let's keep the conversation going and empowered educator faculty room on Facebook.

Why does representation and diversity in the classroom matter?

How does it make an impact on how our students view themselves?

Our students need trusted adults who are available to answer questions about identity and therefore can make a difference in their lives in the long term.

Encouraging conversations about all sorts of intersections of identity in a safe and honest space promotes belonging. As educators, we have the ability to create the type of spaces that support young people to flourish and thrive.

Welcome to episode 3 of Take Notes with Jen Rafferty! In this episode, I’m speaking with Eric Williamson! He is a former conductor with the Grammy Award-winning Brooklyn Youth Chorus, and music teacher at PS 32 in Brooklyn.

Eric has also joined the national facilitation team of the Human Rights Campaign - Welcoming Schools Program, the nation's largest bullying prevention, and LGBTQ+ inclusive education initiative

We explore the effects of insufficient education available to teachers on handling this topic, and how self-reflection and personal development can be a catalyst for change.

Also, how a simple mindset shift can help us lean into conflict, and uncomfortable situations so these vital conversations can be had to better serve our students.

Today is all about inclusion and cultivating communities for belonging for our youth, and the difference having these conversations makes in students’ lives.

As educators, we get to foster safety for our students, even when it’s not easy.

Because feeling safe to be our most authentic selves is how we all grow and shine!

Stay empowered,
Jen

Let’s keep the conversation going! Find me at:

Click here to learn all the ways you can work with me:
 Jen Rafferty | Instagram, YouTube, Facebook | Links
Instagram: @jenrafferty_
FaceBook: Empowered Educator Faculty Room


About Eric Williamson

Eric Williamson is Black Boy Joy! He has captured the hearts of many on international stages with his magnetic energy and light. A former conductor with the Grammy award-winning Brooklyn Youth Chorus and a music teacher at P.S. 32 in Brooklyn, he is no stranger to cultivating communities of belonging for LGBTQ youth. In 2021, he was featured in NY1 for teaching a lesson with NYC Chancellor Meisha Porter on personal pronouns to one of his 1st-grade classes. This led to several workshop opportunities to lead and facilitate conversations with parents and teachers on topics regarding race, anti-racism, sexuality, identity, and culturally responsive teaching. He recently joined the national facilitation team of the Human Rights Campaign Welcoming Schools program, the Nation's largest bullying prevention and LGBTQ+ inclusive education initiative.

A native of Teaneck, NJ, Mr. Williamson received his B.A. in Music from the Pennsylvania State University and his M.A. in Music Education from Teachers College, Columbia University.

Connect with Eric here:

Website: www.ericwilliamson.org
IG: @mrwilliamsonmusicroom
FB: Eric Williamson

TRANSCRIPT: 00:01
Students come to us with a multitude of needs. And as adults in their lives, we do our best to take care of them and guide them through their formative years. However, it is especially important that we pay attention to how we create inclusive spaces, so all students, and our colleagues feel safe to be their most authentic self. Because that's how we all grow and shine. And as educators, we get to foster that safety, but it's not always easy. And so today's guest will take you on a journey of his becoming, teach us about how he's created open and safe spaces and understand that maybe it isn't as hard as we think it is, and guide us to how we can truly be inclusive in the work that we do in our communities.

00:47
Hello, everyone. Welcome back to take notes. I am so excited to introduce our guests for today. This person and I have been kind of living these very parallel lives having so many mutual friends and co workers in common and you are going to be witnessing the first time our paths have actually crossed and our very first conversation, so excited to share it with you. So Eric Williamson is a former conductor with the Grammy Award winning Brooklyn youth chorus, and the music teacher at PS 32 in Brooklyn, and is no stranger to cultivating communities of belonging for LGBTQ youth. He has led and facilitated several workshops and conversations with parents and teachers on topics regarding race, anti racism, sexuality, identity and culturally responsive teaching. And he recently joined the National facilitation team of the Human Rights Campaign welcoming Schools Program, the nation's largest bullying prevention and LGBTQ plus Inclusive Education Initiative. Eric, hello.

01:54
I am so excited to have this conversation with you, Tennant four an empowered educator is all about reflective practices and uncovering hidden biases and beliefs and how that affects our teaching. And you were just the perfect person to come on here and talk about this. I'm so honored. Thank you so much for having me and reaching out. And yeah, thanks for all that you do to so much great energy right now. So let's keep it rolling with this great energy and tell us please a little bit about yourself and how you got to where you are now regarding your plight for creating safe spaces in schools. Absolutely. So I was born and raised in Teaneck, New Jersey, which is a suburb in North Jersey, 10 minutes outside of the city. And growing up. I always love music. I love singing. I love instruments. But when I got to college, I had no idea what I was doing with my life, like absolutely no idea. I was like, maybe I'll do musical theater. And I was like, maybe I'll do psychology. I like people. I like talking but also love performing. And so I went to Penn State for my undergrad. And day one at Pennsic. This massive campus, predominately white campus, over 40,000 students, only 2000 of them were black and brown, which is terrifying. But the first day I was like, You know what, I'm going to the music building. And so the first day I went to the music building, I hopped on a bus. I got there and I saw that there was auditions for choirs, and I was like, Well, I like to sing I always sing so I might as well sign up for a choir that sounds familiar. And I saw this choir called essence of joy. And it said with the music 93 It says this choir sings music of the African African American sacred and secular traditions. I was like, Well, I'm African American, and I sing in charge. This sounds like me, I should sign up. And so day one of auditions. In comes this black queer man, Dr. Anthony Tony Leach, who is a director of back wire and the founder of that choir at Penn State. And I got into the choir and this man single handedly changed my life without fail, like his representation as an out black queer person who also is in church and academia and navigating a predominately white space and excellence. I mean, he really just, he's, he's my current mentor now. And when I was at Penn State, I was still DL. So I was not coming out. I wasn't really talking to anyone. He was the first person that like, saw me, and I was able to have conversations about my identity with him. He's also the one that encouraged me to become a music education major, because I was like, Well, definitely, I don't know what I'm doing. I like music. I like people who was like, why are you not a music teacher? I was like, wait, I can do that. Like that's the thing that I can do, which sounds so like silly saying it out loud. Because I know I was born to do this. But like, young me, I had no idea what was possible. And I also had a trash high school music teacher. So another conversation, but he was like, you can do this. And I was like, Well, I've never had a voice lesson before. I like singing well, I'm not classically trained. So he like hooked me up with a

05:00
Am I required to take voice lessons, I auditioned I got into the school of music. I didn't graduate with an ED degree because it was too expensive. So I graduated with a performance degree. And immediately after I graduated Penn State, I started working at Brooklyn youth chorus, which is where I've been the past seven years, I knew I wanted to teach and I knew I wanted to be in a place that would fill in the gaps of being an educator from the non teaching side. That's like administration, that's like building community with principals and like learning schools. And so through Brooklyn youth chorus, I was able to be at several different schools at a time as a teaching artists, and that led to me being director of the school outreach program and conducting many after school choirs. It was amazing and wonderful. And then I went to teachers college to get my master's degree. And during that time, I was able to meet some fantastic people, while also continuing my work with Brooklyn youth chorus. And once I graduated from TC, it's actually through my connections with Brooklyn youth chorus and the New York City school system that I was able to land my current job, which is PS 32. My heard about it through one of the principals I worked under through Brooklyn youth choir, she was like, Denise, you need to be doing this over here. And the rest is history. But having someone as a mentor that looks like you that shares parts of your identity, when they say representation is everything. That's what it means. Like I'm the byproduct of that. And so I knew once I went into the classroom, I wanted to be the person that I didn't have. I wanted to be like, Dr. Leach, I wanted to be out with my students. I wanted to encourage those conversations about identity, about sexuality in a safe way that promoted love that promoted truth that promoted honesty, that promoted safety that promoted belonging, because that's what I got at Penn State, I was able to find this black queer man who was able to do that for me. And I was like, wow, I want to do this for elementary age students. And I knew that early on that that was the age group I wanted to work with. at Brooklyn youth sports. I started with middle and high school. And I was like, you know, I can do this on my sleeve. I can do this at any given moment. But like, the need is really Elementary. When we think about what kids think about as their formative childhood experiences that like lead into adulthood, a lot of them can refer back to elementary school, The Good, the Bad, and the ugly. And when I think about my identity, being positive for so many years, like elementary school was the main reason why I remain closeted, and didn't want to talk about my identity, I had very traumatizing and harmful experiences as a young child in schools specifically. And I knew that as I became an educator, I wanted to prevent that as much as possible for other children who have similar experience where they have questions about their identity, or they want to try something or they want to talk to an adult, I wanted to ensure that I was that person, wherever space that I inhabited to support young people. So yeah, that's how I got here thinking about my personal experiences first, starting with me. So I think about what did I need to thrive not just to flourish, but to thrive? What will have my life been had I had these things in place? Or had I been able to talk about what I was feeling or experiencing from the inside and out? So yeah, I'm just grateful that I'm in this position now to do this work. But it's been a long journey of getting to you're using your words self reflection, and thinking about what is my place in the world? What do I want to do? What stones have I not turned over that I need to reconcile and deal with? Before I take on the important essential job of being a teacher of young minds? Wow. So there's so much juicy stuff in there.

08:50
I love the

08:52
I love the juice. I will I guess start with the last thing, the last piece that you said, because I think that's a good place to go. You talked about no stone left unturned. And right before we we got on the live with this podcast. You know, we talked about how that piece of self reflection and personal development is a missing piece in a lot of the education for teachers about this. And the training isn't there, you know, when we get to this space? I've heard a lot of times it's like, well, we're not we're not therapists. We're not school social workers. No, no, we're not. But we are very much human.

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And these things that we're talking about right now seem foreign, because we've never done them before. That hasn't been part of our tradition. But we're actually not moving into spaces that we don't already inhabit. We're actually able to see a little bit more clearly. Yes, he talks about some of the things that you've encountered along the way either resistance which I love, I love some good resistance when I can really talk to someone about that. Maybe we'll start there. What are some of the resistance that

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comes up, and how do you navigate that to create safety to have these conversations in the first place? Yeah, I love this question so much. So for me, I'm always navigating two major identities that I consider to be very front facing. And for me, it's my blackness, and my queerness. And no matter what space I'm in, I'm automatically by default in opposition to dominant culture. So I'm always in opposition for being a black person, I'm always an opposition for being a queer person. So I really just hit the ground running every time. And I always unfortunately, I spent a lot of years always being on the defense for those two things. If I'm in a predominantly white space, I'm already on the defense for being black. If I'm in a predominantly black space, I'm on a defense for being queer. So just thinking about, instead of having the mindset of being on the defense, I switch my perspective to being joyful about who I am, and not apologizing about it, and not worrying about like, am I going to be received by people because I am black, or because I'm queer. But now my mindset is, you're welcome. I'm here, and like, let's have a conversation about, you're welcome. Because I'm doing you a favor by being here. And so it took like a lot of years of therapy and building up my competence, to shift that mindset of like, you know, what, sure, I have people who are black, and people who are queer are victims of society. But like, I'm not choosing into that narrative, I am choosing into the narrative of I'm a victor. I'm an overcomer, I am resilient, I'm standing, I am an overcomer, people have so much to learn from me and I have so much more to share. So it really is about shifting the mindset from victim to Victor, and being able to share and learn from each other because the world is missing out on so much if we don't allow ourselves to be in spaces that don't look like us, or may not receive us, like leaning into the conflict or the uncomfortable situation. And you know, with this new mindset that I have, I feel like I've been able to be in community with people and grow together, my motto was stronger together. And society is unable to progress if we don't allow that conflict, and that learning and the misunderstandings to happen. And I know not everyone is built for it. I know that for me that as part of my purpose to kind of be a disrupter people been black people been gay, we're here, let's talk about it. Because again, thinking about children, these are the lives that they are living, and they need advocates in their corner to rally for them to advocate for them to fight for them to stand up for them, in some instances to be a mouthpiece for them. Because a lot of people unfortunately, don't listen to children. And they know and have so much. So I like to think of my about myself sometimes as like a mouthpiece because I just I'll just repeat what the child said, since you're not listening, because child's been saying this for you know, forever and ever. But yeah, I hope that answers your question. Oh, and then some. So there's a couple of places to I want to go. First of all is mindset is everything. You have a choice of what narrative you want to subscribe to? Yes. And I want to talk about this for a second. Because when I come into spaces, and I talk about this, and they are heterogeneous spaces, as a white person, it is inside, I have conflict within myself saying that, because, again, these are stones that I still have to turn over. How can I sit here and say to you, your victimhood that you're experiencing with your narrative that you're choosing is a choice? So I want to know, how do you personally because this is something that I'm continuing to work on, and I learn and I grow and I make mistakes, and I do it again? How do you create safe spaces to have those conversations where you can tell people those narratives or choices, and you have an opportunity to see exactly what's in front of you from a different perspective that allows you to be the victor instead of a victim. So I think it's a few things. I think one is really about cultivating community first. And I think no space is safe. If there's no community because we feel safe. People feel safe when they're at home. And I use that term loosely. They feel safe around trusted loved ones. So it's really about developing trust and cultivating a sense of community because community is not just a physical space, per se. And we've learned that through the pandemic, a lot of us have been able to cultivate these virtual communities where you can gather and affinities basis or not affinity spaces and just feel safe, to share to be yourself to let your hair down to not have the white gaze of society filtering through your everywhere.

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are. So it's really about thinking about how can you develop trust amongst each other. And that's a really nuanced difficult thing when you're thinking about negotiating your different identities, whether it's gender, or sexuality or race, like a lot of us feel safe around different things. And it takes a lot of time and extra work to foster that sense of security. When people are navigating multiple identities all the time. There's no real one answer. But what I do know to be a fact is, how can you cultivate that community and build trust amongst each other, when so much of that is missing in our world today? So yeah, yeah. And I think you're right, sometimes it's uncharted territory for a lot of these spaces to even go there. Right. And, you know, you said, creating a community of trust, which inherently can create safety and the work that I'm doing in trauma informed practices. When we talk about trauma informed practices, it's not like this big T trauma all the time, this practices is just about creating safety. And because at the end of the day, we all have trauma. Yes, yeah. No, it's all right. You know, it's either big T trauma or little T trauma. This isn't, you know, a hierarchy of struggling here, we all have struggle, we all have pain. And in my world, too, I joke, everything's a trauma response, right? We're all we're all kind of bumping up in search responses. Always, always all the triggers all the time.

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That's just just part of being human, you know. So, first of all, having this greater understanding that that's the case, and then creating steps to make spaces safe for these conversations to even take place. So can you speak on an example of how to do that? Because before I'm gonna have you answer this, I just want to be clear, too, is that we talked about this before. And for everyone who's listening, who knows about empowered educator work is that until the adults become comfortable enough with themselves in this kind of work, nothing changes. So it doesn't matter what kind of culturally responsive teaching initiative or SEL initiative you have for the kids. If you are not actively being reflective in this work, it's never going to work. So how do we create? Or maybe what are some strategies or some things that you've done with your work in this arena to facilitate some of these safe spaces? So I have a short answer, but it's very complicated. To your point of like, you have to do the internal work, just do it. It's literally that simple. But What's complicated about it is you have to do that work on the inside. Because it takes courage. It takes it means taking risks. It means putting yourself on the front line of defense. And these are all things that I do whenever I just do it. And when it comes to having conversations about sexuality, or about race and racism, I just say things out loud. And by me doing that, it disrupts this whole narrative of one, these are things that you can't talk about in school, it disrupts the narrative of you can't say this to small children. And it also allows kids to talk about it in a safe space with an adult that's giving them permission to ask the questions and have the conversations. So even though the answer just do it as simple, there's a lot of work I had to get to having the conversation. So I'll give you an example is like whenever I share my sexual orientation with my students, and I've done this, I share with my kindergarteners all the way up to fifth grade, I teach pre K to fifth grade. And like I have the identity conversation all the time, I have taught a lesson on personal pronouns to my first graders using a little song, but all of that I had to kind of move my ego out of the way in order for that learning and that safety to happen for my students. Because it's not about me, for some students. Hearing about personal pronouns is like life or death. Unfortunately, in our country, there's like the suicide rates for LGBTQ plus children is so high, and little things like affirming pronouns, affirming names that our students wants to go by, is life or death. So I always have that. In the back of my mind when I'm taught sharing my identity. It's like it's not about me, and like, yes, it is very uncomfortable is terrifying every time I have to do it, but I've also done, you know, work on my own, to feel confident each time I do it and to feel less fear does well, I always feel some level of fear. Sure. But does it get easier each time? Yes. So to answer your question, like it really is just about doing the things and saying things out loud, especially the things that

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We're most nervous, say it out loud. Like for me, another personal motto I have is if I have fear about saying or doing it, it means I need to do it. So I've been leaning into the uncomfortable leaning into the fear and just allowing myself to be, because that's what our students deserve. And that's what they want to do. But they don't necessarily have permission yet. So somebody doesn't charge us, we have to do that work. So they can feel free to do things and to say things out loud and not feel like they're wrong, or that they're gonna get in trouble. This is another thing about when kids say something that could come off as bullying, I always feel like that as a child sincere cry to either want to talk about it, want to learn more about it, or they're in a hate filled space, where this response is taught, there's a whole lot of stuff under that, that we have to pull out and again, move ego out the way because it's never about us. It's never about our feelings being hurt is really about what's the root of what this child is saying, what do they really need. So again, just do it have the conversation. So the things that you're saying are so like I say that about fear all the time, it's a green light, unless it's fear about touching a hot stove, which is danger, which is different. Fear is a green light. And that's biology. And I'm not going to get into that right now. But that's that's what happens when you're doing something uncomfortable, and your system doesn't think you're safe. So there's going to be fear involved with that. But the dropping of the ego, that's something that we also have to learn through work either through coaching or through therapy. And the truth is, you don't think twice when someone's like, I really want to get in shape and join a gym. But we have this idea that something really big needs to happen in order to go to therapy, or therapy is some sort of weakness, but say you can't read the label from inside the wine bottle.

21:48
So

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you need someone there to just reflect back at you otherwise, you're you, you literally can't see because our blind spots are huge. And again, part of that is safety. Because our ego doesn't want to be wrong, wants to be right and wrong. What does that mean about us? What does that mean about it, and there's all of the stuff that's in there. And it doesn't mean you're wrong, it doesn't mean you're bad, it doesn't mean you can't or you shouldn't, all it means is that you have an opportunity, again, switching that mindset, to talk with somebody to untangle those things and turn over those stones. Yes, very that very that. And I also wanted to mention that like, I am kind of speaking from a biased perspective, and that I work in Brooklyn, New York, I have a very liberal principle that allows me to have these difficult conversations. So for anyone listening, who was not in that kind of supportive environment that wants to engage in talking about student and sexuality, or race or whatever different intersections of our identity, use your classroom use after school programming, we can affect the school building, a lot of times we can affect the district. But when those doors are closed, you might have a little bit more flexibility to do things. And I've also used SEO as like my like, pass or gateway to like, get more into talking about identity with kids and with myself. Also, after school programming is a different system. So like leaning into those spaces to try to have those conversations with students. But I did want to say out loud and acknowledge that I am in a more liberal environment. So I do have that flexibility. And one last thing I want to say is, it's a lot easier to ask for forgiveness than permission. So another thing I don't really do, I don't really ask permission, I just ask for forgiveness. So I just wanted to say that out loud. Like,

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I didn't know I'm like, wow, I wasn't supposed to do that. I'm so sorry, operated the same way throughout my entire

23:59
will will spend a year asking for permission never to get an answer, then the work never gets done. Whereas if we just do it, and then we'll see what happens. At least we did the thing that we wanted to do. Yeah, well, and you know, I'm glad that you said that, because that was actually my next question about how you know you're in a space where you feel safe and supported to do these things. And so many teachers out there don't, what you're saying is, is one avenue. But I also want to encourage you know, folks who might be feeling this way is really take a look at your values and what you truly believe and your mission and your vision. Because if it doesn't align with the place that you're at you again have two choices. You can stay in victimhood and complain about it and say I feel stuck. I don't know what to do. They're not letting me this and I can't do this or you always have a choice to leave.

24:55
Right? Is it easy? No, it is not. It's not easy, but if it's

25:00
have a chance to do something that aligns with you that can open doors to your ability to make massive impact on the kids that you want to reach, then it is in your best interest to go someplace that's going to be supportive of that. Yes. And I will say I am very spiritual. I prayed for this school that I'm in now. And I want to encourage anyone who is like, not sure which way to go, there is a school just for you. It exists, there is leadership that wants to nurture and support you, that aligns with your values that aligns with what you want to do, and how you want to get back into how you want to teach. But you have to have the courage to say out loud exactly what you want for it to happen for it to come your way. Because I was very specific. I was like, I want to be under a black woman principle. I wrote it down as I want to be under a black Auntie, I feel like black aunties and save the world. I want to be in Brooklyn, I want to be at a community school. And like everything was just like Check, check, check, check, check, check. That's the power that your perspective that your energy that your prayer that your beliefs, add, you have to have the courage to put it out there, though. And I feel like a lot of us stop with not being specific about what we want. And then we don't get it. We complain and we're frustrated. But it's like, did you take the time to declare exactly what you want? You can't manifest it? If it's not what you want? Did you ever say it out loud? Did you ever write it down? These are things I've done for myself, and I have the receipt, sound approve it for all the work that I'm doing. But like, it's that simple. And that impactful. It's real, it really does happen. Like I'm a witness, I'm right there with you, I drinking the same juice that you are.

26:53
You know, there's there's so much to this, right. And I mean, we could go on forever talking about this, maybe we might have to do this, and I'll be back we'll talk about

27:03
first of all, it's an understanding of making it okay, and not just okay, but you're right, as a human being to want more, yes, and to say I desire something more and something else. So that's the first piece of this that you are again, you don't have to have to stay in this space, just because this is the way it is, it's the way it is because that's what you think it is. And then that's it. Then focusing again, placing your focus and attention on what you want, instead of what you don't want, which is also really tricky. Baja frameworks, really being intentional on where you place your thoughts, and your energy, and your focus and attention is going to get you the things that aligned with what you want, which also takes some practice, but those receipts, I think, between the two of us alone, we have you

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know, back and

28:03
tell me, you know, in talking about alignments, and just really living your purpose and your dream and truly, you know, what you said what you were born to do, you landed yourself in this new position with welcoming schools. I want to know more about this, because this was new to me. And I want to know what the initiatives are and what is your role here? Yes, oh, I am so blessed because I had no idea this existed. I know about human rights campaign, I had no idea that there was an educational initiative nationwide that supports teachers, and LGBTQ plus inclusions elementary through high school, as well as bullying prevention through an anti racist lens. So I just happen to meet the right people at the right time. I was recommended to apply for this program through a dear friend of mine, Dr. Power Hammond, who I met through a panel, open up pandemic. Now the person I've met in person, but she's like my dear sister, and she was running a panel for New York City teachers who are both black and LGBTQ identities, like how does your positionality help serve schools? I've never lost touch with her. She sent me an email the end of January. She was like, I saw this and this is you. Now before this, for I heard about this. I just started really digging deep into teaching elementary school teachers and parents about how to affirm children's identities because that mindset kids started to we have children who are expressing themselves as young as kindergarten as trans and non binary, and it's super duper wonderful. But there's resistance with anything that's new about like, how do we do this? And how do we have these conversations and how do we support parents for all of the first half of 2021 I was like, looking at resources and figuring out ways to support parents and to

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Teachers and doing this because I have a unique lived experience as a queer person to help contribute a conversation, but also learning myself and you know, working on an elementary school, there was a lack of resources. So I thought regarding how to teach kids about their identity. So what welcoming school does, they do several things. They have booklets, they have lesson plans on how to teach kids about sexual identity, gender orientation, all of the things to support them and their learning in school. And they have six different modules that will take teachers and educators through ways to ensure that one, their curriculum is being inclusive of students identities, that the policies and their schools are also being clear about that, that teachers know how to navigate difficult conversations around gender, and sexuality. So it's really a holistic approach of how to support students who are LGBTQ identify, but also prevent bias based bullying, with information and its data as a data driven program. It's super functional for teachers, because in every single workshop, you have an opportunity to practice talkbacks of how would you respond to this, if a student says some real time how to respond to this, if a parent sends you this email, how do you respond to this, if this difficult conversation comes up, and you have to be a mediator, and so on, and so forth. So it is a nationwide initiative, it is supported by the government, it is data driven instruction, it is functional, it's been just mind blowing for me, because as a person who was creating these workshops from scratch, here's a program that has has existed for almost 10 years now, that's been doing the same work that really provides a holistic way to support children in schools. So I can go on and on about welcoming schools, but like, I recommend all schools to apply for a training, there are different 90 minute trainings that you can sign up for, but it is so worth it, to just have the support of a national organization to do this work, especially for the states like Florida, like Texas, that have all this anti gay legislation. Since we are a national nationwide organization, we can still engage in this work in those states. So just saying that out loud. I am a national facilitator. So I am one of the people going to schools around the country, both virtual and in person. So if you're listening to this, and you feel like you need support, welcoming schools.org is the website, you can also find it on my website, Eric williamson.org, to apply for a consultation and figure out which module best supports you. Again, this is elementary through high school. And we do cater every single training by age by level. So like elementary has a different workshop in high school and a middle school and so on and so forth, but to adapt to the communities that we're going to be serving. And the reason why it's so effective is that they are all run by current teachers. So every single facilitator is either a current teacher, or current administrator, or current guidance counselor. Because teachers know teachers, we know what we need, we know what's missing, we know what's lacking. And we cater these workshops to serve those gaps. And kind of being biased. I've never experienced a Professional Learning Series that allows teachers to try and the way that we get them to engage in these difficult conversations on the spot. And again, leaning into the uncomfortable giving you tools and resources because we have to stop hate when it happens. We can't just allow things to be said and not doing anything about it. And what I appreciate about welcoming schools is it's very proactive and not reactive. It's all about like, when this is said, you get to say this, when this is done, you get to respond in this way. When this policy in your school is passed, here's a way to navigate and negotiate that to ensure that your students and staff feel supported. So it really is a holistic way to just affirm identity. So yeah, that's welcoming schools. Amazing. And all of those links and everything will be in the podcast notes. So everyone have super easy access to them and access to you as well. So the last question that I have for now because we are passing another conversation.

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What is your big dream for education? My dream for education is that all students regardless of race, sexuality, gender identity, gender expression, can go to school and just be students. They don't have to worry about anything else. There is a liberation and learning and unfortunately right now in our

35:00
society there are many barriers prevent students from Liberated Learning. So our students are able to come into school and just learn and experience the joy of learning. And they have no other responsibility, but to be a student, and to experience the joy of learning and for educators to also enter an educational spaces with the same feeling of joy and liberation to just be. So that is my vision, joy and liberated spaces for all. Yes, yes to all of it. The reason why I asked this question to everyone who's on this podcast is exactly what you just said, If you don't say your dreams out loud, then how can they possibly come true? And it's my hope that when people listen to everyone's dreams, collectively, we start to ascend into a place where these dreams start to come true and manifest. I believe that

35:59
I'm there with you like we are stronger to gather and how powerful it is for us to share our dreams and our visioning together there is no single dream that is a live there are dreams within us and we can all achieve it with each other's help. No one is by themselves. And I will end by saying there's a way for us to deconstruct white supremacy and those hateful ideals as for us to be in community together. Yes, yes, we have to do this work together. It is not anyone by themselves in isolation. It is us rallying and being co conspirators doing this work together rooted and love proactive love, but that we will get through this. Yes, yeah.

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Spiral I was like, let me not spiral because I could easily spiral we have to respect which I

37:03
know I love every word. And like I said, this conversation is so not over. So for now, thank you for your time and your talents and the work that you are doing and the work that you are sharing. It is incredible. And I am humbled that you wanted to hang out and spend some time with me today, and I'm looking forward to it again. Yay. Thanks so much for having me. I really appreciate it. My pleasure. And if you liked today's episode, make sure you subscribe and write a nice review and we'll see you next time. Ah, bye

Does the simple act of sitting down to look at your finances stress you out?

Do you avoid tapping on your bank app because you tend to think ignorance is bliss?

When you think about money, do you shift directly into scarcity mindset, and feel your body contract?

As we uncover our stressors, one thing that comes up over and over again is money. And while it may not have to do directly with the stressors at school, money can cause feelings of anxiety and worry, which directly affects how we show up for our students.

Welcome back to Take Notes with Jen Rafferty! In this second episode, I’m chatting with Financial Literacy Coach Diana Greshtchuk. As the CEO of Fan Your Flame, she teaches financial literacy to clients utilizing her 20 years of experience in the financial services industry.

We have an honest talk about what it takes to feel empowered in our actions and choices when it comes to money. We cover everything from the generational money stories that subconsciously guide us, to the disempowering beliefs that take control of our finances- and most importantly, how to heal and move forward.

Diana shares some trauma informed financial tips you may not have considered before, that I’m certain will change your perspective.

Today is all about creating curiosity around finances, financial planning for teachers and educators, changing the language we use when referring to it, and regulating your nervous system while not deluding yourself and perpetuating the problem.

You can figure this out! The tools are all here for you.

When you use intention coupled with awareness you become unstoppable!


Stay empowered,
Jen


Let’s keep the conversation going! Find me at:

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About Diana Greshtchuk

Diana (She/Her) is the CEO of Fan Your Flame LLC, a financial literacy coach, and your best financial friend. She is passionately committed to guiding entrepreneurs, businesses and individuals to achieve a wide variety of financial goals. Diana utilizes pioneering methods rooted in practical financial concepts, business acumen, and mindset work to educate and empower her clients to achieve goals of financial independence, transformation, and abundance.
Diana is a Certified Master Mind Magic Practitioner™ and is a Certified Emotional Intelligence Practitioner. By day, she is a VP of Fund Accounting & Finance at a private equity/venture capital firm based in Los Angeles, and holds an active Certified Public Accountant (CPA) designation in the State of California. She’s a seasoned investor, venture capitalist, and angel investor for aspiring female entrepreneurs with 20 years of experience in the financial services industry.
Diana gives back to the community by volunteering as a Board Member for the Point Foundation, a non-profit organization that empowers promising lesbian, gay, bisexual, transgender, and queer students to achieve their full academic and leadership potential – despite the obstacles often put before them – to make a significant impact on society.

Website: www.fan-your-flame.com

Freebie: Visit www.disruptinginertia.com to learn how you can disrupt inertia to change your money story!

Schedule a free 30 minute discovery call with me to begin your journey of personal financial literacy.

Email: fanyourflamellc@gmail.com

Social Media Handles/Links:
FB: https://www.facebook.com/
FanYourFlameLLC
IG: https://www.instagram.com/FanYour
FlameLLC/
LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/company/fan-your-flame-llc, https://www.linkedin.com/in/
dianagreshtchuk/
Twitter: http://twitter.com/FanYourFlameLLC

Point Foundation Fundraising Page: https://pointfoundation2021.funraise.org/
fundraiser/diana-greshtchuk-988efad?fundraiserPrompt=2062619

TRANSCRIPT:  
as people start to uncover their stressors, one thing that comes up over and over again is money. And while it may not have to do directly with the stressors at school, money can cause feelings of stress and anxiety worry, which of course directly affects how we show up for our students. Being an empowered educator is truly about holistic well being. And today's episode is all about financial hygiene and getting your financial house in order. Hello, and welcome back to take notes. I'm here today with one of my favorite people in the world. Diana Greshtchuk. And Diana is not only an incredibly important person to me, but she is also the CEO of fan your flame and is a Financial Literacy Coach. And I wanted to bring her on to talk about financial health and how important financial health is to our holistic well being, which fits really well into tenant aid of empowered educator which is of course, a sustainable means of self care. So hi.


Hi, thanks for having me today. Of course,


so glad you're here. I would love for you to share a little bit about yourself with our listeners, where you're from and how you got to be a Financial Literacy Coach.


Sure. Hey, everyone. I'm Diana Grace Chuck, I am based in Los Angeles, California, I opened up fan your flame, a financial literacy coaching business, this past Ember 2021. And that vortex week between Christmas and New Year's where you don't really know what day it is. So I just decided to start my company, then. I'm actually doing that on the side at the moment. So I do have a day job. But I am also very experienced in the financial services industry with 20 years experience as an auditor at the Big Four public accounting firms and then in private industry at various asset managers in Seattle. I also did a brief stint in Sydney, Australia for a while. And so with 20 years of financial services experience, there is a lot of financial literacy that I have, that I think a lot of people need in order to have access to building their wealth, sort of on a DIY basis. So I work with clients to build their financial literacy. It's sort of like learning to speak a new language. And so it's learning to read and write understand speak finance, which I think a lot of people aren't really comfortable with unless they went to school for it like me.


Oh, absolutely. It's like you go to college. And I remember my parents kind of quickly teaching me how to write a check before they shipped me off. That was I think the extent of my financial literacy.


Yeah. And who writes checks anymore, right? And how do you reconcile a bank account if you don't use a checkbook, and it's all online. And I do write checks to I mean, I like to delay payment of my bills, so that the utility companies get my money as late as possible.


I have two checks that I write every month. But you're right, everything is now even different from when we grew up. yet. We're trying to navigate a space that we don't have any education about. So causes a lot of stress. And you know, when I talk with teachers about some of the things that stressed them out, when we go into the beginning parts of empowered educator, especially, we just kind of uncover all of our stressors in our lives, these external things, money comes up more often than not. So, you know, I want to know, from your experience with financial coaching and financial literacy, what seems to be some of the biggest causes of the stress when it comes to money.


So I think once people do a preliminary assessment, or as I call it, go on a money date with themselves, and they get a lay of the land, a current financial snapshot that tells them where everything is right now. Assets, liabilities, income and expenses. It can be very confronting, to see what situation you're in. And so stressors that can come out of just the awareness. Number one because I think a lot of people live their finances ignorantly, they tend to think ignorance is bliss. If I don't check the bank account, there's still gonna be money in there. It's like Schrodinger, his balance. And so when people start just having that awareness that can bring a lot of stress, just sitting down, checking your bank accounts can be stressful, but then beyond that, once you have an awareness, I think a lot of people instantly shift to this scarcity mindset. And what I mean by that is there's not enough money. I don't have enough cash. I have a large amount of debt. I don't make enough If money I'm spending too much, it's about not having enough of this resource. And that can cause stress and a lot of people.


So you mentioned this idea of a money date. And I want to just ask a little bit more about that, because you're right. And I've been guilty of this too, especially early on, but before Diana days, when he taught me better, but you know, I also used to be afraid to check my balances. Because again, if I didn't, I didn't know I didn't know. Right? So how do you use what you described as a money date to kind of maybe ease that transition to even look?


Yes. So the trick is, number one, pour yourself a glass of wine, pour yourself a glass of scotch, whatever your go to. Relaxing, Safe Space creator is maybe it's just a cup of Kool Aid, we don't know maybe it's lemonade from the lemonade stand around the corner that the kids got going, whatever it is, bring comfort, find a comfortable place to sit, light a candle, put on some light music, something that eases your nervous system, grab a popsicle, just make sure that you can sit down and get financially naked with yourself, create a safe space, to be financially naked with yourself. Because honestly, if you can't be honest with yourself, if you can't look at the situation for what it is, you're just going to end up deluding yourself and perpetuating the problem. So going on a money date starts with creating safety in your system and a safe, comfortable place to look at the state of affairs.


And I'm really glad you said that about making it safe in your system, because that's something we talk a lot about. And that's a consistent theme throughout empowered educator is understanding that your nervous system is going to be activated when it feels unsafe. And for a lot of people looking at that account is not doesn't feel safe. So creating that that safety is so important. And yeah, I've had to have a popsicle on many occasion. What I'm trying to do things that I don't want to do, because it just creates that that sense of calm. Yeah,


absolutely. And I think that can ease some of the stress. But I think beyond that, once you're honest with yourself, what will ease the stress for a lot of people will be taking action based on the decisions you make when you see the state of affairs.


And that actually brings me to what I was going to ask you next was that action is so important. So how do people then start to feel empowered in their actions and in their choices? To look to the situation? We're aware now we've created the safety. But now what?


Right? So I think that's when you know, we've inherited generational money stories, we learned how to be around money from our parents, their relationship with money, I'll tell you, my parents when I grew up, they argued about money all the time. And it's because they came from a generation that survived the great depression, it was all about scarcity. It was all about the cost of things. And so when you see how your parents react to money, if they're constantly arguing about it, then that teaches you that money is to be argued about. Right. So then you have this disempowering belief that if I take control of my finances, I'm gonna have to argue about it. I have to argue with my spouse, that's how we handle money. That's how it's done. So that can create this feeling of disempowerment. That's a disempowering belief that money causes that. So I think to shift to empowered, I want to give a really simple example. Let's say, you know, you and your spouse are looking at buying a bike for your kid, and your kid wants this great new bike, I don't even think Toys R Us is around anymore, but wherever you buy bikes now, and so your spouse says to you, we can't afford this. Okay, first of all, that's a scarcity mindset. That's a disempowering belief that we can't afford this. The simple shift might be if you reply to your spouse, well, how are we going to afford this? By creating that curiosity? By opening up the door and not saying I can't, but instead, how do I that allows you to then figure out financing for this? Do you talk to their grandparents and see if the grandparents want to buy the gift for them? Do you want to use some of your credit card balances to go into debt to buy the kid that bike so there are ways to finance it. But it goes from a shift from I can't afford this to how do I afford this and that can be empowering, because it lets you control and make the choice that it's not that Oh, I have to be resentful and by this by If you know they're going to leave it outside, it's going to be awful. Whereas you can shift and it becomes, wow, I get to give my kid this bike. And it's going to create a lot of great memories for them, all kinds of things. And so it really lets you take control and take power of your choice to buy the bike.


It's so fascinating to me that those small shifts in our language and intention can have huge impacts in the way that we go about our world and make


choices. Absolutely, it's those little shifts can change how you see the world. And then suddenly the world looks different. You mentioned


generational money stories, and I want to touch back on that for a second, because that's something that hits home for me, too. I mean, even now, you know, and I've shared this with you before is, you know, when I hang out with my mom, and we're doing this or that money seems to come up in all sorts of ways that reminds me of the stories that I was made to believe about money when I was little that I'm still navigating through now. Can you just talk a little bit more about that generational piece? Because I think that's something that's so important that I think is overlooked, we don't even think to think about


it. Absolutely. So with the generational wealth transference, here, I think you can inherit beliefs around money from your parents. But then you also have a choice to break the cycle, or as I say, disrupt inertia. So when you're talking about ways to empower yourself, you don't have to make the same choices as your parents, they had a set of beliefs that govern their day to day choices. And that was on autopilot. And I think something you teach and empowered educator is not to be on autopilot and awareness, maybe through breathing brakes, what are you doing at a certain point in time. So having that awareness and making conscious new choices with intention, can break the generational money trauma that your family has sustained? If your mom is running around talking about the price of chicken today, and how it's so expensive, you can make a choice to say, You know what, I don't care whether the chicken is 50 cents more expensive, I bought the chicken, it's fine. That's an empowered choice.


Taking it even a step further, you know, these are conversations I've even had with my mom. And because when we're talking about these generational stories and the work that I do, and understanding that we inherit these things, I feel grateful that I even get to have these conversations with her to talk about what where did this come from, and she's been able to share with me the money stories that were then passed down to her from my grandmother. So it's really opened up a door to an unusual conversation about money in a way that I never anticipated.


Yeah, and I'll tell you another one, there's a generation before us that is afraid of using debt, or going into debt. And there can be good debt, typically having a mortgage and buying a home that's considered good debt. It's a low interest rate, it's for an investment, it's for an asset that appreciates, you have a plan to pay it back. And so there's a generation out there that just wants you to be debt free, and they assume that you're safe. But how are you ever going to grow and do big things, and maybe those ideas that you need to get financed and you can't afford? Maybe debt is what opens the door. And so it's nothing to be afraid of, if you can use it wisely. So that's something different to where you can break the generational traditional thinking. I like to say traditions are just peer pressure pressure from dead people. So I think when you get an opportunity to look that in the face and say Is that really a good tradition I want to carry on. You can do a lot with that.


That's huge. And you know, by the way, those of you have heard me say tradition is just peer pressure from dead people. I totally took that from Diana. That was Diana's first before it ever was my but yeah, you're right. And making again, those conscious choices from a place of awareness takes effort. That's its work. It is work. And from where I'm standing, it's some of the most important work.


Agreed, agreed, because the inner work is what makes the outer work work. You need to have for money and wealth, strategies to be executed. You need to have a mindset of the long game. You can't be available for the swings in the market that are crazy for short term job losses, like you have to be available for that like that just happens but you know what I'm saying like you don't let that get to your inner environment and you navigate it all knowing that you have everything you need already, and you can find another job You can figure out another source of income, you can figure it all out.


Yeah. And then coming from that place, again of empowerment, changes everything. Because now you're looking at opportunity instead of scarcity and vast nothingness.


And whether you believe you can or whether you believe you can't, you're right.


Absolutely. And what's so interesting too, and I always bring this back is that exact quote, Henry Ford, right? Teachers know this quote, and we tell this to our students, all the time, this is something we just we it just comes out of our mouth, you know, the kids struggling with the math problem. And they're like, Well, you know, if you think you can, or think you can't, you're right. But when it comes to looking in the mirror, you know, this is why empowered educator exists is because we're able to hold up a mirror to ourselves, and how are we actually embodying some of the things that we share with our students about growing and expansion and becoming this fullest? You? And like you'd like to say you're USU?


Absolutely, absolutely.


So one of the things that I think is it really easy concept for people when it comes to managing money, and we've talked about this before is this idea of budgeting, which can sometimes seem really restrictive. So I'm wondering if you can share some of the things that you share with your clients about budgeting, so people can start to feel really good about their financial choices?


Absolutely. I think some of the budgeting can feel constructive, because it's about your mind showing you what you're losing. So that's when you have to cut costs in your budget. And so, when it comes to budgeting, I think that in order to create an abundance mindset, and not a scarcity mindset, it's really coming from a place of gratitude, number one, and number two, putting your money where your mouth is, and I'll say that a different way, spending your money in an aligned way that syncs up with how you want to be in the world that embodies for you putting money towards a charitable nonprofit that aligns with your personal mission, certain expenses, if you don't want to have television in your home, you might opt to budget for something other than that, you may pay for a museum pass if you don't want to pay for television subscriptions, so it's about aligned spending. And then when you factor in, that your mind is constantly showing you loss. And so budgets can feel tight. I really work with my clients to create a budget that feels spacious, it's not going to work. If it's me telling you you can't have something I need them to buy into what they're willing to cut and what they're willing not to cut. So we take a look, once they have their financial snapshot, we look at you know, what line items do you really need in here? What are they actually doing for you? Are they meeting some part of your needs? Are they fulfilling a mission or a purpose that you care about? And if not, can we


get rid of it. So that, again, also creates awareness and holding up a mirror. And I think that's why having a financial coach and someone who is outside of your situation is so important, because you feel like you need to have someone to reflect to mirror back at you because holding it up yourself. Sometimes you don't see everything.


Yeah, often there are blind spots that we don't realize that we have. And so there can be things that make it really hard to hold up a mirror to your own financial situation. So you know, you can always get a friend and have an accountability party. And both of you are just like really? Did you need that? Did you need new earrings?


Yes. In my case, always. Yes. Because a purpose for me, Diana, thank you. So I want to know what is something that listeners can do today that can help either change their money story or start to approach their financial decisions a little bit differently?


Well, I want to ask a question for all of your audience members out there. So if you did something for someone, and they didn't say thank you, would you be inclined to do something for someone again? Probably not. So when you think about your relationship with money personify money. If money is doing something for you, and you're not grateful for it, and you don't express gratitude. is that money going to come back to you? Is it going to work for you again, that's what I encourage my clients to think about is their relationship with money. And so something that someone could choose to be in a disempowering state about, for example, paying bills, I like to turn that on its head. And when I'm paying bills, I express gratitude. It's been really hot this summer, I don't mind paying my utility bill, because I had lots of days of air conditioning. And I need that that's a priority. Thank you so much air conditioning, I will happily pay this bill. So when you are grateful for what you already have, you begin to see how much you have. And then it's not about scarcity and what you don't have, I go back to that Sheryl Crow song and the lyrics are, it's not getting what you want. It's wanting what you've got. So expressing gratitude is what I would tell people that today, you can start making a change with your relationship with money, if you express gratitude when it leaves you.


You know, I've heard you say this so many times, and it gets me single time. Because I think this is a crier. Well, you know, if there's a day that I'm not crying, something's wrong with me. You know, the thing is, that alone is so powerful. And it is the story of scarcity and lack is so pervasive, it's everywhere. So you know, when I hear this from you, and the variety of ways that you've said, It always strikes me slightly differently and serves again, it's just a constant reminder of how important it is to pay attention to your intentions, and how you approach not just everything but you know, specifically we're traveling when you do write the check, or when you do swipe the ATM card, or if you are buying something on Amazon, or you're paying a very large bill or a student loan, or whatever the intention that you have when you're paying that makes all the difference. It really does that is very powerful.


Yeah, I'll spend my money at all day going down that aisle getting something special. And yeah, I didn't need to spend that money, but it brought a lot of joy to my life. Thank you for that joy. Here, take my $5 for this crazy thing I bought.


And I may or may not know my affinity towards the crazy LD aisle. So my last question that I asked everybody on my podcast in some form is teachers lay the building blocks for all other careers, and truly have power to make this transformational generational change. And that's why we need to start with ourselves first in order to do this. And with that being said, And regarding your experiences in the financial world, what is your dream for the future of education,

I was always a lifelong learner, you go to my resume, the objective at the top is to continue learning for the rest of my life. I am dedicated to learning and financial literacy has been one component. But more broadly for teachers. What I really wish is that people would value education like I do, and when I say value education, make it work for them. But then also monetarily compensate teachers for the wide variety and array of BS. I don't know if I can swear on your podcast, I think the wide variety they have to put up with on a daily basis. There's active shooter drills, there's earthquakes, there's things that could happen unexpectedly. There's bad attitudes, there's everything you can think of like administration and bureaucracy and for people to value educators as much as they value the next generation that is learning from them, I think is going to be huge because there's right now contributing to this disparity you know, the upper 1% of wealth in America, I will guarantee none of them are teachers. So where I struggle is that for the other 99% that are trying to get by the daily rat race hamster wheel never enough money, but making it work like valuing education and literacy to the point where they can live an abundant life to because they don't have to worry about getting a second job or a third source of income just to make ends meet. That's what I wish for the future of it.


Huh? Yes, yes. shouting from the rooftops


please. Pay me Hello, see.


This has been fantastic and I'm so grateful that you wanted to come and be a part of this. I just love having more and more excuses to talk with you on Zoom. So before you go So can you please just share with our audience how they can get in touch with you and how they can learn more about you and potentially work with you?


Absolutely, you can head on over to my website, fan hyphen, your hyphen flame.com. You can follow me on Instagram and Facebook at fan your flame LLC. And you can find me that way. And we can get you all sorts of pluses from there.


Awesome. And you have a lot of free webinars and things to I wanted to highlight here


before. That's right. If you wanted to pop over and get a free one hour webinar, I've got four to choose from. One is on the 8020 principle. One is on how to make smarter decisions when you don't have all the information. One is for getting your financial house in order. And one is about debt being your ally. And so if you head on over to disrupting inertia.com that will allow you to pop in your email address and get your freebie video immediately. You can take a gander at that.


Amazing and I have to say, you know a little personal testimony there. I've seen all four of them. And I've taken notes and learn things and has really changed the way that I look at my own Financial Dashboard and inform some of the decisions that I made moving forward. So they're all extremely helpful.


Thank you. That's good to hear. I'm glad it can be helpful for folks. So Thanks, Jeff.


Yeah, absolutely. Well, thank you so much, Diana. I can't wait to have you back. We're going to do this again. We're not done talking about money here.


Oh, there's so many places we can go.


Can't wait. Alright, until next time. Have a good one and I will see you again soon.

TRANSCRIPT: 
I remember all the passion and vision you had when you went into teaching, feeling like building young minds and creating community through your work and make a lasting impact on this world. Those days may feel like they're behind you now, because you're exhausted and stressed, overwhelmed and frustrated. But I'm here to tell you, it doesn't have to be like this. In fact, your love of teaching never really went away, but it absolutely needs transformation. Welcome to The Take worlds Podcast. I'm Jen Rafferty, former music teacher, mom of two and certified emotional intelligence practitioner, and I am here to light the way for you. To create generational change for our kids, we need to shift the paradigm away from the perpetual stress and overwhelm and into a life of joy and fulfillment. This is education 2.0, where you become a priority, shift how you live your life, and how you show up both at work, and at home. So take a sip of steamy morning coffee, grab your notebook, it's time to take notes. Hello, and welcome to Season Two of take notes. I am ecstatic about this season, there have already been so many interviews recorded ready to go out to you to bring you some of the best information, inspiration and ways to integrate things into your practice that I'm just blown away by the people who have been on this season. And I cannot wait to share it with you. And I'm especially excited to kick off this season with one of my favorite people, my sister. Thank you, Rachel.


I'm so excited to be here.


This is a super special thing for me to be able to present this episode to you and to share her with all of you because Rachel and I have been working behind the scenes together in pretty much our whole lives. And it's as we have gotten older, particularly in the last few years of her going into her role and me kind of going into this new empowered educator role in my company, we have been going back and forth over and over what books are you reading? What new trainings are you getting? How are you looking at this? What are you doing here because Rachel is actually the head of learning and development at a company called vetinary Growth Partners. And as a content creator, she's a consultant and a speaker. She creates and delivers interactive leadership training programs that support veterinary practices in establishing or sustaining highly productive teams. And through conflict management and emotional intelligence training, Rachel works with teams to enhance their culture, boost team morale, and improve overall communication. And her goal is always to create fun and engaging learning programs that make leaders feel less alone. Give them the tools to excel in their roles and create beautiful moments of growth and awareness. So obviously, we have so much to share in what she does with her practices and what she does with the veterinary industry and what I do in education, because essentially, we're doing the same thing, just different industries. So Rachel, I'm so glad you're here.


I'm really so excited to be here. This is so fun, and especially adult lives. There's always been this like, how are you going to work together? How does you know you're in teaching? I'm in that med? How are our paths going to sort of cross in this way. And we're finally here. You're right, like there's this beautiful alignment and where we both are in our careers and what we're doing. It's been really fun to be able to work together in this way. So I'm really stoked. Thanks for Yeah,


yes. And so this conversation today, there are so many things we could have spoken about. But I think what is a little bit different and unique about some of your skill set that needs to be given the spotlight a little bit is your experience in conflict management, and your emotional intelligence training. Now we both took similar trainings in emotional intelligence, and you kind of went through it in slightly different venues as well. So you have different things to bring to the table, which I also want to talk about also. So let's start with why were you interested in emotional intelligence and more specifically, conflict management?


Yeah, so my journey in emotional intelligence actually started while I was between jobs. So I was in a job that left me completely drained. It was altogether too much. I found that when I was working in this role, I didn't have a voice. I became very submissive. I didn't advocate for myself and I really put myself in a tough spot physically mentally. As you know in that role is when I was diagnosed with lupus and I had a lot of shame around it. And unfortunately, all the stress of my job created a mental illness inside of me. And it just got to a breaking point like most of us have when you're just like, I just can't do this anymore. Like am I literally going to let this job kill me. And it really took a two trips to the hospital before I actually was willing to admit, almost admit defeat. And that was really hard for me. And so my emotional intelligence journey started when I left that job and the toxicity that it caused my life. And essentially, I went on this healing journey. And a part of that I called him a woman of leisure time, when I was in between that job and my next job. And I really had to find myself and one of our good friends and life coach Tracy lit, she actually at the time had recommended a Brene Brown book to me, she recommended oh my gosh, Daring Greatly


vary greatly. I remember my first introduction to Brene. Brown too.


Yes. So it was daring greatly. And I deliveries, I hesitate on the names because it's us so many. And I read them all. So it's like which one was always start. But Daring Greatly was that point, it was my aha moment, it was the click that I really needed to start rethinking who I am. And I happened to then go work for a company that was already doing emotional intelligence training in the industry. And it was just such a beautiful fit of me coming into this new role with this new version of myself that I had to recreate and figure out who I am and how it was that I got to a point where I let my values go. And I lost myself and then coming into a company that so deeply values this work to the point that we're actually teaching this to hundreds and hundreds of people that need this work as well. And so it was just really, it really sort of felt like Kismet that I found this company that was equally as invested and just saw the value of this work for our industry as much as I saw for myself. So that's the origin story.


Yeah, I'm so glad you said that. Because I refer to the origin story a lot. It's important that we connect with that origin story, because it provides an incredible amount of inspiration and grounding of like, Oh, right. This is why I've made these decisions. So I want to just go back for a second because you said a couple of things I want to hit on when you were diagnosed with lupus when you were in the hospital those few times it was scary for everyone around who was close to you. And what are the things you used to describe it just then was you kind of had to admit defeat? And I'm curious, looking back on it. Do you still see it that way as defeat?


No. And I'm glad you asked that. So yeah, so clarify, in the moment. And I remember crying about the sobbing about this, that wasn't a woman of awareness for me to that I realized how deeply I felt about being a quitter, and how this job was beating me and how me choosing myself. Like literally, that's how I saw it in those moments. That's sort of where I was personally, like, I was somebody and I still feel like I'm somebody who can do anything. I know that I can I have a ridiculous amount of competence in myself and my abilities to get things done and to do it. And it was like, I finally found something that I just had to say, I can't. And you know, it's one of those things that yeah, in those moments, I really did truly feel that it was hard for me to give up. Because I wanted so badly to really I guess myself, I don't think anyone else is sitting on the sidelines being like you better do this, you know, like everyone was telling you to do this. And so it was really an interesting insight into myself. Because before that moment, I don't know that I ever would have thought of myself as somebody who felt any sort of way about quitting right and what the word quitting means. And I found in that moment that I guess I did have some sort of identity crisis around being someone or thinking that doing this thing meant something. And it really just didn't, right. All it meant was that I was putting myself first. And it took me far too long to get to that choice. I let myself and my health get way too far away from me. In hindsight, I should have done it a lot sooner. And yes, I should have listened to all the people in my life who were like, Rachel, just stop. You don't have to do this, right. I just had a lot of pressure on myself and that real strong desire to succeed. But no, after all these years of work, I'm since then it's been about seven years. The work still happens on a daily basis. But the balance that I put on my life and the boundaries that I've put in my life, winning and having that sort of like imaginary trophy at the end of being able to feel like I did something. Yeah, that's gone. Now. The desire for me is always health and wellness first, as much as sometimes I make bad choices or the wrong choice. I still know deep down that that is my true priority. And so when I'm faced up against something now that it's like do I have to admit defeat, so to speak, right, and basically just either choose not to do something, ask for more help, whatever it is, or risk, my health, or my health is always coming first, that has been such a complete paradigm shift for me, being that person in bed who was not crying about her health, but crying about not being able to complete this task, which kind of speaks to my massive checklist person. Right? Yeah, check the box on this job and be like, No, check. I


did it. I love a good checklist. But I think that switch from this idea of first of all of what success is what it means to be successful. And understanding that if you're quitting something, because you're choosing yourself, you're actually winning. That's a huge, you know, really the underlying message of empowered educator, we go through all the tenants, and they kind of break down as to how we get there. But it's always about putting yourself first because that's how you feel empowered to make choices in your life that align with who you are. And I want to speak to something else that you said before we move on to kind of the nitty gritty in it is that we do make stupid choices every day. And the thing is, and this is a big part of it is that self forgiveness piece, because you as beautiful Rachel, who is on this new path wouldn't be here right now, if you didn't make those choices in your path.


Yeah, I saw the real depths of the other side of what lupus can do and what that disease can do to your body. And I'm grateful that I didn't have to sit in that for very long. I am sort of having lupus, I always say lupus is almost like a gift. Now. I mean, I never would have said that eight years ago, nine years ago when I was officially diagnosed, but it is a gift because it is harder for me to ignore all the warning signs. Now, I know where it will put me if I ignore them. And for me, not that anybody wants to have something like this, but it's sort of created the superpower. Like I like to see it where when things are getting too far, or I'm ignoring too much. And I'm missing the signs. My body is the first thing to be, Hey, stop it slow down, you're doing too much. Please be careful. It's unfortunately, it results in discomfort and pain. But it's literally the physical indicator that something is not right, I'm either feeling a feeling of not addressing, usually that's like stress and overwhelm for me, or I'm just actually physically doing too much. And I have this opportunity to recognize those things, those warning signs and do something about it. And I'm responsible for that. And I can choose to ignore it and face the consequences. Or I can cause this moment of pause to reevaluate, think about what's going on. And so for me, these Moments of Awareness physically come in sort of big gestures, go, I'm fatigued, or my hands hurt or things like that. But everybody gets them in their own way. They're probably more subtle for most people. But it is just this indicator that sometimes we just push these things away, right? Oh, my back hurts today. Oh, I didn't sleep well, last night. Oh, I didn't do this. I didn't do that something hurts, I don't feel good. I have a headache. All of those things are signs, those are all signs. Our body is not in this homeostasis kind of place. And these things don't just happen, right? And and so but it's easy for us to be like, Oh, my back hurts. But I'm still going to do all the things on my list today. Because whatever, I'll just take an Advil and pretend it's not happening. But to actually look at all of those things as indicators is game changing? Because then you can just be like, Okay, no, like, I actually think maybe today I need to rest on what's funny about that is as somebody who clearly had issues with achievement, what that meant to me, rest was something that is rule number one, if you're having like a flare up of any sort of symptoms rest. And I actually after many years of dealing with on and off layers of lupus, the common you know, days or weeks or months or years sometimes I actually not that long ago, maybe two, three years ago, I literally had to Google what rest meant. What did quote they mean by rest? Because I didn't think I was doing it right. Like, does it just mean I do like less like it doesn't mean I have to be bed bound but what do we really mean when we say it? And what I found is that yeah, it means like sit your ass down. Don't do anything like for as long as that requires. And I literally traveled to San Diego while I was quote resting. I like went on like a full day hike while I was quote resting like because I'm like, oh, but it's outside. I'm only walking and we can justify anything. That's sort of the struggles that I faced. But just tuning in and listening to my body is really the best possible answer for me to stay in touch with who I am. Now, I'm what I want to be,


oh my gosh, I'm so glad you brought that up, because I remember that. I just Googled rust, because I don't think I'm doing it right. And


it sounds so silly. But truthfully, we live in a world where rust is not only not valued, we actually consider it lazy. If you're resting, you're lazy, because you're not being productive. And truly, to live a lifestyle where you put yourself first you have to look at rest as something that is nourishing to you just as the food that you eat. And the other things that we consume rest has to be a big part of it. And we don't know how to do that, because it wasn't modeled for us. And it is not in grayned in this fast paced society in which we live. So I putting it out there don't even listen Google rest. Yeah, that's,


yeah, seriously, spoiler alert, it's a it's just not doing anything. And by not doing anything, it really means anything like that, just that I kept trying to justify, I'm like, but I can go to the supermarket while I'm resting right, isn't that that's not like an activity, but no, it is an activity. So just for the people who are listening, rest means sit your butt down on the couch, lay in bed, bring everything to you don't go walk the dog, don't go pick up the kids don't go to the supermarket, nothing, just do nothing as your activity for the day, that is all put your feet up heating blanket, whatever you need. Pinch something, that's it. And it really is that simple.


But it's sometimes not easy, because we have some sort of mental gymnastics around it a lot of times to make sure that we really understand it. But it takes practice, like everything else is now you're great at resting, oh, I'm


the best. I'm an award winning roster. I'm very good. I'm willing to coach people, if they need support, we need to


be able to get in touch with the rates. So how does this tie into emotional intelligence because it is all related. And I also love that you said that you were able to find a working environment that aligned with your values. And that's something that is really important, you know, when we're 22, we get out of college, we don't know who we are, let alone our values, right? I mean, we're babies and we get thrown into these jobs. And we just do what we're told. And then our whole being is vulnerable and susceptible to being morphed by whatever cultural values are in the spaces that we go to. So for you to be able to say, Oh, I really need to be in an environment that supports what I value is huge. So as you're kind of moving along through your life, you want to find these spaces. So in regards to what you want, how does that relate to your emotional intelligence practices and what you do with your work now and how you live and work the same values?


Yeah, so you know, in that in between period, like I said, I spent a lot of time figuring out who I am. And a lot of it was reflecting on all the pieces of the puzzle over the time that I was in that job that were a complete misalignment for me, right. And I mentioned a couple it was like, I didn't have a voice. I also felt like I was playing pretend a lot, I kept a lot of distance between me and my co workers. I didn't laugh a lot at work, there were a lot of missing pieces in that reflection. And ultimately, the biggest piece of that puzzle was that I needed a place that balanced working life that truly a lot of companies say that those are really easy words to say, but to live them as another story. And so when I found the company I work for now veteran Growth Partners that was a big piece of the puzzle was me interviewing them in the same way they interview me, you know, I wasn't going to make the same mistake twice. And you're right when I was a kid, no one talked to me about values, and a lot of them are inherent by how you're raised. But I had never identified them with words. And so it really wasn't until I was so far off the path that I realized this was the deep seated issue was that we were just so misaligned on our values. And I needed so desperately to find that place. And so the emotional awareness component of it really came into understanding who I am How am I feeling at any moment. And the values component is a big piece of that self awareness right. So the emotional intelligence you have your Ford big domains and self awareness being the founder question because self awareness is all about who are you. And so you have your self confidence, getting feedback from other people and making sure that the gap between who you are and who people think you are, is small. But a lot of that really boils down to your values and communicating your values, having that emotional literacy. And the word has to really just start with you. And so I felt like starting to work with me was a great place to begin working at this company. And being on the journey myself has been a really great way to continuously work with our member base, right. So we work with veterinary practices, we work with veterinarians, we work with technicians, managers, like everybody at the practice level. So anyone who's bringing their pets into, you know, who's listening, who bring their pets in, you know, we're working with all the people who work in that practice. And emotional intelligence has been such a critical component to helping our industry because, you know, a lot of people think that med is puppies and kittens, and to an extent it is, but there's also a lot of trauma, there's a lot of emergencies, there's a lot of death, there's a lot of struggles that we face, it's a very emotional environment. And so I was in the veterinary field since I was in college, this was always my passion and my dream. And so to be able to now support practices in this way, where I can help them be better for themselves be better for each other, and then obviously be better for the clients who are bringing their pets in, and the pets themselves. Because an emotionally fit team is what we really need to work through the struggles of the day. And it can be a really tough environmental work in. So we do really, really important work


with our teams, I think, again, why the two of us have been able to work so closely together, because everything that you just described, describes being a teacher or school leader, right? It is highly emotional, it is sometimes filled with trauma, especially in the last few years, right post COVID. And we're all dealing with our trauma plus the trauma of the kids that are coming in. We don't have training for that. And we come into this thinking that puppies and kittens, but it's kids and changing the world, you have this beautiful idea where we're bright eyed and bushy tailed, and we're so inspired and excited. And it just lights the fire in us that that this is what we're supposed to do in this world. And this is what really drives me and inherit educator, there is a huge gap of what we're prepared for and what skills we actually need to do our job well. And emotional intelligence is one of the biggest bridges between those two spaces in places. And you're so right with this, regarding the chain, it sounds so cliche, but we see it all the time, the change has to happen with you, you know, you can't just point fingers at everyone and everything else and say this is what's wrong. And this is what's wrong. And if only they would just do this, and if my supervisor would just level know. And when we start taking back our power in that way, understand that self awareness is really the foundation of everything. That's when we can get some traction as to where we can go next.


Absolutely. And yeah, I think that the Emotional Intelligence Component was something that is missed in everybody's education period, the fact that we don't really talk about it, it's not even something that should just be talked about, like one time, like, oh, we take an emotional intelligence course in high school, like, you know, emotions should just become more of a part of our language. And obviously, that's a giant cultural shift for every, you know, that that would just be a major shift. I know, schools are starting to try to do some more of that stuff. But the reality


Yeah, I'm gonna just pause there for a sec. Yeah, yes, we're trying and yes, there are some places and spaces doing it. Well, but you know, I also say this a lot is that emotional intelligence and social emotional learning is what it's called in the education space isn't throwing up a YouTube video about empathy and checking a box and saying we did social emotional learning today. That's not That's


ridiculous. Totally. Right. And it's the same in our industry, too, right? It's easy to sit with the team and watch a video, we provide videos we make that I have trainings on emotional intelligence. But at the end of the day, yes, you're never going to change by watching a video. It takes concerted effort. It takes persistence, it takes a lot of failure. But it really just, it has to happen at a deep personal level. And I understand that a lot of people have feelings about that. Not everyone wants to change and everyone net recognizes a change needs to be made. And from somebody who's been actively doing this work for so long. It doesn't just go away. It gets easier. In some cases. It changes though, because we change and so it's going to be a constant journey. I work with a lot of doctors and people who are fast paced environments who has the time when an emergency comes in, how am I going to stop and take 10 Deep breaths. We're not wired for this work and that's why it really Usually takes a lot of commitment to want to make that change and to also, at least give it enough of a chance to see that benefit, right? When I started making new changes, it's uncomfortable, because yeah, you want to go dive in, you want to ignore the feelings that are running through your head and just power through because it's always supposedly worked for you in the past. But it takes a lot of effort to get to the point where you can almost subconsciously make that choice. But what we know, because we've seen it work is when you do make these changes, the way that it impacts your team, the way that it impacts your life, the way that it impacts the choices that you make. But it has to be something that is a journey, not a destination, as I say,


it is a journey. And anyone who I know who I associate with who I learn from and watching you through this whole journey to it is a journey. This isn't stuff that it's you know, one day, you're just like, I'm emotionally intelligent now.


I wish Right?


Like, in your office, and like you're good to go, No, life happens. Life is lifee all the time. And no, you know, what's going to come through whether it's going to be that emergency or whether my daughter broke her leg this year.


Just one of those


pandemic you variable is you, yes, life is going to happen. And you're right, we are wired for this our brains, our bodies are wired for survival. But we don't live in that same world anymore. We live in this world. And we don't have to be activated all the time. The example that you gave with a doctor with the emergency and I don't have time to take 10 Deep breaths. How are you going to perform? If you don't take those 10? Deep breaths? Yes. And understanding the value in that. And you're right, it is a shift. So you know, as you work with people who are in these high stress environments, especially and, again, I make these parallels all the time between your population and teachers and school leaders. Because it is high stress, it is high stakes, it is high pressure, and no no one's going to die in and on a operating table. But there is a huge responsibility that we take on. What are some concrete things that people can do today,


I would say the first place to start is identifying your values. I really feel like if you're going to start an emotional intelligence journey, I think it's important to know who you are. Like I said, that's a big component of that self awareness. Because that deep commitment, that authenticity, the transparency about who you are, will make a lot of things easier. Because once you know who you are, and what those guiding values are, it's a lot easier to identify people situations, environments that misaligned. And if you're not really aware of what those things are, it's hard to recognize when there's a problem. And so I say it sometimes, you know, when I talk with practices, a lot of times you'll realize that there's a values issue, when you are interviewing somebody, and for anyone who's listening could be you're talking to someone and you're like, we just don't click or something's not right. And you know, sometimes that usually boils down to some sort of values issues, something is just not aligning, and it can be really subtle. And if you haven't really identified what those are, it can be hard to pinpoint what that misalignment is. And so sometimes, then we continue in these situations and these environments and these relationships and this align, because we haven't really identified, what is it that feels wrong, I mean, it's something's off and I can't figure it out. I'm still maintaining this relationship, but it doesn't feel good for me anymore. So values is going to be I think, the best place to start. And then from there really, to me, at least, my journey has been developing an emotional language, that's where I would try to start it's not easy. It is literally learning a language. Because I would say the vast majority of us don't get a lot more than like your top five, seven emotions, right? Like happy, sad, mad, angry, scared, we don't have a lot to work with. And there's a lot of nuance, and the better you're able to understand how you feel, the better you're able to do something about it. So for instance, when I was struggling in my last job, and I was dealing with a lot of stress and overwhelm, I only realized I was dealing with stress and overwhelm. In hindsight, when I was actually doing that job, the physical manifestations of what I was experiencing felt like invigoration and excitement and importance. And I really thought that that was it. So that feeling like the only way I can truly like and I'm sure people can identify with this is the way my insides would feel when somebody would give me another task or knock on my door and surprise me with something. That little twisting of that word drag inside me, right? That's like wringing out some water. It almost felt like a tightness in my throat. But I really in those moments was so unaware of the reality of my feelings and what the physical manifestation meant in terms of language. I really thought that those were positive feelings, like I was important that I was getting stuff done that I had a job to do that this was invigorating and exciting for me. And I thought that's what that was, like, legitimately. And it wasn't,


I am blown away. I was not expecting you to say that at all. And that hit home for me. I don't think we've ever actually talked about this, Rachel. Yeah. So you're all getting this real time? You're so right. And I'm thinking to myself, Wow, there are so many times throughout my career, that idea of importance being respected. Being a valued member of my school districts felt one way but physically actually felt a different way. Mm hmm. That is fascinating. And it's so onpoint, I'm going to sit and think about this one for a little while. Because it is I think, something that hits home for a lot of people. I asked tenant to vision, we go through core values, what are your values? And a lot of times when I asked you how do you want to feel people say things like, important, respected, valued, and they're asking for this external validation from other people, but sometimes that creates this internal physical conflict that you're describing. That isn't actually the thing that you want. Exactly.


Yeah. And I didn't realize it until I was out of it and doing the work that I was like, hmm, I don't think that feeling important, respected, invigorated, excited, should feel physically like this. That's where the disconnect happen. So clearly, I'm somebody who feels my emotions very physically, I know that not everybody necessarily has as loud. I'm not saying that they that you don't have it. It just might be more subtle. But like, for me,


we don't know to listen. Yeah,


exactly. That's what I mean. Like, like, I like I've already and now that's the thing, like I've been doing it for so long that I'm very tuned in physically, so I can really kind of feel it when it's happening. But everyone can if you just slow down and listen, right? Because I think that the thing about self awareness is sometimes it's really easy to focus on the low level feelings and negative feelings, right? It's really easy to find out when you're stressed. Okay, like something that's like a little intense on the scale of intensity of feelings, right? Stress is sort of on like the higher end of how we probably want to feel. So sometimes it's when you get all the way up there, that's when you're noticing it. But we can also kind of slow it down and in the moment like so let's say you're doing work that you think does invigorate you that you're like, Well, I love this work. This is like me and my highest self. Why don't we stop here right now, and think about how you're feeling in this moment. So you can actually have something to compare it to so that way when you are thinking, Oh, invigoration Oh respect Ooh, importance. And it doesn't feel like the way you were feeling in that beautiful moment where your body might have been calm and at ease. Maybe there wasn't a physical manifestation at all. And then physical manifestation was that like, actual relaxation? Now I can be like, well, maybe this isn't what I thought it was, after all. So that's again, the challenge because it's easy, just like anything, you're driving your car, you're not gonna go get the oil, check that the lights not on. But had we maybe done that every now and then just doing a little car inspection here. And there, we might notice things are a problem before they become oh my god, warning light. It's a big problem. So that to me is a good opportunity. Thinking about those moments of joy and ease. When you're sitting at the beach, when you're reading your favorite book, when you're playing with your kid, when you're playing with your dog when you're doing anything that brings you all have those good, happy good stuff, that's a good place to start to, because then it can also be easier for us to channel that back in in those moments of those high level, stressful, overwhelm, angry, furious, like, you know, like whatever those sort of intense emotions are. I can know what a balancing state is, what do I want to get towards? So all of that is emotional literacy. It's not necessarily just the words it's also the physical literacy because sometimes we don't have words for how we always feel but our body is going to tell us


or does is every realize now how much we need to dive in you and me. I like continuing silly me We'll like go ahead and do public management in 40 minutes, it's not gonna happen. We're, I would love to continue this with you and keep having these conversations throughout season two, because there's so much here that we get to talk about and really dive into and we just barely touched this. Where'd the time go? You know, we get into the vortex? It is it's a vortex. Exactly. Energetic vortex. That's right. I'm fully here for it. And I have to ask, as I asked everybody, at the end of our interviews together, you know, is considering what we've been talking about today and your perspective on how things are in your world of education, you know, what is your dream for the future of education?


I think my dream for the future of education is that we're all given time and space to explore this part of the human experience. I understand that it isn't where it needs to be now. But I think that maybe it's that culture of that gogogo that never stopped that hustle. That's sort of the American way that we need to reevaluate. I mean, that's huge. But again, it boils down to education, because it's about recognizing the importance of pausing of resting, of thinking about how we feel about even just taking a beat before you respond to somebody. It's recognizing the small moments. And there's so much distraction everywhere, all the time, that it's easy to pretend like everything's fine and ignore all that stuff. But so I think that the learning component of it needs to be about creating a value around the self and the identifying who we are what we need, how we feel just gonna come out one way or another. And it's just, I think, critical for us to be able to understand ourselves, there's always a strive to understand others like that's like, also like the human kind of experience that connection with others. But we really can't do that well without connecting with ourselves. So yeah, there's a lot of work to be done.


More of that, but it gives me hope, and again, gets my fire going, because that's the work that I do. That's the work that everybody who is a part of empowered educator world is doing. It's all the all of the people who work with you and your practices. It is about holding up a mirror with love and grace and self compassion that we are on this learning journey our whole lives. And once we learn ourselves more, that's how we can really make the biggest impact in this world.


Absolutely.


Rachel, I'm so excited that you are here. This makes me so happy. And I really can't wait to do this again. Yeah, this is so fun. This is the start. So thank you again, and I love you. Love you.


Thanks for having me.


So if you liked today's episode, please leave a five star review and a written review. We appreciate that so much and I cannot wait to share the rest of season two with you. Take notes. Incredible, right? Together we can revolutionize the face of education is all possible. And it's all here for you right now. Let's keep the conversation going. Find me Jen Rafferty on Instagram, Twitter and on Facebook at empowered educator faculty room

Do you feel depleted, overwhelmed, and burnt out from your job?

Are you so accustomed to working in a fast-paced environment, that stopping to take a breath seems laughable?

How long do you think you can go on this way- and have ANY quality of life?

It’s so easy to find yourself adopting and absorbing the cultural values of your work environment. The fact is, your health and well-being are just as important, if not more so, than your productive output.

Welcome to season 2 of Take Notes with Jen Rafferty! In this first episode, I’m speaking with Rachel Teichberg. Besides being my sister, she is the head of Learning and Development at Veterinary Growth Partners.

In her role, she designs fun and engaging learning programs that make leaders feel less alone, give them the tools to excel in their roles, while creating beautiful moments of growth and awareness.

We discuss her journey from having to google “what is rest” (to figure out if she was doing it right), to teaching hundreds of people how to balance personal and professional boundaries through her work.

Today is all about emotional intelligence in the workplace, setting boundaries, and cultivating self-awareness. Rachel’s experience is a profound example of the life-changing benefits of prioritizing yourself - and how it’s possible for you too!

Remember, the more we learn about ourselves, the bigger the impact we can make in the world!


Stay empowered,

Jen



Let’s keep the conversation going! Find me at:

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About Rachel Teichberg

Rachel is the head of learning and development at Veterinary Growth Partners. She works with teams to enhance their culture, boost team morale, and improve overall communication through conflict management and emotional intelligence training. Her goal is to design fun and engaging learning programs that make leaders feel less alone, give them the tools to excel in their roles, while creating beautiful moments of growth and awareness.

Rachel and I have been working behind the scenes together pretty much our entire lives, and sharing her with you brings me so much joy. Her insights offer tremendous value regardless of industry.